Measure 4 tv ad

[bincitysioux]

I understand there is the perception that Harvard is so much better, but is perception always reality? It's sort of like in Jr. High School when the cliques determine certain name brand designer clothes to be superior to all other clothes. People who think that a particular college is so vastly superior to another are every bit as superficial as the Jr. High kids in those cliques. Perception is not always reality, and the opinions of the guys down at the yacht club means squat to me.

It is not a "perception" that Harvard is better than the University of Phoenix, it is reality. It is also reality that the University of North Dakota is also better than the University of Phoenix and hundreds of other institutions of higher learning in every possible realm of academics and athletics.

People who think that a given particular college is vastly superior to another are, to use your own words, normal and down-to-earth.

[82SiouxGuy]

Funny thing is none of what you just copied and pasted applies to me. I don't have an inflated sense of self-importance (or any sense of self-importance for that matter). What I do have is extremely passionate and opinionated views on certain topics. I'm very stubborn and the more somebody tries to tell me I'm wrong the more that makes me feel that I'm right. But none of that has anything to do with self-importance in any way, shape or form. You're way off on this one. Nice try though.

RRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

[jdub27]

Funny thing is none of what you just copied and pasted applies to me. I don't have an inflated sense of self-importance (or any sense of self-importance for that matter). What I do have is extremely passionate and opinionated views on certain topics. I'm very stubborn and the more somebody tries to tell me I'm wrong the more that makes me feel that I'm right. But none of that has anything to do with self-importance in any way, shape or form. You're way off on this one. Nice try though.

Hmmmm....

Individuals with narcissistic personality disorder generally believe that the world revolves around them. This condition is characterized by a lack of ability to empathize with others and a desire to keep the focus on themselves at all times.

Narcissistic Personality Disorder involves arrogant behavior, a lack of empathy for other people, and a need for admiration-all of which must be consistently evident at work and in relationships. People who are narcissistic are frequently described as cocky, self-centered, manipulative, and demanding. Narcissists may concentrate on unlikely personal outcomes (e.g., fame) and may be convinced that they deserve special treatment. Related Personality Disorders: Antisocial, Borderline, Histrionic. Narcissism is a less extreme version of Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Narcissism involves cockiness, manipulativeness, selfishness, power motives, and vanity-a love of mirrors. Related personality traits include: Psychopathy, Machiavellianism.

Never mind, nothing to see here...

[Gothmog]

Funny thing is none of what you just copied and pasted applies to me. I don't have an inflated sense of self-importance (or any sense of self-importance for that matter). What I do have is extremely passionate and opinionated views on certain topics. I'm very stubborn and the more somebody tries to tell me I'm wrong the more that makes me feel that I'm right. But none of that has anything to do with self-importance in any way, shape or form. You're way off on this one. Nice try though.

OK Dave, defending your opinions is admirable...I guess. But, what is the opinion that you are so vehemently defending in this thread? It seems to be be nothing more than: DaveK is always right.

[Goon]

^No.

^{I was thinking that DaveK suffers from delusion}

^{delusion of grandeur}

^{delusion of grandeur - A delusion in which one believes oneself possessed of great importance, power, wealth, intellect, or ability.}

^{The American Heritage® Medical Dictionary Copyright © 2007, 2004 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.}

^{delusion of grandeur}

^{[grän′dyoo͡r]}

^{the gross exaggeration of one's importance, wealth, power, or talents, as manifested in such disorders as megalomania, general paresis, and paranoid schizophrenia. It may have a somatic or religious}

[The Sicatoka]

http://www.grandfork...group/homepage/

The fallout of the limited NCAA sanctions is contagious as other universities such as Minnesota, Wisconsin and Iowa are boycotting UND athletic teams for athletic competition. A few weeks ago, the UND track team was disallowed from a prestigious track meet in Iowa. My low regard for this individual university action is irrelevant. We must deal with reality. ...

I know the leaders on this issue at Spirit Lake and Standing Rock. I proudly claim them as friends, and I am confident as they rightfully fight for recognition of their people that they do not want to cause harm to UND.

I am respectfully suggesting for our future a “yes” vote on Measure 4.

That letter was written by Earl Strinden, the former majority leader of the North Dakota House and retired CEO of the UND Alumni Association, and one of Ralph Engelstad's best friends.

[82SiouxGuy]

http://www.grandfork...group/homepage/

That letter was written by Earl Strinden, the former majority leader of the North Dakota House and retired CEO of the UND Alumni Association, and one of Ralph Engelstad's best friends.

He also played a major role in helping push the law through the Legislature last year. Even Earl has realized the futility of continuing to fight the NCAA.

[Goon]

http://www.grandfork...group/homepage/

That letter was written by Earl Strinden, the former majority leader of the North Dakota House and retired CEO of the UND Alumni Association, and one of Ralph Engelstad's best friends.

This can’t be – Earl must have been bought off or had his retirement threated to be pulled if he didn't come out against the name. Someone must have gotten to him; we all know that the sanctions are minimal at best… #sarcasm #iamkidding

[jdub27]

Received my Alumni Review in the mail today. Nice, big Vote Yes on Measure 4 add was attached as a cover over the original cover. The inside of the additional cover spelled out the reasons for the need for Measure 4 to pass. I applaud the Alumni Associations effort to educate alumni. The article inside goes into even greater detail with quotes from some influential people including O'Keefe, Hakstol, Lennon and other coaches. Link to Alumni Review

"For me, it’s not a debate about the virtues over the use of the Fighting Sioux name and logo at this time. It’s really gone to a different level of having to make a decision based on black and white facts. For a lot of reasons, I look at the situation and we have come to a point in which we don’t really have a choice in the matter. We really only have one decision that we can make. For me it’s a decision that’s based on facts."

"People need to realize by choosing to mandate use of the name and logo — we may win that fight. But in winning that one battle of control, I think we all have to realize that we give up control on many other issues and we put ourselves at the mercy of others. That’s where I’m at: I would rather make the choice to maintain control over our destiny, rather than put that control in somebody else’s hands."

[The Sicatoka]

"People need to realize by choosing to mandate use of the name and logo — we may win that fight. But in winning that one battle of control, I think we all have to realize that we give up control on many other issues and we put ourselves at the mercy of others. That’s where I’m at: I would rather make the choice to maintain control over our destiny, rather than put that control in somebody else’s hands."

Did Dave Hakstol just say "control what's yours to control"?

[The Sicatoka]

In this particular case... the opinion I am so vehemently defending is that UND should keep the nickname no matter what under any set of circumstances.

How do you reconcile your opinion/conclusion with those of Tim O'Keefe or Earl Strinden?

[82SiouxGuy]

In this particular case... the opinion I am so vehemently defending is that UND should keep the nickname no matter what under any set of circumstances. That has nothing to do with a sense of self-importance in any way, shape, or form. I may be many things, some of which admittedly are not great things to be. I'm opinionated, stubborn, and argumentive to be sure... and yes I do have a tendency to think that my opinion is the "right" one, but by no stretch of the imagination am I narcissistic. Narcissists have a need to be the center of attention in social type settings, which is so not me. I'm actually kind of shy with people I don't know well. 82SiouxGuy jumped to the wrong conclusion.

It doesn't have anything to do with self-importance, it has to do with being selfish. It has to do with thinking that the only thing that is important is what you want. Just about everything you talk about comes back to you and what you want and anyone else can go to hell. It has to do with not having empathy for any one else like athletes, students, coaches, staff, faculty, alumni and other fans. If they don't agree with you you throw them under the bus. It has to do with the fact that you believe you know better than people that are actually involved in the process. It has to do with your belief in unreal outcomes such as when you thought the Spirit Lake lawsuit was going to bring the NCAA to its knees and destroy it when just about everyone told you they had little chance to win anything. It has to do with not being able to take responsibility for simple statements that you have made. It has to do with your trying to demonize everyone that disagrees with you, throwing out terms like Nazi, zealot, moron, etc.

[jdub27]

So what? That doesn't make me narcissistic. That makes me opinionated self-centered, stubborn show a lack of empathy for other people , and argumentive demanding.

Where have I seen that before...?

[82SiouxGuy]

So what? That doesn't make me narcissistic. That makes me opinionated, stubborn, and argumentive.

Which is exactly what a narcissist would probably say.

[jdub27]

Wrong answer, 82SiouxGuy.

Narcissist is defined as "a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance and a deep need for admiration".

I don't have an inflated sense of self-importance,

But yet you are willing to sacrifice the student-athletes and athletic department of a University because of your opinion of a nickname and logo. How is that not you putting your importance over others? You've stated before that to you, your opinion is the only one that matters.

[jdub27]

Yeah, so? Am I not entitled to my own opinion? Is every person who votes no on #4 a narcissist based on the criteria given here by the haters?

PS - The student athletes can attend any school they want to. Sorry to let facts get in the way of your drama queen sob story, but UND is not their only option.

Great attitude to have. Way to show the student-athletes you appreciate the entertainment they provide you. You truly do only care about the jersey they wear. The fact that you are so blind to the fact that you are that selfish and only care about what you want further emphasizes everyone's point.

[82SiouxGuy]

Dave says:

Narcissist is defined as "a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance and a deep need for admiration".

The National Institute of Health uses this as a more complete definition, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0001930/.

Narcissistic personality disorder

Narcissistic personality disorder is a condition in which people have an inflated sense of self-importance and an extreme preoccupation with themselves.

Symptoms

A person with narcissistic personality disorder may:

• 
  React to criticism with rage, shame, or humiliation
  
• 
  Take advantage of other people to achieve his or her own goals
  
• 
  Have excessive feelings of self-importance
  
• 
  Exaggerate achievements and talents
  
• 
  Be preoccupied with fantasies of success, power, beauty, intelligence, or ideal love
  
• 
  Have unreasonable expectations of favorable treatment
  
• 
  Need constant attention and admiration
  
• 
  Disregard the feelings of others, and have little ability to feel empathy
  
• 
  Have obsessive self-interest
  
• 
  Pursue mainly selfish goals
  
  

The Mayo Clinic says, http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/narcissistic-personality-disorder/ds00652/dsection=symptoms.

Symptoms

By Mayo Clinic staff
Narcissistic personality disorder symptoms may include:

Believing that you're better than others

Fantasizing about power, success and attractiveness
Exaggerating your achievements or talents
Expecting constant praise and admiration
Believing that you're special and acting accordingly
Failing to recognize other people's emotions and feelings
Expecting others to go along with your ideas and plans
Taking advantage of others
Expressing disdain for those you feel are inferior
Being jealous of others
Believing that others are jealous of you
Trouble keeping healthy relationships
Setting unrealistic goals
Being easily hurt and rejected
Having a fragile self-esteem
Appearing as tough-minded or unemotional

Although some features of narcissistic personality disorder may seem like having confidence or strong self-esteem, it's not the same. Narcissistic personality disorder crosses the border of healthy confidence and self-esteem into thinking so highly of yourself that you put yourself on a pedestal. In contrast, people who have healthy confidence and self-esteem don't value themselves more than they value others.

When you have narcissistic personality disorder, you may come across as conceited, boastful or pretentious. You often monopolize conversations. You may belittle or look down on people you perceive as inferior. You may have a sense of entitlement. And when you don't receive the special treatment to which you feel entitled, you may become very impatient or angry. You may insist on having "the best" of everything — the best car, athletic club, medical care or social circles, for instance.

But underneath all this behavior often lies a fragile self-esteem. You have trouble handling anything that may be perceived as criticism. You may have a sense of secret shame and humiliation. And in order to make yourself feel better, you may react with rage or contempt and efforts to belittle the other person to make yourself appear better.

[Gothmog]

So, just to clarify... are you singling me out individually or does that go for each and every person who is going to vote NO on Measure 4?

Seriously Dave, when you find yourself disagreeing with far more people than you agree with - stop being disagreeable. It's probably you that's wrong.

[ScottM]

Seriously Dave, when you find yourself disagreeing with far more people than you agree with - stop being disagreeable. It's probably you that's wrong.

Dave just derives "self-gratifying" pleasure from all of the attention.

[Gothmog]

This isn't a question of right or wrong, it is a difference of opinion.

What kind of narcissist would consider an opposing opinion to be "wrong"?

Holy !@#$ Dave. You just can't stop arguing. Not even for a moment.

Let it go. You don't have to prove anything.

[bincitysioux]

So, just to clarify... are you singling me out individually or does that go for each and every person who is going to vote NO on Measure 4?

Yes.......................

[82SiouxGuy]

Okay, but what is your point? If you think that defines me you don't know me very well.

I don't know you at all. All I know is the behavior and attitudes that you exhibit on this board.

[82SiouxGuy]

This isn't a question of right or wrong, it is a difference of opinion.

What kind of narcissist would consider an opposing opinion to be "wrong"?

The problem is that you don't seem to know the difference between a "fact" and an "opinion". Everything is an opinion to you, even the definition of words.

[watchmaker49]

Dave says:

The National Institute of Health uses this as a more complete definition, http://www.ncbi.nlm....lth/PMH0001930/.

The Mayo Clinic says, http://www.mayoclini...ection=symptoms.

Sounds a heck of a lot more like Goon than DaveK.

[Teeder11]

Sounds a heck of a lot more like Goon than DaveK.

What's your take on "Chewey"? I notice you leave him out of your sanctimonious defenses of DaveK and Fetchy. You two have had some very classic and very personal public rows on here over the past few months . It'd be only fair to include your friend, Chewey, as another champion in your hollow protests against "hypocricy" and your cheerleading for blind consistency and ignorance in the face of new realities.

Don't get me wrong, I like Chewy's well thought out opposing take on things. He adds value to the discussion; I'm just curious why you left out someone who's been your obsession for so long now.