Big Sky Conference

[SiouxDini]

I call it like I see it. People around were giving Tom Douple crap for getting schooled by Doug Fullerton. I just pointed out that it appears Douple got the last laugh.

I think the "dream come true" is yet to be determined. Let's see what the Montana schools decide.

A situation in the BSC without the Montana schools is still better than getting shafted by the Summit/MVFC and BSC and being in the Summit/Independent for football any day.

[HawksHoops]

Looks like Wayne thinks USD is heading to the MVC. Congrats to them, but I can't wait to see the Sioux in the BSC!

http://waynenelson.areavoices.com/2010/11/04/yotes-make-decision/

[mksioux]

A situation in the BSC without the Montana schools is still better than getting shafted by the Summit/MVFC and BSC and being in the Summit/Independent for football any day.

I never said anything to the contrary.

But UND would clearly be in the worst position of the Dakota schools.

[SiouxDini]

I never said anything to the contrary.

But UND would clearly be in the worst position of the Dakota schools.

Possibly but not necessarily...a bet of a pessimist?

[jimdahl]

The MVFC had no intention of adding both UND and USD under any conditions. They didn't plan to add any schools right now. They didn't want to go to 10 teams and definitely wouldn't have gone to 11. So waiting wouldn't have gotten UND into the MVFC.

If USD has received an invite to the MVFC and take it as it sounds like may be happening, they probably would have done the same thing if UND were still waiting with them. Their move to the Big Sky had to be approved by their Board of Regents. It still would have taken this long, even if UND were still waiting with them. The MVFC would have had the same amount of time to change their mind and make an offer to USD. They probably still would have made an offer to only USD and not UND. And USD probably would make the same decision because the Board of Regents would look at cost of travel and having USD in the same conference as SDSU. No matter how UND played the game, the result for USD doesn't change and neither does the result for UND.

Yep. This theory that MVFC secretly wanted USD but couldn't offer until UND was out of the way just doesn't make sense to me. The two weren't selling themselves as a pair -- USD went to Summit 18 months ago, and would've similarly gone to MVFC if invited.

If true, that USD being about to jump ship on the Summit managed to pressure MVFC into making an offer is great for USD; but it's seemingly quite unlikely that any similar offer would have ever been available to UND (a similar threat was clearly there, in that Summit moved up its visit, but as far as I know MVFC didn't care). In that case, UND's choices were: Summit + FB independent or Big Sky all sports.

If rumors are true, still surprising to me how both the Big Sky leadership and South Dakota media had it so wrong as recently as this evening. If it goes that way, it would seem like the Board had a hand in it, that exiting the Summit wasn't as trivial as expected, or that the hypothetical MVFC invitation even caught USD completely off guard.

[Bigdog42]

I don't think the Big Sky would have withdrawn the invitation if UND had held out a few more days.

And UND and USD were not in completely different situations. They were in slightly different situations.

Totally agree with you, Fasion and Kelly go to the state board to speed up the process for the removal of the nickname so we can get a site visit from the summit. Next, the summit is going to visit but we decide to cancel the visit because the BSC offers a full membership which we accept right away without our so called "partner" USD getting the proper agreements necessary because we wanted to look like big shots! So, USD struggles to get the approvals and in the mean time the MVFC invites USD to their conference starting 2012. One of the struggles was the buyout money which UND should have been talking to USD and maybe even helped them out in that scenerio so we have our partner. Why not wait and make it a package deal with USD? I thought we were travel partners and partners throughout the transition. So, why not wait a week and stroke your own ego until everyone is on the same page? Yeah, we look like idiots again just like we did when RT thought it was dumb to move up to DIAA. We have a serious problem with leadership at UND for the past 10-15 years.

Please don't come back and say it is hindsight because USD left us and we didn't see it coming. YOU JUST DON'T LET IT COME DOWN TO THAT!!! You cover your ass. We deserve to be the only team within 800 miles to our closest conference member. We deserve it if Montana and Montana State leave and are stuck with a $hity conference. What are you going to tell me next? The alumni need to donate more because of the expenses while the people asking for the money don't know their head from their @$$. Yeah, I am taking some shots here but they are well deserved. If you don't think this is accurate you are only kidding yourself. If and when others laugh at us we should almost be laughing at ourselves for the terrible moves we have made.

Alright, I think that covers a little bit of what is on my chest about our horse $hit administration but my main point is UND lacks of strategic vision!!!!

[dmksioux]

Unfortunately I tend to agree with a lot of what MKSioux and BigDog are saying. I will say that if Montana stays in the Big Sky, then we will be fine. Should they leave, I guess the only silver lining I see in this mess is that our chances to make the playoffs go up a bit...

[homer]

Totally agree with you, Fasion and Kelly go to the state board to speed up the process for the removal of the nickname so we can get a site visit from the summit. Next, the summit is going to visit but we decide to cancel the visit because the BSC offers a full membership which we accept right away without our so called "partner" USD getting the proper agreements necessary because we wanted to look like big shots! So, USD struggles to get the approvals and in the mean time the MVFC invites USD to their conference starting 2012. One of the struggles was the buyout money which UND should have been talking to USD and maybe even helped them out in that scenerio so we have our partner. Why not wait and make it a package deal with USD? I thought we were travel partners and partners throughout the transition. So, why not wait a week and stroke your own ego until everyone is on the same page? Yeah, we look like idiots again just like we did when RT thought it was dumb to move up to DIAA. We have a serious problem with leadership at UND for the past 10-15 years.

Please don't come back and say it is hindsight because USD left us and we didn't see it coming. YOU JUST DON'T LET IT COME DOWN TO THAT!!! You cover your ass. We deserve to be the only team within 800 miles to our closest conference member. We deserve it if Montana and Montana State leave and are stuck with a $hity conference. What are you going to tell me next? The alumni need to donate more because of the expenses while the people asking for the money don't know their head from their @$$. Yeah, I am taking some shots here but they are well deserved. If you don't think this is accurate you are only kidding yourself. If and when others laugh at us we should almost be laughing at ourselves for the terrible moves we have made.

Alright, I think that covers a little bit of what is on my chest about our horse $hit administration but my main point is UND lacks of strategic vision!!!!

You can have the Summit/Independent. I'll take the Big Sky for all sports. Sitting and waiting for the Summit offer and than being an independent in football is a lack of vision. That was the only given in this whole process. It has yet to be seen how the current set up will play out. Maybe it will be terrible but I still think we are better off being in the Big Sky. Others can laugh all they want, I won't lose any sleep over it. Bottom line is there are a lot of good things going on at UND right now, some that have not even been announced yet and a decision by USD is not going to change that.

[82SiouxGuy]

Totally agree with you, Fasion and Kelly go to the state board to speed up the process for the removal of the nickname so we can get a site visit from the summit. Next, the summit is going to visit but we decide to cancel the visit because the BSC offers a full membership which we accept right away without our so called "partner" USD getting the proper agreements necessary because we wanted to look like big shots! So, USD struggles to get the approvals and in the mean time the MVFC invites USD to their conference starting 2012. One of the struggles was the buyout money which UND should have been talking to USD and maybe even helped them out in that scenerio so we have our partner. Why not wait and make it a package deal with USD? I thought we were travel partners and partners throughout the transition. So, why not wait a week and stroke your own ego until everyone is on the same page? Yeah, we look like idiots again just like we did when RT thought it was dumb to move up to DIAA. We have a serious problem with leadership at UND for the past 10-15 years.

Please don't come back and say it is hindsight because USD left us and we didn't see it coming. YOU JUST DON'T LET IT COME DOWN TO THAT!!! You cover your ass. We deserve to be the only team within 800 miles to our closest conference member. We deserve it if Montana and Montana State leave and are stuck with a $hity conference. What are you going to tell me next? The alumni need to donate more because of the expenses while the people asking for the money don't know their head from their @$$. Yeah, I am taking some shots here but they are well deserved. If you don't think this is accurate you are only kidding yourself. If and when others laugh at us we should almost be laughing at ourselves for the terrible moves we have made.

Alright, I think that covers a little bit of what is on my chest about our horse $hit administration but my main point is UND lacks of strategic vision!!!!

Do you believe that the MVFC would have taken UND? Do you believe that USD would have said no to the MVFC and yes to the Big Sky just because UND was standing beside them waiting for a conference? Neither situation would have happened under any conditions. You're fooling yourself if you think UND waiting would have changed this situation in any way. USD said yes to the Summit without UND many months ago. They decided to do what was in their best interest without regard to UND. Nothing wrong with that. But they aren't going to change that strategy at this time. They planned to switch to the Big Sky because that was what was best for them at the time, they thought it was their only chance at a home for football. It had nothing to do with whether UND went with them or not. If the MVFC has come calling then they would take that option because they believe it is best for them. It wouldn't matter where UND stood on either issue. UND had 2 options, Big Sky for all sports or Summit for most sports plus football as an independent. It didn't matter if USD was standing beside them or not. Those were UND's options. UND made the right decision.

[UND1983]

You can have the Summit/Independent. I'll take the Big Sky for all sports. Sitting and waiting for the Summit offer and than being an independent in football is a lack of vision. That was the only given in this whole process. It has yet to be seen how the current set up will play out. Maybe it will be terrible but I still think we are better off being in the Big Sky. Others can laugh all they want, I won't lose any sleep over it. Bottom line is there are a lot of good things going on at UND right now, some that have not even been announced yet and a decision by USD is not going to change that.

Agreed.

Everyone listen up: the invite from the MVFC was not coming. I repeat, it was NOT coming. We had 1 choice if we wanted FB to be in a conference.

I am not upset at all by this.

[nd1sufan]

Who will be UND's travel partner in the Big Sky? Any ideas?

[UND1983]

Who will be UND's travel partner in the Big Sky? Any ideas?

Who cares?

[Bigdog42]

You can have the Summit/Independent. I'll take the Big Sky for all sports. Sitting and waiting for the Summit offer and than being an independent in football is a lack of vision. That was the only given in this whole process. It has yet to be seen how the current set up will play out. Maybe it will be terrible but I still think we are better off being in the Big Sky. Others can laugh all they want, I won't lose any sleep over it. Bottom line is there are a lot of good things going on at UND right now, some that have not even been announced yet and a decision by USD is not going to change that.

homer - You are missing the whole point and here is a fact for you. If UND waits a week to announce the acceptance with USD none of this happens and we are both in the same conference as travel partners. Please don't tell me big things have not been announced yet without telling us, otherwise the only big thing is the your own ego by saying this! We all know there is going to be an indoor practice facility. It was talked about when I was playing there and I am getting old. You don't care if others are laughing, especially when they are recruits. Oh, now you care!

[mksioux]

Who cares?

The other ten Big Sky schools. That's who.

I guess it has to be UNC? Place the two isolated outlier schools together.

[UND1983]

homer - You are missing the whole point and here is a fact for you. If UND waits a week to announce the acceptance with USD none of this happens and we are both in the same conference as travel partners. Please don't tell me big things have not been announced yet without telling us, otherwise the only big thing is the your own ego by saying this! We all know there is going to be an indoor practice facility. It was talked about when I was playing there and I am getting old. You don't care if others are laughing, especially when they are recruits. Oh, now you care!

So if UND waits a week that means the MVFC doesn't offer USD? They obviously had a plan to take 1 team. If we wait then we look really bad for telling the BSC to hold on, then finding out that the MVFC only wants one team and it isn't us. How do we win by waiting?

UND only had one date to dance with, the BSC.

[jimdahl]

The way this all developed is just so weird. Here's another quote, from yesterday:

USD hunt for league edges near Big Sky (Argus Leader)

Talk among fans has persisted in recent days that USD's delay in announcing a commitment to the Big Sky - rumored for more than a week now - has to do with the potential for a last-minute invitation to the Missouri Valley for football. Sayler, as he did last week, said there have been no discussions.

"Nothing that we're doing now is based on the hope that something can be done with the Missouri Valley Football Conference," Sayler said. "They've made their decisions. There's no debate going on here."

Monday, Big Sky said agreement with USD was done, just needed to be rubber stamped.

Tuesday, USD athletic director said deal is in hands of the Board of Regents, but MVFC isn't even on the table, no discussions.

Wednesday, local S.D. press say repeatedly that Big Sky is a done deal.

Anyway, here's the first official press mention:

USD expected to join Missouri Valley football, stay in Summit (Argus Leader)

USD officials would not comment Wednesday on the 11th-hour negotiations, but word spread quickly that the school would be turning its back on the Big Sky, which welcomed the University of North Dakota and Southern Utah on Monday.

Fullerton said in a statement that “the dealing between the conference and USD is done. We’ve agreed to the terms. The letter is signed by the Big Sky and waiting for the (USD) president’s signature.”

Wednesday, the commissioner said nothing had changed, but he didn’t have a signature.

“This is the first I’ve heard of it,” Fullerton said Wednesday afternoon when asked about Missouri Valley officials attempting to woo USD. “I didn’t get any indication of that at all.”

Summit League officials were mum during the process, but the conference’s commissioner said Wednesday that the Summit and USD had communicated since Monday.

“I better say ‘no comment,’ ” commissioner Tom Douple said when asked about new developments.

He did, however, confirm that he has had discussions with the Coyotes since news broke that they were “on the verge” of joining another league, as the Big Sky release worded it earlier this week.

“I think (today) it will resolve itself,” he added.

[mksioux]

From eGriz:

Did North Dakota just get Utah Stated?

LOL.

[Bigdog42]

Who cares?

Take off your kelly green sun glasses and look at this with an outsiders view point. The whole fricken conference cares!! I really hope you are not serious. Love the passion but wake up!

[Smoggy]

Take off your kelly green sun glasses and look at this with an outsiders view point. The whole fricken conference cares!! I really hope you are not serious. Love the passion but wake up!

I think you need to read who wrote the original post bc it was an ndsufan who doesn't mind taking jabs at us.

[mksioux]

I think you need to read who wrote the original post bc it was an ndsufan who doesn't mind taking jabs at us.

Nevertheless, it's a completely legitimate question. One without a good answer.

[Bigdog42]

I think you need to read who wrote the original post bc it was an ndsufan who doesn't mind taking jabs at us.

The NDSU posters has a great point and response was we should care who our travel partner is because the rest of the BSC cares.

[nodakvindy]

The one thing that could have been done was to keep everything quiet until all three schools (SUU, UND and USD) were on board and all the contracts were signed. Leaks and unofficial announcements have no long term value and created the opportunity for the MVFC to swoop in at the last minute.

That said, I think the idea that going to the Summit automatically meant football independence is also overstated. Football only was done for Davis and Poly, how hard did UND actually push for that. Were football only options like the Southland or Big South even explored?

Finally, snubbing the Summit was just plain foolish. What was gained by the thinly veiled comments at Tom Douple? I think it's a little ironic that people have talked about the DI move being a marathon and not a sprint, but then throwing that right out the window with this Big Sky invite.

Sure hindsight is 20/20, but a lot of this comes down to ego and hubris, and unfortunately that's a problem that has hurt UND for a while and apparently continues to do so.

[Smoggy]

The NDSU posters has a great point and response was we should care who our travel partner is because the rest of the BSC cares.

I don't think it's that big of a deal, and I read it like a jab at us.

It's not a necessary thing. Somehow SUU was in summit without traveling partner. ndsufan should know this. It's looking like TCU will be offered Big East and maybe they want all sports in or not. Either way, they won't have a travel partner. Hell they don't have a travel partner now that they are in Mountain West, They are only central time zone school.

[bincitysioux]

I call it like I see it. People around were giving Tom Douple crap for getting schooled by Doug Fullerton.

Douple did get schooled by Doug Fullerton............................Fullerton got the University of North Dakota in his conference, Douple got the three stooges of the Dakotas.

If UND waits a week to announce the acceptance with USD none of this happens and we are both in the same conference as travel partners.

Not really understanding this argument. Even if a week wait would have allowed USD to get their BOR in a board room, Abbott and Sayler would have still showed their hand to the Summit when they started talking to Douple about the exit fee and then the MVFC would have been brought into the picture a week later with the same result.

UND & the Big Sky delaying their announcement by a week would have resulted in USD announcing their intentions to join the MVFC on November 11 rather than November 4.

I guess the biggest effect this will have on me is that I don't have to drive to Vermillion every other year anymore.

Hello Big Sky!!

[mksioux]

Douple did get schooled by Doug Fullerton............................Fullerton got the University of North Dakota in his conference, Douple got the three stooges of the Dakotas.

It's pretty clear that Fullerton did not want just UND. And I don't think it's too much of a leap to think that he sold UND and USD to the Presidents as a package deal. I wonder how the rest of the Big Sky is going to feel about UND now?