More Summit movement?

[SiouxVolley]

Neither the Horizon nor MVC want IUPUI or IPFW. The Horizon wants Belmont, NKU, and maybe Murray St according to media. Wichita St could leave the MVC, which may cause the MVC and Horizon to battle over Belmont and Murray St. The MVC may also look at UAB. If Wichita St stays, ORU or Denver could get looks from the MVC, as Wichita St is owed closer neighbors. WSU has only increased the MVC coffers by a few mill lately.

[SiouxVolley]

Do you have a problem with this? Heck, the Summit would probably waive the entrance fee for UND also.

The MVC is not near as sexy as it once was. Geographically and sports wise, the Indiana schools in the Summit have a better chance of getting in as they are closer to the other members and they do not sponsor football. A football centric school scares the crap out of Commissioner Elgin.

Like it or not, the Dakota schools need to focus on the strengthening the Summit and make it the NCC 2.0.

Would they buyout the exit fee from the Big Sky?

Elgin has no choice but to placate Bradley, Drake, Evansville, Loyola, and Wichita St, which don't give a cr*p about football. Elgin doesn't run the league, he only is the XO, not the CO. The Presidents make the major decisions, not Elgin.

[sioux24/7]

I don't understand why people would rather stay in the Big Sky than join the Summit/MVFC. Is it because we want to be separated from the Dakota schools and do our own thing? That's just stupid. The Dakota schools should all be together.

[SiouxVolley]

I don't understand why people would rather stay in the Big Sky than join the Summit/MVFC. Is it because we want to be separated from the Dakota schools and do our own thing? That's just stupid. The Dakota schools should all be together.

Alumni are in Minnesota and Big Sky states. Minnesota is covered by hockey, not by the Slummit.

If we want an NCC division, make it enticing for them to join. We can be leaders for once.

[sioux24/7]

Alumni are in Minnesota and Big Sky states. Minnesota is covered by hockey, not by the Slummit.

If we want an NCC division, make it enticing for them to join. We can be leaders for once.

Oh they are only in those states?

[SiouxVolley]

Oh they are only in those states?

The vast majority of them are in ND, Minn, Colo, and Ariz. Wash, Ore, Utah, and Calif have decent numbers too. The Slummit territory like Indiana, Iowa, Oklahoma don't have many alumns.

I'm not in that vast majority, but I'm not expecting UND to join the Southern Conference to please me.

[mksioux]

The vast majority of them are in ND, Minn, Colo, and Ariz. Wash, Ore, Utah, and Calif have decent numbers too. The Slummit territory like Indiana, Iowa, Oklahoma don't have many alumns.

I'm not in that vast majority, but I'm not expecting UND to join the Southern Conference to please me.

Yes, UND has alumni out west, but more alumni live in North Dakota and Minnesota than any other state, and I'm sure more than the other states combined.  The MVFC/Summit offers more for those fans than the Big Sky.

[darell1976]

Yes, UND has alumni out west, but more alumni live in North Dakota and Minnesota than any other state, and I'm sure more than the other states combined. The MVFC/Summit offers more for those fans than the Big Sky.

If the MVFC/SL had online viewing like "watch Big Sky" I would be for the move.

[mksioux]

If the MVFC/SL had online viewing like "watch Big Sky" I would be for the move.

Good point.  I agree 100%.  Watch Big Sky is the best part about the Big Sky.

[nodakhoops]

Yes, UND has alumni out west, but more alumni live in North Dakota and Minnesota than any other state, and I'm sure more than the other states combined.  The MVFC/Summit offers more for those fans than the Big Sky.

 

 

 

I'll first say that I just want UND and NDSU in the same conference not matter the conference, but I prefer the schools in the Summit/MVFC to the Big Sky so as a fan/donor/alum I would rather be in that conference. Having said that, this statement above is 100% correct. UND needs to focus on gaining interest from the vast majority (ND, MN alumni) in football and basketball not just hockey. If you don't live here then you don't see it but NDSU is killing UND in the PR/Marketing battle across ND and MN and it's because of football and basketball. UND needs to gain fans in those sports and in those state first and foremost. It should be priority #1, because those are the ones who will attend home games not California UND alumni. 

 

NDSU, SDSU, USD, Omaha, Northern Iowa, Western Illnois are all schools that are within a 6 hour drive from the Twin cities area and the first 5 are all drivable from Grand Forks, Fargo, Bismarck, etc. More of our most important alums (ND, MN) could watch football and basketball at home and on the road. 

 

Denver is also a huge UND alumni base and would now be covered by not only hockey, but MBB, WBB, and VB. Our three most important states for gaining interest in FB and BB are ND, MN, and CO and they are all covered nicely in the Summit/MVFC.

 

Another advantage is I have NDSU friends that have told me they would attend several UND football games if UND was in the MVFC when NDSU is out of town and UND was at home because that is the conference they follow. I have to believe there are quite a few casual NDSU college football fans in the area that feel the same. Vast majority of the state is not hard core one side or the other, most just want both in the same conference which in turn would drive up interest for all the programs.

[nodakhoops]

Good point.  I agree 100%.  Watch Big Sky is the best part about the Big Sky.

 

Some of the Bison posters can chime in but I think the MVFC and Summit Leagues both have deals with ESPN3. All of UNDs home games for football and basketball would be on Midco or FSN like now and if the majority of road games are on ESPN3 I don't see much difference to BigSkyTV. Another thing would be UND would get more coverage on midco as I think they have a Summit League show every week along with summit basketball games on Wednesdays and Saturdays (i think) so we'd actually probably see more road games broadcasted right on Midco. Just a guess, but I'd imagine anytime we'd play USD or SDSU on the road in any sport it would be broadcasted on Midco.

 

While I agree BigSkyTV is awesome I think UND would actually gain more coverage in the MVFC/Summit. BigSkyTV is great, but i'll take ESPN3 over that, if they do have that deal. I'll also take the regional/national exposure the UND/NDSU football game gives the State/University every year and gives Grand Forks every other year when they host. 

[bincitysioux]

I am not as infatuated with NDSU as most Sioux fans apparently are, so I don't feel the need to be in the same conference with them.  We already play them in about every sport anyways, now football included.  That should be enough for the growing faction of UND fans that have stated in recent weeks that they would prefer to have the Bison be their only win of the season rather than lose to them but still make the playoffs. 

 

We played every single former NCC school that is DI in various sports this season except Creighton.  Next year we will probably do the same or close to it.  Plus we play Montana, Montana St, Idaho, Eastern Washington, and Weber St.  If we were in the Summit, games against the top Big Sky schools would be few and far between. 

 

NDSU is in fact killing UND in the PR department, but it is not because of who they play it is because of what they do to their opponents. 

 

Yes, NDSU, SDSU, USD, UNI, and Omaha are all drivable locations for many Sioux fans.  We played games for various sports at all those places this year.  Raise your hand if anyone attended any of them.  My guess is the basketball game in Fargo and the hockey game in Omaha are the only ones that had more than 50 UND fans in attendance.  About the same as was at the Northern Arizona basketball game.   

 

I call BS on anyone who says UND fans will travel better if we join the Summit/MVFC.  I have been attending football games on the road for over a decade, and for the most part it has always been about the same number of UND fans in attendance, whether the game was in St. Cloud, MN or in Davis, CA.  The truth is, UND fans travel great for Hockey, and that is about it.  As far as basketball goes, anybody who claims droves of Sioux fans would head to Sioux Falls for the Summit Tourney, they should probably check out the seats at the Sioux Center.  People won't travel a few blocks for basketball right now, they certainly aren't going to drive a few hundred miles. 

 

Denver is a huge alumni base.  We play them in hockey already.  DU doesn't have football, but UNC just a 45 minute drive away does. 

 

We will forever be linked to NDSU, as well as to SDSU and USD.  That will never change.  We will always play them.  Will always recruit against them, both for athletes and regular students.  Regardless of our athletic affiliation.  But the Big Sky offers relationships with more peer schools than does the Summit.  Yes, I realize both leagues have about the same number of "peer" schools to UND.  But if we are members of the Summit, the relationship with the top Big Sky schools disappears. 

 

I can't understand why anyone would not want to be associated with both.  If we are in the Summit, we are linked with 3 peer schools: NDSU, SDSU, and USD.  There is history with UNO, but nobody cares about playing UNO in basketball or volleyball, only hockey, and we are already covered there.  Same goes for Denver.  Nobody is going to say, "man I can't wait until the basketball game with Denver, that is going to be so intense!".  Nobody thinks that, it all about hockey with them, and already covered. 

 

As Big Sky members we are linked with 7 peer schools:  NDSU, SDSU, USD, Montana, Montana St., Idaho, and UC Davis.  Then, on top of still having Denver and UNO ties for hockey, you throw in UNC which has NCC history and doubles our presence in the Denver area.  Lastly we're rubbing shoulders with Weber St., a legit mid-major basketball power, and Eastern Washington which is a premier FCS football power. 

 

And then there is non-conference scheduling.  You think our non-conference schedules are lame right now for basketball, especially the home games?  Just think how bad it would be if you cut NDSU, SDSU, USD, and UNO from the pool of potential candidates. 

 

There is so much more to college athletics than playing NDSU twice a year instead of once a year, which let's be honest, is what this is really all about.   

 

I wish so many UND fans could see the bigger picture, recognize the unique opportunity that Big Sky membership presents, and embrace it. 

 

Rant over..........................

[supersioux]

I'm in the Summit/MVFC camp.  I think it would energize the fan base and university...yes I know we played some of the schools in MBB, WBB, VB, etc but not all.  Honestly a SDSU vs UND WBB game in The Betty would excite me....and here's the great part...we would play NDSU, USD, SDSU twice a year in those sports...a home game against those teams every year would help energize the casual fan in those sports.

[UNDvince97-01]

I argued from the beginning in my personal friend circles that if we had an invite to the MVFC/Summit and an invite from the BSC, that it would be in the best interests of UND to take the MVFC/Summit for a variety of reasons.  Of course, Patty, in her infinite wisdom, decided that wasn't a good idea.  I think both sides missed out on a good partnership moving forward, specifically with the stabilization of the Summit for Basketball and Baseball.  So we didnt have an option, and we took the Big Sky Conference invite, which was and still is an outstanding conference.

 

Also, the travel budgets would be cut down significantly for all sports.  I would love to use that money towards coaching salaries that we all crave right now, among other things.

Given what has transpired since about 2011 or so, I feel even stronger about this now than I did before.  From a business standpoint, I still believe it would be in UND's best interest to be in the MVFC/Summit.

 

Having said that, I was happy then and am happy now that we are in the Big Sky Conference.  It's a great league. 

 

It's just that in a hypothetical situation, I would choose the closer schools and conference.

[UNDvince97-01]

Honest question:  How would UND Football ticket sales be in 2015 if we were facing a MVFC schedule versus a Big Sky Football Conference schedule? 

 

EDIT:  And/or Mens and Womens Basketball?

[UNDColorado]

I am not as infatuated with NDSU as most Sioux fans apparently are, so I don't feel the need to be in the same conference with them.  We already play them in about every sport anyways, now football included.  That should be enough for the growing faction of UND fans that have stated in recent weeks that they would prefer to have the Bison be their only win of the season rather than lose to them but still make the playoffs. 

 

We played every single former NCC school that is DI in various sports this season except Creighton.  Next year we will probably do the same or close to it.  Plus we play Montana, Montana St, Idaho, Eastern Washington, and Weber St.  If we were in the Summit, games against the top Big Sky schools would be few and far between. 

 

NDSU is in fact killing UND in the PR department, but it is not because of who they play it is because of what they do to their opponents. 

 

Yes, NDSU, SDSU, USD, UNI, and Omaha are all drivable locations for many Sioux fans.  We played games for various sports at all those places this year.  Raise your hand if anyone attended any of them.  My guess is the basketball game in Fargo and the hockey game in Omaha are the only ones that had more than 50 UND fans in attendance.  About the same as was at the Northern Arizona basketball game.   

 

I call BS on anyone who says UND fans will travel better if we join the Summit/MVFC.  I have been attending football games on the road for over a decade, and for the most part it has always been about the same number of UND fans in attendance, whether the game was in St. Cloud, MN or in Davis, CA.  The truth is, UND fans travel great for Hockey, and that is about it.  As far as basketball goes, anybody who claims droves of Sioux fans would head to Sioux Falls for the Summit Tourney, they should probably check out the seats at the Sioux Center.  People won't travel a few blocks for basketball right now, they certainly aren't going to drive a few hundred miles. 

 

Denver is a huge alumni base.  We play them in hockey already.  DU doesn't have football, but UNC just a 45 minute drive away does. 

 

We will forever be linked to NDSU, as well as to SDSU and USD.  That will never change.  We will always play them.  Will always recruit against them, both for athletes and regular students.  Regardless of our athletic affiliation.  But the Big Sky offers relationships with more peer schools than does the Summit.  Yes, I realize both leagues have about the same number of "peer" schools to UND.  But if we are members of the Summit, the relationship with the top Big Sky schools disappears. 

 

I can't understand why anyone would not want to be associated with both.  If we are in the Summit, we are linked with 3 peer schools: NDSU, SDSU, and USD.  There is history with UNO, but nobody cares about playing UNO in basketball or volleyball, only hockey, and we are already covered there.  Same goes for Denver.  Nobody is going to say, "man I can't wait until the basketball game with Denver, that is going to be so intense!".  Nobody thinks that, it all about hockey with them, and already covered. 

 

As Big Sky members we are linked with 7 peer schools:  NDSU, SDSU, USD, Montana, Montana St., Idaho, and UC Davis.  Then, on top of still having Denver and UNO ties for hockey, you throw in UNC which has NCC history and doubles our presence in the Denver area.  Lastly we're rubbing shoulders with Weber St., a legit mid-major basketball power, and Eastern Washington which is a premier FCS football power. 

 

And then there is non-conference scheduling.  You think our non-conference schedules are lame right now for basketball, especially the home games?  Just think how bad it would be if you cut NDSU, SDSU, USD, and UNO from the pool of potential candidates. 

 

There is so much more to college athletics than playing NDSU twice a year instead of once a year, which let's be honest, is what this is really all about.   

 

I wish so many UND fans could see the bigger picture, recognize the unique opportunity that Big Sky membership presents, and embrace it. 

 

Rant over..........................

Very well stated. I also believe some here are overlooking the bigger picture. 

[nodakhoops]

Honest question:  How would UND Football ticket sales be in 2015 if we were facing a MVFC schedule versus a Big Sky Football Conference schedule? 

 

 

This is the point. Joining the MVFC/Summit will increase home attendance for UND because it will drive up local interest in the programs. The ability to travel to way more road games and the Summit Tourney are just bonuses. This is about getting casual UND fans and alums to Football and Basketball games. 

 

I'll follow Vince's question up with a similar one. Take a look at NDSUs fb schedule this year.

 

Weber St., UND, Northern Iowa, USD, Western Illnois, & Missiouri St..

 

Now what if UND had this home schedule Weber, NDSU, Northern Iowa, USD, Western Ill. & Missiouri St.

 

Would casual UND fans buy tickets for that schedule. You bet they would. NDSU every other year at home would increase the value of UNDs fb tickets a lot. I bet that equates to an extra 3000-4000 season tickets in FB if not more...That doesn't even get into sponsorship and champions club dollars from the added butts in the seats.Does anyone know the kind of impact that and less travel costs have on an athletic departments budget? It's probably a couple million dollars at least...

 

 

Here is another added bonus. It's obvious UND students come out for NDSU games, well now if your in school for 5 years you see NDSU fb in the alerus 2-3 times and a UND/NDSU basketball game on campus every year. What does that mean? Let's say a freshman goes to just the UND-NDSU BB game his first year, the next year he makes 2-3 games the year after 4-5 game and so on. Pretty soon students leave UND fans of not just UND hockey but also UND basketball and football like they did when I was in school. Those students are the future donors and ticket holders to the program. Students haven't been super excited about the Big Sky but they would be excited about being in a conference with NDSU and beating them for championships. 

 

 

I to like the Big Sky, but what conference is best for growing the fan base? The answer is pretty obvious to me. 

[bincitysioux]

Honest question: How would UND Football ticket sales be in 2015 if we were facing a MVFC schedule versus a Big Sky Football Conference schedule?

EDIT: And/or Mens and Womens Basketball?

I believe they would be the same presuming the NDSU game was on the road like it is already in 2015.

[UNDvince97-01]

I believe they would be the same presuming the NDSU game was on the road like it is already in 2015.

Really? 

 

I guess we agree to disagree.

 

People would be getting season tickets that normally wouldnt because of regional familiarity (ndsu, SDSU, USD, UNI, et al) on the schedule.  Plus if you want tickets to the big rivalry game, you will want to get on board early.

[fightingsioux4life]

Honest question:  How would UND Football ticket sales be in 2015 if we were facing a MVFC schedule versus a Big Sky Football Conference schedule? 

 

EDIT:  And/or Mens and Womens Basketball?

Football and/or Men's Basketball attendence won't improve until the product does.  Conference affiliation won't change that.

[dmksioux]

I still think the best option is for some sort of merger between Big Sky and Summit/MVFC.

 

UND

NDSU

USD 
SDSU

UNI (maybe replace with Northern Arizona)
UNC

MONTANA
MONTANA ST.
IDAHO
EWU

OMAHA
DENVER

 

It will never happen, but would be a darn good conference.  Also, better potential to go FBS...

[bincitysioux]

Really? 

 

I guess we agree to to disagree.

 

People would be getting season tickets that normally wouldnt because of regional familiarity (ndsu, SDSU, USD, UNI, et al) on the schedule.  Plus if you want tickets to the big rivalry game, you will want to get on board early.

 

I think  most people don't care who we play, just that we are winning.  We have not been winning lately, hence attendance suffers.

[mksioux]

Some of the Bison posters can chime in but I think the MVFC and Summit Leagues both have deals with ESPN3. All of UNDs home games for football and basketball would be on Midco or FSN like now and if the majority of road games are on ESPN3 I don't see much difference to BigSkyTV. Another thing would be UND would get more coverage on midco as I think they have a Summit League show every week along with summit basketball games on Wednesdays and Saturdays (i think) so we'd actually probably see more road games broadcasted right on Midco. Just a guess, but I'd imagine anytime we'd play USD or SDSU on the road in any sport it would be broadcasted on Midco.

 

While I agree BigSkyTV is awesome I think UND would actually gain more coverage in the MVFC/Summit. BigSkyTV is great, but i'll take ESPN3 over that, if they do have that deal. I'll also take the regional/national exposure the UND/NDSU football game gives the State/University every year and gives Grand Forks every other year when they host. 

If all the MVFC games are on ESPN3, then that would be perfectly fine with me.  I've grown accustomed to free internet viewing of all UND football games (except when Root picks up the game, which has only happened once) and I wouldn't want that to change.

[bincitysioux]

Hypothetical question....................

 

If NDSU were to trade places with UNC as the only former NCC school in the Big Sky, and everything else being equal with SDSU, USD, UNO, UNC, and Denver all in in the Summit/MVFC, the Summit Tourney in Sioux Falls, which conference would you prefer UND to be in? 

 

My guess is that everyone here pining for the Summit/MVFC would be in favor of the Big Sky in that instance.

 

Am I wrong?

[Siouxperfan7]

This is the point. Joining the MVFC/Summit will increase home attendance for UND because it will drive up local interest in the programs. The ability to travel to way more road games and the Summit Tourney are just bonuses. This is about getting casual UND fans and alums to Football and Basketball games. 

 

I'll follow Vince's question up with a similar one. Take a look at NDSUs fb schedule this year.

 

Weber St., UND, Northern Iowa, USD, Western Illnois, & Missiouri St..

 

Now what if UND had this home schedule Weber, NDSU, Northern Iowa, USD, Western Ill. & Missiouri St.

 

Would casual UND fans buy tickets for that schedule. You bet they would. NDSU every other year at home would increase the value of UNDs fb tickets a lot. I bet that equates to an extra 3000-4000 season tickets in FB if not more...That doesn't even get into sponsorship and champions club dollars from the added butts in the seats.Does anyone know the kind of impact that and less travel costs have on an athletic departments budget? It's probably a couple million dollars at least...

 

I can see attendace increasing, obviously, for NDSU games.  But UNI, W. Ill, and Missiouri State...thos games are no more of a draw than any Big Sky team.  Sure you will have people that would buy season tickets to gaurantee they get tickets to the Bison game.  But 4000-5000...not a chance.  It has been said many times in many threads on this site.  The thing that is going to to get butts in the seats at the Alerus and the Betty is WINNING.