GF Herald Editorial Page

[bincitysioux]

JBB's jealous obsession with UND is endless. Even after the biggest football win in NDSU history he can't even savor it for a day or two, but rather still frets and fears UND's impending move up. Classic.

Moderator:

Can you please ban the latest incarnation of JBB? Thank you!!

Remember when JBB was put on "probation" at Bisonville.com because he couldn't stop talking about UND?!

*Rolling On Floor, Laughing My aff Off!*

[WYOBISONMAN]

I see all of you trying to make strong arguments for the game because you need it. You have nothing significant to offer NDSU that we dont already have. What your offering are marginal benefits. Nothing we cant get from scheduling with any number of programs across the country. We will have more BISON fans at the Metro Dome in few weeks than you guys average.

We did need the game but survived just fine without it and have outgrown any of the old reasons to resume:

1) our stadium is no longer half full.

2) Our ability to bring in marquee opponents no longer makes an association with you necessary

3) Our market is the largest in the State. No need to put you guys in the lime lite. You have your own stadium and your own market.

The idea that the $27.50 tickets wasnt ill will is absurd. We know what happened. The only thing right was the nature of NDSU Football. It is big time.

The other funny point made is typical. Revise the past, in this case lower the seating capacity, and now, years later, declare the thing a sellout! That is rich! Of course there are two sides to everything.

The important thing for NDSU is to keep it all in perspective, look at the relationship at all levels, not just athletics, how we benefited from your actions and what your intentions have been and will be. What kind of partner have you been? That is why we will expect very little from you in hockey. We saw what you had to offer, nothing thank you. Now you may need a conference and some help from us.

Some of the arguments presented in rebuttal are good ones. Others are telling examples of everything that is wrong with what some are calling "The Renewal". Keeping the market split is in the best interest to North Dakota football fans. More will see their team play and more revenues will be generated with the teams staying at home. Of course, like in your case, if your options are limited you would be seeking out a chance to play in Fargo.

But the question remains why are you so eager to play NDSU when just a few short years ago contracts were thrown out? My guess, you are on the outside looking in. Thats why a renwal will look like this:

1) Single game contract for the Fabulous Fargo Dome with no guarantee to make up for the lost NCC game.

2) Single game contract for the Fabulous Fargo Dome with a typical bus trip guarantee.

Good luck on your scheduling. Im sure you will get 10 or 11 games and your hockey relationships may help. I know we will have a full schedule too. Nice showing against W Washington. Your come back is the sign of a strong and focused team.

It sounds to me like this is just a fishing trip to see if you can get any UND fans to bite.....

[NDSU grad]

NDSU has been 'buying' their growth in graduate programs. After adding 20 new PhD programs since 1999, they have also grown their graduate student enrollment through full and partial tuition waivers. NDSU has about 1600 graduate students, and about 900 have a tuition waiver. UND has 2100 graduate students with 740 (35%) with a full or partial tuition waiver. NDSU graduate program has 500 fewer graduate students, but 150 more students on tuition waivers. Perhaps this is NDSU talks so much about needing more funds.

So now you're using what basically amounts to message board comments to back up your points? It should also be noted that the extremely poorly written article in the Bismarck Tribune was an op-ed piece and not a news story. I'd be interested to see how all the universities in the NDUS define tuition waivers.

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

Another way to counter the argument that a UND-NDSU game takes revenue away from the the schools and the state it this. This year UND has 5 home games and NDSU has 5 home games. That equals 10 time the 2 teams play in North Dakota. If one of the university's away games was at the other North Dakota school that would be 11 times they play in North Dakota.

[The Sicatoka]

So now you're using what basically amounts to message board comments to back up your points? It should also be noted that the extremely poorly written article in the Bismarck Tribune was an op-ed piece and not a news story. I'd be interested to see how all the universities in the NDUS define tuition waivers.

Poke around Bisonville and you'll find Bison supporters reporting this is based in truth. Roll in that the numbers of graduate students are fairly accurate ...

http://www.bisonville.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/Ya...150807216/12#12

[NDSU grad]

Poke around Bisonville and you'll find Bison supporters reporting this is based in truth. Roll in that the numbers of graduate students are fairly accurate ...

http://www.bisonville.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/Ya...150807216/12#12

I guess whether the numbers are accurate or not is not really the crux of my argument. I'm just bothered by people arguing for a position based on an op-ed piece of a newspaper and anonymous posts on message boards.

For the record, I am not bothered at all at UND's position of using tuition waivers to support athletes. I am likewise not bothered by NDSU using them to support graduate students. It is very common for tuition to be waived for graduate students as part of their stipend. I do think this information should be in the public domain, however.

[Holdem]

I take issue with Wyobison and others. The idea that I was posting in this thread to fish people into an argument is way off the wall. There are contrasting ideas that some of you cant handle. Obviously when you turn it into a personal argument you have lost. I expect the renwal will be a matter of fact at some point in the future, but the reasons to avoid it are sound. I hope none of you are offended because I take that side.

[WYOBISONMAN]

I take issue with Wyobison and others. The idea that I was posting in this thread to fish people into an argument is way off the wall. There are contrasting ideas that some of you cant handle. Obviously when you turn it into a personal argument you have lost. I expect the renwal will be a matter of fact at some point in the future, but the reasons to avoid it are sound. I hope none of you are offended because I take that side.

I am on hear to talk sports.......stuff like this......If NDSU played the Sioux this year we would kick their ASS....sports talk.....

[GeauxSioux]

I am on hear to talk sports.......stuff like this......If NDSU played the Sioux this year we would kick their ASS....sports talk.....

[Shawn-O]

I am on hear to talk sports.......stuff like this......If NDSU played the Sioux this year we would kick their ASS....sports talk.....

Didn't you get the memo, WYO? There's really no discernable difference between D-II football and 85 scholly MAC football.

[WYOBISONMAN]

Didn't you get the memo, WYO? There's really no discernable difference between D-II football and 85 scholly MAC football.

Good one!

[The Sicatoka]

Good one!

What are you talking "MAC football"?

Chadron State over Montana State over Colorado.

It should have said, "Big XII football".

[NDSU grad]

I take issue with Wyobison and others. The idea that I was posting in this thread to fish people into an argument is way off the wall. There are contrasting ideas that some of you cant handle. Obviously when you turn it into a personal argument you have lost. I expect the renwal will be a matter of fact at some point in the future, but the reasons to avoid it are sound. I hope none of you are offended because I take that side.

This is really some good stuff. This thread should be pinned to the top and receive legendary thread status.

[GeauxSioux]

This is really some good stuff. This thread should be pinned to the top and receive legendary thread status.

Hey, you can't use the word "legendary". That's JBB's word.

[The Sicatoka]

Hey, you can't use the word "legendary". That's JBB's word.

I thought his word was "Fabulous".

[DI IN FARGO]

Everyone including myself is only speculating on what will happen. So here is my prediction, you guys will make the move, your financials won't improve enough to cover the increased costs, your president will depart and leave the problem for someone else to fix and the move will ultimately set you back instead of move you forward as you hope it will. I'm not posting this as smack I just don't see the increase in $$ that it will take to make the move happen being made up in increased giving by alum or your fundraising efforts. Time will tell and we will see what happens.

[GeauxSioux]

Everyone including myself is only speculating on what will happen. So here is my wish, you guys will make the move, your financials won't improve enough to cover the increased costs, your president will depart and leave the problem for someone else to fix and the move will ultimately set you back instead of move you forward as you hope it will. I'm not posting this as smack I don't want to see the increase in $$ that it will take to make the move happen being made up in increased giving by alum or your fundraising efforts. Time will tell and we will see what happens.

I changed your post to what you really wanted it to say. Remind me to take you off my Christmas card list.

[CoteauRinkRat]

I changed your post to what you really wanted it to say. Remind me to take you off my Christmas card list.

Exactly, it is not what he thinks will happen at all, it is what he wishes will happen.

[Holdem]

I am on hear to talk sports.......stuff like this......If NDSU played the Sioux this year we would kick their ASS....sports talk.....

This thread is titled UND's Reclassification to Division I. Makes me wonder where you got the idea all of us would be talking about a game that wont be played this year or even say something like “we would kick their ass”.

It seems to me issues surrounding the reclassification are being discussed. Stuff like this......Once the lawsuit is filed the reclassification will get a little tougher. Its not the NCAA a nebulous ruling body they are suing. Its NDSU, The Ohio State, UCLA, UCD etc, etc, etc. Its all the members of the NCAA that will pay this bill defending the organizations right to govern its own championship events.

[PCM]

Once the lawsuit is filed the reclassification will get a little tougher. Its not the NCAA a nebulous ruling body they are suing. Its NDSU, The Ohio State, UCLA, UCD etc, etc, etc. Its all the members of the NCAA that will pay this bill defending the organizations right to govern its own championship events.

So UND's lawsuit is going to cost the poor little ol' NCAA money. Cry me a river.

If the members of the NCAA forced the executive committee to follow the organization's constitution and bylaws, the lawsuit would be a moot point. UND is doing the NCAA membership a favor by attempting to end rule by executive committee fiat before it becomes the norm.

I wish it hadn't come to a lawsuit, but by violating its own procedures, acting like an arm of government and meddling where it doesn't belong, the NCAA has brought the problem on itself.

[The Sicatoka]

Its all the members of the NCAA that will pay this bill defending the organizations right to govern its own championship events.

... in accordance with NCAA's legislative process. And they didn't do that.

Oops. Did someone miss that key detail?

(Now read the Kupchella quote in my signature.)

[DI IN FARGO]

Exactly, it is not what he thinks will happen at all, it is what he wishes will happen.

Wow you people really have little brother syndrome in a big way. I could care a less what happens anymore to your beloved school as long as it doens't increase the already screwed up funding inequity formula to cover your move up. I post a comment on what I think will happen and you jump all over it and try to tell me what I think. I don't have to wish it to happen I think in time it will come to fruition without me or anyone else hoping one way or the other.

[dakotadan]

Wow you people really have little brother syndrome in a big way.

Have you ever read bisonville? Or talked to a bison fan? Somehow no matter what is being discussed, they turn in into a UND/NDSU comparison.

I could care a less what happens anymore to your beloved school...

Obviously that's not true or you wouldn't be here.

...as long as it doens't increase the already screwed up funding inequity formula

Thanks for proving the point.

[The Sicatoka]

... the already screwed up funding inequity formula ...

Then blame yourself. The president of NDSU agreed to it when it was created.

[Bison Dan]

Actually UND is paying for both sides of the lawsuit. 100% on the one side and a much smaller % on the other.