Moo U diaries

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

You certainly implied it when you said UND's backups don't have "real talent". What else would that mean? Let's not backpedal here. 

First of all, that's not a direct quote so you quoting me as saying "real talent" is already a stretch. Secondly, depth is about emphasis on a position, which is what my point has been this entire discussion. NDSU emphasizes certain positions due to the nature of how they are built. Because of that they don't take chances in recruiting with certain positions. O line and d line are two good examples. They offer many scholarships and bring many guys on campus to compete, some of them work out some of them don't but they don't leave it to chance by only recruiting one or two guys each year. Opposite example would be wide receiver, this is not a position of emphasis for NDSU, they don't allocate a lot of scholarship money to it each year. Probably why you have seen so many walk on receivers have success over the years. Nobody is disrespecting your players, I'm saying the coaches need to emphasize recruiting certain positions to compete in a different style of football.

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

CAA plays a different style that still worked fine against the MVFC. 2016 Big Sky conference teams EWU and UND competed fine against MVFC and CAA (although UND ultimately lost two close games to CAA). Essentially, don't get too lost in conference affiliation. 

Fair, but if you watch the CAA it's built very similar to the MVFC.

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

2 hours ago, JohnboyND7 said:

Is Alabama sliding every year or two then? I mean,  they didn't win the title!

Every year(including the juggernaut 2013 team), ndsu has had close games.  Losing coaches is not a bad thing,  means you are doing a good job finding good people.  Would you rather have a low energy guy who can't do any better than FCS? No. 

You have a prescription misfire?????? Too many pills?????? You are so full of yourselves.............

You no ALABAMA.

2 hours ago, Bison06 said:

You're really reaching for this one. Not every team can be better than the previous year's team. This past year in my mind was already going to be a team that was looking to replace some great players, corners were both green, offensive line was replacing NFL talent and then of course there's replacing Carson wentz, all that was before our two best and possibly most important defensive players went down for the season and the team still made the national semifinals, lost to the eventual champion and beat the other team in the championship in the regular season. The 2014 team wasn't as good as the 2013 team, did that mean they were slipping?  I realize for a UND fan it is comforting to think NDSU's run might be over, but all indications are that NDSU is primed and ready for another deep playoff run next year so don't hold your breath. 

Scratch the first sentence and you getting closer. Next years last loss could be on the road.

 

[UND-FB-FAN]

7 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

First of all, that's not a direct quote so you quoting me as saying "real talent" is already a stretch. Secondly, depth is about emphasis on a position, which is what my point has been this entire discussion. NDSU emphasizes certain positions due to the nature of how they are built. Because of that they don't take chances in recruiting with certain positions. O line and d line are two good examples. They offer many scholarships and bring many guys on campus to compete, some of them work out some of them don't but they don't leave it to chance by only recruiting one or two guys each year. Opposite example would be wide receiver, this is not a position of emphasis for NDSU, they don't allocate a lot of scholarship money to it each year. Probably why you have seen so many walk on receivers have success over the years. Nobody is disrespecting your players, I'm saying the coaches need to emphasize recruiting certain positions to compete in a different style of football.

I agree with your points. Just for your information, though, - as I don't know what you know about UND football - Bubba and his staff certainly emphasize defensive and offensive linemen, too. They are building their program in a very similar fashion to NDSU. UND also emphasizes athletic body types (6'2" 185 - 215 lbs.) that can play either outside backer or safety and also have significant special teams roles. 

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

I agree with your points. Just for your information, though, - as I don't know what you know about UND football - Bubba and his staff certainly emphasize defensive and offensive linemen, too. They are building their program in a very similar fashion to NDSU.

I can see that and know bubba and Schmidt's history and understand fully why UND fans are optimistic for the future based on what is being built and who is building it. Just thought it would be an interesting discussion point to see how UND would handle the unique challenge of building a team that is successful in two different conferences simultaneously. It took NDSU a couple of years in the MVFC to build a team that could compete week in and week out, maybe UND will do it faster.

[homer]

10 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

First of all, that's not a direct quote so you quoting me as saying "real talent" is already a stretch. Secondly, depth is about emphasis on a position, which is what my point has been this entire discussion. NDSU emphasizes certain positions due to the nature of how they are built. Because of that they don't take chances in recruiting with certain positions. O line and d line are two good examples. They offer many scholarships and bring many guys on campus to compete, some of them work out some of them don't but they don't leave it to chance by only recruiting one or two guys each year. Opposite example would be wide receiver, this is not a position of emphasis for NDSU, they don't allocate a lot of scholarship money to it each year. Probably why you have seen so many walk on receivers have success over the years. Nobody is disrespecting your players, I'm saying the coaches need to emphasize recruiting certain positions to compete in a different style of football.

I've passed along the note so the coaches know what they need to recruit.  Now we cross our fingers and hopefully we are able to compete in your conference.  

[homer]

1 minute ago, Bison06 said:

I can see that and know bubba and Schmidt's history and understand fully why UND fans are optimistic for the future based on what is being built and who is building it. Just thought it would be an interesting discussion point to see how UND would handle the unique challenge of building a team that is successful in two different conferences simultaneously. It took NDSU a couple of years in the MVFC to build a team that could compete week in and week out, maybe UND will do it faster.

NDSUs lack of competing in the MVFC wasn't completely due to lack of talent.  

[Bison06]

8 minutes ago, BarnWinterSportsEngelstad said:

You have a prescription misfire?????? Too many pills?????? You are so full of yourselves.............

You no ALABAMA.

Scratch the first sentence and you getting closer. Next years last loss could be on the road.

 

It's also likely that NDSU's final loss will be in the regular season and the season will end with me on the field in Frisco, TX. Thinking that they're falling from grace is something I've been reading on this board since 2011. I suppose eventually you'll be right so it's a smart position to take.

[geaux_sioux]

1 hour ago, Bison06 said:

I think the UND coaching staff may find themselves in a bit of an interesting recruiting position these next few years. As we know, nearly every team is built to win its respective conference. Conference teams are who you play the majority of your games against so it makes sense to build your team to beat those teams specifically. What's interesting is the style to win the big sky and the style to win the MVFC are very different and IMO require a different approach in building your team. e.g. In the big sky, your defense better be able to handle 5 wide on a consistent basis, meaning you'll likely want to have a lot of depth in your secondary. In the MVFC if you see 5 wide it won't be all game so you probably don't need quite the depth in the secondary. In the MVFC you'll get more of a steady dose of the power running game and will likely need a much deeper front 7, especially the d line. NDSU has won championships on the back of a defense that is built from the front back and their d line depth has been amazing these past 7 years.

How do you think the UND coaches will approach the task of staying competitive in the big sky for the time being, but also knowing that their team will need to be built differently to compete in the MVFC year in and year out.

Our deepest position group is DL. We're still working on the secondary. Bubba has been building UND MVFC style from day 1. That's the reason for our success last season.

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, homer said:

I've passed along the note so the coaches know what they need to recruit.  Now we cross our fingers and hopefully we are able to compete in your conference.  

Do you mean to tell me that nothing we discuss on this board has any actual consequence with what our favorite teams do? Why didn't somebody tell me, I could be accomplishing much more important things with my life than hypothesizing on the future of football at two little known FCS schools in nowhere America. 

[UND-1]

5 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

I can see that and know bubba and Schmidt's history and understand fully why UND fans are optimistic for the future based on what is being built and who is building it. Just thought it would be an interesting discussion point to see how UND would handle the unique challenge of building a team that is successful in two different conferences simultaneously. It took NDSU a couple of years in the MVFC to build a team that could compete week in and week out, maybe UND will do it faster.

They have four years.  

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

1 minute ago, Bison06 said:

It's also likely that NDSU's final loss will be in the regular season and the season will end with me on the field in Frisco, TX. Thinking that they're falling from grace is something I've been reading on this board since 2011. I suppose eventually you'll be right so it's a smart position to take.

Youngstown, JM, and you will be the favorites. Have to play the season. JM is going to be tough with their rah rah coach.

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, homer said:

NDSUs lack of competing in the MVFC wasn't completely due to lack of talent.  

It wasn't? You'd find about 19k people in fargo every Saturday that would say different. QB talent, o line was down, d line was down. If it wasn't talent and depth at our important positions what was it?

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, UND-1 said:

They have four years.  

But that's my point, they have to be competitive in the big sky for the next four years too.

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, BarnWinterSportsEngelstad said:

Youngstown, JM, and you will be the favorites. Have to play the season. JM is going to be tough with their rah rah coach.

So if you're saying NDSU will be in the top 3 for teams you would pick to win the championship next year, how can they be slipping?

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

7 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

But that's my point, they have to be competitive in the big sky for the next four three years too.

FYP

4 years from now you'll be playing in the Hawk's Nest.

[UND-1]

Just now, Bison06 said:

But that's my point, they have to be competitive in the big sky for the next four years too.

The way UND plays will not change anything as far as recruiting.  They know they need better OL, especially in four years.  The rest of it is the same.  UND needs good safeties in their scheme no matter who they are playing, for instance.  Corners, yep.  Defensive line, yep...and so on.  

[homer]

3 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

So if you're saying NDSU will be in the top 3 for teams you would pick to win the championship next year, how can they be slipping?

Off the field issues and chemistry played a part.  Not the tightest ship those seasons. 

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

2 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

So if you're saying NDSU will be in the top 3 for teams you would pick to win the championship next year, how can they be slipping?

They'll be a near top favorite at the beginning of the season. JM will come out #1, Then season will to be played. U won't be #1 like last year......

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, UND-1 said:

The way UND plays will not change anything as far as recruiting.  They know they need better OL, especially in four years.  The rest of it is the same.  UND needs good safeties in their scheme no matter who they are playing, for instance.  Corners, yep.  Defensive line, yep...and so on.  

A college football team simply cannot b stacked with depth at every position, offering an additional scholarship to a certain position necessarily takes one away from another there are only 63 to go around. So you say bubba and crew are going to emphasize the defensive backfield to shore the position group up. Which position group will they be taking scholarships away from to emphasize the defensive backfield?

[UND-1]

Just now, Bison06 said:

A college football team simply cannot b stacked with depth at every position, offering an additional scholarship to a certain position necessarily takes one away from another there are only 63 to go around. So you say bubba and crew are going to emphasize the defensive backfield to shore the position group up. Which position group will they be taking scholarships away from to emphasize the defensive backfield?

Linebacker.  

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, homer said:

Off the field issues and chemistry played a part.  Not the tightest ship those seasons. 

Losing tends to do that to 19 year old young men. Seems like an effect rather than a cause.

[UND-FB-FAN]

12 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

But that's my point, they have to be competitive in the big sky for the next four years too.

So a top MVFC team couldn't compete in the Big Sky Conference? This comment makes no sense to me. As UND builds itself via recruiting and philosophy to compete in the MVFC (as they have been doing all along), they will yet compete just fine in the Big Sky Conference. They did just fine in 2016. Big Sky Conference teams and Missouri Valley teams alike still play by the same rules. UND will not change their current direction - OL and DL. 

[Bison06]

Just now, UND-1 said:

Linebacker.  

So it's interesting that bubba is shoring up the defensive backfield, do you all think that might have anything to do with the fact that to win the big sky you'll have to beat EWU? Because if I look at your defensive backfield competing in the MVFC I wouldn't say the need to improve it is nearly as important. This has been my point since the beginning, of it were 3 years from now I doubt UND would be as concerned about shoring up the DB group, they won't find a Cooper Kupp and his crew in the MVFC.

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

So a top MVFC team couldn't compete in the Big Sky Conference? This comment makes no sense to me. As UND builds itself via recruiting and philosophy to compete in the MVFC (as they have been doing all along), they will yet compete just fine in the Big Sky Conference. They did just fine in 2016. Big Sky Conference teams and Missouri Valley teams alike still play by the same rules. 

This is just how conferences work. Teams build themselves to beat their conference mates. Originally, NDSU built a team that could beat UNI so they could win the conference. They were the stud in conference so it's the way it goes.

I would be willing to bet you any amount of money, that when bubba and staff look at UND's team, they ask themselves what do we need to do to beat EWU, the class of the big sky and then they set out to do it.