ND Supreme Court Rules against the NDSBoHE

[82SiouxGuy]

I put the idea out on AGS - at least one Montana fan seemed to think it was reasonable that the NCAA could ban post-season events in ND due to the state wide vote passing. He citied SC, as you have.

Maybe this isn't impossible...

It isn't impossible. But it isn't very likely either. The current sanctions will get plenty of results for the NCAA so they probably won't feel a need to add anything further.

[watchmaker49]

The Bison guys have do have a legit point. Clueless Al would have had to have found something else if it had not been drug out for so long. As for the NCAA doing a state ban is not really that far out of the possible realms of outcomes from the vote. As everyone here has attested to the arrogance of the NCAA what a better way to slap someone down then to show them who is the big dog and who is still pissing like a puppy. They could easily slap bans on playoffs for the whole state and nothing could be done to stop them. Thy are going to be very pissed off if the vote to keep the name wins. With their money and power over college sports I would not be surprised to see them slap the yapping mutt nipping their ankles down.

[Gothmog]

I put the idea out on AGS - at least one Montana fan seemed to think it was reasonable that the NCAA could ban post-season events in ND due to the state wide vote passing. He citied SC, as you have.

Maybe this isn't impossible...

The question isn't "could the NCAA expand sanctions to include all ND members?", it's "why would they?"

Punishing NDSU, Minot State, and UMary would benefit no one, with the possible exception of UND.

[darell1976]

The Bison guys have do have a legit point. Clueless Al would have had to have found something else if it had not been drug out for so long. As for the NCAA doing a state ban is not really that far out of the possible realms of outcomes from the vote. As everyone here has attested to the arrogance of the NCAA what a better way to slap someone down then to show them who is the big dog and who is still pissing like a puppy. They could easily slap bans on playoffs for the whole state and nothing could be done to stop them. Thy are going to be very pissed off if the vote to keep the name wins. With their money and power over college sports I would not be surprised to see them slap the yapping mutt nipping their ankles down.

Even if does seem far fetched you do know its spreading all over Bisonland like a wildfire. If not people wouldn't talk about it. People are scared at the SU and that is why some are thinking of ways to discredit it. If this reaches Gene Taylor or Craig Bohl and most likely with the internet and word of mouth it may I bet some phone calls will be made to the NCAA to see if they really would do this. IMO as good as NDSU was in their title run...home field helped them greatly. Imagine playing at JMU, and GSU.

[darell1976]

The question isn't "could the NCAA expand sanctions to include all ND members?", it's "why would they?"

Punishing NDSU, Minot State, and UMary would benefit no one, with the possible exception of UND.

If those people vote yes to keep the name they are punishing UND. As I said before its like being an accessory to a crime. They are telling UND I will help you break the NCAA law by voting yes.

[82SiouxGuy]

The question isn't "could the NCAA expand sanctions to include all ND members?", it's "why would they?"

Punishing NDSU, Minot State, and UMary would benefit no one, with the possible exception of UND.

Why does the NCAA punish all the schools in South Carolina when the transgression is the state flying a Confederate flag over the Confederate memorial on the state capital grounds? That flag has nothing to do with any school in the state. Expanding sanctions to all of North Dakota because of a statewide vote makes just as much sense.

[The Sicatoka]

Why does the NCAA punish all the schools in South Carolina when the transgression is the state flying a Confederate flag over the Confederate memorial on the state capital grounds? That flag has nothing to do with any school in the state. Expanding sanctions to all of North Dakota because of a statewide vote makes just as much sense in NCAA-think.

Clarified your post.

[Gothmog]

If those people vote yes to keep the name they are punishing UND. As I said before its like being an accessory to a crime. They are telling UND I will help you break the NCAA law by voting yes.

C'mon, there's no proof that anyone, other than a few BV posters, actually have or ever will try to use the referendum to "punish" UND.

In any case, the ballot box is sacred. You have no right to criticize any citizen for exercising their constitutional right to vote.

[darell1976]

C'mon, there's no proof that anyone, other than a few BV posters, actually have or ever will try to use the referendum to "punish" UND.

In any case, the ballot box is sacred. You have no right to criticize any citizen for exercising their constitutional right to vote.

I crizicize any citizen who wishes to destroy the athletic department of my favorite school. Whether they attend UND, NDSU, Mary, Minot State, or even Lake Region

[Gothmog]

Why does the NCAA punish all the schools in South Carolina when the transgression is the state flying a Confederate flag over the Confederate memorial on the state capital grounds? That flag has nothing to do with any school in the state. Expanding sanctions to all of North Dakota because of a statewide vote makes just as much sense.

This has been discussed before. All schools in SC are punished because they display the SC flag on campus. Just as NDSU would be punished if it displayed UND's logo at the Fargo Dome.

[Benny Baker]

Are some of you actually suggesting that you would prefer the NCAA to sanction the state as a whole? I understand that it's a means to a possible end, but it's really disappointing to hear any North Dakotan, or anyone else for that matter, hope that the NCAA further interferes with North Dakota, its academic institutions, its public resources, and further divides our state.

Seriously, any of you who actually wish for this state-wide ban should be ashamed of yourself. Quit traveling down this ever-narrowing tunnel and stop losing sight of the big picture. North Dakota doesn't need the NCAA to make any more of our state's decisions. I would think that we could all agree on this.

[ScottM]

This has been discussed before. All schools in SC are punished because they display the SC flag on campus. Just as NDSU would be punished if it displayed UND's logo at the Fargo Dome.

No, the SC policy applies because the Confederate flag flies on state capitol grounds. The Mississippi policy applies because the Southern Cross is part of the the state flag. The individual schools' own actions are irrelevant, sort of like UND's own attempts to dump the Sioux moniker would not prevent the NC$$ from painting North Dakota with the same, broad brush if the executive committee so ruled.

[82SiouxGuy]

This has been discussed before. All schools in SC are punished because they display the SC flag on campus. Just as NDSU would be punished if it displayed UND's logo at the Fargo Dome.

They are not punished for displaying the South Carolina flag on campus. South Carolina has a Confederate flag that was initially flown over the State Capital building. When the NCAA started to object to that the state moved the flag to a Soldiers Memorial dedicated to the veterans of the Confederate Army. The memorial is part of the State Capital grounds. No Confederate flags are flown on college campuses (at least officially) and South Carolina does not incorporate the Confederate flag in their state flag like Mississippi does.

Edit: Flying the Confederate flag over the memorial has been put into state law and needs a super majority to be removed from state law.

[The Sicatoka]

All schools in SC are punished because they display the SC flag on campus.

FAIL.

The issue is one, one, Confederate flag that used to fly over the state capital but that now flies in a cemetary by a war memorial. That one flag got a state-wide sanction from the NCAA. (Link to dated article http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/14138981/ )

The SoCar flag is a palmetto, not the "stars and bars".

[82SiouxGuy]

Are some of you actually suggesting that you would prefer the NCAA to sanction the state as a whole? I understand that it's a means to a possible end, but it's really disappointing to hear any North Dakotan, or anyone else for that matter, hope that the NCAA further interferes with North Dakota, its academic institutions, its public resources, and further divides our state.

Seriously, any of you who actually wish for this state-wide ban should be ashamed of yourself. Quit traveling down this ever-narrowing tunnel and stop losing sight of the big picture. North Dakota doesn't need the NCAA to make any more of our state's decisions. I would think that we could all agree on this.

I don't think that anyone truly wishes that the NCAA would expand the sanctions. The point is that the group of people that plan to vote in favor of the state law just because they want to hurt UND needs to know that it could happen and it would be just as fair as voting in this law just to damage UND.

[The Sicatoka]

... that the NCAA further interferes with North Dakota, its academic institutions, its public resources, and further divides our state.

Ironic that an organization that sanctions members for lack of internal institutional control is trying, from the outside, to control a member institution.

[FargoBison]

Why does the NCAA punish all the schools in South Carolina when the transgression is the state flying a Confederate flag over the Confederate memorial on the state capital grounds? That flag has nothing to do with any school in the state. Expanding sanctions to all of North Dakota because of a statewide vote makes just as much sense.

The NCAA has a pretty clear policy on Native American nicknames and nowhere does it say that an entire state will be punished because of one school. The whole thing is designed to punish schools that are not in compliance, not states.

Also the SC ban allows for any NCAA postseason game that was earned on merit to still take place in SC. Only predetermined tournaments(like NCAA basketball regionals) are banned. I really doubt the NCAA would be interested in placing the kind of sanctions on ND schools that have been talked about, specifically postseason games earned on merit.

[The Sicatoka]

The NCAA has a pretty clear policy on Native American nicknames and nowhere does it say that an entire state will be punished because of one school. The whole thing is designed to punish schools that are not in compliance, not states.

What stops the NCAA Executive Committee from changing or expanding their policy to states?

[MplsBison]

The question isn't "could the NCAA expand sanctions to include all ND members?", it's "why would they?"

Punishing NDSU, Minot State, and UMary would benefit no one, with the possible exception of UND.

The reason to do it is not because you want to punish the other schools in the state. The reason to do it is to get more people upset at the law and (hopefully) vote against it.

Now that I think about it, the NCAA would actually do well to let be known that they are planning a state-wide sanction to match the state-wide vote, if it passes. You could bet your last red cent that it would not come to pass.

[82SiouxGuy]

The NCAA has a pretty clear policy on Native American nicknames and nowhere does it say that an entire state will be punished because of one school. The whole thing is designed to punish schools that are not in compliance, not states.

Also the SC ban allows for any NCAA postseason game that was earned on merit to still take place in SC. Only predetermined tournaments(like NCAA basketball regionals) are banned. I really doubt the NCAA would be interested in placing the kind of sanctions on ND schools that have been talked about, specifically postseason games earned on merit.

Yes the NCAA policy on NA nicknames is clear. That doesn't mean that they can't change it at any time.

Just to show that the NCAA doesn't have to follow an exact policy, Alabama also has Confederate flags flying over a Civil War memorial on the State Capital grounds. They are not subject to the same policy as South Carolina.

To make things even less fair for South Carolina schools, both the ACC and the SEC have instituted a similar ban on hosting playoffs in South Carolina. So schools like Clemson and South Carolina can't even host conference playoff games.

The point should be that NDSU supporters should not be fighting against UND on this issue because they could become involved at some time in the future for no good reason.

[MplsBison]

C'mon, there's no proof that anyone, other than a few BV posters, actually have or ever will try to use the referendum to "punish" UND.

In any case, the ballot box is sacred. You have no right to criticize any citizen for exercising their constitutional right to vote.

I criticize any citizen who votes without knowing what the heck is going on and not doing any research on the issues he/she is voting. That's why I actually think "low turnout" is not that big of a deal. All it means is that only the people who actually cared enough about the issue voted on it.

I don't want an extra 50% of the population hurrying to the polls after work to cast a ballot when they haven't had time to research the issue.

See my previous post about some of the "guideline" I think, sadly, are going to be used to decide yes or no.

[UNDBIZ]

The reason to do it is not because you want to punish the other schools in the state. The reason to do it is to get more people upset at the law and (hopefully) vote against it.

Now that I think about it, the NCAA would actually do well to let be known that they are planning a state-wide sanction to match the state-wide vote, if it passes. You could bet your last red cent that it would not come to pass.

I believe this is what we (UND fans) are hoping for (not for NDSU to be sanctioned, but for their fans to vote down the law).

[FargoBison]

Yes the NCAA policy on NA nicknames is clear. That doesn't mean that they can't change it at any time.

Just to show that the NCAA doesn't have to follow an exact policy, Alabama also has Confederate flags flying over a Civil War memorial on the State Capital grounds. They are not subject to the same policy as South Carolina.

To make things even less fair for South Carolina schools, both the ACC and the SEC have instituted a similar ban on hosting playoffs in South Carolina. So schools like Clemson and South Carolina can't even host conference playoff games.

The point should be that NDSU supporters should not be fighting against UND on this issue because they could become involved at some time in the future for no good reason.

Where is this big movement from NDSU supporters? All of the NDSU supporters I know that would vote "yes" wouldn't be doing it to hurt UND, they'd be doing it because they think the NCAA is wrong and want UND to keep the name. Those are the minds UND needs to change.

I don't know a single NDSU fan that is planning to vote for this to hurt UND.

[firewall]

Where is this big movement from NDSU supporters? All of the NDSU supporters I know that would vote "yes" wouldn't be doing it to hurt UND, they'd be doing it because they think the NCAA is wrong and want UND to keep the name. Those are the minds UND needs to change.

I don't know a single NDSU fan that is planning to vote for this to hurt UND.

Have you heard the producer of the Mike McFeely show yesterday and again today. He is an NDSU supporter who has openly stated he will vote to keep the name and logo with the "intent of harming UND." Get a clue.

[FargoBison]

Have you heard the producer of the Mike McFeely show yesterday and again today. He is an NDSU supporter who has openly stated he will vote to keep the name and logo with the "intent of harming UND." Get a clue.

I don't listen to McFeely's show...With that said I think he is in the vast minority of voters.