Coaching Change Questions

[Zypher]

So I am curious as to what others think in regards to coaching retention and when its time to make a change.

Colorado College’s Kris Mayotte (Union College Alum) is in his 3^rd season with the team, he currently has a 33-64-7 record.  In his first 2 years, he has maintained a solid 7^th place finish each year, this year tho, they have the chance to finish 5-7^th place. In order to get into the NCAA Tournament this year, they will need to win the NCHC Tournament for an automatic bid, which by all means, will not happen.

Denver’s David Carle (Denver Alum) is currently in his 6^th season with the team, and currently has a 131-58-15 record. His highest finish in the NCHC was 1st and has maintained a top 4 average almost every other year, and is on track to do the same this year as well.

Duluth’s Scott Sandlelin (UND Alum), he is currently in his 24^th year with a record of 451-378-100. His highest finish in the NCHC was 2nd (3x) and has maintained a top 4 average almost every other year.

Miami Ohio’s Chris Bergeron (Miami Ohio Alum) in his 5th season, has a record of 35–101–15 with 0 NCAA Tournament appearances. His highest finish in the NCHC was 7^th his first year, but has finished last every year since, and is on track to do the same this year as well. In order to get into the NCAA Tournament this year, they will need to win the NCHC Tournament for an automatic bid, which by all means, will not happen.

Omaha’s Mike Gabinet (Omaha Alum) in his 7^th season, has a record of 105-108-14, with 1 NCAA Tournament Appearance. His highest finish in the NCHC was 3rd in the 2020-2021 season but has finished around 6^th on average every other year, and is on track to do the same this year as well. Over his tenure, they have had glimpses of success, but nothing that has been sustained. In order to get into the NCAA Tournament this year, they will need to win the NCHC Tournament for an automatic bid.

St. Cloud State’s Brett Larson (Duluth Alum) is currently in his 6^th season with the team, and currently has a 117-66-19 record. His highest finish in the NCHC was 1st and has maintained a top 4 average almost every other year, and is on track to do the same this year as well.

UND’s Brad Berry (UND Alum) is currently in his 9^th year with a record of 195-98-32. His highest finish in the NCHC was 1st (3x) and has maintained a top 4 average almost every other year, and is on track to do the same this year as well.

 

Western Michigan’s, Pat Ferschweiler (Western Michigan Alum) in his 3rd season, has a record of 63–32–3, with 2 NCAA Tournament appearances. By far, appears to have righted the ship at Western Michigan. Currently they are on track to potentially earn a bid into the NCAA Tournament again this year.

 

Now lets add to this our incoming member

 

Arizona State, their coach, Greg Powers (Arizona State Alum, Club Team), is an interesting one. Powers coached the team from 2010-2015 as the coach for Arizona State’s club team, with a record of 164-27-9, and continued as coach when they transitioned to D1 in 2015, and is in his 9^th season D1 (14 total with the team), with a record of 119-143-22. Although his current record is a losing record in D1, he does have a proven record with the team, that he can produce, his combined total for both club and D1 is 283-270-31. Only time will tell where they go when the formally transition into the NCHC.

Out of all the teams I mentioned, when you look at the historical numbers and rankings of the NCHC, the teams traditionally competing for the top 4 in the conference, Denver, Duluth, St. Cloud, UND, and Western Michigan, have coaches with relatively strong winning records over their tenure.

 

I’m going to give Colorado College a small pass, due to it being Mayotte’s 3^rd season, he is still trying to build a team, but it continues to trend downward when compared to Western’s success, with a coach of the same tenure. But when you look at Miami (5^th season) and Omaha (7^th season), of their current coaches, there seems to have been ample time for these coaches to make the necessary changes to improve their teams, especially given the turnaround Ferschweiler has done at Western in less than 3 years. They are beginning to play like the Western of old! Most of us know, that if these teams (Miami, and Omaha) were D1 football teams, coaching changes would have been done by now for both teams. When teams seem to be less competitive, it is reflective in the fanbase and its attendance at the games, and its support of the team at the games. In the end, lets be honest, neither Miami or Omaha’s choices have been successful anywhere close to where they should be, Colorado Colleges choice is starting to become questionable.

 

Over the decades, North Dakota has been blessed with the coaches we have been given. I think that is why many are extremely critical when things don’t go right for the team. In the end, I don’t mind having the teams that the chances of winning are high, just like any other fan, but my questions to you are this; Is it possible, that the talent pool of quality coaches is small, and the only real opportunity for most teams is to try to poach a quality coach from another school? Do you make a change because a coach doesn’t win the regular season, what about the conference tournament? How many chances do you give a coach to make the NCAA Tournament, and then win a National Title? Finally, at what point, after how many unproductive and under productive seasons do you cut your losses, and move forward with a new head coach?

[jk]

This could get interesting.  Miami needs to try again.  I wouldn't make a change in Omaha or CC.

The others should be careful about changing.  There are plenty of examples of perennial winners becoming former powers.  

For UND specifically, I have liked what has turned into a pattern, accidentally I think, of turning it over after about a decade.  The program has gone from one great coach to another in the middle of each of the last three decades, and by most metrics (but not all, especially not one), the program has remained among the best.  Continuing the pattern would have us see the job turn over in the next few years.  

[Zypher]

I would definitely agree with you for the time being about CC, i do feel that a little more time should be given to the staff to work out the bugs. As for Omaha, I do think they need to seriously look at possible changes to the head coach. in 2011 Omaha made the decision to cut both the football (who was a decent overall program) and their wrestling (who had won 6 national title in the 8 years prior) and decided to make Hockey their premier/focus sport. 

Even after that change, the highest they finished was 3rd with Blaise (2x), Gabinet (1x),. This includes NO Conference Titles or Tournament Titles, and only 2 visits to the National Tournament. 

If the same had occurred at Denver, Duluth, St Cloud, or UND the fans would be clamoring for a change. (Just like some are at UND because of missing the NCAA Tournament a few times with Berry over the last few years.)

[cberkas]

Bergeron has a year left if I remember correctly and Miami isn't going to buyout his contract if you go by the money troubles Miami has from their message board. 

Gabinet was basically handpicked to be an assistant coach to take over after Blais. I don't see him leaving anytime soon or Omaha forcing him out. Omaha dropping football and wrestling had to do with University of Nebraska and not competing for players, or that is at least what has been said about it (Mavpuck would know more about it). 

Colorado College was in way worse shape after Scott Owens left then Western Michigan when Jeff Blashill left and Andy Murry took over. 

[The Sicatoka]

Let the others worry about their houses. 

Be happy our house has good options should they be called upon. 

[Zypher]

8 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Let the others worry about their houses. 

Be happy our house has good options should they be called upon. 

I just posing a question. I find it interesting how quick teams in other sports are to change coaches for poor performances. This doesn't always seem to be the case in college hockey, wondering why that would be.

[Blackheart]

46 minutes ago, Zypher said:

I just posing a question. I find it interesting how quick teams in other sports are to change coaches for poor performances. This doesn't always seem to be the case in college hockey, wondering why that would be.

Not as much revenue as football or basketball?

[Zypher]

That all depends on the School. At UND and UNO Hockey is the primary sport. I believe the same is true for Denver, St. Cloud as well as Duluth. I would agree with the revenue argument for the Big10 Hockey schools tho.

[Shawn-O]

1 hour ago, Zypher said:

I just posing a question. I find it interesting how quick teams in other sports are to change coaches for poor performances. This doesn't always seem to be the case in college hockey, wondering why that would be.

With the exception of about a half-dozen schools (maybe), hockey is a complete afterthought in the AD's office.   

[nodak651]

I think Miami has a commitment issue and they should be kicked out of the league.

Fiscal 2022 they somehow had a lower overall budget and lower travel budget than they did in 2016.  Their NCHC.TV broadcast is probably a good indication of their current commitment level.  Just kinda guessing, but pair that with the comments from their AD, and I don't think changing the coach will fix anything. 

[AlphaMikeFoxtrot]

1 hour ago, Shawn-O said:

With the exception of about a half-dozen schools (maybe), hockey is a complete afterthought in the AD's office.   

Hopefully the new AD at Iowa's previous tenures at Minnesota and Connecticut showed her the possibility that lies in front of her with Barta's anti hockey Bison arse gone.

[MafiaMan]

On 1/19/2024 at 4:40 PM, nodak651 said:

I think Miami has a commitment issue and they should be kicked out of the league.

Fiscal 2022 they somehow had a lower overall budget and lower travel budget than they did in 2016.  Their NCHC.TV broadcast is probably a good indication of their current commitment level.  Just kinda guessing, but pair that with the comments from their AD, and I don't think changing the coach will fix anything. 

Yikes. 

[Godsmack]

Under Kris Mayotte, in his first season, the team won 9 games (winning %, .292), including a road victory at a ranked Boston College. In Mayotte’s second year, he won 13 games (winning %, .382). His Tigers went on the road as the seventh seed and knocked off #7 nationally ranked Western Michigan and then they went on to St. Paul and shut out the #3 ranked DU Pioneers in the Frozen Faceoff semifinals.
 

This year, his Tigers have already won 13 games, equaling last year’s total and they have a .614 winning percentage.  The Tigers are knocking on the door of both a top four conference finish (currently just 1 point behind Western Michigan) with a chance at hosting in the first round for the first time in over a decade and they currently sit at 16th in the pairwise. I’d say Mayotte has done everything a CC fan and administrator could possibly ask for and more, especially given the deep hole his predecessor had dug the program into prior to his arrival. 

With a brand new on campus barn and the program winning, you are routinely seeing at or near capacity crowds and a growing student section that frankly had vanished in the mid-2000’s. There is genuine excitement and chatter about the hockey team on campus and in the community. 

If anything, I see CC on an upward trajectory and if Mayotte continues to lead the team to even greater heights, I could see opportunities at bigger more ‘blue blood’ programs in his future (ala, Don Lucia in the late 1990’s going to Minnesota after turning around a near lifeless CC program that up until his first year on the job hadn’t won a McNaughton cup since 1957). Mayotte’s job at CC is very secure. 

[MafiaMan]

On 1/22/2024 at 10:06 PM, Godsmack said:

Under Kris Mayotte, in his first season, the team won 9 games (winning %, .292), including a road victory at a ranked Boston College. In Mayotte’s second year, he won 13 games (winning %, .382). His Tigers went on the road as the seventh seed and knocked off #7 nationally ranked Western Michigan and then they went on to St. Paul and shut out the #3 ranked DU Pioneers in the Frozen Faceoff semifinals.
 

This year, his Tigers have already won 13 games, equaling last year’s total and they have a .614 winning percentage.  The Tigers are knocking on the door of both a top four conference finish (currently just 1 point behind Western Michigan) with a chance at hosting in the first round for the first time in over a decade and they currently sit at 16th in the pairwise. I’d say Mayotte has done everything a CC fan and administrator could possibly ask for and more, especially given the deep hole his predecessor had dug the program into prior to his arrival. 

With a brand new on campus barn and the program winning, you are routinely seeing at or near capacity crowds and a growing student section that frankly had vanished in the mid-2000’s. There is genuine excitement and chatter about the hockey team on campus and in the community. 

If anything, I see CC on an upward trajectory and if Mayotte continues to lead the team to even greater heights, I could see opportunities at bigger more ‘blue blood’ programs in his future (ala, Don Lucia in the late 1990’s going to Minnesota after turning around a near lifeless CC program that up until his first year on the job hadn’t won a McNaughton cup since 1957). Mayotte’s job at CC is very secure. 

Sheesh…no, he won’t date you, @Godsmack!

[Godsmack]

9 hours ago, MafiaMan said:

Sheesh…no, he won’t date you, @Godsmack!

Hey, just pointing out the success Mayotte has had in just three seasons. 

[Zypher]

So, it looks like there are at least 3 open positions for head coaches at the D1 level. Bowling Green, Lindenwood, and Miami Ohio. Obviously, for the most part, I don't think any of these schools have the money to seduce a current head coach in the top 20 to leave their current teams. But, what current Assistant Bench Bosses across D1 Hockey. do you think may be persuaded to take the move, to accept a position at any of these schools?

Out of our 3 Assistants, I don't see Dane leaving. I get the feeling he is most likely the "next coach up"  whenever Berry retires. As for Karl or Dillion, I could see both Lindenwood and Bowling Green as potential moves. Miami, although, currently a step down in a sense, could become a major step up, if they were able to turn that program totally around. (although it would take 3-4 seasons to do so.)

[cberkas]

There are 5 openings Miami, Lindenwood, BGSU, Princeton, and Stonehill. 

[Zypher]

3 minutes ago, cberkas said:

There are 5 openings Miami, Lindenwood, BGSU, Princeton, and Stonehill. 

Thought i heard 5, but couldn't find the other 2. ty for adding them.

The other issue i didn't mention, it timing. they basically have a month to get someone in the position, for recruiting. But trying to get a coach hired from assistants with teams in the national tournament, drops you down to about 2 weeks after the national tournament, so that you have a coach in place to talk to current player to retain them, and recruit replacement players. as most practices begin in late September / first week of October.

[nodak651]

Would Poltulny-> Miami work?

[siouxkid12]

On 3/19/2024 at 8:42 AM, Zypher said:

So, it looks like there are at least 3 open positions for head coaches at the D1 level. Bowling Green, Lindenwood, and Miami Ohio. Obviously, for the most part, I don't think any of these schools have the money to seduce a current head coach in the top 20 to leave their current teams. But, what current Assistant Bench Bosses across D1 Hockey. do you think may be persuaded to take the move, to accept a position at any of these schools?

Out of our 3 Assistants, I don't see Dane leaving. I get the feeling he is most likely the "next coach up"  whenever Berry retires. As for Karl or Dillion, I could see both Lindenwood and Bowling Green as potential moves. Miami, although, currently a step down in a sense, could become a major step up, if they were able to turn that program totally around. (although it would take 3-4 seasons to do so.)

If any of our assistants left, I am assuming they would go to a program that is respected by administration and is cheered on. They probably wont leave to a school who considers hockey as an afterthought. Plus Dillion doesn't even have a year under his belt coaching and why would Karl leave?

[siouxkid12]

23 hours ago, nodak651 said:

Would Poltulny-> Miami work?

maybe but whoever Miami is going to hire will have to show that coach that they are committed to winning.

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

Hi, BG guy here again popping in for my yearly engagement with the SiouxSports world.  I'm curious as to this group's rankings on the attractiveness of the BG job vs. the Miami job.  Which is "better" and why?

I'll hang up and listen to your answer.

[Blackheart]

23 minutes ago, TalonsUpPuckDown said:

Hi, BG guy here again popping in for my yearly engagement with the SiouxSports world.  I'm curious as to this group's rankings on the attractiveness of the BG job vs. the Miami job.  Which is "better" and why?

I'll hang up and listen to your answer.

Well if the primary consideration was having enough horses to win in your league, Bowling Green would be miles ahead of Miami.  Bergeron never won more than 8 games in any of the 5 seasons as head coach of Miami.  Looks like just 19 conference wins in five years; finishing last in 4 of 5 seasons.  Eigner's BG teams were just a bit over .500 the last five years with 20+ win seasons in his first two.  So the ramp up to having a winning squad would appear to favor Bowling Green at this point. 

It's interesting to note that Bergeron's time as Bowling Green's coach showed improvement in win totals each of his nine years before leaving for Miami. (including NCAA's his last year)  So did Bergeron suddenly become a bad coach upon arriving in Miami?  Did he not recruit well enough to compete in the NCHC?

As far as attractiveness, there are a lot of things to consider including facilities, fan/admin support, history of the program, the league you play in, salary, etc.  I'll leave that to someone who knows more about hockey in the CCHA footprint.

[Kevin G]

1 hour ago, TalonsUpPuckDown said:

Hi, BG guy here again popping in for my yearly engagement with the SiouxSports world.  I'm curious as to this group's rankings on the attractiveness of the BG job vs. the Miami job.  Which is "better" and why?

I'll hang up and listen to your answer.

Hey man, thanks for stopping by. The BGSU job has at least one huge advantage over the Miami job: a reasonable path to conference championships and the NCAA tournament. Bowling Green can more easily compete at the top of the CCHA; at the very least no one looks to be running away with the conference anymore. Miami however is far behind the top of the NCHC; they’re even far behind the middle of the conference. So Miami has a longer and more difficult path to success than BGSU, in my opinion. (Plus I’m not sure that folks in Miami are content with their conference affiliation. That’s probably not an issue at Bowling Green.)