Cost of Attendance

[Cratter]

I thought the max limit for fcoa per the NCAA is $4,000?

Does anyone know for sure?  I've seen a few different numbers in this thread.. 

No limit.  It's based on the figures a school uses. 

[Cratter]

Hammersmith:

Holy mother of god. I looked up UND's current COA adjustment. This is the amount that sets the upper limit of the scholarship. The number that's thrown around most often is $3500. It varies from college to college, and each school is required to put it somewhere on its website. UND's was hidden pretty deep. (I'm not saying UND is trying to hide it for some reason, just that it's not as easy to find as most schools). I looked up a handful of schools this weekend for a discussion on AGS. NDSU was $3400, UNI was $2300, Lehigh was $2100, Texas was $4300. UND gives a number of $5800. That's insane. It means UND would be able to spend an additional $365,400 in football scholarships. That probably works out to about 20 additional scholarships. UND is ending up gaming the system before there was a system to game.

 

Shhhh  

 

[sioux24/7]

Have not read too much into any of this but how is the number decided? I find it crazy that we are able to offer $1500 more than Texas!

[UNDBIZ]

Have not read too much into any of this but how is the number decided? I find it crazy that we are able to offer $1500 more than Texas!

Cost of living in the area plays a major role.  For some reason, Grand Forks isn't cheap.  Housing, gas, food, pretty much everything but a shot at a downtown bar, has historically been more expensive in Grand Forks than Fargo.

[Cratter]

It doesn't have to do with tuition, room, books etc.  But "personal living expenses".  Not sure anyone knows how a school really comes up with their own numbers.  And that's where there will probably be adjustments to this so there is more of a equal playing field. 

[fightingsioux4life]

Cost of living in the area plays a major role.  For some reason, Grand Forks isn't cheap.  Housing, gas, food, pretty much everything but a shot at a downtown bar, has historically been more expensive in Grand Forks than Fargo.

Damn GOBC!

[Walsh Hall]

It's tough with the FCS thing.  There are relatively few FCS programs that will have the institution commitment to pony up for the FCOA.  FCS is already incredibly unbalanced in the level of commitment from the institutions.  I fear with FCOA implemented the difference between the haves and have nots will be huge, and the group of haves will be vastly outnumber the have nots.

The hockey team absolutely needs FCOA.  Not having them would be like Alabama or Ohio St. not having them in football.

[fightingsioux4life]

Just listening to an interview with Matt Larsen on KFGO, its a little deceiving as he stated NDSU does not fully have the funds to do this right now and they will admittedly have challenges in raising that money.  You wouldn't get that from any of the articles or comments out on this today but it came from him on the Jack Michaels show.  Now what they do have is a couple big donations and are raising awareness on what this additional cost is to help raise the rest of the money.  That is where they are smart, get the need out there, paint the picture and have your fanbase step up.  That is the message UND and Faison should follow this up with.  "We can do it but we need a little more help."

If anything, NDSU doing it today maybe causes people to up there donations or start donating.  UND just needs to push it.  

This is my basic argument in a nutshell.

[fightingsioux4life]

It's tough with the FCS thing.  There are relatively few FCS programs that will have the institution commitment to pony up for the FCOA.  FCS is already incredibly unbalanced in the level of commitment from the institutions.  I fear with FCOA implemented the difference between the haves and have nots will be huge, and the group of haves will be vastly outnumber the have nots.

The hockey team absolutely needs FCOA.  Not having them would be like Alabama or Ohio St. not having them in football.

If this is the case, we must ensure that we end up in the haves category.

[bison73]

Just listening to an interview with Matt Larsen on KFGO, its a little deceiving as he stated NDSU does not fully have the funds to do this right now and they will admittedly have challenges in raising that money.  You wouldn't get that from any of the articles or comments out on this today but it came from him on the Jack Michaels show.  Now what they do have is a couple big donations and are raising awareness on what this additional cost is to help raise the rest of the money.  That is where they are smart, get the need out there, paint the picture and have your fanbase step up.  That is the message UND and Faison should follow this up with.  "We can do it but we need a little more help."

If anything, NDSU doing it today maybe causes people to up there donations or start donating.  UND just needs to push it.  

May be you didn't hear that coa  will be fully funded for the first 3 years due to a couple of big donars.

[UND-1]

May be you didn't hear that coa  will be fully funded for the first 3 years due to a couple of big donars.

I heard they had donations for half the amount from big donors and are looking for a match amount to finish it off-hence the website.  Did he not say that at the presser?  

[homer]

May be you didn't hear that coa  will be fully funded for the first 3 years due to a couple of big donars.

Larsen never mentioned anything about that so I didn't hear that.  I did hear him say they will have a challenges with it, he talked about a website that directed people to go if they had questions about what COA was, finally he talked about how it will be a number tracked and taken out of the scholarship fund.  

Him or Jack never mentioned anything about it being fully funded for the first 3 years.  

Below is the podcast:

http://740thefan.com/upload/NDSUCostofAttendancechatwithMattLarsenDavidRichmanandMarenWalseth82715.mp3

[jackal]

Larsen never mentioned anything about that so I didn't hear that.  I did hear him say they will have a challenges with it, he talked about a website that directed people to go if they had questions about what COA was, finally he talked about how it will be a number tracked and taken out of the scholarship fund.  

Him or Jack never mentioned anything about it being fully funded for the first 3 years.  

Below is the podcast:

http://740thefan.com/upload/NDSUCostofAttendancechatwithMattLarsenDavidRichmanandMarenWalseth82715.mp3

The way i understood it, they had donors pledging half of amount needed in the form of a matching donation for the first 3 years.

Edited August 27, 2015 by jackal

[Cratter]

It's tough with the FCS thing.  There are relatively few FCS programs that will have the institution commitment to pony up for the FCOA.  FCS is already incredibly unbalanced in the level of commitment from the institutions.  I fear with FCOA implemented the difference between the haves and have nots will be huge, and the group of haves will be vastly outnumber the have nots.

The hockey team absolutely needs FCOA.  Not having them would be like Alabama or Ohio St. not having them in football. 

That's the whole point of this so the haves can further separate from the have-nots.  

[Matt]

Just listening to an interview with Matt Larsen on KFGO, its a little deceiving as he stated NDSU does not fully have the funds to do this right now and they will admittedly have challenges in raising that money.  You wouldn't get that from any of the articles or comments out on this today but it came from him on the Jack Michaels show.  Now what they do have is a couple big donations and are raising awareness on what this additional cost is to help raise the rest of the money.  That is where they are smart, get the need out there, paint the picture and have your fanbase step up.  That is the message UND and Faison should follow this up with.  "We can do it but we need a little more help."

If anything, NDSU doing it today maybe causes people to up there donations or start donating.  UND just needs to push it.  

Makes me wonder if there's an advantage to announcing and getting the need out there first before other regional schools come knocking to some of the same donors for the same purpose.  Certainly each school has their own fans/alumni but there's also a significant amount of overlap on the corporate account list.

Edited August 27, 2015 by Matt

[homer]

Makes me wonder if there's an advantage to announcing and getting the need out there first before other regional schools come knocking to some of the same donors for the same purpose.  Certainly each school has their own fans/alumni but there's also a significant amount of overlap on the corporate account list.

They were smart to continue to use the momentum they have built.  

That is what bothered me with Faison's comments, while the answer was not incorrect, his response didn't articulate the need or build excitement for potential recruiting opportunity.  

[Cratter]

Wonder if any football recruites are going to be watching the Bison football game Saturday on ESPN listening to the commentators talk about NDSUs FCOA. 

[darell1976]

It's tough with the FCS thing.  There are relatively few FCS programs that will have the institution commitment to pony up for the FCOA.  FCS is already incredibly unbalanced in the level of commitment from the institutions.  I fear with FCOA implemented the difference between the haves and have nots will be huge, and the group of haves will be vastly outnumber the have nots.

The hockey team absolutely needs FCOA.  Not having them would be like Alabama or Ohio St. not having them in football.

Do they really need it? UND has the history, coaches, facilities to field a great hockey team, will money change that? Say UND pays X amount of dollars to every player while Miami doesn't and UND fails to win the NCHC or make the playoffs while Miami goes to the Frozen Four; you would have an uproar on campus. I think UND is already a leg up on the competition as far as hockey goes, but could use a "boost" in other sports like football, basketball and others. 

[darell1976]

Wonder if any football recruites are going to be watching the Bison football game Saturday on ESPN listening to the commentators talk about NDSUs FCOA. 

They will be too busy talking about the nickname issue while calling the Bison UND.

[Walsh Hall]

That's the whole point of this so the haves can further separate from the have-nots.  

I just think that is a bad thing, even if we are in the "have" side of the equation.  The FCS playing field is already incredibly unbalanced based on the committed from the various institutions.  That is just going to make it worse.  I wish there was a gentleman's agreement that FCS school don't do FCOA, but FBS do. 

This will be like having 3 teams in the NFL that don't need to abide by the salary cap.  There will definitely be a competitive advantage for a very small number of schools, and that isn't good for the long term viability of the system.

[Siouxperfan7]

I just think that is a bad thing, even if we are in the "have" side of the equation.  The FCS playing field is already incredibly unbalanced based on the committed from the various institutions.  That is just going to make it worse.  I wish there was a gentleman's agreement that FCS school don't do FCOA, but FBS do. 

This will be like having 3 teams in the NFL that don't need to abide by the salary cap.  There will definitely be a competitive advantage for a very small number of schools, and that isn't good for the long term viability of the system.

This will deffinitely speed up the process for creating a 3 tier D1 in football.  There will be the P5, the rest of the FBS and the FCS schools that provice FCOA, and the rest of the FCS that do not offer FCOA.  

[Matt]

Since there are only two programs that have announced this, with one of them-Liberty-openly wanting to move to FBS, i wonder if any FCS conferences would set FCOA policies to prohibit or severely limit offering FCOA.  This wouldn't be unprecedented as we've seen conferences set their own scholarship limits.

We look at this from the UND perspective, but I can't imagine UNI is very excited at the prospect of competing in this arms race with ndsu.  It wouldn't shock me to see them get a coalition of MVFC schools that would like a vote to limit FCOA.

[Cratter]

I just think that is a bad thing, even if we are in the "have" side of the equation.  The FCS playing field is already incredibly unbalanced based on the committed from the various institutions.  That is just going to make it worse.  I wish there was a gentleman's agreement that FCS school don't do FCOA, but FBS do. 

This will be like having 3 teams in the NFL that don't need to abide by the salary cap.  There will definitely be a competitive advantage for a very small number of schools, and that isn't good for the long term viability of the system.

You'll probably see some lopsided scores in the first round of the NCAA hockey tourney with some conferences auto bids. 

[Cratter]

Since there are only two programs that have announced this, with one of them-Liberty-openly wanting to move to FBS, i wonder if any FCS conferences would set FCOA policies to prohibit or severely limit offering FCOA.  This wouldn't be unprecedented as we've seen conferences set their own scholarship limits.

We look at this from the UND perspective, but I can't imagine UNI is very excited at the prospect of competing in this arms race with ndsu.  It wouldn't shock me to see them get a coalition of MVFC schools that would like a vote to limit FCOA.

UNI uses up all their donors more to pay their men's basketball coach just shy of $1,000,000.

I wouldn't feel too sorry for them. 

[GeauxSioux]

A tweet from Tom Miller regarding the USD AD " We will do it,", but waiting to see how best to implement it.  Not rushing timeline.