UND Football Expectations

[darell1976]

Glad you're on record supporting an absurd disparity in opportunities provided for female student athletes. Just in case you forgot the numbers: 282 unduplicated men participants (68.6%) and 129 unduplicated women participants (31.4%). I'm sure that won't be an issue at some point in the future.

Whoa wait NDSU has women sports?

[jdub27]

Whoa wait NDSU has women sports?

 

I'll give them credit, they do pretty well in some the ones they do manage to field a team for, but still ended up looking up to both of the South Dakota schools in the season long standings.

[UND-FB-FAN]

Hard to believe that you actually believe your BS. UND didn't move up because they already had a successful DI sport and were happy with DII in all others. UND did their best to try and have the SU's fail in their transition to DI, but we all know how that worked out. Because of NDSU's success in their transition UND athletic dept was under a lot of pressure to move up. They did so without a plan unlike the SU's which had studied the move for years. UND's logic was if the SU's can do it'll be no problem for us. Your transition period was by far the worst in the Dakota's and it's still a problem today.(your standings in the BSC all sports standing shows this)

UND dropped the ball on that one back then and I'm not going to defend their actions, other than hindsight is 20/20. Even NDSU and SDSU weren't entirely sure how successful they would be when making the jump up, regardless of how much you want to gloat now. UND's timing is not so much the issue as is the fact UND's administration with Fasion was/has been hesitant in giving enough funding to football and basketball and limiting hockey. NDSU didn't have the "hockey problem" to worry about when moving up, and by that I mean they didn't have to heavily fund a sport that wasn't football or basketball.

UND still needs to work on improving the budget for football and basketball. Football had a bit of a budget bump when Bubba was hired, putting them at fourth in the Big Sky Conference, but basketball is still way behind.

To say hockey doesn't factor into that is negligent; hockey absorbs a huge portion of the athletic department budget, but we know that isn't going away so UND just needs to raise more funds.

[darell1976]

I'll give them credit, they do pretty well in some the ones they do manage to field a team for, but still ended up looking up to both of the South Dakota schools in the season long standings.

Yep softball, and sports like golf. Women's basketball and volleyball not so much.

[JohnboyND7]

Whoa wait NDSU has women sports?

Would you like to compare the success of each schools women's teams? Not even remotely close.

[fightingsioux4life]

.

When you think Duke, you think BB. When you think Alabama, you think FB. When you think UND, you think ..............?

Duke has a football team in which many fans are passionate about, but you don't really think of Duke as a FB school. Same could be said about Alabama and BB. Like it or not, UND is known for its hockey. This doesn't mean that the other sports can't be competitive. It's just the way it is. I don't think the NFL is looking at Bubba or Brian Jones as potential coaching candidates. Hakstol just signed a deal with the Flyers as the first college coach to make the jump since Badger Bob. I'm not saying scrap the other sports, I love going to football games when we are competitive. It's not a hockey only attitude, it's just the fact that people are more supportive/interested in teams that have more success. Sorry, but that is the reality!

Sorry, but you just proved my point for me.

 

The bolded statement above is precisely what is wrong with athletics right now.  If you don't support the FB program all the time (win or lose, good times and bad), it will never be successful on a year to year basis.  And like Sic said, it is possible to be good in more than one sport at the same time.  The idea that we have to pick one sport and ignore the rest is a false choice.....and needs to be put to bed once and for all.

[geaux_sioux]

Sorry, but you just proved my point for me.

The bolded statement above is precisely what is wrong with athletics right now. If you don't support the FB program all the time (win or lose, good times and bad), it will never be successful on a year to year basis. And like Sic said, it is possible to be good in more than one sport at the same time. The idea that we have to pick one sport and ignore the rest is a false choice.....and needs to be put to bed once and for all.

There were a ton of fans that left when Mussman took over. In fact, the IPF was fully funded and ready to go until Lennon left and Mussman took over. Most of the donations were pulled and it took a long time to get the money back.

[UNDvince97-01]

 In fact, the IPF was fully funded and ready to go until Lennon left and Mussman took over. Most of the donations were pulled and it took a long time to get the money back.

Really?  That's news to me.  Hadnt heard that before...

[gfhockey]

We had all the money pretty much in place

That's what mussman was always telling recruits it was ready to be built

What he didn't know was the gobc pulling away money

[nosidel]

 

EDIT: Every time I wheel this out someone always pipes up and asks -- "what changed for UND, then?"  I will try to get out ahead of that one this time by simply saying that the total and utter collapse of the NCC is what shifted the entire paradigm and forced UND to make the leap.  

 

This is utter nonsense. The NCC was a perfectly viable DII conference when UND announced it was leaving. It was UND's leaving that caused the NCC to collapse not the other way around. 

[UNDBIZ]

We had all the money pretty much in place

That's what mussman was always telling recruits it was ready to be built

What he didn't know was the gobc pulling away money

 

[nosidel]

Why do you care about how we are doing in the BSC? Jealous you guys couldn't get in...twice? But thanks for your interest in UND and Big Sky athletics.

 

How many times did SUU fail to get into the Big Sky? Remind me, when did they (SUU) ultimately get their bid?

[jdub27]

How many times did SUU fail to get into the Big Sky? Remind me, when did they (SUU) ultimately get their bid?

 

They were denied membership in 1996 and promptly joined the Mid-Con (now Summit).  Not sure if they officially applied for the spot UNC got in 2006 (under direction of former AD Tom Douple) but records show they were interested at the time.  The Big Sky is where they always aspired to be and they bolted when given the chance in 2010, even though Douple had switched over to commissioner of the Summit by that time.

 

For fun, here's a quote from former athletic director Tom Douple when he was at SUU:

"The Big Sky is a very, very good conference," Douple said.

[nosidel]

.

When you think Duke, you think BB. When you think Alabama, you think FB. When you think UND, you think ..............?

Duke has a football team in which many fans are passionate about, but you don't really think of Duke as a FB school. Same could be said about Alabama and BB. Like it or not, UND is known for its hockey. This doesn't mean that the other sports can't be competitive. It's just the way it is. I don't think the NFL is looking at Bubba or Brian Jones as potential coaching candidates. Hakstol just signed a deal with the Flyers as the first college coach to make the jump since Badger Bob. I'm not saying scrap the other sports, I love going to football games when we are competitive. It's not a hockey only attitude, it's just the fact that people are more supportive/interested in teams that have more success. Sorry, but that is the reality!

 

Here's the problem: there are really only two NCAA sports that matter in terms of fan popularity and national media exposure -- basketball and football. All of the schools that you mentioned have one of those two sports as their primary sport. The exposure that an Alabama gets from its football team, or a Duke gets from its basketball team, so greatly out weighs the exposure UND gets from its hockey team that your comparing UND to those schools is absurd.

 

The hard reality for UND as a hockey school is that a couple of sweet sixteen runs in the NCAA men's basketball tournament -- which is, I think, attainable for either NDSU or UND -- would return more media exposure and national interest than a hockey program ever can.

[UND-FB-FAN]

Here's the problem: there are really only two NCAA sports that matter in terms of fan popularity and national media exposure -- basketball and football. All of the schools that you mentioned have one of those two sports as their primary sport. The exposure that an Alabama gets from its football team, or a Duke gets from its basketball team, so greatly out weighs the exposure UND gets from its hockey team that your comparing UND to those schools is absurd.

The hard reality for UND as a hockey school is that a couple of sweet sixteen runs in the NCAA men's basketball tournament -- which is, I think, attainable for either NDSU or UND -- would return more media exposure and national interest than a hockey program ever can.

I agree with you.

It's the reality of UND being a hockey school, in that they are limited in the amount of recognition they can receive. The hockey program is already maxed out, so the only way to improve UND athletics' support - which is needed, by the way - is to improve football and basketball.

[homer]

Would you like to compare the success of each schools women's teams? Not even remotely close.

 

This year?  Last couple years?  It would be interesting to compare in the sports that both offer.  Conference standings, conference rankings, etc. 

[UNDBIZ]

This year?  Last couple years?  It would be interesting to compare in the sports that both offer.  Conference standings, conference rankings, etc. 

 

Once you get into softball, soccer, track, & x-country, UND women's teams get pretty weak....

[petey23]

We had all the money pretty much in place

That's what mussman was always telling recruits it was ready to be built

What he didn't know was the gobc pulling away money

And you wanna guess you wanna know what else?

[Csonked Out]

NDSU is where we are aspiring to be. Multiple football championships and multiple March madness tournaments. We can moan all we want about why but they have hired all the right coaches by allotting proper coaching salaries and assistants. Our basketball program is mediocre at best and football has been poor for 5 years.

We shot ourselves in the foot by not paying competitive salaries to our coaches and assistants.

Here are the 2 goals I have

1) MBB must win the Big Sky or Jones needs to be fired as he has had far to much time.

2) football finishes the season with a winning record. It is a tough schedule and this is only year 2.

I hate to agree with NDSU fans on this but they are better than us in every way right now. Results speak for themselves and I am embarrassed by ours lately.

[UNDBIZ]

NDSU is where we are aspiring to be. Multiple football championships and multiple March madness tournaments. We can moan all we want about why but they have hired all the right coaches by allotting proper coaching salaries and assistants. Our basketball program is mediocre at best and football has been poor for 5 years.

We shot ourselves in the foot by not paying competitive salaries to our coaches and assistants.

Here are the 2 goals I have

1) MBB must win the Big Sky or Jones needs to be fired as he has had far to much time.

2) football finishes the season with a winning record. It is a tough schedule and this is only year 2.

I hate to agree with NDSU fans on this but they are better than us in every way right now. Results speak for themselves and I am embarrassed by ours lately.

 

I've noticed from friends and family in Grand Forks that the town seems to be in a bit of a bubble.  Unfortunately, NDSU is destroying UND in marketing/visibility throughout most of North Dakota and Minnesota right now.  The last 5 years have been rough.

[nosidel]

They were denied membership in 1996 and promptly joined the Mid-Con (now Summit).  Not sure if they officially applied for the spot UNC got in 2006 (under direction of former AD Tom Douple) but records show they were interested at the time.  The Big Sky is where they always aspired to be and they bolted when given the chance in 2010, even though Douple had switched over to commissioner of the Summit by that time.

 

For fun, here's a quote from former athletic director Tom Douple when he was at SUU:

 

My point was that Darrel's post was silly. Something obviously changed in the Big Sky between NDSU's being turned down for membership and UND's receiving a bid. SUU's acceptance into the Big Sky at the same time as UND after being turned down at around the same time as NDSU pretty strongly demonstrates that.

 

In any case, NDSU would not switch conferences with UND, and is certainly not jealous of the Big Sky.

[Csonked Out]

I've noticed from friends and family in Grand Forks that the town seems to be in a bit of a bubble. Unfortunately, NDSU is destroying UND in marketing/visibility throughout most of North Dakota and Minnesota right now. The last 5 years have been rough.

They market better, they fund their sports better, and they have more success. The fact we are having this debate just makes me laugh because they are that much better right now. Even Bubba is getting almost 50% of the salary Kleiman is. I'm not sure about assistants but you get what you pay for and we have been clearance shopping for a long time.

If our budget is that tight, than we need to drop a couple of un profitable sports (women's hockey) and properly fund our major sports.

[CMSioux]

I've noticed from friends and family in Grand Forks that the town seems to be in a bit of a bubble.  Unfortunately, NDSU is destroying UND in marketing/visibility throughout most of North Dakota and Minnesota right now.  The last 5 years have been rough.

SU is advertising in St. Cloud - but a big billboard doesn't mean it's working - UND must be visible where it counts and doing something right because isn't the student count at UND at an all-time high and aren't they discussing ways to control admissions so they can maintain the quality of education? 

[UND-FB-FAN]

NDSU is where we are aspiring to be. Multiple football championships and multiple March madness tournaments. We can moan all we want about why but they have hired all the right coaches by allotting proper coaching salaries and assistants. Our basketball program is mediocre at best and football has been poor for 5 years.

We shot ourselves in the foot by not paying competitive salaries to our coaches and assistants.

Here are the 2 goals I have

1) MBB must win the Big Sky or Jones needs to be fired as he has had far to much time.

2) football finishes the season with a winning record. It is a tough schedule and this is only year 2.

I hate to agree with NDSU fans on this but they are better than us in every way right now. Results speak for themselves and I am embarrassed by ours lately.

Yep. Football will get there, but still could use improvements; can't get complacent.

If you're a football and basketball fan, as I am, UND has been embarrassed by NDSU recently. That needs to change with - as you said - better coaches in the area of basketball and better budget for equipment/facility improvements in the area of football. The HPC will be great for football, but the new coaching offices and meeting/film rooms of phase II are also a huge deal. UND needs to get that funded and built sooner rather than later, because then UND and Bubba will be in great position.

[UNDBIZ]

SU is advertising in St. Cloud - but a big billboard doesn't mean it's working - UND must be visible where it counts and doing something right because isn't the student count at UND at an all-time high and aren't they discussing ways to control admissions so they can maintain the quality of education? 

 

NDSU is bigger with high school students, whereas UND is hitting better with "non-traditional" students, aka, older people and transfers.  UND is trying to raise the quality of education through tighter admission standards, but that's not due to the campus being full.  UND's largest freshman class was in 2004 or 2005 I believe.