Facilities Master Plan

[andtheHomeoftheSIOUX!!]

Another thing, I am betting the indoor football practice facility happens sooner rather then later.

[GeauxSioux]

Another thing, I am betting the indoor football practice facility happens sooner rather then later.

Are you a betting man with inside information?

[Rick]

Are you a betting man with inside information?

I think he is.....we'll most likely find out at Homecoming.

[GeauxSioux]

Q&A: Robert Kelley

Q. What is your opinion of the three major facilities used by UND athletes, the Alerus Center, Ralph Engelstad Arena and the Betty Engelstad Sioux Center?

A. There’s nothing like the REA for men’s hockey. The Betty is certainly, for right now, a very acceptable venue for our basketball and volleyball teams. The Alerus, for right now, is an excellent facility for football. If we’re successful, I think all of them will be able to grow, and then we may 10 years down the road start looking at how we might reposition some of our athletic venues.

Q. What are your priorities for facility upgrades? The school has talked about an indoor practice facility, a soccer field-running track complex and a new outdoor football stadium.

A. It’s part of our university facilities plan. We’re looking at options for where to place those investments. I would imagine from the near to intermediate future, we’re going to see some progress on that.

Looks like we are not quite at the point of announcement, but close.

Q. What is the No. 1 priority?

A. I think for capital construction for the university, I think the No. 1 priority is an indoor practice facility.

Q. Are these projects doable?

A. Yes. We’re going to have to raise some money and look at our revenue streams for bonding.

I like his pro-athletic attitude. Not just regarding the master plan, but overall.

[star2city]

Q. What is the No. 1 priority?

A. I think for capital construction for the university, I think the No. 1 priority is an indoor practice facility.

Does that mean they have the necessary donations, including funding for demolition of the Old Ralph?

Q. Are these projects doable?

A. Yes. We

[GeauxSioux]

Grand Forks Guy has a discussion on the future of UND facility-wise. Where will UND build in the future?

Nothing is as important to the city of Grand Forks as its flagship employer and cultural foundation - the University of North Dakota. UND's enrollment has been up and down in recent years, but I feel that UND will very likely grow by quite a bit in the longterm. If UND does increase the size of its student body and its campus offerings, how will the campus change to accommodate that growth?

When UND was founded in the 1880s, it was placed two miles outside of the city limits of Grand Forks. For years, students had to cross fields by means of carriage, train, or trolley in order to access the campus. Over the last 125 years, the city has grown to meet the campus - indeed, it has surrounded the campus. UND is now essentially a land-locked institution. There are no large tracts of undeveloped land adjacent to campus.

[star2city]

Pickens ups the ante once again...

Division I Notes - www.ncaa.org

Oklahoma State's $165 million donation up in smoke?

Nearly three years ago, the billionaire oilman T. Boone Pickens donated $165 million to Oklahoma State

[MplsBison]

He's going to be richer than Bill Gates anyway once we install 10k wind mills from ND to TX and use CNG for cars.

[moser53]

Another thing, I am betting the indoor football practice facility happens sooner rather then later.

What kind of progress is being made with the practice facility? Anybody got any updates.

[PartTime]

Question.....................The end of January the Herald had a piece about the Alerus Center and how Steve Hyman, the Alerus Center Director, would like to see 31 million spent on the Alerus Center over the next 21 years for updating and improvements. What I found a little surprising is how there was no mention or plan for adding more seating to the Alerus Center. Why wouldn't they want to address this future problem and try keep their largest tenant, UND football? I'm a little curious.

[GeauxSioux]

St. Thomas OKs $118 million construction project

The University of St. Thomas unveiled plans today for a $52 million athletic and recreation complex and a $66 million student center on the university's main campus in St. Paul.....The 180,000-square-foot athletic complex will be located east of St. Thomas' football stadium and will open for use in fall 2010.

Construction of the proposed 240,000-square-foot student center, if approved next year by the Board of Trustees, would begin in fall 2010 and be completed by February 2012.

The two projects and a parking ramp all will be named for Lee and Penny Anderson, who made a $60 million gift to St. Thomas in 2007. It is believed to be the largest single contribution by an individual or a couple to a college or university in Minnesota and is part of St. Thomas' $500 million, eight-year fundraising drive.

[GeauxSioux]

Has anyone heard any word on the proposed Practice Facility? I have mentioned previously the price of steel is driving up the costs on construction projects. One project which I'm working on has gone back for complete redesign to get rid of the steel and build it out of concrete. I received notification from a vendor yesterday that all products would see a 10-12% increase later this month due to the world-wide demand for steel.

Here is an interesting link showing a couple of UND projects, including the practice facility. It also has a couple of possible projects for downtown GF.

Last summer and into the fall the price of steel skyrocketed, putting many construction projects on hold. Then the economy went in the toilet killing more projects. With the price of steel down and construction firms scratching for work (at least along the Gulf Coast), now would be the time to great pricing on new construction. Anyone heard what has been going on the proposed Practice Facility?

[siouxperseven]

Last summer and into the fall the price of steel skyrocketed, putting many construction projects on hold. Then the economy went in the toilet killing more projects. With the price of steel down and construction firms scratching for work (at least along the Gulf Coast), now would be the time to great pricing on new construction. Anyone heard what has been going on the proposed Practice Facility?

I haven't heard a word and I've got a good friend who's in the loop. Even though things have been good around here commercial projects are hard to find especially new ones. There's not much planned in regards to renovating buildings at the college which there's been 2-3 per year for awhile now. If people have money they're not spending it on new buildings...same as cars I assume. And material still sucks....common sense would say prices will go down but I kep gettign letters about cost increases including light gauge steel. How are things down south?

[GeauxSioux]

I haven't heard a word and I've got a good friend who's in the loop. Even though things have been good around here commercial projects are hard to find especially new ones. There's not much planned in regards to renovating buildings at the college which there's been 2-3 per year for awhile now. If people have money they're not spending it on new buildings...same as cars I assume. And material still sucks....common sense would say prices will go down but I kep gettign letters about cost increases including light gauge steel. How are things down south?

Prices on steel pipe and fittings are down and will probably stay that way until China's economy starts booming again. Brass is up, though. Construction-wise our firm has been fortunate to be involved in some good long term projects, such as this one we are a sub-contractor on. The last building (#4) is just starting. I have a friend who called yesterday from Alabama saying that they closed his branch, as he hadn't sold a job in 7 months. Times are tough and quite competitive, which is why it is a good time to start a project.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

Brass is up, though.

Sure; monkey repairs after our long cold winter is causing a spike in demand.

[star2city]

Old Ralph to be Indoor Training Center

The nickname situation isn't going to help with fund raising, especially now that it's clear that Kelley wants the name gone.

UND’s old Ralph Engelstad Arena could, in the next five years, become university athletes’ new indoor training center, according to President Robert Kelley.

The idea still is at the thinking-out-loud stage, he said, but it’s more doable at this stage than the indoor training center that’s now on the long-term plan.

That plan, dating back to late 2007, called for demolition of the arena and building a $19 million to $20 million training center in its place.

Renovating the old Ralph would cost about a quarter of that, according to Rick Tonder, associate director for facilities and planning. The lower the cost, the less time it would take to raise the necessary funds, he said.

Athletic Director Brian Faison said he considers an indoor training center “the most important project out there” for his department.

[bincitysioux]

Sounds good to me.....I'm ready to pony up. I support THE University of North Dakota and its student-athletes. Not an abstract and arbitrary moniker......

[GeauxSioux]

I thought that I had read that the Old Ralph had structural issues.

I know that it would cost far less than building a new facility, but is renovating a 40 year old building investing the money wisely?

How would this fit into the overall master plan for athletics?

I'm not trying to poo-poo the whole plan, I'm just tossing thoughts out there.

[star2city]

I thought that I had read that the Old Ralph had structural issues.

I know that it would cost far less than building a new facility, but is renovating a 40 year old building investing the money wisely?

How would this fit into the overall master plan for athletics?

I'm not trying to poo-poo the whole plan, I'm just tossing thoughts out there.

The structural question weren't answered. Seems they would need to remove much of the concrete / soil in the bowl down to the ice level in order to increase the practice surface area.

As far as fitting into the overall master plan, if UND ever got an retractable roof stadium, the need for a $20 M indoor facility are much reduced. An indoor facility is needed now.

[siouxrunner]

Renovating the old Ralph is not a good idea. The land is better suited being used by the EERC. Consider that the EERC is actually growing during the recession, and you get an idea of the space needs there over the next 5-10 years.

I used the old Ralph as a practice facility for track for a couple of years at UND. It was cramped, with tight corners, and not good for running. Also, I cannot imagine the football team using any of the space in there for practice, which is one of the main goals for an indoor facility. As a track/XC athlete, we constantly brought up the issue of not having an indoor training facility. The teams with indoor tracks (USD, Mankato, NDSU) consistently landed better recruits and finished higher at conference meets, both outdoor and indoor. We were always told it was being worked on and was a high priority. Well, do you think the track coach/Athletic department has called me, a former runner who went through harsh winters of outdoor training, for support of an indoor track? Nope. It seems like there are avenues that the AD could be pursuing as far as funding before they settle for trying to make the old Ralph work.

[star2city]

Renovating the old Ralph is not a good idea. The land is better suited being used by the EERC. Consider that the EERC is actually growing during the recession, and you get an idea of the space needs there over the next 5-10 years.

I used the old Ralph as a practice facility for track for a couple of years at UND. It was cramped, with tight corners, and not good for running. Also, I cannot imagine the football team using any of the space in there for practice, which is one of the main goals for an indoor facility. As a track/XC athlete, we constantly brought up the issue of not having an indoor training facility. The teams with indoor tracks (USD, Mankato, NDSU) consistently landed better recruits and finished higher at conference meets, both outdoor and indoor. We were always told it was being worked on and was a high priority. Well, do you think the track coach/Athletic department has called me, a former runner who went through harsh winters of outdoor training, for support of an indoor track? Nope. It seems like there are avenues that the AD could be pursuing as far as funding before they settle for trying to make the old Ralph work.

With $5 million being the proposed cost, have to believe what is being considered is excavating most of the seating area so that there would be at least 50,000 ft2 in the lower floor (rather than 17,000 ft2 for the arena floor). With that much space, there would be room for a 200 m indoor track in the lower bowl, as well as an arficial surface inside the track lanes. The concourse level could be resurfaced for longer distance training for track.

As far as the EERC, they wanted that space for a parking ramp. The EERC has land east of it's facility, but so far has chosen not to develop it.

An indoor facility of some kind is needed for almost every sport not at the Engelstad complex. Can't imagine track having any type of prayer of success at DI without an upgrade. Football badly needs it too.

Without some kind of indoor facility,

[82SiouxGuy]

I thought that I had read that the Old Ralph had structural issues.

I know that it would cost far less than building a new facility, but is renovating a 40 year old building investing the money wisely?

How would this fit into the overall master plan for athletics?

I'm not trying to poo-poo the whole plan, I'm just tossing thoughts out there.

I have been told that the building needs a new roof. That is the only major structural problem that I know about. I believe that the ice making machinery also needed to be replaced, but that wouldn't be a part of an indoor training facility for other sports.

[puck]

I have been told that the building needs a new roof. That is the only major structural problem that I know about. I believe that the ice making machinery also needed to be replaced, but that wouldn't be a part of an indoor training facility for other sports.

Rick Tonder was just interviewed on KNOX about the Old Ralph plan. The roof needs to be replaced, which he said was not unusual for a building of that age. The steel skin has some holes that would need repair, but structurally is sound. Would remove all seats above the concouse level (street level as you enter) and would be able to have a 5-7 lane 200M track. Would remove all seats in the lower level and be able to have a football size field with fieldturf. The advantage to this plan is infrastructure (steam line, water, & electricity) is in place, which would be about 40% of the cost in a new facility. Also the building has locker room facilities and the loft/office area that can be used. He talked about this as being an interim plan, but did not elaborate on how long it would be interim.

[GeauxSioux]

Rick Tonder was just interviewed on KNOX about the Old Ralph plan. The roof needs to be replaced, which he said was not unusual for a building of that age. The steel skin has some holes that would need repair, but structurally is sound. Would remove all seats above the concouse level (street level as you enter) and would be able to have a 5-7 lane 200M track. Would remove all seats in the lower level and be able to have a football size field with fieldturf. The advantage to this plan is infrastructure (steam line, water, & electricity) is in place, which would be about 40% of the cost in a new facility. Also the building has locker room facilities and the loft/office area that can be used. He talked about this as being an interim plan, but did not elaborate on how long it would be interim.

Did he offer any kind of possible timeline on this proposed plan?

[MplsBison]

Something doesn't add up.

Either he got the size of the track wrong or the size of the field wrong...but I know for a fact you can not fit a regulation football field inside a 200m track.

You can almost fit one inside a 300m track, I know Akron did this for their fieldhouse and the track just nips off the corners of the endzones.

And obviously a full size 400m track you can fit a football field plus more inside, but I don't know any indoor tracks that are full size. Almost all are 200m (some fancy ones at big schools have banked turns) and a couple are 300m.