House Bill to Save the Sioux Passes 65 to 28.

[Oxbow6]

Now, for a quick sidebar:

I'm amazed at how many don't know how something becomes law (called the Century Code in ND).

In an effort to try to fix the apparent short-comings of either the schools or the learners here's an educational video about how a "bill" becomes law. (The transcript of the video is here.) Be aware however that this is written for US laws, not specifically ND, but the process is the same.

To translate it:

Washington or Capital Hill = Bismarck

House of Representatives = State House

Congress = Legislature

Congressman* = State representative

Senate = Senate

Senator = Senator

President = Governor

White House = Governor's office

* some will argue Congressman can mean House or Senate, but it's most commonly used for a House member.

My 4th grade daughter just went thru this whole topic a few weeks ago in school. Really not a tough concept to grasp.

Maybe the Jeanotte's of this conflict should review their elementary textbooks.

[Oxbow6]

I'll take "What series of Mercedes will the lawyers buy?" for $200, Alex.

You think the C-class series is thinking a little to small!?!?

[ScottM]

You think the C-class series is thinking a little to small!?!?

Maybe. I'm looking at another A4, a 335ix or a C300/350, since I don't like driving buses. My neighbor just leased an S550. I think that beast has its own zip code.

[The Sicatoka]

I'll take "What series of Mercedes will the lawyers buy?" for $200, Alex.

You think the C-class series is thinking a little to small!?!?

Boop-boop-boop. Incorrect.

What is the SLK-class?

[Ray77]

If UND wins this and the Sioux nickname is safe...whats the odds other schools who were forced to change their nickname will try to do the same thing. Boy Miles Brand sure didn't know what he got himself into with that list.

Boom! In the past the US Senate has hinted around at taking a look at the organization that is the NCAA and maybe it's time that they actually do so? Seems to most that the NCAA has severely overstepped their bounds in a few areas while looking out for the interests of the student/athlete takes a backseat to their profit margins and social engineering.

I haven't followed this process at other schools so I don't know all the details with the other schools that have changed names, but to my knowledge no other school has stood up to the NCAA to the degree that we have - "we" being Fighting Sioux supporters, the Native Americans from the Spirit Lake tribe that worked hard to get a vote, the Native Americans from the Standing Rock tribe that have worked tirelessly in efforts to save the name, and now the state government. I'm very proud of all the people that have stood in this fight and worked towards keeping the name. If this were to bring about big change to the NCAA going forward, I would love to be able to say that it was the Fighting Sioux that spearheaded the change.

[Oxbow6]

Maybe. I'm looking at another A4, a 335ix or a C300/350, since I don't like driving buses. My neighbor just leased an S550. I think that beast has its own zip code.

1st two are deal breakers with me...can't get my clubs and remaining golf stuff in trunk...got to have priorities!

[Siouxbooster#33]

Leigh Jeanotte is a member of the Turtle Mountain Band of Chippewa Indians. e.g., he is not a Sioux. Not Santee, Lakota, nor Nakota. I believe this member of the UND faculty has every right to speak out, say what they want, and comment on events as they see fit. I, of course, have every right to consider the source. Jeanotte is too often a quote-source for the Herald and other media outlets, whose opinion is often taken to represent a Native's anti-name viewpoint, and whose opinions on these issues is granted some level of credibility. I am seeking to find the background of those who either profess to speak with authority or who are granted some level of authority by others. I have therefore noticed an interesting trend. With the exception of Dr. Erich Longie and the various leadership at Standing Rock -- most of the Native anti-nickname sources tabbed by the Herald, or employed by UND, are Chippewa. I am not an anthropologist, but as a resident of North Dakota and a person who has tried to educate myself as best as possible on this issue, the Chippewa and Sioux races are distinctly different. Different heritage, different language, different history.

What I am wondering is this: Why are some members of the Chippewa race so openly hostile to the name "Fighting Sioux?" While at the same time give their blessing -- literally -- to the Central Michigan Chippewas? Heck, CMU fans and supporters actually butcher this great Native's nation's name by calling themselves, "the Chips." And this is all ok? I have a family member who lives in Northern Michigan and, knowing our agony over the Sioux name, provided me with a t-shirt that read, on the front: "CMU Chippewa Warriors," and on the back it said, "The Chippewa Nation and Central Michigan: One and Unified."

I have to wonder if this hypocritical position by one of the louder anti-name persons has MUCH more to do with racial jealously? I am wondering if this position has more to do with a Chippewa v. Sioux prejudice than anything regarding the name, or Native enrollment, or Native issues on campus?

I don' know.

I don't pretend to know. And I tread lightly on these sorts of issues because often they become emotional and unproductive. But I just kind of scratch my noggin and wonder why so many Chippewa seem so blithely and serenely accepting of the CMU Chippewa, while at the same time, converely, are so bitter, outspoken, always-quoted, and (frankly) wholey dedicated to the discrediting and removing the Fighting Sioux name?

[SIOUXPR]

Potato, Potato the guy is still a buffoon.

At least he can spell, and has a grasp of the English language. Your anti-intellectual rants are quite amusing considering the source.

[Oxbow6]

At least he can spell, and has a grasp of the English language. Your anti-intellectual rants are quite amusing considering the source.

Since you have nothing of substance or value to bring to this conversation or agrument, you can have Jeanotte and the rest of his/your ilk help you off your glass tower.

[darell1976]

Leigh Jeanotte is a member of the Turtle Mountain Band of Chippewa Indians. e.g., he is not a Sioux. Not Santee, Lakota, nor Nakota. I believe this member of the UND faculty has every right to speak out, say what they want, and comment on events as they see fit. I, of course, have every right to consider the source. Jeanotte is too often a quote-source for the Herald and other media outlets, whose opinion is often taken to represent a Native's anti-name viewpoint, and whose opinions on these issues is granted some level of credibility. I am seeking to find the background of those who either profess to speak with authority or who are granted some level of authority by others. I have therefore noticed an interesting trend. With the exception of Dr. Erich Longie and the various leadership at Standing Rock -- most of the Native anti-nickname sources tabbed by the Herald, or employed by UND, are Chippewa. I am not an anthropologist, but as a resident of North Dakota and a person who has tried to educate myself as best as possible on this issue, the Chippewa and Sioux races are distinctly different. Different heritage, different language, different history.

What I am wondering is this: Why are some members of the Chippewa race so openly hostile to the name "Fighting Sioux?" While at the same time give their blessing -- literally -- to the Central Michigan Chippewas? Heck, CMU fans and supporters actually butcher this great Native's nation's name by calling themselves, "the Chips." And this is all ok? I have a family member who lives in Northern Michigan and, knowing our agony over the Sioux name, provided me with a t-shirt that read, on the front: "CMU Chippewa Warriors," and on the back it said, "The Chippewa Nation and Central Michigan: One and Unified."

I have to wonder if this hypocritical position by one of the louder anti-name persons has MUCH more to do with racial jealously? I am wondering if this position has more to do with a Chippewa v. Sioux prejudice than anything regarding the name, or Native enrollment, or Native issues on campus?

I don' know.

I don't pretend to know. And I tread lightly on these sorts of issues because often they become emotional and unproductive. But I just kind of scratch my noggin and wonder why so many Chippewa seem so blithely and serenely accepting of the CMU Chippewa, while at the same time, converely, are so bitter, outspoken, always-quoted, and (frankly) wholey dedicated to the discrediting and removing the Fighting Sioux name?

I know the SIoux and the Chippewas are enemys since the late 1700's-early 1800's. So maybe some of them were taught to continue the hostilities.

[sioux7>5]

Maybe. I'm looking at another A4, a 335ix or a C300/350, since I don't like driving buses. My neighbor just leased an S550. I think that beast has its own zip code.

I would rather have a Maybach over a Mercedes but that is just me. I also prefer a G550 over flying commercial. But since I would need to win the lottery to get either I will just keep on dreaming.

[dakota fairways]

... I am wondering if this position has more to do with a Chippewa v. Sioux prejudice than anything regarding the name, or Native enrollment, or Native issues on campus? ...

+1 for you, Siouxbooster#33

[Siouxbooster#33]

Any remaining questions as to Mr. Kelley's position was cleared up, I think, in the Bismarck Tribune article, which was a bit more detailed and contained more significant quotes than the Herald (which I suspect is interested in providing some cover for the anti-name people).:

http://www.bismarcktribune.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/2011_session/article_d1c045f2-3dfc-11e0-82ee-001cc4c002e0.html

Some tid-bits from our President:

If this continues to pass, we could see a constitutional challenge," Kelley said.

Kelley said he'll be watching to see what the Senate does with the bill but called it a speed bump in meeting the Aug. 15 deadline for the transition away from the nickname this year."I think the campus and Grand Forks are waiting to move on. They're weary of the issue," Kelley said.

A speed bump? Just a slight hiccup in the super-highway leading to August 15?

[Oxbow6]

Any remaining questions as to Mr. Kelley's position was cleared up, I think, in the Bismarck Tribune article, which was a bit more detailed and contained more significant quotes than the Herald (which I suspect is interested in providing some cover for the anti-name people).:

http://www.bismarcktribune.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/2011_session/article_d1c045f2-3dfc-11e0-82ee-001cc4c002e0.html

Some tid-bits from our President:

If this continues to pass, we could see a constitutional challenge," Kelley said.

Kelley said he'll be watching to see what the Senate does with the bill but called it a speed bump in meeting the Aug. 15 deadline for the transition away from the nickname this year."I think the campus and Grand Forks are waiting to move on. They're weary of the issue," Kelley said.

A speed bump? Just a slight hiccup in the super-highway leading to August 15?

Good research here. Kelley is not what this great university of ours needs...an out of touch, leftist, ivory tower living, educational zealot. He DOESN'T get it...period. I've been hard on both Kelley and Faison, but Kelley is now becoming the obvious problem in this nickname scenerio. He has become a tool for the out-spoken faculty and the minority haters of the Sioux name. IMO, he as much of a backbone as Gumby. It's truly embarrassing as an alum to to watch and witness!

[Goon]

At least he can spell, and has a grasp of the English language. Your anti-intellectual rants are quite amusing considering the source.

None the less Skippy, having watched Eliot Glassheim's antics over the years it's my opinion that he is a bumbling buffoon, that's usually on the wrong size of the issues.

[Siouxbooster#33]

None the less Skippy, having watched Eliot Glassheim's antics over the years it's my opinion that he is a bumbling buffoon, that's usually on the wrong size of the issues.

Did you all know that Mr. Glassheim attended, and attained both his Masters and Ph.D. from Univeristy of New Mexico at the same time that Robert Kelley (Our Dear Leader) was a professor at that fine school, including Dean of Graduate Studies?

Probably nothing, probably. . . .

[dmksioux]

Good research here. Kelley is not what this great university of ours needs...an out of touch, leftist, ivory tower living, educational zealot. He DOESN"T get it...period. I've been hard on both Kelley and Faison, but Kelley is now becoming the obvious problem in this nickname scenerio. He has become a tool for the out-spoken faculty and the minority haters of the Sioux name. IMO, he as much of a backbone as Gumby. It's truly embarrassing as an alum to to watcha nd witness!

While all of this may be true to a degree, do you think it's any different than most of the other University Presidents? I would like to keep the name, but I'm not sure if the positives outweigh the negatives at this point. Since Kelley is a University President, perhaps he has a pulse on what other University Presidents feel in regards to the Sioux name. For example, perhaps he has spoken with the President of Texas Tech to see how he feels about scheduling the Sioux in anymore athletic competitions. Perhaps the TT President told him it's not worth the negative PR his school received with the TT Raider/Native American caricature poster to schedule us anymore. I'm not pretending to have any inside knowledge on any of this, but I'm guessing Mr. Kelley has more information to work with then the general public. Do I like that we may lose the nickname...absolutely not. But the negative ramifications of keeping it definitely needs to be considered. The questions is, for me I guess, is who is looking out for the best interest of the University (long term)...the ND State Legislature or Mr. Kelley. I'm not sure I can answer that question.

[Teeder11]

While all of this may be true to a degree, do you think it's any different than most of the other University Presidents? I would like to keep the name, but I'm not sure if the positives outweigh the negatives at this point. Since Kelley is a University President, perhaps he has a pulse on what other University Presidents feel in regards to the Sioux name. For example, perhaps he has spoken with the President of Texas Tech to see how he feels about scheduling the Sioux in anymore athletic competitions. Perhaps the TT President told him it's not worth the negative PR his school received with the TT Raider/Native American caricature poster to schedule us anymore. I'm not pretending to have any inside knowledge on any of this, but I'm guessing Mr. Kelley has more information to work with then the general public. Do I like that we may lose the nickname...absolutely not. But the negative ramifications of keeping it definitely needs to be considered. The questions is, for me I guess, is who is looking out for the best interest of the University (long term)...the ND State Legislature or Mr. Kelley. I'm not sure I can answer that question.

Well said. I too want the nickname and logo to stay FOREVER. I too am as anti-PC as you can be. And I am very intrigued and excited by what is taking place in Bismarck, but I have that luxury as an arm-chair critic. BUT for those who bear the burden of resolving this issue, sometimes the best course of action is not the most popular one.

[mksioux]

Any remaining questions as to Mr. Kelley's position was cleared up, I think, in the Bismarck Tribune article, which was a bit more detailed and contained more significant quotes than the Herald (which I suspect is interested in providing some cover for the anti-name people).:

http://www.bismarcktribune.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/2011_session/article_d1c045f2-3dfc-11e0-82ee-001cc4c002e0.html

Some tid-bits from our President:

If this continues to pass, we could see a constitutional challenge," Kelley said.

Kelley said he'll be watching to see what the Senate does with the bill but called it a speed bump in meeting the Aug. 15 deadline for the transition away from the nickname this year."I think the campus and Grand Forks are waiting to move on. They're weary of the issue," Kelley said.

A speed bump? Just a slight hiccup in the super-highway leading to August 15?

Interesting. In his formal press release, Kelley said he respects the legislative process. So which is it? Does he respect it, or is it just a speed bump?

[SIOUXPR]

None the less Skippy, having watched Eliot Glassheim's antics over the years it's my opinion that he is a bumbling buffoon, that's usually on the wrong size of the issues.

So what makes him a buffoon. The fact that his is smart. The fact that he is Jewish. That his opinion is different from yours. Please provide some examples instead of just name calling. I've known Eliot for a long time and his commitment to public service, the community of Grand Forks, and the University of North Dakota is something that can't be rivaled by too many people.

[ScottM]

Interesting. In his formal press release, Kelley said he respects the legislative process. So which is it? Does he respect it, or is it just a speed bump?

I'd guess he's betting the legislation, if passed, probably won't alter the final result and the Sioux name/logo are formally retired at some point.

[Goon]

Did you all know that Mr. Glassheim attended, and attained both his Masters and Ph.D. from Univeristy of New Mexico at the same time that http://www.legis.nd.gov/assembly/60-2007/house/representatives/bios/eliotglassheim.html (Our Dear Leader) was a professor at that fine school, including Dean of Graduate Studies?

Probably nothing, probably. . . .

Yeah I did when I looked up his name BA, Wesleyan University, MA and Ph.D., University of New Mexico Ph.D didn't even attend UND.

This pretty much sums it up on Kelley...

Dr. Robert Kelley will be the 11th president in UND's 125-year history. Kelley has been dean of the College of Health Sciences and professor of medical education and public health at the University of Wyoming since 1999. Before his present post, he was associate vice chancellor for research and executive associate dean of the graduate college at the University of Illinois at Chicago, and professor of biological sciences at the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences and professor of anatomy and cell biology at the College of Medicine, both at the University of Illinois at Chicago. At the University of New Mexico, he served as chair of anatomy and senior executive associate dean, as well as other faculty capacities. He has also taught at the University of California, Berkeley.

Kelley earned his bachelor's degree in biology and chemistry from Abilene Christian University in Abilene, Texas, in 1965, and his master's degree in 1966 and doctorate in 1969, both in cell and developmental biology from the University of California, Berkeley.

Edited February 22, 2011 by Goon

[SIOUXPR]

Yeah I did when I looked up his name BA, Wesleyan University, MA and Ph.D., University of New Mexico Ph.D didn't even attend UND.

This pretty much sums it up on Kelley...

Who cares if Kelly or Eliot didn't attend UND. A lot of good that degree did you. Their are many other great colleges and universities in this country outside of your narrow spectrum.

[Goon]

So what makes him a buffoon. The fact that his is smart. The fact that he is Jewish. That his opinion is different from yours. Please provide some examples instead of just name calling. I've known Eliot for a long time and his commitment to public service, the community of Grand Forks, and the University of North Dakota is something that can't be rivaled by too many people.

No Skippy, it has nothing to do about his ethnic back ground, I think some one said it best when he called Eliot a gas bag, the guy loves spending everyone elses's money.

Here he is in support of Obama Care.

Here he is Rep. Eliot Glassheim, D-Grand Forks, speaking in opposition to permanent tax cuts in the North Dakota House of Representatives.

[Siouxbooster#33]

So what makes him a buffoon. The fact that his is smart. The fact that he is Jewish. That his opinion is different from yours. Please provide some examples instead of just name calling. I've known Eliot for a long time and his commitment to public service, the community of Grand Forks, and the University of North Dakota is something that can't be rivaled by too many people.

As long as you agree with his worldview. Otherwise, he is quick to label nonbelievers, quick to attack, quick to inflame, quick to demean. As one of the earliest agents against the name, back in the 1970's, Mr. Glassheim is dedicated to this particular crusade. He is a genuinely nice man. But his political worldview is quite polarizing. With Mr. Glassheim, he too often is consumed by his own political beliefs and this causes him to intensely dislike those who do not agree with his views. That makes him human, fair enough. But on this particular issue, he has been filling and expelling his wind-bag-lungs for decades. No doubt he will do so long after the matter is resolved. But please, don't suddenly take stock in his standard anti-name stump speech recycled most recently on Monday in Bismarck. Please, don't present him as some clear headed, enlightened, even-handed, unbiased paragon of reason. He is a veteran of bitter partisan politics, sometimes as a passenger -- but more often as the driving ofrce behind divisive, destructive, insulting, and unpleasant dialog. I suggest the anti-name crowd try to find a few new champions.

And as a side note, your inclusion of Mr. Glassheim's religion is EXACTLY the sort of baseless accusations which are so very unecessary. Not a single soul on this board has ever raised that fact, nor hinted at that fact, nor mentioned that fact, insinuated that fact. Its highly likely that most people do not know Mr. Glassheim is jewish, since he himself - to his credit - has NEVER used his faith as an excuse, or as a defense, or as a weapon to attack. I suspect he would be deeply disappointed that somebody who calls himself a friend would resort to such churlish reparte.