homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Homer, curious who this documented coach is or what he said exactly? Article is below, the man is an alum, letter winner and is as passionate about UND as anyone. He also has some outside knowledge of the recruiting game. For me the biggest question is if no nickname satisfies the agreement signed by the NCAA and state of North Dakota. http://www.grandforksherald.com/content/former-sioux-football-coach-dale-lennon-says-und-losing-recruits-already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEagle Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 There is a non UND coach on record stating the nickname was being used against UND. He had no reason to toe any line as he was not a UND employee. That was when there were sanctions. Again, I am waiting from someone to come out and answer the question of what meets the NCAA requirements per the signed agreement. He wasn't saying the nickname was being used against UND. It was the controversy surrounding the nickname and the fact that there could be sanctions given to UND over it. Of course, other recruiters would use those threats to help them win recruits. If the NCAA hadn't made those threats, the nickname itself was being used against UND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 He wasn't saying the nickname was being used against UND. It was the controversy surrounding the nickname and the fact that there could be sanctions given to UND over it. Of course, other recruiters would use those threats to help them win recruits. If the NCAA hadn't made those threats, the nickname itself was being used against UND. Has anyone come out and stated not selecting a nickname satisfies the agreement signed by the NCAA and the state of North Dakota? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxphan27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 How would not having a nickname be used against UND by other teams' coaches? Would they sit in a recruit's living room and say you know, UND doesn't have a nickname, so, Neener Neener Neener? Or am I missing something here? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND1983 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 How would not having a nickname be used against UND by other teams' coaches? Would they sit in a recruit's living room and say you know, UND doesn't have a nickname, so, Neener Neener Neener? Or am I missing something here? You're missing something here. Read the post above yours. The NCAA and sanctions over the old nickname was the problem back in the day. Everyone wants to know if it will pop up again by not having a nickname. Wish Kelley would answer the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 How would not having a nickname be used against UND by other teams' coaches? Would they sit in a recruit's living room and say you know, UND doesn't have a nickname, so, Neener Neener Neener? Or am I missing something here? Recruiters don't have to always deal in fact. They can run with innuendo. "So you're thinking about North Dakota? Well, they haven't put that whole nickname fiasco behind them; they don't have a name. Who knows what'll happen to them and their playoff chances between now and them figuring all that out." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 The NCAA and sanctions over the old nickname was the problem back in the day. Everyone wants to know if it will pop up again by not having a nickname. Wish Kelley would answer the question. You're assuming it stopped. Sicatoka's post is pretty spot on. Not as effective now as it was when the sanctions were looming and it was a hurdle to possibly getting a conference, but it is still pretty easy to spin the dumpster fire this has become into a negative that gives a recruit something a little extra to think about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scpa0305 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 http://siouxfb.areavoices.com/2015/07/27/quite-the-recruiting-weekend/ Wait a minute....do these kids know we don't have a nickname? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 http://siouxfb.areavoices.com/2015/07/27/quite-the-recruiting-weekend/ Wait a minute....do these kids know we don't have a nickname? Any statement from the NCAA if not selecting a nickname moves the school any further from the Fighting Sioux name and satisfies the signed agreement in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 http://siouxfb.areavoices.com/2015/07/27/quite-the-recruiting-weekend/ Wait a minute....do these kids know we don't have a nickname? Are you trying to argue that the nickname debacle (in the past and currently) has had absolutely zero impact on recruiting? I don't think anyone has claimed that there is any way to fully know or measure exactly what impact there has been as it is one of hundreds of things that comes into play throughout the recruiting process, but to claim that it hasn't been or isn't brought up and gives some recruits at least something extra to consider is just being naïve. It isn't exactly generating positive press either. Why continue to give opposing coaches an extra arrow in their quiver? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBR Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Any statement from the NCAA if not selecting a nickname moves the school any further from the Fighting Sioux name and satisfies the signed agreement in place. No idea what you're trying to say there Dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 No idea what you're trying to say there Dude. It's not too difficult. What terms were agreed upon 3 years ago and does being know as the University of North Dakota _________ meet that requirement as the main reason for not selecting a name is to fill the blank above with Fighting Sioux. Does that satisfy the NCAA so they don't come back and threaten sanctions on UND. Dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bigskyvikes Posted July 27, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted July 27, 2015 Are you trying to argue that the nickname debacle (in the past and currently) has had absolutely zero impact on recruiting? I don't think anyone has claimed that there is any way to fully know or measure exactly what impact there has been as it is one of hundreds of things that comes into play throughout the recruiting process, but to claim that it hasn't been or isn't brought up and gives some recruits at least something extra to consider is just being naïve. It isn't exactly generating positive press either. Why continue to give opposing coaches an extra arrow in their quiver? No, I think he just proved that "this nickname debacle hurts recruitment" is only a scare tactic and not reality. Nobody can prove different. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigskyvikes Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It's not too difficult. What terms were agreed upon 3 years ago and does being know as the University of North Dakota _________ meet that requirement as the main reason for not selecting a name is to fill the blank above with Fighting Sioux. Does that satisfy the NCAA so they don't come back and threaten sanctions on UND. Dude. Another scare tactic, Kelly could be hiding this to drop the hammer at the end, but to think he or his staff don't know the answer to this is silly, IMO. Just because they haven't told you and me doesn't mean they don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 No, I think he just proved that "this nickname debacle hurts recruitment" is only a scare tactic and not reality. Nobody can prove different. What exactly did he "prove"? Seems to me that the only thing that was proven is that despite the nickname debacle, the UND football coaches are able to get recruits to buy in to what they are trying to do. Not sure how you can claim it isn't reality? UND coaches have admitted to having to battle it. Opposing coaches admit to using it. Is it measurable? No. But it is real despite what you try to argue. It is one of many things that UND continues to have to face because the issue isn't resolved and having "no nickname" continues down that path. At what point do all these "little things" that the "no nickname" crowd keeps dismissing as having minimal impact add up to be enough to make them realize that moving on is the only true way to distance UND from the net negative the nickname situation is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND1983 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Another scare tactic, Kelly could be hiding this to drop the hammer at the end, but to think he or his staff don't know the answer to this is silly, IMO. Just because they haven't told you and me doesn't mean they don't know. That is not a scare tactic, it is a simple question. Scare tactics are when Sioux Lovers dig up dirt on an ex-president trying to make him seem like a horrible human being so people won't vote for Roughriders. That was about as desperate of a scare tactic as I have ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBR Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It's not too difficult. What terms were agreed upon 3 years ago and does being know as the University of North Dakota _________ meet that requirement as the main reason for not selecting a name is to fill the blank above with Fighting Sioux. Does that satisfy the NCAA so they don't come back and threaten sanctions on UND. Dude. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxphan27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 You're missing something here. Read the post above yours. The NCAA and sanctions over the old nickname was the problem back in the day. Everyone wants to know if it will pop up again by not having a nickname. Wish Kelley would answer the question. My pont was that question will be answered by then. We will not go forward with an option that creates instant sanctions. Which makes the entire discussion about opposing coaches another fear mongering scare tactic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 My pont was that question will be answered by then. We will not go forward with an option that creates instant sanctions. Which makes the entire discussion about opposing coaches another fear mongering scare tactic. It hasn't been brought up by any decision makers or UND personnel this go around. How are they using it as a scare tactic. It's only been brought up by me and a few others on this board as something that officially needs to be addressed as the NCAA has proven time and time again it plays by its own set of rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdub27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It hasn't been brought up by any decision makers or UND personnel this go around. How are they using it as a scare tactic. It's only been brought up by me and a few others on this board as something that officially needs to be addressed as the NCAA has proven time and time again it plays by its own set of rules. Not to mention they also have the power to change them as they go along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxphan27 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It hasn't been brought up by any decision makers or UND personnel this go around. How are they using it as a scare tactic. It's only been brought up by me and a few others on this board as something that officially needs to be addressed as the NCAA has proven time and time again it plays by its own set of rules. They're not the ones using it as a scare tactic. People on here are the ones using it as a reason to be afraid of going with no nickname. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigskyvikes Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 They're not the ones using it as a scare tactic. People on here are the ones using it as a reason to be afraid of going with no nickname. EXACTLY! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigskyvikes Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 That is not a scare tactic, it is a simple question. Scare tactics are when Sioux Lovers dig up dirt on an ex-president trying to make him seem like a horrible human being so people won't vote for Roughriders. That was about as desperate of a scare tactic as I have ever seen. With all the PC bs going around and is the ultimate reason the Sioux name is gone, and you say no nickname people are the ones digging up dirt on an ex-president to not allow RR as a name?! That's the dumbest shyt I've ever heard! There are other choices you know, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 They're not the ones using it as a scare tactic. People on here are the ones using it as a reason to be afraid of going with no nickname.People on here have all sorts of opinions. No one of those people has wrote a letter to the editor, called radio stations or planned protests but those are ok right. At the end of the day it should be a factor in the decision. If it's all good with the NCAA than the leadership needs to come out and say so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxperfan7 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 They're not the ones using it as a scare tactic. People on here are the ones using it as a reason to be afraid of going with no nickname. It's been use by other coaches to recruit against UND. That is a FACT. You can choose to not believe it, but it is reality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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