choyt3 Posted December 1, 2008 Posted December 1, 2008 isn't it for frozen 4 appearances? May be. My opinion is that UND isn't a program that needs to be hanging banners that have the word "appearances" on them.
AZSIOUX Posted December 1, 2008 Posted December 1, 2008 Speaking of banners, I've always wondered why UND doesn't hang banners for WCHA playoff titles. I think that's an accomplishment worthy of a banner. it is a nice tourney to win and others have brought that up in the past but i like NC$$ title banners and regular season wcha titles only to be hung. very clean looking and is rewarding the long season of hard work for both of those. any team can sneak into the final 5 and maybe run a 2 or 3 game tourney and get a banner. i like it the way it is.
Goon Posted December 1, 2008 Author Posted December 1, 2008 Speaking of banners, I've always wondered why UND doesn't hang banners for WCHA playoff titles. I think that's an accomplishment worthy of a banner. There is something I agree on.
Goon Posted December 1, 2008 Author Posted December 1, 2008 May be. My opinion is that UND isn't a program that needs to be hanging banners that have the word "appearances" on them. Yeah I am not fond of that banner.
ScottM Posted December 1, 2008 Posted December 1, 2008 May be. My opinion is that UND isn't a program that needs to be hanging banners that have the word "appearances" on them. They remind me of "Participant" ribbons. Just show up, and you get something.
AZSIOUX Posted December 1, 2008 Posted December 1, 2008 They remind me of "Participant" ribbons. Just show up, and you get something. like little johnny jr. gets when his parents make him play sports every year so super-dad johhny senior can live through his kid because he flamed out at a JV star
Irish Posted December 1, 2008 Posted December 1, 2008 Here's my 2 cents worth on our current state of affairs: It's interesting to see the debate on talent - do we have the talent and just aren't playing at all or is this a mediocre bunch? A debate I never thought I would see about the Sioux. I think it is some of both. In my opinion, our sophomore and junior classes are below UND standards and behind what other top teams got. In addition - no one is getting better - no breakout years or even steady improvement. Trupp has one goal for Christ's sake - don't even mention Lapoint's lack of progress. We need some studs here and in a hurry. I agree that we didn't win a title with Oshie ant Toews, but we should have won at least one. If we don't recruit the hell out of the next couple of years get used to this type of record. Are we getting beat to top talent or misjudging our recruits? What happened to the Shattuck pipeline? We are carrying a lot of dead weight this year (I know some have much potential - but we still have to put the puck in the net) The recruiting now is all on Hak. Get some studs please! Playing style - It was only 4 1/2 years ago when we beat both BC and BU out east to win the regional - Parise described our defensemen making players squeal when the came in front of the net. See any of that this year? This is the softest team I have ever seen the Sioux field since the Bjorkman days. The dump and chase/ cycle, cycle, cycle just ain't working either. It seems that absolutely no one likes this or the results it produces. I have even had fans from other teams wonder why we never carry the puck into the zone. Yet Hak seem to stubbornly hang on to it. It's like football coaches who get a blind spot for an offense thats time is past yet can't move on. Even the best coaches have a hard time changing some times. I wonder if the coaches ever discuss the offense and trying something else? This style is brutal to watch (cycle until you lose it). During a power play this weekend we had a great centering pass - nobody home. However, we had 3 players in the same spot along the boards. Get in front of the net! The uneven play and lack of intensity - This is a Hakstol team trademark. Every time we think we have our crap together, we lay an egg. It's hard when our good play comes in 1 game spurts. Overall - what we are seeing isn't Fighting Sioux hockey as I have known it. Playing style adds to the irritation.
jk Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 - no one is getting better - no breakout years or even steady improvement. Playing style - It was only 4 1/2 years ago when we beat both BC and BU out east to win the regional - Parise described our defensemen making players squeal when the came in front of the net. See any of that this year? This is the softest team I have ever seen the Sioux field since the Bjorkman days. I have even had fans from other teams wonder why we never carry the puck into the zone. Yet Hak seem to stubbornly hang on to it. In the junior class, Vandy and Genoway have steadily improved throughout their careers and are very good college players (although I do think Genoway is trying to do too much right now). Zajac has also taken a step forward this year. Of the sophomores, Frattin is a ton better than last year - much more assertive. Trupp has seemed to be in a sophomore slump. I love Marto's skating, but he and LaPoint do need to improve. Do you know what people said on this board when the Sioux defense consisted of the big mean guys? "Why can't we get someone on the blueline who can handle the puck?" Now you have Genoway, Marto and LaPoint and people want the big mean guys again. When Blood, Fienhage and McWilliam get up to speed in a few years, there will be plenty of size and grit back on the blueline. A real key to the effectiveness of the defensive corps then will be the offensive development of Marto and LaPoint, which seems stuck right now. And while the defense may be soft, up front Kozek, Watkins, Zajac, Malone and Hextall all play a physical game. The offense carries the puck into the zone when the other team lets them - like CC. When you play a team that clogs the neutral zone, if the opening is not there to carry it in, it's called a turnover and everyone here is complaining about the odd-man rushes against. I'd much rather they chip it in then and take your chances in the offensive zone.
Oxbow6 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 In the junior class, Vandy and Genoway have steadily improved throughout their careers and are very good college players (although I do think Genoway is trying to do too much right now). Zajac has also taken a step forward this year. Of the sophomores, Frattin is a ton better than last year - much more assertive. Trupp has seemed to be in a sophomore slump. I love Marto's skating, but he and LaPoint do need to improve. A real key to the effectiveness of the defensive corps then will be the offensive development of Marto and LaPoint, which seems stuck right now. Vandy maybe has improved a little, but how many of other 1st line WCHA center would you take over him? 5, maybe 6? He, in a "normal" UND team talent pool, is a 3rd line center. I love Genoway...when he has a clue, which is 50/50. Agree he is trying way to hard. Agree that Zajac as vastly improved from last year, but still doesn't give you much offensively. Frattin?? 4 goals in the last few games when he did nothing for his first 50 games is not a ton better? To me he is the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. Trupp is in slump and is now hurt. Marto is just not playing well. I think he comes around soon. LaPoint came in as this gifted offensive d-man. IMO he should be rotating in every other game instead of Blood as I just don't see much in him. This team is talent poor offensively compared to past UND teams playing an offensive system that their "talents" aren't made for. And if we can't produce anything offensively from our d-man, please stand someone up and hit someone once in awhile from the blue line. This team has NO identity? Are we physical? Speed? Offensive? Defensive? Unless they figure that out, you are going to see what we have been seeing...inconsistant play.
AZSIOUX Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Vandy maybe has improved a little, but how many of other 1st line WCHA center would you take over him? 5, maybe 6? He, in a "normal" UND team talent pool, is a 3rd line center. I love Genoway...when he has a clue, which is 50/50. Agree he is trying way to hard. Agree that Zajac as vastly improved from last year, but still doesn't give you much offensively. Frattin?? 4 goals in the last few games when he did nothing for his first 50 games is not a ton better? To me he is the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. Trupp is in slump and is now hurt. Marto is just not playing well. I think he comes around soon. LaPoint came in as this gifted offensive d-man. IMO he should be rotating in every other game instead of Blood as I just don't see much in him. This team is talent poor offensively compared to past UND teams playing an offensive system that their "talents" aren't made for. And if we can't produce anything offensively from our d-man, please stand someone up and hit someone once in awhile from the blue line. This team has NO identity? Are we physical? Speed? Offensive? Defensive? Unless they figure that out, you are going to see what we have been seeing...inconsistant play. agree on a few points. this team isnt bad defensively or at goaltending. jones and blood are damn good defensively and genoway and miller are there to create rushes and scoring chances and thats fine. the others are in need of stepping up and hope when joe comes back that he brings a extra dimension to this crew overall being physical and a few points. blood and fienhage are physical and are improving game to game. blood a bit more having played a handful more games. you are so right when you say this team has no identity. that could change soon or it may not but ill be there for the ride with the rest of ya maybe frattin is ready to break out. he has had a nice few game span. would be great to get some offensive help from that sophmore class that doesnt have much when looking at trupp and malone this season along with VV and kozek who are gifted players. i like the team overall and think it will get better as we go but it needs to start vs harvard with 2 important wcha games coming after then 2 more potential important non conference games over the holiday. those could mean tons in march. go sioux!!
mikejm Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 ...This is the softest team I have ever seen the Sioux field since the Bjorkman days...I've voiced my opinion about this year's team. But this is particularly vile. BTW, I lived through the Bjorkman years, and there was some pretty good talent on a couple of those teams, too. After awhile I think the players just quit believing in poor ole Rube and it clearly showed (or didn't show, more accurately) on the ice. I think there is talent on this team; I just think they are being plugged into a pattern that the rest of college hockey has figured out and can easily defend. Time for Hakstol to look into a run-and-gun offense. Call Jerry York and ask for his handbook or something.
Irish Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 I've voiced my opinion about this year's team. But this is particularly vile. BTW, I lived through the Bjorkman years, and there was some pretty good talent on a couple of those teams, too. After awhile I think the players just quit believing in poor ole Rube and it clearly showed (or didn't show, more accurately) on the ice. I think there is talent on this team; I just think they are being plugged into a pattern that the rest of college hockey has figured out and can easily defend. Time for Hakstol to look into a run-and-gun offense. Call Jerry York and ask for his handbook or something. I'm not quite sure how to take this comment - I just feel that this team is playing soft. I too was around in the Bjorkman days and for the Barn days before that. A trademark of the Sioux has always been hardnosed hockey - I just don't see it from this bunch particularly the defense. I'm not saying we don't have any hitters, but I feel that the game has been taken to us far too often so far this season.
siouxforce19 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Vandy maybe has improved a little, but how many of other 1st line WCHA center would you take over him? 5, maybe 6? He, in a "normal" UND team talent pool, is a 3rd line center. I love Genoway...when he has a clue, which is 50/50. Agree he is trying way to hard. Agree that Zajac as vastly improved from last year, but still doesn't give you much offensively. Frattin?? 4 goals in the last few games when he did nothing for his first 50 games is not a ton better? To me he is the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. Trupp is in slump and is now hurt. Marto is just not playing well. I think he comes around soon. LaPoint came in as this gifted offensive d-man. IMO he should be rotating in every other game instead of Blood as I just don't see much in him. This team is talent poor offensively compared to past UND teams playing an offensive system that their "talents" aren't made for. And if we can't produce anything offensively from our d-man, please stand someone up and hit someone once in awhile from the blue line. This team has NO identity? Are we physical? Speed? Offensive? Defensive? Unless they figure that out, you are going to see what we have been seeing...inconsistant play. I'm sorry, but to call Frattin the biggest disappointment of the sophomore class is laughable. I'd give that title to Malone. Currently, he's the one I think should be up in the press box watching. I think Trupp is about ready to come out of that slump of his...he had a good game on Friday... but then he got hurt, so we don't know. Frattin is not the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class.
DAR Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 I'm sorry, but to call Frattin the biggest disappointment of the sophomore class is laughable. I'd give that title to Malone. Currently, he's the one I think should be up in the press box watching. I think Trupp is about ready to come out of that slump of his...he had a good game on Friday... but then he got hurt, so we don't know. Frattin is not the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. Malone was a fairly highly regarded reruit and has been terrible. Trupp has been a disappointment as well this year. However, to me the guys who have laid the biggest egg are Marto and Lapoint...I mean come on NO POINTS between the two of them this whole season. Both of these guys were tabbed as offensive D-men. They are like -15 between the two of them...horrible. I don't understand why Fienahge does not play more in front of one of these two.
DAR Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 I'm sorry, but to call Frattin the biggest disappointment of the sophomore class is laughable. I'd give that title to Malone. Currently, he's the one I think should be up in the press box watching. I think Trupp is about ready to come out of that slump of his...he had a good game on Friday... but then he got hurt, so we don't know. Frattin is not the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. It is pretty obvious...Vandy is a checking line center. He is not a playmaker. Vandy was effective with Watkins and Porter a couple years back. In a checking line role. Put Gregoire on the top line with Kozek and Duncan PLEASE.
siouxforce19 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 It is pretty obvious...Vandy is a checking line center. He is not a playmaker. Vandy was effective with Watkins and Porter a couple years back. In a checking line role. Put Gregoire on the top line with Kozek and Duncan PLEASE. Gregoire is not a center ... they'd have to convert him to play one. I'm not opposed to this option. I've heard many others think this sounds like a good idea. The only other centers you could put there are trupp and toews, and trupp's probably injured and toews hasn't played much, therefore I vote to convert gregs to a center. sounds good. yup, pretty sure.
siouxprideforever Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Wow, if we can't agree on who should sit and who should play - I can only imagine the challenge the coaches must face, especially if they see the kids play every day! I think that we caught the Big Red team off guard on Friday night. However, they adapted and took the game to us on Saturday. Unfortunately, while they re-tooled we did not. Just as we caught them off guard on Friday - they caught us off guard on Saturday. I struggle with understanding how a team with our talent can't adapt quickly (and I do believe that is the coaches responsibility). Taking them to the wood shed and skating them silly won't help them understand what to do when their opposition changes game strategy on them.
Oxbow6 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 I'm sorry, but to call Frattin the biggest disappointment of the sophomore class is laughable. I'd give that title to Malone. Currently, he's the one I think should be up in the press box watching. I think Trupp is about ready to come out of that slump of his...he had a good game on Friday... but then he got hurt, so we don't know. Frattin is not the biggest disappointment of that sophomore class. Malone has been...not very good so far in a UND sweater, but last year Hak made reference to the frosh class as having potentially a Hobey Baker type player/top college player down the road (if I remember the radio broadcast correctly). That reference, according to some people I have talked to, was about Frattin. You see anything that would give pause that Frattin has those skills/qualities?? I sure don't. That's why I said he is the most disappointing so far in that class. I think Frattin has good skill and upside, as evidence by his hat trick Friday, but prior to the last few games he had done about as much as Malone in his UND career.
siouxforce19 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Malone has been...not very good so far in a UND sweater, but last year Hak made reference to the frosh class as having potentially a Hobey Baker type player/top college player down the road (if I remember the radio broadcast correctly). That reference, according to some people I have talked to, was about Frattin. You see anything that would give pause that Frattin has those skills/qualities?? I sure don't. That's why I said he is the most disappointing so far in that class. I think Frattin has good skill and upside, as evidence by his hat trick Friday, but prior to the last few games he had done about as much as Malone in his UND career. Sophomore... he's got 2 more years. And we don't know if what he's done the past few games is going to continue or not. And I'd definitely wait a while before throwing around a Hobey discussion his way. I definitely wouldn't call him a disappointment YET. We could very well be proven wrong by the end of the year. We shall see.
Oxbow6 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Sophomore... he's got 2 more years. And we don't know if what he's done the past few games is going to continue or not. And I'd definitely wait a while before throwing around a Hobey discussion his way. I definitely wouldn't call him a disappointment YET. We could very well be proven wrong by the end of the year. We shall see. It was Hak, per his comments last year, that made that claim (or something like that), not me! I think at this point you could say Frattin has underacheived and subsequently is a disaapointment to date based on performance.
siouxforce19 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 It was Hak, per his comments last year, that made that claim (or something like that), not me! I think at this point you could say Frattin has underacheived and subsequently is a disaapointment to date based on performance. Don't freak out... I never said you claimed that. Some people just take a while to develop. Maybe he has underachieved thus far, but he's got a while to go to make up for that if he does. I hope what we saw from him this weekend is a sign of things to come, but we'll see.
mikejm Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 ...last year Hak made reference to the frosh class as having potentially a Hobey Baker type player/top college player down the road (if I remember the radio broadcast correctly). That reference, according to some people I have talked to, was about Frattin... Hak made the comment to me personally. And he was not talking about Frattin. Think shorter, faster.
Oxbow6 Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 Hak made the comment to me personally. And he was not talking about Frattin. Think shorter, faster. Then I stand corrected and I won't believe anything my "sources" tell me. Thanks for setting the record straight.
Goon Posted December 2, 2008 Author Posted December 2, 2008 Then I stand corrected and I won't believe anything my "sources" tell me. Thanks for setting the record straight. I can think of a couple of short guys that need to pick it up; Trupp, Duncan.
Sioux-per Villain Posted December 2, 2008 Posted December 2, 2008 I can think of a couple of short guys that need to pick it up; Trupp, Duncan. If anyone needs to pick it up and improve on his sparkling 3 pts so far this year, it's Kozek. He hasn't scored in more than a month for Christ's sake! At least take a penalty now and then so we'd all know you're still on the team.
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