Standing Rock/Spirit Lake

[redwing77]

Who cares about the votes unless what people the rumors and the way society is on the reservations is totally bunk. If activist groups really are into bullying and pressuring the masses in such a way as to make the masses believe that voting to support the nickname would be to throw away their heritage, how valid is the vote?

It can't hurt to wait for the vote to be cast, but expecting anything other than what we already know would be foolish.

In my (apparently racist) opinion, the US Government isn't the only bully the NA people face.... the Tribal Council and NA activists do their share as well.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

I have not heard. Something tells me that several alumni have contacted Goetz and the incoming President and have told them not to be too quick to just dump the name...

It's JMHO, but I'd say the committees have been formed and a lot of PR types have drafted memos. They're just not public knowledge as of now.

I'd also say that there are a lot of timelines, etc. being drawn up to lessen the harm.

[GeauxSioux]

I have not heard. Something tells me that several alumni have contacted Goetz and the incoming President and have told them not to be too quick to just dump the name...

It's JMHO, but I'd say the committees have been formed and a lot of PR types have drafted memos. They're just not public knowledge as of now.

I'd also say that there are a lot of timelines, etc. being drawn up to lessen the harm.

If they were hoping to have things wrapped up by the time Kelley takes office, they better get something moving. It's just surprising to hear nothing.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

If they were hoping to have things wrapped up by the time Kelley takes office, they better get something moving. It's just surprising to hear nothing.

Thank you for reminding me of the impending changeover. I didn't recall that at all.

I did look up some of the earlier posts in this thread, and here the wording is something like "much closer to a resolution" rather than a definitive "wrapped up": so I offer that for whatever its worth.

http://forum.siouxsports.com/index.php?sho...9502&st=269

I do agree that just over a month is a very short period of time to "announce" a committee, have them meet, and finally announce that the committee has made more than one decision.

[dakotadan]

Tribal council bans vote on nickname

The Standing Rock Sioux Tribal Council placed a moratorium early in May on any reservationwide referendum to gauge tribal support for UND

[Goon]

Tribal council bans vote on nickname

So they ask for a say in the matter and then ban the members of the tribe to actually have a say?

It has gotten to the point where I don't even want our school to be represented by these people.

That makes no sense to me at all. If you have a vote it will bring to a close whether the tribe is for or against the fighting sioux name.

Squash free speech.

[GeauxSioux]

The resolution recites a familiar laundry list of reasons for tribal disapproval of the nickname, including the perpetuation of Indian stereotypes and the disrespectful actions of some fans at UND sporting events.

The council is afraid of a vote, yet proclaims that the nickname will perpetuate stereotyping. Why not let the people decide.

It truly is amazing that Ron His Horse is Thunder and his ilk complained that they weren't asked to be included in discussions regarding the name and then when the settlement was announced he complained that it was all being put on him and now he won't even let the people decide for themselves.

If I were the ones attempting to get a resolution, I would start a petition, collect enough names so that the referendum's outcome would be obvious and take the data to the media.

[Oxbow6]

The council is afraid of a vote, yet proclaims that the nickname will perpetuate stereotyping. Why not let the people decide.

It truly is amazing that Ron His Horse is Thunder and his ilk complained that they weren't asked to be included in discussions regarding the name and then when the settlement was announced he complained that it was all being put on him and now he won't even let the people decide for themselves.

If I were the ones attempting to get a resolution, I would start a petition, collect enough names so that the referendum's outcome would be obvious and take the data to the media.

And we, as citizens of this state, wonder why status quo has reigned on ND reservations for decades! Oh, I'm sorry...is this the sterotyping NA are concerned with?!

[GeauxSioux]

RESOLUTION NO. 209-08

WHEREAS, the Dakota, Lakota and Nakota Tribes opposing the use of the UND nickname and logo have set forth a variety of reasons for their resistance to the nickname and logo, including: the misappropriate of sacred spiritual images; the practices of non-Indians at sporting events; the reduction of complex Tribal, cultural and linguistic issues to a Hollywood stereotype; the attribution of violent images to Indian people by identifying them as

[The Sicatoka]

More proof of what I've said for a while:

Ron His Horse is Thunder = Kim Jong Il

Go Cavalry.

[dagies]

With regards to the sorority party, in my best Napoleon Dynamite voice:

IDIOTS!

[ScottM]

The Standing Rock Sioux Tribal Council placed a moratorium early in May on any reservationwide referendum to gauge tribal support for UND

[Sioux-cia]

The US government was denounced by Native Americans for what was perceived as being their being treated like children who didn't know what was best for them not that long ago. Tribal councils' dictatorial control over their constituants would indicate that Native Americans are still being treated like children who don't know what is best for themselves.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

It has gotten to the point where I don't even want our school to be represented by these people.

I think some of the hard-core anti-nickname people on those reservations will read something like this and take it as "proof" that they're on the right course, and celebrate a victory. I think the reality is 180 degrees opposite: to the outside world this will show that the leaders simply don't want

any

sort of discourse that may disagree with what they want.

With regards to the sorority party, in my best Napoleon Dynamite voice:IDIOTS!

Daiges, I really think that the leaders who want to have their own way and thwart any possibility that their rulings might be overturned. And I think part of stems from the belief that once

one

of their decisions is overruled, people may start looking more closely at

all

of their rulings.

I believe this moratorium would have happened whether or not some sorority had a party. This mindset existed long before any particular party.

[The Sicatoka]

The US government was denounced by Native Americans for what was perceived as being their being treated like children who didn't know what was best for them not that long ago. Tribal councils' dictatorial control over their constituants would indicate that Native Americans are still being treated like children who don't know what is best for themselves.

Nailed it.

[sioux7>5]

I love the name Cavalry!!!

More proof of what I've said for a while:

Ron His Horse is Thunder = Kim Jong Il

Go Cavalry.

[petey23]

That makes no sense to me at all. If you have a vote it will bring to a close whether the tribe is for or against the fighting sioux name.

Squash free speech.

Exactly. The only response that the nickname committee should make at this point is something along the lines of how unfortunate this is that the tribal council has decided to deprive their own people of an opinion on the matter and depending upon the results of the vote could have possibly sped up the committees decision on the Fighting Sioux nickname but as of now with the information we have to work with we will probably wait until the end of the 3 year period and at that time re-evaluate our agreeement with the NCAA and the courts on this issue and decide at that time if it is the right decision for UND to drop the Fighting Sioux nickname or if it is a better decision to accept NCAA santions at that time as we would still be a few years away from being affected by them. Again it is truly unfortunate that the Tribal Council has acted in a way that prevents a speedy resolution to this matter. Unless something changes, our next meeting and statement on this issue will be 1 month before the NCAA and Court decision is to go into effect. Thank You Now.

[Sioux-cia]

I believe that the SR tibal council chairman's tenure will be done before the end of the NCAA's three year moratorium on our use of the Fighting Sioux name and logo. We should wait until the new Chairman takes office and see which way the wind blows before making any decisions. Could be the new Chairperson will be a democratic leader vs a dicatator.

[Goon]

The council is afraid of a vote, yet proclaims that the nickname will perpetuate stereotyping. Why not let the people decide.

Reading the TEA leaves and the various articles coming out of SRT from people in support of the Fighting Sioux name it would appear that Ron His Horse Thunder has his own agenda and it appears that his agenda is not representing the will of all the people of the SRT.

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

Well, this clearly shows that the leaders down there have there own agenda. No way around it, the res is one corrupt place.

[SportsDoc]

Well, this clearly shows that the leaders down there have there own agenda. No way around it, the res is one corrupt place.

I guess that makes it similar to Washington DC, then.

It is becoming more and more evident that jumping through all these hoops, just to have to potentially do it again at some future date is simply not worth it, even if we could succeed now.

Time to move on. All this animosity being created over this by good people on both sides (and, yes, some not so good) is not good for the soul. Let's get rid of the anger and move on, and let's try and do it positively and with a good attitude. It won't be easy, but we can do it.

If it takes someone saying they win and we lose, fine, I'll say it. The anti-nickname side wins, the Fighting Sioux nickname supporters lose. Let's move forward.

[redwing77]

I guess that makes it similar to Washington DC, then.

It is becoming more and more evident that jumping through all these hoops, just to have to potentially do it again at some future date is simply not worth it, even if we could succeed now.

Time to move on. All this animosity being created over this by good people on both sides (and, yes, some not so good) is not good for the soul. Let's get rid of the anger and move on, and let's try and do it positively and with a good attitude. It won't be easy, but we can do it.

If it takes someone saying they win and we lose, fine, I'll say it. The anti-nickname side wins, the Fighting Sioux nickname supporters lose. Let's move forward.

I guess that depends upon your definition of corrupt.

Dictatorial is more like the res tribal council. They don't want to know what their people think. That defies democracy and screams communism. It's the same rational behind big brother in 1984. They don't need to chime in because Big Brother knows whats good for the masses.

Washington DC is pettiness, partisanship personified. They abhor the term "partisan politics" but they play it every day by putting pork barrel spending measures, 950+ (exaggeration perhaps) riders on bills, and calling for ludicrous procedures (like today they called for the reading of a 500 page document, effectively ending whatever it was they were supposed to be doing) to effectively grind Congress to a halt.

We in the free U.S. can be dissatisfied and show it by voting these people out of office. I don't know if the NA people are that politically motivated nor willing/able to see through the smokescreen the tribal council lays down on them. I'd imagine that they'd vote a rock in provided the rock doesn't in any way harm their daily livelihood.

[The Sicatoka]

The anti-nickname side wins, the Fighting Sioux nickname supporters lose. Let's move forward.

The supporters win one thing: Not having to listen to their non-sense ever again.

The anti- folks will get something they didn't expect: Banishment to the realm of inconsequentiality.

[sioux7>5]

Did I hear somewhere that the tribes want to have a say in the new nickname. That is crap, they can't have it both ways.

[ScottM]

Did I hear somewhere that the tribes want to have a say in the new nickname. That is crap, they can't have it both ways.

Agree. Once the name/logo go, I could care less if UND ever deals with SR/SL again, and would prefer they do not especially on picking a new name/logo.