jimdahl Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 First Bison1234, now McFeely: Sioux shouldn't play Bison With Division II Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bisonfan1234 Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 If UND doesn't move up soon, they'll always be playing second fiddle to NDSU in North Dakota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eskimos Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 Yeah, especially when NDSU is drawing 500 fans at the old BSC when they have to play SE Alabama Tech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdahl Posted December 4, 2003 Author Share Posted December 4, 2003 If UND doesn't move up soon, they'll always be playing second fiddle to NDSU in North Dakota. I can't imagine many UND fans will convert to become Bison football fans simply because the Bison belong to a different division that also has a fanbase limited to fans of its specific member institutions. It's probably true that most of us would cheer for the Bison if they did well in a major sport in which they belong to the top classification, such as the Big Dance, though I don't think that will stop us from cheering for the Sioux the rest of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 It's probably true that most of us would cheer for the Bison if they did well in a major sport in which they belong to the top classification, such as the Big Dance, though I don't think that will stop us from cheering for the Sioux the rest of the time. And considering the "success" NDSU has enjoyed in division II mens basketball, I'm just sure they'll be making some major noise in the Big Dance really soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hansel Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 First Bison1234, now McFeely: Sioux shouldn't play Bison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 I can't imagine many UND fans will convert to become Bison football fans simply because the Bison belong to a different division that also has a fanbase limited to fans of its specific member institutions. It's probably true that most of us would cheer for the Bison if they did well in a major sport in which they belong to the top classification, such as the Big Dance, though I don't think that will stop us from cheering for the Sioux the rest of the time. With some NDSU fans being so pig headed and idiotic, I'm sure many UND fans will not become NDSU football fans simply because they do not want to be associated with such insensitive and idiotic people. I never disliked NDSU more since I started reading the football thread and some of their fans' posts here. Sad that the loudest NDSU fans tend to be misguided fools whose only aim is to make themselves feel superior in some way instead of being sportsman like and bashing UND just for the sake of bashing UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8BallSiouxFan Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 I think to be fair it should be known most NDSU FB Fans are not this idiotic! I have a brother that plays for the Sioux FB team. I live in Fargo and I have heard nothing but good things about the SIOUX FB team the last couple weeks, or for that matter the whole season! I don't think it is that hard to figure out why the Sioux will no longer be playing the Bison! I think everyone should just drop it and concentrate on what is next...Which is the Semi final game vs a very talented team~ The Alerus is going to need maximum fan support~ So all you BIson peeps jump in your car and come support NORTH DAKOTA~!~!~ It's not like there is anything better to do~Or I guess you could just sit at home and cry waiting for a Bison playoff game in about 7-8-years............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 Mike McFeeley wrote in his column... Now it truly is a case of the Sioux looking out for their best interests. Earth to Mike: That's what it's always been about. Dale Lennon and Roger Thomas have said so all along. The rules didn't suddenly change at the end of the regular season. Both teams drew up their regular season schedules knowing full well that the Division II playoff selection criteria were deliberately designed to discourage DII schools from playing outside their division. While I applaud McFeeley for admitting that he was wrong on this issue, it is disingenuous for him to say that up until last weekend, the Sioux weren't operating in their best interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamStrait Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 We'll never know, but I highly suspect that if UND does continue the rivalry w/ 'SU, when 'SU finally becomes DIAA tournament eligible, they'll drop UND from their schedule like a hot potato. That is, unless UND has moved up to D1AA by then. Why? Because it would hurt 'SU's playoff chances. If such were to come to pass, I'd be willing to bet a substantial amount of money that no accusation of "spite" on the part of 'SU will come from McTouchy-Feely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hansel Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 We'll never know, but I highly suspect that if UND does continue the rivalry w/ 'SU, when 'SU finally becomes DIAA tournament eligible, they'll drop UND from their schedule like a hot potato. That is, unless UND has moved up to D1AA by then. Why? Because it would hurt 'SU's playoff chances. If such were to come to pass, I'd be willing to bet a substantial amount of money that no accusation of "spite" on the part of 'SU will come from McTouchy-Feely. I can't say for sure whether down the road SU would want the rivalry to continue.. however playing d2 teams doesn't hurt DIAA teams as bad as vice versa. The GPI used for IAA (similar to d2's SSI) uses the Massey index for schedule strength. The massey rates all teams in all divisions http://www.masseyratings.com/rate/cf-m.htm currently the sioux are 115, ahead of many IAA schools and some IA schools. Therefore playing the d2 sioux (assuming the sioux continue to be succesful, and with Lennon i think that will continue for a while) would help out a team's GPI greater than playing a weaker IAA team, (schools like liberty, hofstra etc) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 If UND doesn't move up soon, they'll always be playing second fiddle to NDSU in North Dakota. Time for the Bison fan to sober up, never will UND play second fiddle to NDSuck. Number one if your confused come up to Grand Forks and look at our sports facilities... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison_Kent Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 I will give you that REA is a top notch facility but playing second fiddle, I think not. Let's do a little comparison on sports: Football FargoDome Vs. Alerus Center Advatage FargoDome Basketball Bison Sports Arena Vs. Hyslop Sports Center Advantage BSA Baseball Newman Outdoor Field Vs. Kraft Field Advantage Newman Hockey REA vs. None Advantage REA Wrestling BSA Vs. None Advantage BSA Volleyball Benson Bunker Fieldhouse Vs. Hyslop Advantage Hyslop. I think with that total NDSU has 4 better arenas and UND has 2 better arenas. I wouldn't call that second fiddle for NDSU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoggy Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 Granted Hyslop is old, but we have a new arena on the way (that vball will use as well). And we aren't going DIAA. How about you guys? I'm serious here, because I've been to your bball arena and it isn't any better than Hyslop. If you want to be DI you have a lot of improvements to make to facitilities. Tough to compare baseball, because neither owns the field and that field wasn't built for the bison. As for the SSI stuff. I'm glad that UNA's having to come here has proved why we can't play the thundering turd. I always have bragged about the rivalry when I've traveled and I'd love to see it continue, but it isn't worth the risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonguy Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 Tough to compare baseball, because neither owns the field and that field wasn't built for the bison. From: Newman Outdoor Field Facts... Built as a joint venture between the RedHawks, the City of Fargo and NDSU NDSU could have built their own stadium, but instead opted to wait for a collaborative effort, which yielded a greater result. Newman Outdoor Field is located on NDSU property, and has a NDSU primary tenant clause much like the Fargodome. I still don't understand why UND didn't push to have the Alerus built on UND property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinnesotaNorthStar Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 Basketball Bison Sports Arena Vs. Hyslop Sports Center Advantage BSA I thought we were playing in REA this year for basketball...or is that next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 In all fairness, I would agree about baseball and (for now) basketball and volleyball. The Hyslop is a dump. That's just how I feel. It's a confusing building that the only sense of it is to those who made the building. It remains the only building on UND's campus that I still can't figure my way around. We are building a new bball and vball facility. We will possibly have a new swimming and diving facility in 2-5 years. If you ask me, the new sports complex is fine, but I think we should implode Hyslop and rebuild it into a better facility. I've been to Newman field. It's really nice. As for the FargoDome vs Alerus, I think it really makes no difference either way. I've been to both facilities for football and ALerus looks and is newer, but they are pretty equal. Atmosphere is a different argument. Hockey and Wrestling are nonfactors unless you use the bball games at the Ralph as a factor because NDSU has no hockey program. But, it is a great facility. Other than that, I think the assessment is right on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 I thought we were playing in REA this year for basketball...or is that next year. Next year. This year, sore arses on wooden benches Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 I will give you that REA is a top notch facility but playing second fiddle, I think not. Let's do a little comparison on sports: Football FargoDome Vs. Alerus Center Advatage FargoDome Basketball Bison Sports Arena Vs. Hyslop Sports Center Advantage BSA Baseball Newman Outdoor Field Vs. Kraft Field Advantage Newman Hockey REA vs. None Advantage REA Wrestling BSA Vs. None Advantage BSA Volleyball Benson Bunker Fieldhouse Vs. Hyslop Advantage Hyslop. I think with that total NDSU has 4 better arenas and UND has 2 better arenas. I wouldn't call that second fiddle for NDSU. Let's run through this with the real facilities that matter: Next year's. I'm going to do this in a boxing "ten point must" system. Football FargoDome Vs. Alerus Center FargoDome 10-8. It wins on capacity, but gives points on atmosphere. Basketball Bison Sports Arena Vs. Ralph Engelstad Arena (yes, hoops moves in next year) REA 10-1. The only comparison is that both have courts and roofs. Baseball Newman Outdoor Field Vs. Kraft Field Newman 10-5. But does anyone north of Omaha (without a dome) care about college baseball? Hockey REA vs. None REA 10-0. Wrestling BSA Vs. (with no wrestling program any more, put the old facility here, Hyslop) BSA 10-8. Seating capacity. Volleyball Benson Bunker Fieldhouse Vs. Ralph Engelstad Arena Sport Center. REA-SC 10-1. The Benson-Bunker-Bombshelter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonguy Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 Sicatoka, If you're going to throw old facilities in as well as new, give NDSU five points for the Coliseum for hockey. If you give five points for Kraft Field, the Coliseum is easily worth five points . I've seen better baseball fields at Fargo elementary schools. Better hockey facilities than the Coliseum at GF elementary schools further proves the Coliseum/Kraft equivalence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bisonfan1234 Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 The revamped BSA (won't be done next year) should be pretty nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoggy Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 From: Newman Outdoor Field Facts... NDSU could have built their own stadium, but instead opted to wait for a collaborative effort, which yielded a greater result. Newman Outdoor Field is located on NDSU property, and has a NDSU primary tenant clause much like the Fargodome. I still don't understand why UND didn't push to have the Alerus built on UND property. My bad on the baseball stadium. I just assumed Fargo/Redhawks owned it. Out of curiosity, where did NDSU get the money for a joint venture. Was it fb revenue or an alumni drive or something else? I'm curious, because I keep hearing rumblings from people to make sure UND doesn't use public funds (i.e. state money for the school) to build their sports complexes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonguy Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 cheeringsiouxfromsmoggycali, I dont' know if it was a financial part on NDSU's behalf, or just a donation/lease of the land for Newman Field. I do know that Erv Inniger asked the baseball players/staff if they wanted a decent new stadium (they had the funds for it), or if they wanted to wait to see if they could have a really nice stadium(FM was still trying to land a Northern League team at the time). They decided to wait. I believe NDSU leases the Fargodome land for $.01 for 99 years, contingent that it is first/foremost a facility for NDSU activities. The NDSU football staff may even be moving their offices into the Fargodome as a permanent part of the BSA renovation. It just seems strange to me that UND plays football in an arena that they don't have anything to do with, and don't hold any leverage with. It seems feesible that the Alerus management could put UND between a rock and a hard place if they really wanted to raise the rates a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinnesotaNorthStar Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 Sicatoka, If you're going to throw old facilities in as well as new, give NDSU five points for the Coliseum for hockey. If you give five points for Kraft Field, the Coliseum is easily worth five points . I've seen better baseball fields at Fargo elementary schools. Better hockey facilities than the Coliseum at GF elementary schools further proves the Coliseum/Kraft equivalence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoteauRinkRat Posted December 5, 2003 Share Posted December 5, 2003 The revamped BSA (won't be done next year) should be pretty nice. A revamped BSA is still not going to be that great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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