What the hell is the deal with ASU hockey

[ArchyAlum11]

So has anyone heard anything about which conference ASU will be joining? I remember hearing that they were planning to announce just after the frozen four, but I still haven't heard jack other than the NCHC denying that they were going to add ASU. I know that the BigTen isn't going to add them, so its Either the NCHC or the WCHA. Also if either leauge were to get ASU do you think their would be any effort to get Air Force to leave Atlantic hockey to become either the 10th or 12th team?

[southpaw]

1 hour ago, ArchyAlum11 said:

So has anyone heard anything about which conference ASU will be joining? I remember hearing that they were planning to announce just after the frozen four, but I still haven't heard jack other than the NCHC denying that they were going to add ASU. I know that the BigTen isn't going to add them, so its Either the NCHC or the WCHA. Also if either leauge were to get ASU do you think their would be any effort to get Air Force to leave Atlantic hockey to become either the 10th or 12th team?

AF will never leave Atlantic Hockey. Right now, they have a chance of making the national tournament every year as the autobid. If they go to another conference, that goes out the window. 

They can hold their own in single games throughout the year with NCHC teams but they would be a bottom feeder in any other conference. 

[NoDakFan]

2 hours ago, southpaw said:

AF will never leave Atlantic Hockey. Right now, they have a chance of making the national tournament every year as the autobid. If they go to another conference, that goes out the window. 

They can hold their own in single games throughout the year with NCHC teams but they would be a bottom feeder in any other conference. 

Maybe its just my homerisim talking but I think they could hold their own in the WCHA to be a mid standings team. But yea, they could probably say goodbye to the tournament.

[cberkas]

From the ASU vice president for real estate development said this.

Quote

“This is going to be a walkable development, and will set the tone and scale for the remainder of the acreage,” said John Creer, ASU vice president for real estate development. “Across the street, we see development of a hockey arena, a smaller, perhaps gymnastics arena. This creates a sports district entrance to the area.”

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2016/06/03/asu-developer-going-vertical-with-first-phase-of.html

[Goon]

14 hours ago, ArchyAlum11 said:

So has anyone heard anything about which conference ASU will be joining? I remember hearing that they were planning to announce just after the frozen four, but I still haven't heard jack other than the NCHC denying that they were going to add ASU. I know that the BigTen isn't going to add them, so its Either the NCHC or the WCHA. Also if either leauge were to get ASU do you think their would be any effort to get Air Force to leave Atlantic hockey to become either the 10th or 12th team?

 

It appears that someone jumped the gun with the ASU story. The WCHA and the NCHC are hesitant to take a program that doesn't have an acceptable arena. 

[ArchyAlum11]

2 hours ago, Goon said:

It appears that someone jumped the gun with the ASU story. The WCHA and the NCHC are hesitant to take a program that doesn't have an acceptable arena. 

I doubt that the Arena issue is as big a deal for the WCHA, after all look at Ferris State's Arena, if seats just over 2000 students, though I have been told that when they have a full house it is one of the most intimating buildings to play in. WCHA wants to have a power 5 conference school in the conference and exposure on the pac-10 network so they would probably be willing to look the other way on the arena for the time being, that said I can see travel costs to AZ being a issue for the smaller schools that make up the WCHA.

[NoDakFan]

9 hours ago, ArchyAlum11 said:

I doubt that the Arena issue is as big a deal for the WCHA, after all look at Ferris State's Arena, if seats just over 2000 students, though I have been told that when they have a full house it is one of the most intimating buildings to play in. WCHA wants to have a power 5 conference school in the conference and exposure on the pac-10 network so they would probably be willing to look the other way on the arena for the time being, that said I can see travel costs to AZ being a issue for the smaller schools that make up the WCHA.

The travel in that conference is ridiculous currently. Trips to Arizona in addition to the Alsaka and Alabama trips would be very costly for schools. I think they would need ASU to help pay for those and I'm not sure ASU really wants to do that.

[SIOUXFAN97]

I think the "travel" word is what is holding up asu...I don't think western mich and Miami are happy in the nchc (travel and lack of regional rivals-bgu or notre dame) and I think the majority of teams in the wcha aren't happy either (travel-Alaska-twice, Alabama, and now maybe Arizona?)...I think asu is trying to talk unlv to jump with them..i don't think asu wants to join the wcha one year and see it implode and go scrambling for another conference the next year...

[southpaw]

48 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

I don't think western mich and Miami are happy in the nchc (travel and lack of regional rivals-bgu or notre dame) 

Couldn't be further from the truth.

Although, when ASU joins the NCHC, Bowling Green will be coming with.  

[SIOUXFAN97]

14 minutes ago, southpaw said:

Couldn't be further from the truth.

Although, when ASU joins the NCHC, Bowling Green will be coming with.  

so if bgu doesn't join the nchc will western mich and Miami still be happy...with or without another non-regional rival in asu?

[The Sicatoka]

The NCHC is running 24 conference games now (less than full round-robin 28). 

If they go to ten teams, that'd be 36 games for full round-robin. Would they look to stay at 24 games? 

[southpaw]

58 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

so if bgu doesn't join the nchc will western mich and Miami still be happy...with or without another non-regional rival in asu?

Of course they will.

[SIOUXFAN97]

2 hours ago, southpaw said:

Of course they will.

source?

[jdub27]

31 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

source?

They are in a top if not the top conference that has multiple bids each year. It makes money and has a reserve fund in case they don't. All pretty good reasons to be happy. Even if they aren't and wanted to leave, there is a buyout of $1.5 million with a 24 month required notice which only goes up if the timeframe is shortened. They can still play those other teams in non-conference match-ups if they were that important. I don't see them going anywhere.

[SIOUXFAN97]

19 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

They are in a top if not the top conference that has multiple bids each year. It makes money and has a reserve fund in case they don't. All pretty good reasons to be happy. Even if they aren't and wanted to leave, there is a buyout of $1.5 million with a 24 month required notice which only goes up if the timeframe is shortened. They can still play those other teams in non-conference match-ups if they were that important. I don't see them going anywhere.

if the feeling was mutual where western and Miami wanted to leave and the nchc wanted to replace them with bigger fish would the 1.5 mill buyout go away? I would guess...yes?

[southpaw]

36 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

if the feeling was mutual where western and Miami wanted to leave and the nchc wanted to replace them with bigger fish would the 1.5 mill buyout go away? I would guess...yes?

Who are these bigger fish?  You're asking a hypothetical question that can't be answered for close to a decade.

And my source for knowing WMU and Miami are happy?  Talking to administrators and coaches from both schools.  Being annoyed with increased travel compared to the CCHA does not mean you're upset with being in a conference, or looking to leave.

[SIOUXFAN97]

bigger fishes....Arizona State, Arizona, or UNLV?

[southpaw]

11 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

bigger fishes....Arizona State, Arizona, or UNLV?

The NCHC is at 8 schools right now.  For the conference to want to replace Miami and Western with bigger schools, there would need to be 4 of those bigger fish available.  I don't see a bunch of big schools jumping to play D1 hockey for quite a while.  The NCHC is not going to kick out two schools in order to add two more to stay at 8.  They'll likely max out at 10.

Who decides what schools are bigger fish vs smaller fish?  Miami and Western are the only 2 schools in the conference to be FBS.  Miami has shown a consistent dedication to hockey.  Western had some decent years at the end of the CCHA and had hired Andy Murray, showing they were attempting to stay at the top of the college hockey world.  If you want to talk about small schools, take a look at CC, Denver, UMD, UNO, Duluth, and UND.

[SIOUXFAN97]

5 minutes ago, southpaw said:

The NCHC is at 8 schools right now.  For the conference to want to replace Miami and Western with bigger schools, there would need to be 4 of those bigger fish available.  I don't see a bunch of big schools jumping to play D1 hockey for quite a while.  The NCHC is not going to kick out two schools in order to add two more to stay at 8.  They'll likely max out at 10.

how many people on here expected asu to announce d1 intentions?  maybe they are working with Arizona to get them to add...unlv is rumored to ready to jump (maybe engelstads help them)...you never know

I still see the wcha shaking it up a bit and western and Miami jumping ship to a small 8 team bus league centered around Michigan and the Midwest...

[SiouxSherm94]

13 minutes ago, southpaw said:

Who are these bigger fish?  You're asking a hypothetical question that can't be answered for close to a decade.

And my source for knowing WMU and Miami are happy?  Talking to administrators and coaches from both schools.  Being annoyed with increased travel compared to the CCHA does not mean you're upset with being in a conference, or looking to leave.

Needless to say, it's a part of conference membership. Big question that ASU needs to ask themselves is what's going to place their program in the best spot in the long run. It's clear they had the funds to jump into the NCAA ranks and maintain the program, regardless of what conference they join. When it comes to competition, the NCHC no doubt will be the better fit for them. As I've said before, the skill (no offense to the WCHA) that we have will help build their program. It might take time but ASU has the potential of being a very good program with the athletes that they have and will bring in the future. Also, the overall structure of our conference is sound, especially financially. It would make more fiscal sense for them to join us, considering Fenton and the other higher ups agree to it. 

I REALLY hope they join us. 

[SIOUXFAN97]

28 minutes ago, SiouxSherm94 said:

Needless to say, it's a part of conference membership. Big question that ASU needs to ask themselves is what's going to place their program in the best spot in the long run. It's clear they had the funds to jump into the NCAA ranks and maintain the program, regardless of what conference they join. When it comes to competition, the NCHC no doubt will be the better fit for them. As I've said before, the skill (no offense to the WCHA) that we have will help build their program. It might take time but ASU has the potential of being a very good program with the athletes that they have and will bring in the future. Also, the overall structure of our conference is sound, especially financially. It would make more fiscal sense for them to join us, considering Fenton and the other higher ups agree to it. 

I REALLY hope they join us. 

so do I...I would swap western and Miami for unlv and asu...alligient flights in feb and march to watch the Sioux play there would be fun

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

11 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

so do I...I would swap western and Miami for unlv and asu...alligient flights in feb and march to watch the Sioux play there would be fun

Can't say I'd turn down those direct flights to az and Vegas in the winter

[#MACtion]

14 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

how many people on here expected asu to announce d1 intentions?  maybe they are working with Arizona to get them to add...unlv is rumored to ready to jump (maybe engelstads help them)...you never know

I still see the wcha shaking it up a bit and western and Miami jumping ship to a small 8 team bus league centered around Michigan and the Midwest...

No chance.

[Goon]

2 hours ago, #MACtion said:

No chance.

I agree it's not going to happen. 

[southpaw]

17 hours ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

I still see the wcha shaking it up a bit and western and Miami jumping ship to a small 8 team bus league centered around Michigan and the Midwest...

Ah yes, that bus-league based around Michigan.  Let's take a look a the distances of the closest 10 schools to Miami that have a chance of being in the new league:

Notre Dame - Going to the B10, why would they leave to play a bunch of lower schools?

Bowling Green - Good fit for the 3 MAC schools to be together. 3 hour drive.

Western Michigan - Same as BGSU. 4 1/4 hours.

Bobby Mo - AHA now, has a good thing going with a few tournament appearances in a lower league. 5 hours.

Mercyhurst - AHA now. Similar to Robert Morris, going from bigger fish to a small one. 5 1/2 hours.

Ferris State - Used to be conference mates with Miami, Western, BGSU and Notre Dame. 6 hours.

Canisius College - Not a lot of success even in AHA. Would be a bottom feeder and bring PWR down. 7 hours.

Niagara - Not a lot of recent success.  In fact, they've been pretty horrible in AHA. 7 1/4 hours.

RIT - Some trips to the National Tournament as part of AHA, some success once there. 8 hours.

LSSU - Bottom feeder for a long time. That might change with other crappy teams.  8 3/4 hours.

Unless Miami wants to drive everywhere, they trade flying into places like Denver, Minneapolis, Colorado Springs and Omaha for trying to fly into tiny towns with even smaller airports.  With the B10 conference forming, a lot of those "bus schools" that the CCHA did went out the window.  No OSU, MSU and UM means the three biggest schools aren't around anymore.

I can't tell if this new conference is better or worse than the current WCHA from a competition standpoint.  You've got a lot of crappy AHA teams, some not so great WCHA teams and then a few good schools.  Similar to the WCHA, this conference would struggle out of conference, pulling their PWR down, meaning it's a one-bid league.  Would Miami want that?