UNDvince97-01 Posted February 16, 2004 Posted February 16, 2004 So the Fargodome has been open what, 10 years? And they already have to remodel the locker room? Didn't the Fargodome know from the beginning that NDSU fb would be there? Why not do it right the first time? Lockers I can understand, but the rest seems odd. they must not have ordered the top quality lockers from Debourgh Mfg.
bisonguy Posted February 16, 2004 Posted February 16, 2004 The new locker rooms at the Fargodome would be for practice. The gameday locker rooms would stay intact. Sicatoka, The Fargodome and NDSU had agreed that it would be best if the Fargodome footed the bill for the practice locker rooms. I believe it had something to do with NDSU "owning" part of the Fargodome. Something of a "owner build to suit" sort of thing. Everything I have heard is that the capital for the BSA renovation would be raised by NDSU, and not come from the state.
Riverman Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 UND DID NOT GO D1aa (D1)!!! WE DID NOT LEAVE D2!! Or the NCC!!NDSU left why put the blame on UND? Is there something in the water?All we hear from Fargo (cept Big Eddie) is crying about how we(UND) destroyed the rivalry. IMHO, UND left the door open for football with if your so good you play here (Alerus). That date is/was open for along time.I think NDSU declined IMHO they need our (UND fans) $$$. I heard on Big Eddies show the $2 student fee will help raise almost a million for sports.Seems a little small for D1 don't you think? I think the BSA could use a little work and the Fargo Dome needs lockers and ..... I guess know that I look at it, it is UND's fault for not helping out on paying for NDSU to be D1! Who watches Steve Hallstrom? And who cares what he has to say?
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 UND DID NOT GO D1aa (D1)!!! WE DID NOT LEAVE D2!! Or the NCC!!NDSU left why put the blame on UND? Is there something in the water?All we hear from Fargo (cept Big Eddie) is crying about how we(UND) destroyed the rivalry. IMHO, UND left the door open for football with if your so good you play here (Alerus). That date is/was open for along time.I think NDSU declined IMHO they need our (UND fans) $$$. I heard on Big Eddies show the $2 student fee will help raise almost a million for sports.Seems a little small for D1 don't you think? I think the BSA could use a little work and the Fargo Dome needs lockers and ..... I guess know that I look at it, it is UND's fault for not helping out on paying for NDSU to be D1! Who watches Steve Hallstrom? And who cares what he has to say? It's simply a matter of persepective on what was the original cause of the rivalry ending. Was it: 1) NDSU leaving or 2)UND not signing. The immediate cause was UND not signing, but they have an equally good case for not signing because it will hurt their play off chances. However i don't buy all the uneven playing field crap when UND almost lost to Winonna State (who has 16) and when NDSU beat Montana (who has 63).
PCM Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 Was it: 1) NDSU leaving or 2)UND not signing. If NDSU wouldn't have left, there would have been no reason for UND not to sign. Once again, it is my pleasure to bring you the following educational public service announcement.
MinnesotaNorthStar Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 If NDSU wouldn't have left, there would have been no reason for UND not to sign. Once again, it is my pleasure to bring you the following educational public service announcement. Don't you just love when these things come full circle? And you can't tell me that Babich or Bohl didn't use "We're moving to D1" as a recruiting tactic.
BisonMav Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 And you can't tell me that Babich or Bohl didn't use "We're moving to D1" as a recruiting tactic. ......and the problem with that is?
Cratter Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 It's lose lose situation for UND. Discontinue to play the rivalry now and you get Steve's opinion. Quite 5-10 years down the road when NDSU has a major advantage, then get Steve's opinion "UND's scared and doesn't like losing to NDSU anymore, what a bunch of pansies, why now? why at this point? blah, blah, blah.....'' It's going to end eventually thanks to NDSU moving. Now is as good time as any.
BisonMav Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 The problem with that is we're no longer competing on a level playing field, and that's why we no longer have a Sioux/Bison game to look forward to. People whine about losing this great rivalry, but they don't stop to think about how if they were to continue playing it would gradually become one-sided and would no longer be a great rivalry. I'm happy quitting while we're ahead. My question was what's wrong with using the Divison I label in recruiting.
bisonguy Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 My question was what's wrong with using the Divison I label in recruiting. Obviously, nothing. Dale Lennon was telling last year's recruits that UND would be moving to DI within three years/
timbo Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 i am a huge bison fan but i believe that UND saying they dont need ndsu is just stupid. they do but dont want to admit it. also ndsu needs UND. its a two way street and actually i blame the ncaa for making d-2 more and more like d-3 or naia. the UND sioux will be d-1 i a few years and no one can deny it. they are not going to stand by and watch d-2 turn more and more into a low talent pool league.the reason that UND is taking a lot of if not all of the blame in my eyes is that ndsu put the ball right in roger thomas's hands and instead of running with it he just stood there. he took way to long to make a decision if he would have just said we are done it would not have been a huge issue but 2 basketball games and speculation all over the board made it worse.
timbo Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 oh, by the way if you dont move to d-1 you will lose one of the best coaches in football because he is to good to sit and watch UND stay and other schools move up.
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 I think the NCAA is headed for MAJOR reclassification after the BCS schools split away and form their own association ala the NAIA. I forsee all sports going to a 2 division system. Either you're scholorship or non-scholorship.
bigmrg74 Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 I think the NCAA is headed for MAJOR reclassification after the BCS schools split away and form their own association ala the NAIA. I forsee all sports going to a 2 division system. Either you're scholorship or non-scholorship. holy *shibby*!! for once, Bisonfan1234 has had a pretty intellegent post for once. i don't quite see it being a 2 division, scholorship or non-scholoship. I think it would break down more like five divisions for football. first off, the top division would be from the BCS schools, once they get off the damn bowls and do a real playoff system!! The second division would be the non-BCS DI-A schools, like those from the MAC, plus some of the better DI-AA teams. Third would be the lesser DI-AA schools, plus the cream of the cream D2 schools. Fourth would be the rest of D2 with a couple of the D3 heavyweights. And fifth would be whoever is left, D3, NAIA, and JUCO's. Max scholorships would go to the big boys at the top and would decrease as you go down. The strength of scheduling would be fixed so that a team isn't hurt as much for playing a team thats a division up than playing a team thats a division down.
The Sicatoka Posted February 17, 2004 Posted February 17, 2004 I think the NCAA is headed for MAJOR reclassification after the BCS schools split away and form their own association ala the NAIA. I forsee all sports going to a 2 division system. Either you're scholorship or non-scholorship. Coherent. Non-antagonistic. Very reasonably stated. Who are you and how did you get 1234's password! I'd agree that an NCAA shuffle just may be in the cards. I'm not sure if the BCS schools will completely break away or just get their own new division. (The NCAA would really be hurt revenue-wise if they left completely so they'd probably bend over backwards to keep them in the overall fold by creating a "BCS" division.) What would a "new" NCAA look like? It's anyone's guess.
MinnesotaNorthStar Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 My question was what's wrong with using the Divison I label in recruiting. There's nothing wrong with using that...I'd expect Lennon to use it if we were moving up as well. My point is that if NDSU thinks that just because the players that get the scholarships don't come in until next year, they're already getting better recruits based on that. That's almost as good as a scholarship.
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 The NAIA and the NJCAA have nothing to do with the NCAA. They have completely different rules. In fact, i'm not even sure if title-xi affects them. In this same manner, i see another new association of top NCAA institutions called the BCS (after the football ranking system) or whatever name they felt was suitable. If this association wasn't affacted by title-xi it would be all the better for them. No longer would they have to keep money losing sports simply because they're required to by the NCAA. No longer would they have to limit scholorships or not be able to offer a kid because he didn't qualify in the clearinghouse. They could run it strictly like a business, which i see as their main goal. I definately see them adopting a NDSCS style of athletic departments with only the main (money making sports) offered. With the teams left, the NCAA will have to reclassify since most of the D1A schools will probably leave for this new association. I suppose i see the need for different levels of scholorship max levels...but i don't like how schools can have any number lower than this maximum number. I feel there should be a minimum as well. So (for example in football) D1 should be max 85 min 65, D2 max 45 min 30, D3 no scholorship. IMO, if you can't fund 30 scholorships for football then what's the point of offering any? But it probably won't be like that. The stupid NCAA will continue to do things the way they want.
Smoggy Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 The BCS teams will never leave the NCAA, because they make too much money on March Madness. As far as the NCAA, who knows what's going on. When did they institute the 13 year non playoff for bball? I know a few years ago SI had an excellent article on schools that jumped to DI for the bball money and failed (a few in Illinois and Georgia I believe). I believe after all that the NCAA tried to make it harder for schools to become DI. Maybe it'll get lowered back down like Bison fans think, and maybe it won't. Just remember that the big time schools don't want any more teams taking a slice of their bball money.
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 The BCS teams will never leave the NCAA, because they make too much money on March Madness. Just like NDSU would never leave the NCC, huh? Why not simply bring march madness with them?! After all, they have most of the main march madness teams with them. I think the TV's would rather watch UGA vs. UFL than Gonzaga try to take on Southern IL.
Riverman Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Random thoughts I have.. We have Wooger Wisdom (Former UM Gopher hockey coach) know we have Bohl-Shi*...(Current coach at NDSU) First we have Bohl:"All I can see is how much interest there was all the way from Wahpeton to Crosby,ND.,for the Bison Sioux football game",he said."I have a hard time understanding how you let that go."(well duh you went D1aa)! Also another quote: "I think every young man who has or will play football in this state looked forward to the game."(No kidding?really?) And last but not least the blame on UND quote: "It's disappointing that at this time UND has decided not to continue the rivalry."( Not even "Rocky" would say things so da*n stupid!) Even Gene Taylor understands! His Quote:"I understand why UND decided to discontinue it's rivalry with NDSU.When we will have 18 more scholarships than UND.So there is an uneven playing field."(now if he would just tell Coach Bohl that and a few of the NDSU fans!) The Hockey program didn't make money? Well somebody out bid me on ZP's game worn jersey by over a grand!(I wonder where that money goes?)
Smoggy Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Just like NDSU would never leave the NCC, huh? Why not simply bring march madness with them?! After all, they have most of the main march madness teams with them. I think the TV's would rather watch UGA vs. UFL than Gonzaga try to take on Southern IL. Maybe they would, but I always will watch a close underdog game rather than the boring UF vs. Georgia tilt (even though I'm a UF fan). The great thing about March Madness is the cinderella teams. I also don't think they'd get as much TV money by having a smaller tourney. Currently the majority of the BCS conferences get in anyways, and allowing any more (if they had their own tourney) would have below .500 teams.
CoteauRinkRat Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 The BCS teams will never leave the NCAA, because they make too much money on March Madness. I guarantee that the majority of the money will follow the big basketball school. CBS will not be shelling out money if the big schools are not in the NCAA's tourney.
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Not only that but i'm dumbfounded how people always say "what about the cinderella teams?"... yes..what about them? There are cinderella's within the BCS teams too. It doesn't have to be a small school. All you need is a team like Nebraska knocking off Kansas and you get a cinderella.
The Sicatoka Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Title IX (pronounced: title nine) is Federal law. It's goal was "gender equity." We could, and have, filled page after page of other threads debating its merits. The bottom line about it is this: Title IX isn't the NCAA or NAIA or NJCAA; Title IX is Federal law and no matter what level you play at you have to be in compliance. Regarding the NCAA and scenarios: The key issue for the "bigs" (the BCS schools if you will) is simple: Money. They don't want to share as much with the smaller schools because they are the "rainmakers." They want to keep what they perceive as having earned. It's tough to argue with that. If the issue was strictly football, I'm sure the BCS conferences would be gone, and maybe would be gone already. But in comes that billion dollar basketball television deal and the issue is not just football money any more. Where does that put all this? It's anyone's guess. But I do know this: This will boil down to a money issue.
Bisonfan1234 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 I am baffeled that the BCS schools simply don't take the tournament with them by taking all the good schools. If they formed their own association they would have all the big schools working for them. They could have their own billion dollar tournament, or even a bowl style postseason if they pleased. The only thing is would they take the good basketball schools who weren't as good at football or didn't have football (Providence for example). Honestly, now that i think about it, Providense and schools like these would be a perfect fit for this new association. They could cut their athletic departments down to only men's and women's basketball and make good money. If they would be subject to title ix, then they simply would have to find a couple sports to offset football. This could be volleyball, soccer, softball, or whatever, so long as the scholorships were the same. Also, some schools would obviously still want to compete in hockey and wrestling (since they can make money at them). They'll have to have even more sports for women then, so who knows.
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