dj_hoime Posted October 17, 2005 Share Posted October 17, 2005 I need help I am doing a persuasive speech on why we should keep the Sioux name. I just need some good points on this subject that i might not think of. Thank You Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoteauRinkRat Posted October 17, 2005 Share Posted October 17, 2005 Look through some of the threads in the Sioux Name forum. There is plenty of good stuff there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted October 17, 2005 Share Posted October 17, 2005 Through this long process, I have changed one view on the Sioux name. The Sioux people who want the name changed do not bellieve that our use of it is honoring the Sioux people. I have come to believe that it is the name and the Sioux people of times gone by that we are honoring, not the people of today. As I've stated recently the University of North Dakota honors the name and the ancestors of the current Sioux through the accomplishments of the students, the athletes, the alumni, and the University; the American Indians state that they are who brought the programs to UND but without the Universit,y the American Indian programs and services would not exist. That's one shortened point of view. There are many others in the Sioux Name threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted October 17, 2005 Share Posted October 17, 2005 Do a search for Yttrium's posts on the name issue. Great stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mujack Posted October 17, 2005 Share Posted October 17, 2005 I hope you are not thinking of doing that for UND English Class. I see a D+ written all over it no matter what you do or say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I hope you are not thinking of doing that for UND English Class. I see a D+ written all over it no matter what you do or say. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Plus you'd get beaten up by GK and his group of merry thugs when you visit the reservations. They have eyes inside their casinos you know. I'm agreeing with mujack. As hot as this topic is to talk about, I don't think it is wise to talk about it in class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I hope you are not thinking of doing that for UND English Class. I see a D+ written all over it no matter what you do or say. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You'd be better off giving a speach about Pro-Abortion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 (edited) I had to write a persuasivce speech in Speech class. Is Dr. Fisher (Fischer?) still around? He gave me a C because I couldn't get rid of my Chicago 'twange'. Didn't know I had one until that class. Edited October 18, 2005 by Sioux-cia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagies Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 Fight the good fight. Don't allow perceptions to alter your choice of topics. There should be no reason you can't get a good grade on a pro-nickname speech. If indeed you do a good job and get a bad grade based on subject matter, I would guess there would be ears in powerful places on that campus that would like to hear your story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I always find threats of litigation and physical intimidation work, such as "inadvertantly" bringing an axe handle to class. Well, and the occasional bribe too ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnowtheFacts Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I need help I am doing a persuasive speech on why we should keep the Sioux name. I just need some good points on this subject that i might not think of. Thank You <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Here's a list of what I have heard on this website so far..Threats, arguments, and excuses... However I agree that if it is for a class at UND, you might want to check with the prof. as most English and Speech classes have banned the topic altogether. 1. If the Name changes, then people will forget about the Sioux culture 2. The name at UND keeps people educated about the Sioux 3. If the Name goes than so does your free schooling 4. Change the Name and no more funding for your Native American Programs 5. I thought "Sioux" was a slanderous word and the Lakota/Nakota/Dakota didnt want to be associated with it anyway. 6. What about the Fighting Irish, the Vikings, the Vandals, Aztecs......They aren't offended! 7. How will this help the poverty/education/health situation on reservations? 8. Dont you have something better to worry about like alcoholism, drugs, crime, teenage pregnancy, diabetes??.... 9. What about Sioux Falls, Sioux City, Indianapolis..... 10. If we change the Indian-related nicknames and logos what next? Peta should be up in arms about animals being degraded as mascots.... 11. What about all those polls?? 12. Yeah those tribal resolutions are made by corrupt politicians and only represent very few pro-change activists 13. How come I only see one or two natives at protests and mostly white people? Most of the people against the name on this campus are white professors. 14. We are Honoring you! 15. This campus is a shrine to Native Americans..... 16. My friends who are native american like the logo 17. What about that one guy who was NA and played on the hockey team? 18. A NA designed the logo 19. Im sick of those Politically Correct activists.... 20. We have over 400 Native students on this campus and 25 native american programs....... 21. We have started a committee to "study" the issue 22. Im named after a family member and Im not offended 23. I would be proud if a school's nickname was named after me. 24. Can we make a compromise? 25. If this affects you and your children like you say then you need to get a better self-esteem and teach your children not to be affected so personally by it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggler Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 How can a prof ban this topic? Screw that, you should be able to speak on it whether you are for or against the name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnowtheFacts Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 How can a prof ban this topic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxFanatic Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 How ironic, I'm doing a persuasive speech on why the Fighting Sioux nickname should be kept as well. Considering I'm younger tha almost if not all of you here it's for my composition class. Which means yes I'm a high schooler. Anyways this is a rather easy topic to write about since it's the center of alot of attention now and articles regarding the issue are released constantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGame Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 However I agree that if it is for a class at UND, you might want to check with the prof. as most English and Speech classes have banned the topic altogether I wouldn't touch this topic in a class at UND unless you really feel the Prof. is fair and will grade on your work instead of possibly having a different opinion than his or hers. Had a bad experience with this in composition class at UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyMom Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 I had a composition class that turned into a 'discuss the nickname' class. We would seriously put all of our chairs in a circle and talk about it every class. It was good, because we had Native Americans and athletes both giving their perspectives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_hoime Posted October 18, 2005 Author Share Posted October 18, 2005 Im doing it in High School English So i might get a higher grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted October 18, 2005 Share Posted October 18, 2005 Here's a list of what I have heard on this website so far..Threats, arguments, and excuses... However I agree that if it is for a class at UND, you might want to check with the prof. as most English and Speech classes have banned the topic altogether. 1. If the Name changes, then people will forget about the Sioux culture 2. The name at UND keeps people educated about the Sioux 3. If the Name goes than so does your free schooling 4. Change the Name and no more funding for your Native American Programs 5. I thought "Sioux" was a slanderous word and the Lakota/Nakota/Dakota didnt want to be associated with it anyway. 6. What about the Fighting Irish, the Vikings, the Vandals, Aztecs......They aren't offended! 7. How will this help the poverty/education/health situation on reservations? 8. Dont you have something better to worry about like alcoholism, drugs, crime, teenage pregnancy, diabetes??.... 9. What about Sioux Falls, Sioux City, Indianapolis..... 10. If we change the Indian-related nicknames and logos what next? Peta should be up in arms about animals being degraded as mascots.... 11. What about all those polls?? 12. Yeah those tribal resolutions are made by corrupt politicians and only represent very few pro-change activists 13. How come I only see one or two natives at protests and mostly white people? Most of the people against the name on this campus are white professors. 14. We are Honoring you! 15. This campus is a shrine to Native Americans..... 16. My friends who are native american like the logo 17. What about that one guy who was NA and played on the hockey team? 18. A NA designed the logo 19. Im sick of those Politically Correct activists.... 20. We have over 400 Native students on this campus and 25 native american programs....... 21. We have started a committee to "study" the issue 22. Im named after a family member and Im not offended 23. I would be proud if a school's nickname was named after me. 24. Can we make a compromise? 25. If this affects you and your children like you say then you need to get a better self-esteem and teach your children not to be affected so personally by it... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> A few more: The nickname brings a sense of history. The past should be remembered, so as to not be repeated. The name reveres the character and bravery of Sioux leadership, in spite of the wrongs done to them. The name is an attempt at reconciliation for past wrongs. Unfortunately certain whites and NA reject concepts of forgiveness. Maintaining the nickname a one small step in counteracting the demasculination of American culture. Some objectors of the name consider masculine expressions of sports competition, especially football and hockey, deplorable and violent. The nickname change is a symptomatic of an attempt to demasculinize white and minority cultures, both in the present and in the past. It should not be surprising that most nickname objectors, both male and female, have mostly militant feminist views. The nickname should be maintained because there is honor within UND. Nickname objectors, often white so-called intellectuals, consider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted October 19, 2005 Share Posted October 19, 2005 The Sioux people of today do not believe we are honoring them. They're right. I believe we are honoring the couragous, brave, honorable Sioux of two centuries past. The University of North Dakota Fighting Sioux are known for excellence in sports, high academic achievements of its athletes, excellent programs which include business/medicine/aerospace, successful alumni, close to if not the highest number of American Indian programs/services in the country, and a large percentage of American Indian students. Unfortunately, nationally, the Sioux Indians of today are known, rightly or not, for casinos, gambling addictions, substance abuse, alcoholism, fetal alcohol syndrome, teen-age pregnancies, high percentage of grammer school/high school dropouts, unmanaged chronic health problems such as diabetes, poverty, unemployment, lack of ambition due to that monthly government check, racism, violence on reservations........... The University of North Dakota's American Indian programs/services are here to assist with the problems cited above. The Sioux people and others who are pro-name changers don't acknowledge this reality. Their focus today is on the creation of lies and the distortion of half truths that are meant to show the country that the use of the Sioux name by the University of North Dakota is disrespectful. It's not UND that's disrespecting the Sioux name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted October 19, 2005 Share Posted October 19, 2005 The Sioux people of today do not believe we are honoring them. They're right. I believe we are honoring the couragous, brave, honorable Sioux of two centuries past. The University of North Dakota Fighting Sioux are known for excellence in sports, high academic achievements of its athletes, excellent programs which include business/medicine/aerospace, successful alumni, close to if not the highest number of American Indian programs/services in the country, and a large percentage of American Indian students. Unfortunately, nationally, the Sioux Indians of today are known, rightly or not, for casinos, gambling addictions, substance abuse, alcoholism, fetal alcohol syndrome, teen-age pregnancies, high percentage of grammer school/high school dropouts, unmanaged chronic health problems such as diabetes, poverty, unemployment, lack of ambition due to that monthly government check, racism, violence on reservations........... The University of North Dakota's American Indian programs/services are here to assist with the problems cited above. The Sioux people and others who are pro-name changers don't acknowledge this reality. Their focus today is on the creation of lies and the distortion of half truths that are meant to show the country that the use of the Sioux name by the University of North Dakota is disrespectful. It's not UND that's disrespecting the Sioux name. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'd also add that the perception of racism of the white man towards NA people is what keeps the reservation's up and running and the NA people down and drowning. In this day and age, where Equal Opportunity for everyone (including criminals) and the compromise of ideals for the sake of diversity (including affirmative Action and even quotas) that is sweeping the nation, the excuse to be downtrodden is just a plea for sympathy. A call for help, for if they enable themselves, put down the bottle, seek help for their medical needs, and do whatever it takes to get themselves a good job and a good lifestyle even if it means integrating, they'll leave the reservations behind to crumble in the dusts of history. The prospect of doing it all for themselves, on the other hand, is frightening. And it would certainly mean an end to all the Federal money coming in. They'd be on their own like every black, white, asian, or whatever race in the United States. That prospect scares them to death. Native Americans right now just want their checks and they still want the respect the whites and blacks and asians get too. How many kids go up to beggars on the street corner and say "I want to be just like you when I grow up?" How many kids of a man who does nothing but accept his Federal assistance check say "This is the life! When I grow up, I'm going to do what my dad does!" Maybe some NA do, but I can't name one who has to say that. All they have to do is to do the work. Show up at school, get that "dumb" piece of paper while walking across that stage wearing a "goofy" gown. Fill out some applications, go to college, do more work, think about what you want to be, and go for it. It's a LOT of work, but it isn't impossible, unless you truly are that beggar. I've NEVER met a beggar I could respect, and I have never met one with Honor. I've met Native Americans with Honor and Respect... of course all of those I've met don't live on the reservation. They got real jobs off of it. So, I give you this question: What is the worst thing ever done that's listed: The White man putting the NA people in reservations, or the NA people losing the ability to fend for themselves? If you ask me, the second option is a lot more depressing than the first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_hoime Posted October 21, 2005 Author Share Posted October 21, 2005 hey thanks for all the stuff. Do you know where to find info on how many NA programs and students re at UND. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 hey thanks for all the stuff. Do you know where to find info on how many NA programs and students re at UND. Thanks. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Check out PCM's posts, I know he's posted them and I would guarantee it's accuracy given the source! Also check out UND website, Kupchella's speech, UND's appeal are posted and should contain the info. Say are you going to share your grade with us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_hoime Posted October 21, 2005 Author Share Posted October 21, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted October 21, 2005 Share Posted October 21, 2005 hey thanks for all the stuff. Do you know where to find info on how many NA programs and students re at UND. Thanks. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Here's the link for the list of programs. http://www.UND.edu/dept/aiss/Indian%20Related%20Programs.htm Here are the enrollment statistics for 2004-2005: http://www.UND.edu/profile/ Apparently the stats for the current semester aren't up yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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