The Sicatoka Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Straight up raw numbers comparisons would be wrong as we know there is a base difference there. Scaled comparisons (post season to regular season average) would be the better way to look at the question, "Are X's fans coming out for post-season games in comparison to their regular season games."
Risky Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 I think NDSU will have good crowds. There are more expectations this year. They are good. More importantly there is no local television. That is huge. They are also not playing Thankasgiving weekend. That is huge.
Matt Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Don't even try to compare attendance with NDSU. 5000 to 12000 You are bickering over scraps, these averages are way behind the national leaders. 2010 NCAA DIVISION I FCS ATTENDANCE TEAM LEADERS Rank School G Attendance Average 1. Appalachian St. 8 205,719 25,715 2. Montana 6 152,689 25,448 3. Jackson St. 5 120,698 24,140 4. Old Dominion 7 138,474 19,782 5. Delaware 10 177,526 17,753 6. Ga. Southern 6 105,763 17,627 7. Jacksonville St. 6 103,977 17,330 8. Harvard 5 84,589 16,918 9. James Madison 6 99,584 16,597 10. North Dakota St. 7 111,607 15,944 11. Florida A&M 4 63,651 15,913 12. Youngstown St. 6 90,661 15,110 13. South Carolina St. 5 74,309 14,862 14. Tennessee St. 4 59,444 14,861 15. Liberty 5 73,149 14,630 Rank School G Attendance Average 16. Yale 6 87,553 14,592 17. Montana St. 7 100,089 14,298 18. McNeese St. 5 68,852 13,770 19. N.C. A&T 5 66,941 13,388 20. Massachusetts 5 65,023 13,005 21. UNI 6 77,980 12,997 22. Southern U. 5 64,481 12,896 23. Texas St. 6 76,827 12,805 24. Chattanooga 5 63,494 12,699 25. Penn 5 59,629 11,926 26. Norfolk St. 5 59,393 11,879 27. Citadel 6 68,669 11,445 28. Alcorn St. 6 68,459 11,410 29. Alabama St. 6 67,061 11,177 30. Western Ill. 6 66,573 11,096
homer Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Don't even try to compare attendance with NDSU. 5000 to 12000 Take Rob Morris, play them 3-4 times in the two years prior, including the opener that season. Beat them by 40+ each time. Put the game on statewide TV. And than figure what your attendance would have been. That was what Winnona was for us that year. It may have been slightly more than 5,000 but I guarantee it wouldn't have been 12,000. I'm glad you finally admit that the weekend and opponent really does make a difference. If it makes a difference if its your 1st playoff game ever in the dome, imagine it being a common opponent when you were making the playoffs every year like UND was at the time.
Bison Dan Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Take Rob Morris, play them 3-4 times in the two years prior, including the opener that season. Beat them by 40+ each time. Put the game on statewide TV. And than figure what your attendance would have been. That was what Winnona was for us that year. It may have been slightly more than 5,000 but I guarantee it wouldn't have been 12,000. I'm glad you finally admit that the weekend and opponent really does make a difference. If it makes a difference if its your 1st playoff game ever in the dome, imagine it being a common opponent when you were making the playoffs every year like UND was at the time. That's exactly why we got out of DII - Instead of picking the best 16 teams they were more interested in being PC. Imagion if you would have moved up with us. I think you would have liked your transition a lot better.
Teeder11 Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 That's exactly why we got out of DII - Instead of picking the best 16 teams they were more interested in being PC. Imagion if you would have moved up with us. I think you would have liked your transition a lot better. We weren't interested in playing a shell game and raping our academic budgets in order to do it like Wild Joe "Take it to the next level at all cost" Chapman was. Where is he now? We were ready when we were ready. I must say, when you look at athletics as a whole, our transition went quite swimmingly. I like where we are at right now. Oh, in regard to attendance.... NDSU better be drawing bigger raw numbers by comparison.... your base population area (those within relatively short driving distance of the dome) is nearly four times that of UND's. Not an excuse, just facts, man. 1
Bison Dan Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 We weren't interested in playing a shell game and raping our academic budgets in order to do it like Wild Joe "Take it to the next level at all cost" Chapman was. Where is he now? We were ready when we were ready. I must say, when you look at athletics as a whole, our transition went quite swimmingly. I like where we are at right now. Oh, in regard to attendance.... NDSU better be drawing bigger raw numbers by comparison.... your base population area (those within relatively short driving distance of the dome) is nearly four times that of UND's. Not an excuse, just facts, man. How many presidents and AD's have you gone through in the last 8 years? Hey if you're happy with your transition great - I'm sure the future will be just as good.
Risky Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Take Rob Morris, play them 3-4 times in the two years prior, including the opener that season. Beat them by 40+ each time. Put the game on statewide TV. And than figure what your attendance would have been. That was what Winnona was for us that year. It may have been slightly more than 5,000 but I guarantee it wouldn't have been 12,000. I'm glad you finally admit that the weekend and opponent really does make a difference. If it makes a difference if its your 1st playoff game ever in the dome, imagine it being a common opponent when you were making the playoffs every year like UND was at the time. Great post. So so true.
Johnny Five Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Again, it turns into a Bison-Sioux pissing match. Sweet. If there were first round games in Bozeman, Missoula, or JMU this Thanksgiving weekend, tickets would be easy to come by just as they were for NDSU last year. It's not any particular fan base here, it statistically does not draw well. Once again, the JMU AD has a renovated stadium that this season AVG 25K fans per game in the regular season, and he was only banking on 12K the first game of the playoffs when he submitted the bid. Can't argue that, he said it outright. These games do not draw that well for whatever reason, even at historically good FCS schools. And let's be honest, the bid process has to make some of the "at-large" selections turn some heads with that selection committee, which in turn makes the field slightly flawed. NDSU was a OT game away from hosting a semifinal last year, and as the last team in that is just flat out wrong to me.
Matt Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Very nice facilities at JMU http://www.jmusports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=14400&ATCLID=205241033
Johnny Five Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Allegedly the NSU vs ODU game is SOLD OUT this weekend. According to a quick wiki search their stadium is just under 20K. Schools are in fairly close proximity so that helps, but nonetheless that will make for a great atmosphere. ODU program is quite the story.
CMSioux Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Take Rob Morris, play them 3-4 times in the two years prior, including the opener that season. Beat them by 40+ each time. Put the game on statewide TV. And than figure what your attendance would have been. That was what Winnona was for us that year. It may have been slightly more than 5,000 but I guarantee it wouldn't have been 12,000. I'm glad you finally admit that the weekend and opponent really does make a difference. If it makes a difference if its your 1st playoff game ever in the dome, imagine it being a common opponent when you were making the playoffs every year like UND was at the time. We have to keep in mind ndsu is new at this hosting a home playoff game thing. This generation has only experienced it once. 2
Bison Dan Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 We have to keep in mind ndsu is new at this hosting a home playoff game thing. This generation has only experienced it once. NDSU has hosted and won more home playoff games than UND ever will.
sultan Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 The people that handled hosting the previous playoff games at NDSU aren't alive anymore. 2
CMSioux Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 NDSU has hosted and won more home playoff games than UND ever will. Everytime the fact is brought up that UND owns the won/lost record over ndsu in football we are told that history doesn't matter - my point was that this generation of bison fan has experienced one playoff game after waiting for 20 years - and that wasn't even of enough interest to generate a sell-out. 4
siouxu31 Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Everytime the fact is brought up that UND owns the won/lost record over ndsu in football we are told that history doesn't matter - my point was that this generation of bison fan has experienced one playoff game after waiting for 20 years - and that wasn't even of enough interest to generate a sell-out. And now cue the Bison fan excuses...... Should we go with: A.) "It was Thanksgiving weekend and all the students had left for home"....... B.) "It wasn't because there was less interest in the Bison football team, it was because there was less interest in who the Bison were playing"....... C.) "People actually had to go buy tickets to the game rather than having free tickets given to them"........ D,) "People in Fargo had forgotten that it is possible to host a playoff football game, after not experiencing that concept in 20 years"......... E.) "People were more interested in watching the Sioux hockey team play against Notre Dame in a nonconference series up in Grand Forks":......... 1
WYOBISONMAN Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 I think NDSU will be tough to beat at home. And they'll end up with a pretty easy draw in their first game. I think there are some serious injury issues. It seems like Jensen's turf toe is a real mobility limiter and could play a big role in the playoffs. I have never experienced turf toe (closest for me is gout which was horrible) so I am not sure of the pain level, but it must be significant and it seems to not go away very fast. To have success against the better teams NDSU will need a mobile Jensen.
Bison Dan Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 And now cue the Bison fan excuses...... Should we go with: A.) "It was Thanksgiving weekend and all the students had left for home"....... B.) "It wasn't because there was less interest in the Bison football team, it was because there was less interest in who the Bison were playing"....... C.) "People actually had to go buy tickets to the game rather than having free tickets given to them"........ D,) "People in Fargo had forgotten that it is possible to host a playoff football game, after not experiencing that concept in 20 years"......... E.) "People were more interested in watching the Sioux hockey team play against Notre Dame in a nonconference series up in Grand Forks":......... Any team that ONLY gets 5,000 to a football game - any game - I wouldn't be talking too much. Kind of sad really, what's your attendance for the year? 47,045 for 6 games - 7,800 aveage WOW - our first 3 games had 54,268 So smacking about attendance really isn't your strong suit.
WYOBISONMAN Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Do you think tv hurts a playoff team, I blame the FSSN for our poor attendance in playoff games with Winona State...5000?? I really don't think TV hursts games. It gets the team exposure, aids recruiting and builds the fan base. Winning is what puts arses in the seats. Fans will go to games regardless of TV coverage......they like the game.....they like the tailgate.....they just like being a part of it.
zonadub Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Everytime the fact is brought up that UND owns the won/lost record over ndsu in football we are told that history doesn't matter - my point was that this generation of bison fan has experienced one playoff game after waiting for 20 years - and that wasn't even of enough interest to generate a sell-out. i will qualify this comment - i am a UND alum ... be careful about being too superior about playoff attendance at NDSU. first of all, they got to the playoffs, and second, they have a high enough in-season attendance average to be able to get a home game. unless UND starts getting a better crowd under the Big Sky banner (and last weekend's conference championship game which was not during Thanksgiving break, against the last remaining rival doesn't speak well for the Alerus crowds), when UND does get into the playoffs, they will be traveling to Robert Morris, not hosting them.
Matt Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Any team that ONLY gets 5,000 to a football game - any game - I wouldn't be talking too much. Kind of sad really, what's your attendance for the year? 47,045 for 6 games - 7,800 aveage WOW - our first 3 games had 54,268 So smacking about attendance really isn't your strong suit. Let's give it some perspective. Fargo's 2010 population of 105,549 and the avg attendance ndsu reported to the NCAA in 2010 was 15,994 per game. Let's compare that to the Montana. The 2010 Census put the population of Missoula at 66,788. Yet they averaged 25,715 in their attendance. Even if I expand the parameters out, Missoula county is still only slightly larger than Fargo proper at 109,299. So, you can come here and smack talk UND fans about the ndsu attendance all you want. Beating UND in football attendance isn't a very high bar, never has been. Just don't break your arm patting yourself on the back for your freaking tenth place national attendance ranking. The facts show ndsu is nowhere near where it should be, and if you keep comparing it to where UND is at, they never will be.
Bison Dan Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Let's give it some perspective. Fargo's 2010 population of 105,549 and the avg attendance ndsu reported to the NCAA in 2010 was 15,994 per game. Let's compare that to the Montana. The 2010 Census put the population of Missoula at 66,788. Yet they averaged 25,715 in their attendance. Even if I expand the parameters out, Missoula county is still only slightly larger than Fargo proper at 109,299. So, you can come here and smack talk UND fans about the ndsu attendance all you want. Beating UND in football attendance isn't a very high bar, never has been. Just don't break your arm patting yourself on the back for your freaking tenth place national attendance ranking. The facts show ndsu is nowhere near where it should be, and if you keep comparing it to where UND is at, they never will be. Your right there's nothing to compare. I didn't start the smack but your pop. count is flawed - look at Neb. and a host of other DI fb teams that have small pop. centers. Besides if we had a 25,000 seat venue who knows after this year.
Teeder11 Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Let's give it some perspective. Fargo's 2010 population of 105,549 and the avg attendance ndsu reported to the NCAA in 2010 was 15,994 per game. Let's compare that to the Montana. The 2010 Census put the population of Missoula at 66,788. Yet they averaged 25,715 in their attendance. Even if I expand the parameters out, Missoula county is still only slightly larger than Fargo proper at 109,299. So, you can come here and smack talk UND fans about the ndsu attendance all you want. Beating UND in football attendance isn't a very high bar, never has been. Just don't break your arm patting yourself on the back for your freaking tenth place national attendance ranking. The facts show ndsu is nowhere near where it should be, and if you keep comparing it to where UND is at, they never will be. No smack intended for the many respectful SU fans on this board. Those who are not -- if the shoe fits, wear it. Grand Forks is the biggest hockey town in a 150-mile radius. It has a long established history as an NCAA Division I powerhouse in a conference that up until its eventual disbanding will have been equal in relative stature to the SEC of FBS fooball (for all the footballheads out there ). UND plays strong rivals week in and week out in a world class facility. Ocassionally, UND plays Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Michigan State, Notre Dame, Boston College, Boston University, Harvard, Yale, Ohio State, etc. With all that, it still amazes me that the Grand Forks' market can draw 12,000 people consistently night after night. But again, we are drawing from Bismarck, Minot, Devils Lake, Thief River Falls, Crookston, Canada and FARGO and all point in between -- not just Grand Forks County. There is no competition in the area for elite college hockey. UND hockey has a statewide, regional and even national following. That is not the case for FCS football in North Dakota. It is much more parochialized and divided as far as allegiences go. So all that said, I, too, am somewhat underwhelmed by attendance claims down south given the context of the size of the potential fanbase, the fact that they are not in a transitional conference and the fact that they are actually playing competitive teams for real hardware.
bisoninnwmn Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 In our defense, NDSU will probably ave over 18K this year. I wish we had a bigger facility, the attendance would rise IMO. The point on the 1st round playoff games.....Thanksgiving weekend always has lower attendance.....check Appy State and other perenial FCS playoff teams. If the Bison could get 17-18K for our playoffs game/games, that would be great.
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