Expressing displeasure through decreased attendance

[Bison06]

45 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

Gotta love fair weather fans!!  Wait....I mean fake fans.  If you were a real fan of UND football before the USD game, you are still a fan today.  I choose to be a fan of UND through the good times and the bad.  From winning the National Championship in 2001, to losing to Sioux falls at home, and every game in between.   If the win by 34 or lose by 38, I will still support this team the same.  Others have the same line of thinking.  Just wish there weren't so many that don't.

I've always thought of it the opposite way. When a team isn't performing in a way that pleases you, the only way to truly create change is to not support them financially. It makes a bit more sense at the pro level than at the college level, but I think it still holds mostly true.

I'm a huge Minnesota professional sports fan, but I haven't been to a twins or timberwolves game in years because I don't want to send the message that the way they are playing or making personnel decisions is worthy of my dollar. Put a competitive product on the field and I'll spend some money to come to your stadium. Free market economics at its best. By supporting a team that is underperforming, you are in a way allowing it to continue. As I said, makes a bit more sense at the pro level.

[nodak651]

31 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

I've always thought of it the opposite way. When a team isn't performing in a way that pleases you, the only way to truly create change is to not support them financially. It makes a bit more sense at the pro level than at the college level, but I think it still holds mostly true.

I'm a huge Minnesota professional sports fan, but I haven't been to a twins or timberwolves game in years because I don't want to send the message that the way they are playing or making personnel decisions is worthy of my dollar. Put a competitive product on the field and I'll spend some money to come to your stadium. Free market economics at its best. By supporting a team that is underperforming, you are in a way allowing it to continue. As I said, makes a bit more sense at the pro level.

Assuming you wait to see a trend first, and wouldn't bail just because of one or two bad games?  

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, nodak651 said:

Assuming you wait to see a trend first, and wouldn't bail just because of one or two bad games?  

Absolutely, jumping ship on UND this early would be a mistake. It is fair, however, to have it shift lower on your priority list though if it was already going to be a hassle to get there as the above poster is doing. It loses its luster a bit after a loss like that for a fan who has to drive quite a ways to make the game. 

[Gothmog]

1 hour ago, Bison06 said:

I've always thought of it the opposite way. When a team isn't performing in a way that pleases you, the only way to truly create change is to not support them financially. It makes a bit more sense at the pro level than at the college level, but I think it still holds mostly true.

I'm a huge Minnesota professional sports fan, but I haven't been to a twins or timberwolves game in years because I don't want to send the message that the way they are playing or making personnel decisions is worthy of my dollar. Put a competitive product on the field and I'll spend some money to come to your stadium. Free market economics at its best. By supporting a team that is underperforming, you are in a way allowing it to continue. As I said, makes a bit more sense at the pro level.

That may make you feel better, but it doesn't really help bring about change. If the team has already lost you as a supporter you have no voice at all.

[Bison06]

14 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

That may make you feel better, but it doesn't really help bring about change. If the team has already lost you as a supporter you have no voice at all.

How so? Improve the product and I'm back. 

Clearly, my thought process isn't unique. Why do you think attendance is higher during winning seasons than losing seasons? People pull their support in general when a team is losing and increase their support when a team is winning.

as an example, my friends and I already have plans to go to a timbwrwolves game this year because of all the excitement with the offseason moves. Never would have considered that in the past 10 years.

[Siouxperfan7]

10 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

How so? Improve the product and I'm back. 

Clearly, my thought process isn't unique. Why do you think attendance is higher during winning seasons than losing seasons? People pull their support in general when a team is losing and increase their support when a team is winning.

as an example, my friends and I already have plans to go to a timbwrwolves game this year because of all the excitement with the offseason moves. Never would have considered that in the past 10 years.

Thanks random Bison fan guy, but I really could care less about what you and other Bison fans think about what UND's attendance should be.  But hey, thanks for your fair weather/bandwagon thoughts!!

[Bison06]

4 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

Thanks random Bison fan guy, but I really could care less about what you and other Bison fans think about what UND's attendance should be.  But hey, thanks for your fair weather/bandwagon thoughts!!

I find it hilarious how critical you all are of bisonville about dissenting opinions. Pot meet kettle.

You all are just so welcoming. If I changed my name to anything that didn't have Bison in it, nothing about my comment was either inflammatory nor referenced me being a Bison fan. You just feel like being an a-hole I guess.

 

[Gothmog]

38 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

How so? Improve the product and I'm back. 

Clearly, my thought process isn't unique. Why do you think attendance is higher during winning seasons than losing seasons? People pull their support in general when a team is losing and increase their support when a team is winning.

as an example, my friends and I already have plans to go to a timbwrwolves game this year because of all the excitement with the offseason moves. Never would have considered that in the past 10 years.

The threat of taking your money elsewhere is much more powerful than actually doing so.

[Bison06]

1 minute ago, Gothmog said:

The threat of taking your money elsewhere is much more powerful than actually doing so.

So when attendance drops the front office doesn't take that as a sign that their fan base is unhappy and make changes?

[tnt]

27 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

So when attendance drops the front office doesn't take that as a sign that their fan base is unhappy and make changes?

But in college sports if you aren't putting money into a program it is much harder to get results.  Tell me how easy it would be to keep putting a very competitive team on the field if the money coming into the program could no longer support FCOA?   I know you don't look at that as your concern, which is fine with me, because I am hoping someday the throngs of fair weathers that are part of the Bison crowd will help bring the program down a notch after some less than stellar play.  

[Bison06]

33 minutes ago, tnt said:

But in college sports if you aren't putting money into a program it is much harder to get results.  Tell me how easy it would be to keep putting a very competitive team on the field if the money coming into the program could no longer support FCOA?   I know you don't look at that as your concern, which is fine with me, because I am hoping someday the throngs of fair weathers that are part of the Bison crowd will help bring the program down a notch after some less than stellar play.  

If NDSU takes a step back and consistently starts missing the playoffs, I would fully expect the fan base to "speak up" and show their dissatisfaction by not attending games and removing their financial support. The NDSU decision makers would then have to decide to keep the status quo and accept their new financial reality or make the necessary changes. Either way, the fans being "fair weather" in my opinion is a good thing. Don't send a message that what the team is currently doing is ok with you if it isn't ok with you. 

[Gothmog]

1 hour ago, Bison06 said:

I find it hilarious how critical you all are of bisonville about dissenting opinions. Pot meet kettle.

You all are just so welcoming. If I changed my name to anything that didn't have Bison in it, nothing about my comment was either inflammatory nor referenced me being a Bison fan. You just feel like being an a-hole I guess.

 

Unless you're buying a lot of tickets or donating a lot of cash, your removing support isn't going to make more than a negligible difference. If you continue to buy tickets and donate money you do have a voice. A small one perhaps, but at least, someone will listen to you vent. It's one thing to decide not to go to games because you don't enjoy them. It's quite another to deny yourself the enjoyment under a delusion that it will make the team better. 

[Bison06]

3 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

Unless you're buying a lot of tickets or donating a lot of cash, your removing support isn't going to make more than a negligible difference. If you continue to buy tickets and donate money you do have a voice. A small one perhaps, but at least, someone will listen to you vent. It's one thing to decide not to go to games because you don't enjoy them. It's quite another to deny yourself the enjoyment under a delusion that it will make the team better. 

You're assuming that only one person is acting as I'm suggesting. If UND were to see a drop in season tickets by a significant amount, you honestly don't think the AD would call a meeting and maybe even call some of those former season ticket holders to ask why they didn't renew?

[gundy1124]

13 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

If NDSU takes a step back and consistently starts missing the playoffs, I would fully expect the fan base to "speak up" and show their dissatisfaction by not attending games and removing their financial support. The NDSU decision makers would then have to decide to keep the status quo and accept their new financial reality or make the necessary changes. Either way, the fans being "fair weather" in my opinion is a good thing. Don't send a message that what the team is currently doing is ok with you if it isn't ok with you. 

I really don't have a problem with this analysis.  Life in general, don't reward what's not earned.  Need a big bounce back week in GF.  In spite of my joke about season tickets for sale in the game thread......I am doubling down with about 25 family members and friends for Saturday.  

[CMSioux]

You chose to come here with a Bison nickname and wonder about the reception? I highly doubt your true colors would be hidden with a different name. I think you are treated much more kindly here than anyone who goes to bison-swill with a UND agenda. 

[Bison06]

7 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

You chose to come here with a Bison nickname and wonder about the reception? I highly doubt your true colors would be hidden with a different name. I think you are treated much more kindly here than anyone who goes to bison-swill with a UND agenda. 

Or there is the novel idea of actually reading the my posts and responding to them based on their content.

[JohnboyND7]

7 minutes ago, CMSioux said:

You chose to come here with a Bison nickname and wonder about the reception? I highly doubt your true colors would be hidden with a different name. I think you are treated much more kindly here than anyone who goes to bison-swill with a UND agenda. 

B06 doesn't post on BV, so I don't think he really cares. 

 

[Gothmog]

38 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

You're assuming that only one person is acting as I'm suggesting. If UND were to see a drop in season tickets by a significant amount, you honestly don't think the AD would call a meeting and maybe even call some of those former season ticket holders to ask why they didn't renew?

Are you going to lead that charge? If not, as an individual you're better off keeping your relationship with the school/team intact...and enjoying attending games/events.

[Midwestern Hawk]

36 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

You're assuming that only one person is acting as I'm suggesting. If UND were to see a drop in season tickets by a significant amount, you honestly don't think the AD would call a meeting and maybe even call some of those former season ticket holders to ask why they didn't renew?

Really?  It was one game.  I don't think many will make a decision on season tickets based on one game.  

[nodak651]

I don't get why everyone is so offended by what Bison06 has to say... he makes some good points, and it's just an economics discussion, really.  UND has had poor attendance, so they created a game day committee to improve the product.  That is relevant to Bison06's point.

I personally think withdrawing support and money works best for pro sports, rather than college, because college programs still need to recruit players, and players want to go places with good fan support.  Whereas pro sports teams can just draft and trade for their players.  

[nodak651]

7 minutes ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

Really?  It was one game.  I don't think many will make a decision on season tickets based on one game.  

He didn't really say that they would.

3 hours ago, nodak651 said:

Assuming you wait to see a trend first, and wouldn't bail just because of one or two bad games?  

 

3 hours ago, Bison06 said:

Absolutely, jumping ship on UND this early would be a mistake. It is fair, however, to have it shift lower on your priority list though if it was already going to be a hassle to get there as the above poster is doing. It loses its luster a bit after a loss like that for a fan who has to drive quite a ways to make the game. 

 

[Bison06]

11 minutes ago, Midwestern Hawk said:

Really?  It was one game.  I don't think many will make a decision on season tickets based on one game.  

My posts on this topic are not specifically about UND's current situation. If you read back, just speaking generally in response to another poster talking about "real fans" will continue to attend even if the team isn't fairing well.

[Bison06]

20 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

Are you going to lead that charge? If not, as an individual you're better off keeping your relationship with the school/team intact...and enjoying attending games/events.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I feel the only true power the average fan has is to allocate their finances elsewhere to show the powers that be they are dissatisfied. You're right that the threat of pulling significant funding would also send a clear message, but your average fan doesn't have that leverage the way a large donor would.

[Gothmog]

42 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I feel the only true power the average fan has is to allocate their finances elsewhere to show the powers that be they are dissatisfied. You're right that the threat of pulling significant funding would also send a clear message, but your average fan doesn't have that leverage the way a large donor would.

If the average fan doesn't have enough leverage to send a message by threatening to withdraw support, as you say, then the average fans also does not have leverage to send the same message by actually withdrawing support. No matter how you look at it, if your goal is to improve the team, you'd do better by staying engaged with team. 

 

[Bison06]

2 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

If the average fan doesn't have enough leverage to send a message by threatening to withdraw support, as you say, then the average fans also does not have leverage to send the same message by actually withdrawing support. No matter how you look at it, if your goal is to improve the team, you'd do better by staying engaged with team. 

 

Again agree to disagree.

Attendance falling, i.e. an individual fan pulling their financial support, clearly has an effect on the Athletic Department's decision making in my mind and can bring about real change. Losing the "casual fan" is a problem for any athletic team, college or pro.