jdub27 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 i wish someone at the herald (brad s) would straight up ask this question to faison...and get a truthful answer! The number isn't a big secret. I've sat through presentations that Jody has done where its been openly laid out, though this was a few years ago so I don't remember what they were or know what they are currently. It is probably listed somewhere in their tax returns which are available freely online due to them being a non-profit or possibly even in the UND Foundation annual report. Also remember that cash flow from the Ralph also pay back the bonds that were used to build the Betty. I'm not sure if the services the REA provides (tickets,etc) are netted out before or after money exchanges hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 The number isn't a big secret. I've sat through presentations that Jody has done where its been openly laid out, though this was a few years ago so I don't remember what they were or know what they are currently. It is probably listed somewhere in their tax returns which are available freely online due to them being a non-profit or possibly even in the UND Foundation annual report. Also remember that cash flow from the Ralph also pay back the bonds that were used to build the Betty. I'm not sure if the services the REA provides (tickets,etc) are netted out before or after money exchanges hands. It seems like you know more than I do - here are some of my basic questions that I have never seen answered publically - not saying they aren't public, just that I haven't seen the answers: Who gets the ticket revenue for hockey games - I would assume UND gets it all, but would like to know for sure Who gets the money from concessions? How much is that for hockey per year? What are the arrangements for profits from the Sioux Shop? Does UND athletics "pay" rent to the Ralph for games or practice ice time? In other words, for the hockey season who gets what revenue from games? For me, this is quite a different set of information than how much The Corporation send back to Sioux Sports (after expenses) - My calculations may be way off here, but assuming UND athletics gets the entire ticket gate for hockey games, the New Ralph holds at least 5,000 more than the old Ralph. At a ticket cost of 37.50 per ticket and a season of 22 home games, that should be $4,125,000 more revenue per year - not including the associated costs for season tickets such as Club membership in order to purchase tickets.Plus what The Ralph rolls back to UND. It it works like this, that's a lot of new revenue. This is what has never made sense to me - we have a free new venue which seats 5,000 more people and our Athletic Department is so broke we have to operate some DI sports "on a DII budget" . Why don't we have millions more per year? If we are not getting all the money for admissions, we are getting hosed. If we are, why didn't we see a big bump in revenue? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmksioux Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It seems like you know more than I do - here are some of my basic questions that I have never seen answered publically - not saying they aren't public, just that I haven't seen the answers: Who gets the ticket revenue for hockey games - I would assume UND gets it all, but would like to know for sure Who gets the money from concessions? How much is that for hockey per year? What are the arrangements for profits from the Sioux Shop? Does UND athletics "pay" rent to the Ralph for games or practice ice time? In other words, for the hockey season who gets what revenue from games? For me, this is quite a different set of information than how much The Corporation send back to Sioux Sports (after expenses) - My calculations may be way off here, but assuming UND athletics gets the entire ticket gate for hockey games, the New Ralph holds at least 5,000 more than the old Ralph. At a ticket cost of 37.50 per ticket and a season of 22 home games, that should be $4,125,000 more revenue per year - not including the associated costs for season tickets such as Club membership in order to purchase tickets.Plus what The Ralph rolls back to UND. It it works like this, that's a lot of new revenue. This is what has never made sense to me - we have a free new venue which seats 5,000 more people and our Athletic Department is so broke we have to operate some DI sports "on a DII budget" . Why don't we have millions more per year? If we are not getting all the money for admissions, we are getting hosed. If we are, why didn't we see a big bump in revenue? Just a guess: Women's Hockey, increased scholarships for football, and increased travel costs while already being near maxed out in advertising revenue. Keep in mind I have no knowledge on any of UND's budget numbers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It seems like you know more than I do - here are some of my basic questions that I have never seen answered publically - not saying they aren't public, just that I haven't seen the answers: Who gets the ticket revenue for hockey games - I would assume UND gets it all, but would like to know for sure Who gets the money from concessions? How much is that for hockey per year? What are the arrangements for profits from the Sioux Shop? Does UND athletics "pay" rent to the Ralph for games or practice ice time? In other words, for the hockey season who gets what revenue from games? For me, this is quite a different set of information than how much The Corporation send back to Sioux Sports (after expenses) - My calculations may be way off here, but assuming UND athletics gets the entire ticket gate for hockey games, the New Ralph holds at least 5,000 more than the old Ralph. At a ticket cost of 37.50 per ticket and a season of 22 home games, that should be $4,125,000 more revenue per year - not including the associated costs for season tickets such as Club membership in order to purchase tickets.Plus what The Ralph rolls back to UND. It it works like this, that's a lot of new revenue. This is what has never made sense to me - we have a free new venue which seats 5,000 more people and our Athletic Department is so broke we have to operate some DI sports "on a DII budget" . Why don't we have millions more per year? If we are not getting all the money for admissions, we are getting hosed. If we are, why didn't we see a big bump in revenue? The information I was told was a few years back but guessing most of it still holds true. If anyone sees anything that is incorrect, feel free correct it. -UND gets the ticket price for the hockey games, season and single game (less all the fees attached on). They do contrac with the REA for handling the ticket sales -Concessions and Sioux Shop I'm not as sure on. Some of the concessions are run by outside vendors (Little Caesar's, TCBY, Red Pepper, etc) and pay some sort of rent, I believe the rest are run by the REA in some fashion. That goes through the REA's financials (UND Sports Facilities Inc). Sioux Shop might be the same but its also possible it might be a separate entity, again not sure on that one. -I believe that UND and the REA have a usage agreement. I don't know what that dollar amount is but I believe the terms are favorable for UND. -The other thing I'm not sure about is how the suite arrangement is done or what the revenue split on that is. This year UND would have received $405 from all season ticket holders as that was the cost of the tickets (a little over $18/game this year). The Champions Club would have received the donations that were required for those tickets. You also need to account for increase in the number of student tickets in your calculation. And again, UND contracts with the REA to handle all the ticket sales, distribution, etc. Total ticket sales for the entire athletic department were just under $4.1 million last year. Not sure how much of this helps but it is my understanding of how things work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I believe UND Sports Facilities, Inc, was set up as a not-for-profit entity. Looking online they file a Form 990 (so that makes sense). As such, if they make money (revenues > expenses) they need to donate it to a named charitable organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I believe UND Sports Facilities, Inc, was set up as a not-for-profit entity. Looking online they file a Form 990 (so that makes sense). As such, if they make money (revenues > expenses) they need to donate it to a named charitable organization. The three non-profits that are involved in running the REA are UND Arena Services (management of the REA) , UND Sports Facilities Inc (day to day operations of the REA) and Ralph Engelstad Arena (owner of the actual building). UND Sports Facilities pays UND Arena Services a management fee every year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post southpaw Posted February 11, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted February 11, 2015 I am giving what I think is a reasonable amount, and am not sure that if I gave more it would go towards any increase in competitiveness as that doesn't seem to by high on our AD's priorities. I'm curious why so many people bring this up, yet there isn't a lot of proof to back up the claim. Faison fired Mussman and hired Bubba to increase the competitiveness of the team. Faison brought in a great volleyball coach after being forced to fire Hardee. Faison secured the building of the IPF, which undoubtedly will help increase the quality of the teams in all sports. Is it all because he hasn't fired a basketball coach who finished 3rd and 2nd respectively in his two years in the big sky? Or because there isn't a video board in the Betty? I'm curious why so many people think this and what are some examples. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Cause NDSU is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 The information I was told was a few years back but guessing most of it still holds true. If anyone sees anything that is incorrect, feel free correct it. -UND gets the ticket price for the hockey games, season and single game (less all the fees attached on). They do contrac with the REA for handling the ticket sales -Concessions and Sioux Shop I'm not as sure on. Some of the concessions are run by outside vendors (Little Caesar's, TCBY, Red Pepper, etc) and pay some sort of rent, I believe the rest are run by the REA in some fashion. That goes through the REA's financials (UND Sports Facilities Inc). Sioux Shop might be the same but its also possible it might be a separate entity, again not sure on that one. -I believe that UND and the REA have a usage agreement. I don't know what that dollar amount is but I believe the terms are favorable for UND. -The other thing I'm not sure about is how the suite arrangement is done or what the revenue split on that is. This year UND would have received $405 from all season ticket holders as that was the cost of the tickets (a little over $18/game this year). The Champions Club would have received the donations that were required for those tickets. You also need to account for increase in the number of student tickets in your calculation. And again, UND contracts with the REA to handle all the ticket sales, distribution, etc. Total ticket sales for the entire athletic department were just under $4.1 million last year. Not sure how much of this helps but it is my understanding of how things work. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I'm curious why so many people bring this up, yet there isn't a lot of proof to back up the claim. Faison fired Mussman and hired Bubba to increase the competitiveness of the team. Faison brought in a great volleyball coach after being forced to fire Hardee. Faison secured the building of the IPF, which undoubtedly will help increase the quality of the teams in all sports. Is it all because he hasn't fired a basketball coach who finished 3rd and 2nd respectively in his two years in the big sky? Or because there isn't a video board in the Betty? I'm curious why so many people think this and what are some examples. This is a really good question and made me think a bit about my answer - - I'm not thrilled with his interpersonal skills - not that being a rah rah guy is always the answer, but he gives us absolutely nothing to rally around or get emotionally excited about. He may care deeply about winning but hasn't expressed that to the fans in a way that gets anyone fired up - Yes, he finally pulled the trigger on Muss, but in my opinion, let things go way too long to the point where we need a massive rebuilding project to become competative again. He also gave Muss a contract extension which we had to eat. This at a time when our sister school to the south is having unprecidented success - I'm really tired of hearing from my NDSU buddies - If he cared about winning, something would have been done after Sioux Falls - Men's basketball isn't really a program that people are going to rally behind in its current state. I'm worried Jones is another Muss and it will take us another 5 years to make a change. - Poor luck and timing - Many fans I know of are frustrated with our overall athletic situation and when you add in the second longest title drought in history in Men's Hockey (been discussed, not saying it's Faison's fault or to fire Hak - just frustrating) - Our place as the best school in the state by far is being threatened by the AC, who anyone can see has the fire in their belly. Faison has all the excitement of an accountant. - There have been no signature wins anywhere to get excited about. - Need something to rally around for fundraising - I'm worried that if I give more it will go to a Jones extension like he did with Muss - He has done some good things like the conference allignments, but for crap's sake we really need a big winner. Really. North Dakota needs to be buzzing about UND sports again. - Maybe that's the answer to your question - go to any town in North Dakota and start talking about athletics and what school comes up? Didn't used to be that way, even when the Bison were winning DII championships. - 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightingsioux4life Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 This is a really good question and made me think a bit about my answer - - I'm not thrilled with his interpersonal skills - not that being a rah rah guy is always the answer, but he gives us absolutely nothing to rally around or get emotionally excited about. He may care deeply about winning but hasn't expressed that to the fans in a way that gets anyone fired up - Yes, he finally pulled the trigger on Muss, but in my opinion, let things go way too long to the point where we need a massive rebuilding project to become competative again. He also gave Muss a contract extension which we had to eat. This at a time when our sister school to the south is having unprecidented success - I'm really tired of hearing from my NDSU buddies - If he cared about winning, something would have been done after Sioux Falls - Men's basketball isn't really a program that people are going to rally behind in its current state. I'm worried Jones is another Muss and it will take us another 5 years to make a change. - Poor luck and timing - Many fans I know of are frustrated with our overall athletic situation and when you add in the second longest title drought in history in Men's Hockey (been discussed, not saying it's Faison's fault or to fire Hak - just frustrating) - Our place as the best school in the state by far is being threatened by the AC, who anyone can see has the fire in their belly. Faison has all the excitement of an accountant. - There have been no signature wins anywhere to get excited about. - Need something to rally around for fundraising - I'm worried that if I give more it will go to a Jones extension like he did with Muss - He has done some good things like the conference allignments, but for crap's sake we really need a big winner. Really. North Dakota needs to be buzzing about UND sports again. - Maybe that's the answer to your question - go to any town in North Dakota and start talking about athletics and what school comes up? Didn't used to be that way, even when the Bison were winning DII championships. - Nice summary on how I feel about things. And I am glad I am not the only one that feels this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND-FB-FAN Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 This is a really good question and made me think a bit about my answer - - I'm not thrilled with his interpersonal skills - not that being a rah rah guy is always the answer, but he gives us absolutely nothing to rally around or get emotionally excited about. He may care deeply about winning but hasn't expressed that to the fans in a way that gets anyone fired up - Yes, he finally pulled the trigger on Muss, but in my opinion, let things go way too long to the point where we need a massive rebuilding project to become competative again. He also gave Muss a contract extension which we had to eat. This at a time when our sister school to the south is having unprecidented success - I'm really tired of hearing from my NDSU buddies - If he cared about winning, something would have been done after Sioux Falls - Men's basketball isn't really a program that people are going to rally behind in its current state. I'm worried Jones is another Muss and it will take us another 5 years to make a change. - Poor luck and timing - Many fans I know of are frustrated with our overall athletic situation and when you add in the second longest title drought in history in Men's Hockey (been discussed, not saying it's Faison's fault or to fire Hak - just frustrating) - Our place as the best school in the state by far is being threatened by the AC, who anyone can see has the fire in their belly. Faison has all the excitement of an accountant. - There have been no signature wins anywhere to get excited about. - Need something to rally around for fundraising - I'm worried that if I give more it will go to a Jones extension like he did with Muss - He has done some good things like the conference allignments, but for crap's sake we really need a big winner. Really. North Dakota needs to be buzzing about UND sports again. - Maybe that's the answer to your question - go to any town in North Dakota and start talking about athletics and what school comes up? Didn't used to be that way, even when the Bison were winning DII championships. - I also agree with this. It's not a sin to be ambitious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow6 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Irish for AD! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niouxsiouxfan Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Let me say it before someone from %gobc... Jones is NOT getting an extension anytime soon. When the team does better next year, I believe he wouldn't even get it then. He would/should be evaluated in his final year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niouxsiouxfan Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Very well stated Irish! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneksioux Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Well said Irish. Also, I'm curious what jones does if anything to be involved in the community. I haven't heard of any programs the basketball team gets involved in for gf's youth. Maybe I'm wrong here and they are very involved and I just haven't noticed. But if they want to boost the team's hype without winning I think this would be the first place to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niouxsiouxfan Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Well said Irish. Also, I'm curious what jones does if anything to be involved in the community. I haven't heard of any programs the basketball team gets involved in for gf's youth. Maybe I'm wrong here and they are very involved and I just haven't noticed. But if they want to boost the team's hype without winning I think this would be the first place to start. I know they do different things as a team in the community for different charities. In the spring/summer the guys coach local basketball kids. Of course they have their camp as well that the players coach in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoopster Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 As most informed people are well aware of coaches are almost always given extensions vs letting contract expire. The very obvious reason is that recruits prefer to have an pretty good idea who their college coach will be . Think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND-FB-FAN Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 As most informed people are well aware of coaches are almost always given extensions vs letting contract expire. The very obvious reason is that recruits prefer to have an pretty good idea who their college coach will be . Think! Recently at UND, under Faison as AD, extensions have been offered as a way to make up for a lack of salary dollars. When Mussman was HC for the football team, he was paid minimally compared to other Big Sky coaches; therefore, an extension was drafted as a compromise. Ultimately, it had to be bought out. Fortunately, I think Faison and the athletic department will not be extending Jones' contract; however, it's too bad they gave him an extension a couple seasons ago. The mindset was applied there as well, as Jones is once again paid minimally compared to other Big Sky men's basketball coaches. In the end, Faison may still end up having to buy out the last year of Jones' contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpaw Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 This is a really good question and made me think a bit about my answer - - I'm not thrilled with his interpersonal skills - not that being a rah rah guy is always the answer, but he gives us absolutely nothing to rally around or get emotionally excited about. He may care deeply about winning but hasn't expressed that to the fans in a way that gets anyone fired up - Yes, he finally pulled the trigger on Muss, but in my opinion, let things go way too long to the point where we need a massive rebuilding project to become competative again. He also gave Muss a contract extension which we had to eat. This at a time when our sister school to the south is having unprecidented success - I'm really tired of hearing from my NDSU buddies - If he cared about winning, something would have been done after Sioux Falls - Men's basketball isn't really a program that people are going to rally behind in its current state. I'm worried Jones is another Muss and it will take us another 5 years to make a change. - Poor luck and timing - Many fans I know of are frustrated with our overall athletic situation and when you add in the second longest title drought in history in Men's Hockey (been discussed, not saying it's Faison's fault or to fire Hak - just frustrating) - Our place as the best school in the state by far is being threatened by the AC, who anyone can see has the fire in their belly. Faison has all the excitement of an accountant. - There have been no signature wins anywhere to get excited about. - Need something to rally around for fundraising - I'm worried that if I give more it will go to a Jones extension like he did with Muss - He has done some good things like the conference allignments, but for crap's sake we really need a big winner. Really. North Dakota needs to be buzzing about UND sports again. - Maybe that's the answer to your question - go to any town in North Dakota and start talking about athletics and what school comes up? Didn't used to be that way, even when the Bison were winning DII championships. - Thanks for the well thought-out response. My only interactions with Brian have been through the NCHC and I can definitely see how he comes off as unemotional. He's a pretty straight forward guy who doesn't have a lot of ups or downs, at least outwardly. Remember, before Faison we had a rah-rah kind of guy in Buning and that didn't work out too well. I think Jones is definitely on Faison's radar, as he should be. I don't foresee any extension. From what I have read, this is Jones' final year under contract, although there is an option for keeping him around two more years. I would be surprised and upset if Jones is around any longer than the extension would allow. While I haven't been the loud screaming and yelling type to have Jones fired that seems pretty common (or just loud) around here, I don't think he's earned an extension. I just don't think he's forced Faison to fire him. The basketball team has the talent to win but we just haven't seen it. As was mentioned, five of the conference losses have come by 7 points or less. That's more about experience than anything. Of the 7 players who had more than 10 minutes of playing time last night, only Nash played consistently last year. Tyler, De Rouen, Shanks and Cashman weren't on the team. Hooker averaged 4 ppg and Antwi started one game all year. As for Mussman, here's quick blurb from SFI the day after he received an extension in the summer of 2012: The extension was definitely warranted for Coach Mussman. He seems to be settling into the role of Head Coach and recruiting has appeared to have gotten better each of the past 4 years. This deal is also good for the stability of the program as they exit the transition abyss and enter the beautiful views of the Big Sky Conference. The football program was inconsistent early in the transition but seemed to find some footing during this past season, going 8-3 and winning the games they should have. Their three losses were to Idaho (FBS), Fresno State (FBS) and Cal Poly, who shared the Great West Championship with UND. Not everyone, including those who are heralded for their coverage of UND football thought the Mussman extension was a bad thing. You don't really fire a coach after it seemed like things were on the up-swing. While they only beat Sioux Falls by 2 at home, they also lost at Fresno by just 5 (a game UND was leading in the 4th quarter). Mussman was named the coach of the year in the Great West for that season. Looking back at the schedule, Muss was fired about when he should have been, although earlier in the season would have been acceptable too but then you get into some coaches not applying because they don't want to abandon their team mid-season. I think the crappy timing of UND going through the transition while NDSU started getting hot in football and basketball hurt UND more than anything Faison has done. I've been defending Faison on here even before I took a look at all of the accomplishments of the UND athletic department. When I stepped outside of the "We need to be as good or better than NDSU" lens, it's pretty remarkable how the athletic department (note... athletic department, not just athletics) has continued to progress since Faison took over. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoopster Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 nothing here about having to win Big Sky Title or never having a rebuilding year....sorry fellas....In July 2012, Jones received a three-year extension with two option years. Jones has been UND's head coach for seven seasons. Last season, in UND's first year in the Big Sky Conference, Jones led UND to a 12-8 conference record and a third-place finish--the best ever for a first-year Big Sky team. UND went 16-17 overall last season, giving Jones a seven-year record of 102-114 and a conference mark of 36-43. "Coach Jones has a clear blue print for this program and the results are showing," said UND athletic director Brian Faison. "This team has had as much success as any team transitioning to the Division I level in recent years, including three straight CollegeInsider.com Postseason Tournament berths. "We saw the immediate success his team had during its first year in the Big Sky. With the program heading in the right direction, we are happy to show him this level of commitment by extending his contract." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darell1976 Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 nothing here about having to win Big Sky Title or never having a rebuilding year....sorry fellas....In July 2012, Jones received a three-year extension with two option years. Jones has been UND's head coach for seven seasons. Last season, in UND's first year in the Big Sky Conference, Jones led UND to a 12-8 conference record and a third-place finish--the best ever for a first-year Big Sky team. UND went 16-17 overall last season, giving Jones a seven-year record of 102-114 and a conference mark of 36-43. "Coach Jones has a clear blue print for this program and the results are showing," said UND athletic director Brian Faison. "This team has had as much success as any team transitioning to the Division I level in recent years, including three straight CollegeInsider.com Postseason Tournament berths. "We saw the immediate success his team had during its first year in the Big Sky. With the program heading in the right direction, we are happy to show him this level of commitment by extending his contract." Good job during transition getting to the CIT, but transition is over we shouldn't be at .500 or below and getting beat by low level teams including a DI transfer team and blown out by the instate rival. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND-FB-FAN Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 nothing here about having to win Big Sky Title or never having a rebuilding year....sorry fellas....In July 2012, Jones received a three-year extension with two option years. Jones has been UND's head coach for seven seasons. Last season, in UND's first year in the Big Sky Conference, Jones led UND to a 12-8 conference record and a third-place finish--the best ever for a first-year Big Sky team. UND went 16-17 overall last season, giving Jones a seven-year record of 102-114 and a conference mark of 36-43. "Coach Jones has a clear blue print for this program and the results are showing," said UND athletic director Brian Faison. "This team has had as much success as any team transitioning to the Division I level in recent years, including three straight CollegeInsider.com Postseason Tournament berths. "We saw the immediate success his team had during its first year in the Big Sky. With the program heading in the right direction, we are happy to show him this level of commitment by extending his contract." Heading in a right direction...well that is no longer the case. 8-15 is not in the right direction... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoopster Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Heading in a right direction...well that is no longer the case. 8-15 is not in the right direction... Non morons call it a rebuilding year, pretty stupid to think teams never rebuild only improve every and year forever and ever...this board needs an IQ requirement for posters. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niouxsiouxfan Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Non morons call it a rebuilding year, pretty stupid to think teams never rebuild only improve every and year forever and ever...this board needs an IQ requirement for posters. Stooping to personal attacks is not the way to go. It's a fan site, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. If you are extremely smart, I don't have to explain the meaning of fan, so let people vent. Although many things have changed in the US, we still have freedom of speech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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