BTHC - Alvarez and OSU want to make it happen?

[GeauxSioux]

The problem is the cost of renovation/getting a new arena is more than private money for UND will fund, and is much more than ND tax payers will be willing to pitch for.

It would never be funded with North Dakota money. It would need to be big time donations.

A new stadium is part of the long term master plan.

http://grandforkslife.blogspot.com/2008/01...y-pictures.html

[gopherz]

You're a Gopher fan; you're sick by definition.

Swine flu, actually.

And there's no way a $113 million dollar hockey rink could be built at UND.

Please inform Misters T Brewster and D Lucia and T Smith of same.

That's kind of my point, your resources will be spread very thin then.

It's sad but true. We have been trying to get this practice arena built for a year or two for basketball and are having difficulties doing so. When you have such a high profile coach who is really turning the program around, you'd think that'd be easy. Not so much.

Really, then why waste time on things like "Plan 2" in here.

http://grandforkslife.blogspot.com/2007/12...for-future.html

Honestly I have no idea because I think that's an incredible waste of time. Did they not even consider the huge price tag? A college stadium at a small school with a retractable roof? What a JOKE.

Nothing can ever change from what it is today. Got it.

Not true, but the change would have to be of a very large scale. You don't go from having half attended games and losing to NAIA teams, to competing at the FBS level in front of a full stadium.

First, we're talking affiliates for Big Ten Hockey, not full Big Ten membership. Next, they're talking Miami of Ohio, Western Michigan, and Bowling Green. I'll take UND head-to-head academically against those three.

It sure seems like some people are talking about full Big Ten affiliation. But if not, my fault.

Notre Dame is the plum the Big Ten has sought for decades. Notre Dame coming in as a full member is what the BT wants. I'd guess we have to wait until the end of the ND NBC deal to see what comes next.

Agreed once again. I think it happens. If it does, you can lock up the BTHC as a done deal.

Big Ten Network money will be a big pressure.

Like I said, UND has to evaluate the changing environment and work to control what it can control.

Absolutely. Big Ten Network has been wildly successful and the money there would be huge. Not so much for the Gophers who already have a great TV deal, but for other teams and the network as a whole its a very intriguing idea

[The Sicatoka]

Swine flu, actually.

I think Gophers and I think swine. (Too easy. )

Honestly I have no idea because I think that's an incredible waste of time. Did they not even consider the huge price tag? A college stadium at a small school with a retractable roof? What a JOKE.

Talk to me about TCF attendance when the Gophs are five years into that facility, below 0.500, and the gameday high temp is predicted in the 20s. In this climate, once a dome, always a dome.

Not true, but the change would have to be of a very large scale. You don't go from having half attended games and losing to NAIA teams, to competing at the FBS level in front of a full stadium.

Immediately? No.

With a long-term plan? Ask Boise State.

Regarding Notre Dame: The same press release announces Notre Dame joining the BT and the immediate formation of the BTHC. The only question is when it happens, if ever.

[gopherz]

I think Gophers and I think swine. (Too easy. )

Too soon

Talk to me about TCF attendance when the Gophs are five years into that facility, below 0.500, and the gameday high temp is predicted in the 20s. In this climate, once a dome, always a dome.

I'm actually not a big worried about TCF attendance. Right now the stadium is totally sold out with season tickets, plus a waiting list. Something like that doesn't simmer over just a few years. People love the whole back to campus thing, and enjoying football the way it is meant to be played. Have you been to a game at TCF yet? If you haven't, go there and then tell me if you can still say the same thing. The atmosphere is phenomenal, and the stadium is first-class. While I agree that the team will have to be successful because a nice stadium can't hold over forever, there is a lot of excitement around the program and the stadium only holds a little over 50k, so selling it out consistently for a long time shouldn't be an issue.

I love that we are going to get some cold games. Get the old people who sit on their hands the whole time to give up their tickets and get some of the younger people off of the waiting list. Also, Gophers have scheduled some huge non-conference games, which is going to continue peaking interest in the program, including season ticket sales. USC next year, Texas in 6 years, etc.

Immediately? No.

With a long-term plan? Ask Boise State.

Long term plan would have to be really really long-term. Boise state and TCU are very similar. Both are an overwhelming powerhouse in weak conferences (okay, the Mountain West isn't that horrible anymore for the most part). They've found their niche. But I'd like to see how a team like Boise State would do playing ever game against a formidable opponent, not just one or two a year. Sure they play and beat some teams like Oregon this year, but you never see them playing USC/Texas/etc....

In regards to it being long-term, I think that long-term would be a lot longer than the time it's going to take to form a BTHC.

Regarding Notre Dame: The same press release announces Notre Dame joining the BT and the immediate formation of the BTHC. The only question is when it happens, if ever.

You got that one right. I think it's going to happen after their TV contract, but maybe that is just wishful thinking.

[Big A HG]

Too soon

Get over it, baby...

"Swine" flu, which it's actually not...it's closer to a Spanish Flu...is not even worse than a normal flu. It's media propaganda. A few people die from it, but thousands die each year from the regular flu.

Wow

[sagard]

I'd say give it a few years and this thing will be a done deal. Being a huge Minnesota fan in nearly every sport, I'd love nothing more than to be able to play MSU/Michigan/tOSU every year a few times, instead of just playing Michigan/MSU once and Wisconsin twice. I don't want to lose the UND rivalry, but I don't think that'd be part of it. The blow to the other schools in the WCHA would be huge, as they'd lose a ton of national exposure due to it's 2 biggest media teams leaving...oh well, look forward to hearing some other's comments.

Michigan is usually a fun opponent, but I wouldn't give up UMD/SCSU/MSU (let alone UND) games for MichState/OSU/NotreDame. I like seeing the local kids play and the current WCHA is far and away the best avenue do that.

[Knickball2]

National Championships in sports other than hockey, Big Ten, when is the last time a football team from there was national champion, and when was the last

time a basketball team from there was national champion. You would think the way Big Ten supporters act, that the conference was dominant in all major sports.

Seems like they win once every 20 years, maybe. Am I wrong? Michigan and Indiana in basketball, and Michigan and Ohio State in football, but recently, I don't think so.

Oh yeah, Michigan State in basketball also, but it seems like most Big Ten supporters overlook that school as the little brother.

[Knickball2]

And another thing, where are all those professional hockey players from the big ten schools, get real....

[nodak hockey fanatic]

And another thing, where are all those professional hockey players from the big ten schools, get real....

im not on the bthc side here... but minny, mich and mich state are three of the top teams when it comes to putting guys into the pros (along with und of course), so i don't think your argument holds here.

[gopherz]

And another thing, where are all those professional hockey players from the big ten schools, get real....

Fail....

[gjw007]

When I read these comments, I can't help but think back to the late 70s when I attended UND. All the Big Ten schools that played D1 hockey except OSU and Notre Dame were part of the WCHA. I think the BTHC will eventually materialize, the only question is in what form.

[Siouxdonyms]

In the WCHA, Minnesota gets all the attention: FSN, multiple rivals, Exel tournament. In a BTHC, most of their games would be on the Big Ten Network, the tournament would likely move (to Chicago?), and Mariucci would be on the periphery of the conference: nonoe of those favor the Gophers. From the Badger viewpoint, they would gain in almost all aspects with a BTHC.

IMHO, this is a huge story that is still playing out. It's very apparent Alvarez wants out of the WCHA and he's not going anywhere as the AD. For the first time, we know that a BTHC was discussed and that Maturi is the only AD strongly against the concept. If Delaney, other Big Ten AD's and presidents keep pushing, how long can Minnesota hold out?

Not only that, what do you do come league tournament time? Where is it played? Michigan's going to try to get it, as would Wisconsin. If you're thinking about the revenue the annual tournament brings in for your city/state, why would Minnesota want to change that? They get the Final Five tournament every year, which boost MSP economy at least for a weekend.

[Goon]

Not only that, what do you do come league tournament time? Where is it played? Michigan's going to try to get it, as would Wisconsin. If you're thinking about the revenue the annual tournament brings in for your city/state, why would Minnesota want to change that? They get the Final Five tournament every year, which boost MSP economy at least for a weekend.

This was why the MN ad was against the Big Ten Hockey Conference.

[mksioux]

This was why the MN ad was against the Big Ten Hockey Conference.

Right, but it sounds like he was the only one strongly against it. Reading bewteen the lines, it sounds like Ohio State, Wisconsin, and the Commissioner are pretty much on board. Michigan and Michigan State may be against it for now, but I doubt their objection is nearly as strong as Minnesota's. If Michigan or Michigan State decide a BTHC is okay, Minnesota will not be able to stop it. I don't know if/when that will happen, but it's really not as far-fetched as you seem to think.

However, just because the possible affiliates mentioned in the article have FBS football, I don't think that would be a condition to affiliate membership in the BTHC. I think the affiliate situation will be very fluid as the Big Ten members negotiate. UND should be working behind the scenes to see what the Big Ten Presidents and AD's would be looking for in affiliate members, and plan accordingly.

[Goon]

Right, but it sounds like he was the only one strongly against it. Reading bewteen the lines, it sounds like Ohio State, Wisconsin, and the Commissioner are pretty much on board. Michigan and Michigan State may be against it for now, but I doubt their objection is nearly as strong as Minnesota's. If Michigan or Michigan State decide a BTHC is okay, Minnesota will not be able to stop it. I don't know if/when that will happen, but it's really not as far-fetched as you seem to think.

However, just because the possible affiliates mentioned in the article have FBS football, I don't think that would be a condition to affiliate membership in the BTHC. I think the affiliate situation will be very fluid as the Big Ten members negotiate. UND should be working behind the scenes to see what the Big Ten Presidents and AD's would be looking for in affiliate members, and plan accordingly.

If you go back and read the article you will see that Eaves was against the move to the BTHC and the CCHA. It sounds like the Wisconsin AD went after this option without consulting his hockey coach.

In an e-mail, CCHA commissioner Tom Anastos said he's had no contact with UW officials about such an idea, but said he'd be interested in the Badgers coming to his league.

Yet the option of moving to the CCHA was certainly broached by UW officials at some point. Asked about the notion, Alvarez said men's coach Mike Eaves wasn't interested in changing leagues.

"If Mike's not interested, I'm not interested,'' Alvarez said. "I'd be interested in other things. As I've said before, regionalizing hockey makes sense.''

According to sources familiar with the Big Ten discussions, multiple scenarios were broached. One would bring Notre Dame, a CCHA member, into the mix to create the six-school lineup required by the NCAA for one of its automatic national tournament berths.

[mksioux]

If you go back and read the article you will see that Eaves was against the move to the BTHC and the CCHA. It sounds like the Wisconsin AD went after this option without consulting his hockey coach.

The way I read it, that passage is about Eaves being against Wisconsin switching to the CCHA, not about the formation of a BTHC. But in any event, I don't think it matters in the long term. What is important is that the BTHC makes a lot of sense to Wisconsin, as an institution, and has the backing of the administration. Ultimately, I don't think the hockey people are going to end up making the decisions on this issue.

[Goon]

The way I read it, that passage is about Eaves being against Wisconsin switching to the CCHA, not about the formation of a BTHC. But in any event, I don't think it matters in the long term. What is important is that the BTHC makes a lot of sense to Wisconsin, as an institution, and has the backing of the administration. Ultimately, I don't think the hockey people are going to end up making the decisions on this issue.

I will put a wager that it never come sto fruition.

[Stromer]

I will put a wager that it never come sto fruition.

I would have to disagree. It's will happen, its just a matter of when.

[The Sicatoka]

Ultimately, I don't think the hockey people are going to end up making the decisions on this issue.

Ding! Winner-winner-chicken-dinner!

This will be decided by the money people, not the hockey people. If the money people say they want/need this for Big Ten Network programming and advertising revenue Minnesota's love of playing SCSU, MSU-M, UMD, soon BSU, will lose out.

I'll say it again: Of course Michigan, Michigan State, and Ohio State want Miami of Ohio as an affiliate. It's close to them. But I suspect in some potential "affiliates negotiations" Minnesota and Wisconsin would want some sort of consideration for them, say a more west affiliate that would be as good for them (at the gate*) as Miami would be for tOSU. And that's why I keep saying UND should control what is its to control and be as ready and attractive as possible, just in case.

* We know who consistently fills both Mariucci and Kohl and who travels well to other events also. They know it too.

[star2city]

However, just because the possible affiliates mentioned in the article have FBS football, I don't think that would be a condition to affiliate membership in the BTHC. I think the affiliate situation will be very fluid as the Big Ten members negotiate. UND should be working behind the scenes to see what the Big Ten Presidents and AD's would be looking for in affiliate members, and plan accordingly.

After further thought, I think the Big Ten has significant motivation to desire FBS membership among potential hockey affiliates and those reasons are primarily monetary, not status.

The Big Ten needs a lower level FBS league around, so that they can freely add home wins to their FBS schedule. Playing the MAC adds at least 10 wins a year to the Big Ten overall record. The MAC games are relatively cheap because of limited travel, don't require a 1:1 or even a 2:1 (except for lower attendance teams like Northwestern or Indiana), and allow more Big Ten schools to go bowling. The SEC and the B12 benefit from two lower-level conferences in their midst: CUSA and Sunbelt. The Big Ten has to throw the MAC a few bones to keep the MAC from starving: MAC FBS too important to the Big Ten. It's to the Big Ten's benefit to have more lower-level FBS teams around: keeps the game rates down and provides for more visiting fans. The western Big Ten, especially Minnesota and Wisconsin, needs more MAC type FBS schools to schedule. FCS schools really are of limited value to the Big Ten's primary money-maker: football.

[The Sicatoka]

After further thought, I think the Big Ten has significant motivation to desire FBS membership among potential hockey affiliates and those reasons are primarily monetary, not status.

This will be decided by the money people, not the hockey people.

[Blackheart]

Barry Alvarez should stick to his strengths...winning Rose Bowls against UCLA and beating hell out of Minnesota in the Paul Bunyan ax game...leave hockey alone Barry!

[MplsBison]

After further thought, I think the Big Ten has significant motivation to desire FBS membership among potential hockey affiliates and those reasons are primarily monetary, not status.

The Big Ten needs a lower level FBS league around, so that they can freely add home wins to their FBS schedule. Playing the MAC adds at least 10 wins a year to the Big Ten overall record. The MAC games are relatively cheap because of limited travel, don't require a 1:1 or even a 2:1 (except for lower attendance teams like Northwestern or Indiana), and allow more Big Ten schools to go bowling. The SEC and the B12 benefit from two lower-level conferences in their midst: CUSA and Sunbelt. The Big Ten has to throw the MAC a few bones to keep the MAC from starving: MAC FBS too important to the Big Ten. It's to the Big Ten's benefit to have more lower-level FBS teams around: keeps the game rates down and provides for more visiting fans. The western Big Ten, especially Minnesota and Wisconsin, needs more MAC type FBS schools to schedule. FCS schools really are of limited value to the Big Ten's primary money-maker: football.

Well that does it, then: NDSU and UND to upgrade to FBS football and join the MAC.

[star2city]

Well that does it, then: NDSU and UND to upgrade to FBS football and join the MAC.

But, we have hockey!

You don't have hockey!

If UND went FBS because of the BTHC, it be would inevitable that NDSU would attempt to follow the FBS route and forget about BSA upgrades.

Rather be in the post-Boise St WAC with Idaho, Montana, Montana St, Utah St, Nevada, Cal Poly, UC Davis etc than the MAC. An FBS UND could practically get annual games vs the Gophers. That would be the type of schedule that would get the state and alumni excited.

UMinn could still schedule FCS schools, too, like USD, SDSU, NDSU.

[mksioux]

I was listening to WCCO radio this morning in the car and heard Don Lucia say that there was serious discussion of a BTHC this summer and that it was "a lot closer to happening than most people know." He said (and I'm paraphrasing based on memory) that there was one school in particular that was really driving it and Minnesota was the main hold out to keep it from happening. We pretty much knew all of that, but the seriousness placed on it by the Don was interesting.