Building UND Athletics

[SIOUXFAN97]

1) I don't think that is the 990 for the full organization. It seems to only be part of the organization. My guess is that they have more than 1 501©3 set up. It might be the 990 for the Betty, but that is just a guess.

2) You probably have to read through any explanations. I doubt that it's as simple as picking out 1 of those lines. Sometimes the answer is in one of the schedules later in the document.

3) You may need to talk with someone at REA to get the explanation or break out the number.

i guess they have three different 990's...bottom line how much does rea give on any given year?? you would think that they would do that large fake check promotion to highlight how they give but if they don't are they ashamed of how little it actually is???

[southpaw]

i guess they have three different 990's...bottom line how much does rea give on any given year?? you would think that they would do that large fake check promotion to highlight how they give but if they don't are they ashamed of how little it actually is???

My guess is that 99% of fans don't realize UND doesn't own the REA. Doing a big check donation thing like that would raise some eyebrows no matter how big the amount is.

[The Sicatoka]

Would it be better if UND had to pay to play in REA, like they have to pay to play in Alerus Center?

[fightingsioux4life]

i guess they have three different 990's...bottom line how much does rea give on any given year?? you would think that they would do that large fake check promotion to highlight how they give but if they don't are they ashamed of how little it actually is???

Not as easy as 82SiouxGuy says it is, is it? You almost have to be a lawyer to understand those forms; which is why doing your taxes every April is such a pain in the butt. He should remember that the next time he scolds and preaches to others on what they should or shouldn't do.

[fightingsioux4life]

Would it be better if UND had to pay to play in REA, like they have to pay to play in Alerus Center?

Apples and oranges. The Alerus Center was built by the City of Grand Forks to promote economic development and bring in outside dollars. UND is just another client of the Alerus Center. REA was specifically built with a mission to benefit UND and UND athletics. So charging UND to play there would be a slap in the face and a knife in the back. And I don't see that ever happening.

[82SiouxGuy]

Not as easy as 82SiouxGuy says it is, is it? You almost have to be a lawyer to understand those forms; which is why doing your taxes every April is such a pain in the butt. He should remember that the next time he scolds and preaches to others on what they should or shouldn't do.

Which is why I also said that you would need to contact someone at REA, or did you forget that part? You seem to miss some of those details. The 990 isn't set up to give specifics on how much is given to a specific entity, although sometimes those details are revealed in the attached schedules. That is up to the organization and the people that are filling out the forms. They can decide how much detail to put into the form. The 990 is a generic form used by thousands of non-profits around the country. That's why they don't have a line that says "Money given to UND Athletics". You would be better off being a tax accountant to understand the forms rather than an attorney. Accountants fill out the forms. The information is there, you just need help separating it from all of the other information. Of course you always want someone else to find the answers for you rather than you going and asking questions of the people that might actually know something.

[jdub27]

Not as easy as 82SiouxGuy says it is, is it? You almost have to be a lawyer to understand those forms; which is why doing your taxes every April is such a pain in the butt. He should remember that the next time he scolds and preaches to others on what they should or shouldn't do.

You're right. Complaining about it without giving any effort to find out the facts and just making assumptions is a lot easier to do.

[Cratter]

The fact is you can't find out of how much the Ralph gives unless you hire an accountant.

Good luck calling the Ralph and saying " yeah how much did you give UND last year."

[82SiouxGuy]

The fact is you can't find out of how much the Ralph gives unless you hire an accountant.

Good luck calling the Ralph and saying " yeah how much did you give UND last year."

Have you actually tried talking to Jody, or is this just your guess? You aren't going to get the answer if you call the front desk, you actually have to talk to someone that knows what is going on. Have you tried talking to someone in the Athletic Department? As a public entity they have to be pretty open about where money comes from.

[jdub27]

The fact is you can't find out of how much the Ralph gives unless you hire an accountant.

Good luck calling the Ralph and saying " yeah how much did you give UND last year."

I disagree completely with this. As I stated earlier, a few years ago I sat in on a presentation of Jody's and he went through their financials, including what they give to UND and what they pay to cover debt payments on the Betty among a ton of other things. Because of how they are set up, the information is accessible.

[SIOUXFAN97]

ask..don't ask..hire an accountant....ask someone to hire an accountant?? if REA give soooo much money to the athletic department you think that number would be front and center on their webpage in big bold numbers..... 34.3 MILLION DOLLARS DONATED SINCE 2001!!!! i bumped this thread up bc i think with und only generating a couple million dollars more than than the ndac i think is horrible considering how many millionaires have passed thru just the mens hockey side in the last ten years not to mention atheletes and non-athletes that have passed thru the business and engineering schools in the past 40 years...mr. mean/mr. chipman to name a few???

[82SiouxGuy]

ask..don't ask..hire an accountant....ask someone to hire an accountant?? if REA give soooo much money to the athletic department you think that number would be front and center on their webpage in big bold numbers..... 34.3 MILLION DOLLARS DONATED SINCE 2001!!!! i bumped this thread up bc i think with und only generating a couple million dollars more than than the ndac i think is horrible considering how many millionaires have passed thru just the mens hockey side in the last ten years not to mention non-athletes that have passed thru the business and engineering schools in the past 40 years...mr. mean/mr. chipman to name a few???

UND just completed a fund raising campaign that raised $324,000,000 in something like 6 years. UND is now raising $40-50,000,000 per year in donations and they expect to continue raising money at that rate. I don't know how much you want people to give.

As far as how much REA has given to the athletic department, as has been mentioned before it would be a losing proposition to broadcast it no matter how much it is. Some people would think it wasn't enough. Other people would complain about how much they were giving away and complain about the prices that REA charges. It would be a lose-lose proposition to broadcast the amount.

[SIOUXFAN97]

UND just completed a fund raising campaign that raised $324,000,000 in something like 6 years. UND is now raising $40-50,000,000 per year in donations and they expect to continue raising money at that rate. I don't know how much you want people to give.

As far as how much REA has given to the athletic department, as has been mentioned before it would be a losing proposition to broadcast it no matter how much it is. Some people would think it wasn't enough. Other people would complain about how much they were giving away and complain about the prices that REA charges. It would be a lose-lose proposition to broadcast the amount.

i think your confusing und the education side with und the athletics side...last year the und athletics department had 19 million in revenue...the ndac a little over 16 million....i think with all the advantages und has over the ndac i would have thought that number would have easily been twice that..

[82SiouxGuy]

i think your confusing und the education side with und the athletics side...last year the und athletics department had 19 million in revenue...the ndac a little over 16 million....i think with all the advantages und has over the ndac i would have thought that number would have easily been twice that..

I'm not confusing anything. The dollars I quoted include athletics, academics, etc. They include the new Indoor Practice Facility, which is not included in the Athletic Department dollars. But it is sure going to benefit the Athletic Department. It's all one big pie. I'm not sure where your expectations come from other than grabbing numbers out of the sky.

That $19 million in revenue included ticket sales, donations, sponsorships, student fees, contributions by the school itself to athletics, etc. According to an article in the Grand Forks Herald and the Fargo Forum about a week ago, student fees and school contributions make up about 47% of the revenue for UND athletics and 43% of the revenue for NDSU. The rest comes from the other sources. Student fees were higher at UND, institutional contributions were higher at NDSU. 47% and 43% were among the lowest numbers in schools that sponsor FCS football. Both athletic departments are doing all right compared to their peers.

As far as individual donations, that is up to the people that have the money. They can donate to whatever they want. Just because some young athletes come into money doesn't mean they have to make large donations. I've been told that some do and some don't. They also have a right to donate to the athletic department, education, or whatever they want. Some of them actually do care about academics. The same goes for alumni that make their money in other fields. Many of them have done very well, and many of them have made very generous donations. I would guess that a lot of them are interested in donating to the academic side, and many of them are included in that $324,000,000 in donations over the past 6 years.

NDSU has had some alumni that have done pretty well themselves. They have an engineering school, a business school and have had athletes play professional sports. They have some very large farmers that are alumni. Fargo is a larger city with more businesses that can donate significant sums of money. I don't believe their endowment is as large as UND, but they do very well for the size of school.

[jdub27]

i think your confusing und the education side with und the athletics side...last year the und athletics department had 19 million in revenue...the ndac a little over 16 million....i think with all the advantages und has over the ndac i would have thought that number would have easily been twice that..

Unless the donations are going through the Champions Club, which one time and large donations usually don't, they aren't going to be included in that number. They are going to be gifts to the University and directed to athletics and would show up that, in things like the $324 million Spirit Campaign. Focusing on that revenue number is a losing battle. It is a manufactured number.

[Cratter]

Good luck calling the Ralph and saying " yeah how much did you give UND last year."

I have good luck. I called Jody and asked how much the Ralph gave UND athletic department and he have me the number for last year.

[Irish]

I have good luck. I called Jody and asked how much the Ralph gave UND athletic department and he have me the number for last year.

Well . . . . .

[jodcon]

Well . . . . .

[Cratter]

Because of the North Dakota Legislature. Remember, they wouldn't accept the donation of the building if it was going to cost any money. They wanted to have a track record showing it would pay for itself, including long term upgrades. That's where the delay comes from in terms of turning the building over to UND.

Didn't they pass this after Ralph "donated" the arena to the university?

Pretty dumb law as Ralph could have just given UND a 100 million and they could have then "decided" to build a new arena with it and "hire" Ralph to oversee its construction.

What about the spiritual building that someone "built/donated" on campus few years ago? That building costs UND money to run, albeit a small amount.

[Cratter]

One other thing to remember is that cash may not be the only thing that REA provides for UND. There is a value to services provided. If REA provides services at lower cost than UND would be able to provide for themselves (or no cost), there is a value to that because it is money that UND doesn't have to spend. It is often called an in-kind donation. That value is also probably mixed into the 990 somewhere. That's another reason you either need to read the attachments and schedules very thoroughly or get an explanation from someone at REA.

He started out by saving a bunch of stuff like this....

[Hammersmith]

UND just completed a fund raising campaign that raised $324,000,000 in something like 6 years. UND is now raising $40-50,000,000 per year in donations and they expect to continue raising money at that rate. I don't know how much you want people to give.

Be careful not to double-count the money. Just saying.

[SiouxVolley]

Be careful not to double-count the money. Just saying.

Thank you for your keen interest in UND. Converse over here and mock over on bisonvile.

[Cratter]

He said they gave UND $550,000. Which is about enough to pay for UNDs top three coaches.

One would guestimate the "Ralph complex" costs $4.5+ Million to operate in expenses?

with the ralph and the betty taking in all the revenue from mens bball, womens bball, womens vball, mens hockey, and womens hockey are we (und athletics) losing money on this deal???

[SIOUXFAN97]

He said they gave UND $550,000. Which is about enough to pay for UNDs top three coaches.

One would guestimate the "Ralph complex" costs $4.5+ Million to operate in expenses?

if that number is accurate ralph is spinning in his grave

[82SiouxGuy]

Didn't they pass this after Ralph "donated" the arena to the university?

Pretty dumb law as Ralph could have just given UND a 100 million and they could have then "decided" to build a new arena with it and "hire" Ralph to oversee its construction.

What about the spiritual building that someone "built/donated" on campus few years ago? That building costs UND money to run, albeit a small amount.

They passed the law after Ralph had announced the donation but before the building was built. Yes, they could have done it the other way. But I'm pretty sure the building wouldn't have been nearly as fancy. I think that the design was part of what worried law makers.

A lot of buildings have been built on campus with donated money. The small chapel is one example. These buildings weren't covered by the law. And the fact that they were built by the school or the foundation after money makes them different than REA.