captains suspended

[yzerman19]

If this team party has been allowed to happen for years, why isn't faison holding hakstol responsible as well?

Ding, Ding, Ding...I'm sure it was always a non-issue, so never discussed as needing to be managed- until UND gets labeled binge drinking capital of the world, and a party gets out of hand with the most highly visible representatives of the University, and Faison feels the need to flex a little.

[JLP157]

We used to have all campus parties at the now empty slot of land on University Avenue across from the library. Never even thought about checking an I.D. The beer distributors treated us(and other houses) like an account, they would bring signage and give us swag to give away....hell McKinnon even put the large Clydesdale in our front yard a few times. It wasn't uncommon for us to burn through 20-25 kegs at these events......times have changed.

McKinnon must have stolen the Clydesdale, since they aren't the Budweiser distributer....

[bigskyvikes]

If Kristo was suspended two years ago, and suspended this time twice, that makes three, doesn't it?

[The Sicatoka]

Folks, it's a different time and a different place.

We're living in a world where behavior of college athletes is rightly under scrutiny. Look at the mess at BU. Look at the mess at Montana. Look at the mess at NDSU. And then look at the complete mess that is Penn State.

That's problem one.

Problem two?

The studies are out there: booze thrashes your physical skills, and that's long after you've sobered up. Remember our "Saturday night home game funk" a while back? I was pretty sure I knew what the issue was. I'm more sure now.

So if the team went too far I'd rather see Administration deal with it with a loud, clear message, before someone gets hurt.

And to those of you who said "Why not punish Hak too?" ... uh, do you know that conversation hasn't been had as well? I would not surprise me in the least if Hak had an uncomfortable chat with Faison and Faison's boss.

[iluvdebbies]

Maybe....could be .....possible....but then again you don't deal in speculation.

[petey23]

McKinnon must have stolen the Clydesdale, since they aren't the Budweiser distributer....

My bad then. I used to have a picture of me riding it.....thank God we didn't have todays technology back in the day!

[watchmaker49]

We used to have all campus parties at the now empty slot of land on University Avenue across from the library. Never even thought about checking an I.D. The beer distributors treated us(and other houses) like an account, they would bring signage and give us swag to give away....hell McKinnon even put the large Clydesdale in our front yard a few times. It wasn't uncommon for us to burn through 20-25 kegs at these events......times have changed.

We had a nice party at your house one summer night back in the 80's. After a couple of hours we realized that no one at the party lived there. The fire extinguisher by the front door shot all the way across the living room. It also shot the entire length of the upstairs hallway. I call BS on this. Those of you who remember the old Spud Bar they would not even use that many for Buck Pichers back n the 80's.

[petey23]

We had a nice party at your house one summer night back in the 80's. After a couple of hours we realized that no one at the party lived there. The fire extinguisher by the front door shot all the way across the living room. It also shot the entire length of the upstairs hallway. I call BS on this. Those of you who remember the old Spud Bar they would not even use that many for Buck Pichers back n the 80's.

Uncommon might have been the wrong choice in words. 20-25 was probably the most we ever went through(early start with a couple bands in front yard at the end of rush week). Normally we would order 12 and have 6 on reserve. We used to clear around $700-$1200 at $3/cup.

[The Sicatoka]

Maybe....could be .....possible....but then again you don't deal in speculation.

Who speculated? I responded to speculation with a simple "Do you know it has? Do you know it hasn't?" type response.

Let's get this back on point:

Apparently there's an issue large enough, serious enough to:

- suspend all four captains, including the previously untarnished Corbin Knight*

- cost Kristo an extra game

- put some additional guys out for the second game of the season (three of those four are of age)

- put the entire team on notice

- put the entire team in a weekly class

and as a bonus, some more members of the team are waiting for their MIP citations on Monday apparently (and assumably more team discipline).

Those are not measures taken lightly by the University, nor by the State. That's a lot of extra work for a lot of people.

No one forced a drink into the hand of any of those guys. (If they did that's a whole other problem and should be crushed with even more vigor.)

Worse? Just the week before two guys on the team had issues (Senkbeil, Parks). Yet these guys had a party where all this happened. Hakstol had put the guys on notice; heck, he suspended Senkbeil from the team for two weeks, Yet, the message didn't get through to the team.

So I don't blame Brian Faison one bit for apparently going 'Cool Hand Luke' on the team: "What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach. So you get what we had here last week, ... I don't like it any more than you men."

*Why would you tarnish the previously unmatched reputation of that guy? Surely not just to "one up" NDSU. They included Knight in the discipline.That alone says there's a significant problem.

[siouxkid12]

Who speculated? I responded to speculation with a simple "Do you know it has? Do you know it hasn't?" type response.

Let's get this back on point:

Apparently there's an issue large enough, serious enough to:

- suspend all four captains, including the previously untarnished Corbin Knight*

- cost Kristo an extra game

- put some additional guys out for the second game of the season (three of those four are of age)

- put the entire team on notice

- put the entire team in a weekly class

and as a bonus, some more members of the team are waiting for their MIP citations on Monday apparently (and assumably more team discipline).

Those are not measures taken lightly by the University, nor by the State. That's a lot of extra work for a lot of people.

No one forced a drink into the hand of any of those guys. (If they did that's a whole other problem and should be crushed with even more vigor.)

Worse? Just the week before two guys on the team had issues (Senkbeil, Parks). Yet these guys had a party where all this happened. Hakstol had put the guys on notice; heck, he suspended Senkbeil from the team for two weeks, Yet, the message didn't get through to the team.

So I don't blame Brian Faison one bit for apparently going 'Cool Hand Luke' on the team: "What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach. So you get what we had here last week, ... I don't like it any more than you men."

*Why would you tarnish the previously unmatched reputation of that guy? Surely not just to "one up" NDSU. They included Knight in the discipline.That alone says there's a significant problem.

Well said!

[watchmaker49]

Uncommon might have been the wrong choice in words. 20-25 was probably the most we ever went through(early start with a couple bands in front yard at the end of rush week). Normally we would order 12 and have 6 on reserve. We used to clear around $700-$1200 at $3/cup.

That I could see easily. Did you guys buy the kegs from Billy and Ted?

[The Sicatoka]

That I could see easily. Did you guys buy the kegs from Billy and Ted?

Can you move the off-topic stuff to PM? Thanks.

[gfhockey]

billy and ted from the down under?

Crazy Canadiens

[The Sicatoka]

Why is this a big deal?

How soon they forget:

http://www.nytimes.c...&position=&_r=0

But the experience of Fargo, where power hours sent one 21-year-old into a coma and killed another, shows how difficult it can be to change a culture of drinking.

It's not like the days where it was "a couple beers" some of us remember. Today's students on just about every campus in America drink to obliteration and beyond, to the point of passing out. (I have college-aged relatives that tell me about the attitudes and actions and I'm simply taken aback. These people are putting their own lives at risk and think it's acceptable behavior in civil society.)

Given the choice of headlines between "Faison suspends ... " and "Player found dead" I'll pick Faison sending the message. Every. Time.

Melodramatic by me?

Re-read the link.

[siouxkid12]

Why is this a big deal?

How soon they forget:

http://www.nytimes.c...&position=&_r=0

It's not like the days where it was "a couple beers" some of us remember. Today's students on just about every campus in America drink to obliteration and beyond, to the point of passing out. (I have college-aged relatives that tell me about the attitudes and actions and I'm simply taken aback. These people are putting their own lives at risk and think it's acceptable behavior in civil society.)

Given the choice of headlines between "Faison suspends ... " and "Player found dead" I'll pick Faison sending the message. Every. Time.

Melodramatic by me?

Re-read the link.

I am glad you posted that link, it is a great read! Hopefully some people on this board read it and realize that this is something where you don't gain "TRUE" friendship over. You wouldn't let your friends play Russian Roulette, so why would you let them do a "power hour"?

[Dolphinswin]

From what I heard going from dorm room to dorm room, I'm 2 floors from Jordan schmaltz right now, was that one of the freshman was taken out of somewhere (the party) in a weel chair with Alcohol poisoning. Jordan schmaltz called the cops and ran , this is why we were shoed back into our rooms by the RA's , they were searching for schmaltz.

[yababy8]

From what I heard going from dorm room to dorm room, I'm 2 floors from Jordan schmaltz right now, was that one of the freshman was taken out of somewhere (the party) in a weel chair with Alcohol poisoning. Jordan schmaltz called the cops and ran , this is why we were shoed back into our rooms by the RA's , they were searching for schmaltz.

This is a horrible post for several reasons, none of which is greater that the fact that it makes no sense.

But it did make me think of something regarding the speculation revolving around more charges coming in the morning;

Contributing to the deliquency of minors charges pending for 21 year old teammates?

[82SiouxGuy]

This is a horrible post for several reasons, none of which is greater that the fact that it makes no sense.

But it did make me think of something regarding the speculation revolving around more charges coming in the morning;

Contributing to the deliquency of minors charges pending for 21 year old teammates?

This is from the article in the GF Herald over the weekend. It doesn't mention anything about any charges other than the 4 minors, so I doubt that there will be any other charges. If they were going to charge any more players they would have included them in the statement.

The latest suspensions came the same day that a local prosecutor said underage drinking charges would be brought against four players.

David Jones, assistant state’s attorney for Grand Forks County, said he signed “informations,” or complaint sheets, on four UND hockey players under 21, he said, alleging they consumed alcoholic beverages.

The charges won’t be formally entered into the state court system until Monday, he said; therefore, he declined to release their names.

[tnt]

Why is this a big deal?

How soon they forget:

http://www.nytimes.c...&position=&_r=0

It's not like the days where it was "a couple beers" some of us remember. Today's students on just about every campus in America drink to obliteration and beyond, to the point of passing out. (I have college-aged relatives that tell me about the attitudes and actions and I'm simply taken aback. These people are putting their own lives at risk and think it's acceptable behavior in civil society.)

Given the choice of headlines between "Faison suspends ... " and "Player found dead" I'll pick Faison sending the message. Every. Time.

Melodramatic by me?

Re-read the link.

And I saw on the news last night that an 18-year old was killed by a train in Fargo at about 3:00 a.m. and they believe alcohol was involved. We already had an incident like that happen on UND's campus last year. Totally agree, rather be proactive, than have to tell any promising young student's parents that there kid is no longer with us, and by the way this type of activity has been going on for a while, but we passed it off as kids being kids.

[tnt]

I might add that besides the worst case scenario from this, how would the Athletic department explain many of the numerous other stupid, and lawless things that happen when people get too intoxicated. I have no doubt that people brushing this off as normal would be asking for heads to roll if an intoxicated player/players forced themselves onto women. A lot of bad things happen when people have lost control of their ability to think correctly.

[The Sicatoka]

And I saw on the news last night that an 18-year old was killed by a train in Fargo at about 3:00 a.m. and they believe alcohol was involved. We already had an incident like that happen on UND's campus last year. Totally agree, rather be proactive, than have to tell any promising young student's parents that there kid is no longer with us, and by the way this type of activity has been going on for a while, but we passed it off as kids being kids.

Grand Forks/UND student in 2011: http://www.kfyrtv.co....asp?news=56063

Fargo/NDSU student in 2012: http://www.inforum.c...icle/id/375270/

I have no doubt that people brushing this off as normal would be asking for heads to roll if an intoxicated player/players forced themselves onto women.

That's called "the Montana problem". No. Wait. That's called "the Boston University problem". No. Wait. It's both.

[yzerman19]

When I was in undegrad, the power hour was one shot of beer per minute for an hour. Which equates to about 8 beers, which will get you quite drunk, but is about 1/3 of the alcohol content of doing 21 shots of booze.

Alcohol poisoning would have to be diagnosed at the hospital- no dorm occupier can make that diagnosis.

I bet more kids die from texting and driving than from hard partying- should we suspend players for that too?

As I said earlier, individually tragic events happen all the time. You can't control it- in reality, there is very little any of us can control. Establishing rules and controls are just ways for people to try and make themselves feel better.

Back to the booze- the human body has a bunch of mechanisms to prevent alcohol poisoning- throwing up being the most notable, and simply passing out so as not to be able to consume anynmore. Getting to the level where you are actually at risk of system shutdown would seem very difficult to do- especially for novice drinkers.

Bottom line for me is that this too shall pass, and college kids will go on drinking to excess, fornicating, skipping class,etc. That is just what they do.

[The Sicatoka]

I bet more kids die from texting and driving than from hard partying- should we suspend players for that too?

That's illegal also, and an even bigger risk to people around them.

As I said earlier, individually tragic events happen all the time. You can't control it- in reality, there is very little any of us can control. Establishing rules and controls are just ways for people to try and make themselves feel better.

Bottom line for me is that this too shall pass, and college kids will go on drinking to excess, fornicating, skipping class,etc. That is just what they do.

We can set expectations. We can deal with those who fail to meet expectations.

[82SiouxGuy]

When I was in undegrad, the power hour was one shot of beer per minute for an hour. Which equates to about 8 beers, which will get you quite drunk, but is about 1/3 of the alcohol content of doing 21 shots of booze.

Alcohol poisoning would have to be diagnosed at the hospital- no dorm occupier can make that diagnosis.

I bet more kids die from texting and driving than from hard partying- should we suspend players for that too?

As I said earlier, individually tragic events happen all the time. You can't control it- in reality, there is very little any of us can control. Establishing rules and controls are just ways for people to try and make themselves feel better.

Back to the booze- the human body has a bunch of mechanisms to prevent alcohol poisoning- throwing up being the most notable, and simply passing out so as not to be able to consume anynmore. Getting to the level where you are actually at risk of system shutdown would seem very difficult to do- especially for novice drinkers.

Bottom line for me is that this too shall pass, and college kids will go on drinking to excess, fornicating, skipping class,etc. That is just what they do.

They are still kids, I believe that you have stated the same. As kids they still need guidance. They still need to learn. They still make mistakes. They don't know everything, even if they believe that they do. Isn't college supposed to be a place where they learn, where they are guided, where mistakes are corrected? If the answer to that question is yes, then you don't just "let kids be kids". You correct when you can and you help them learn lessons about life. They aren't going to completely stop making mistakes, none of us do. But it's a good thing if they can learn to cut down on the number of mistakes they make and the severity of those mistakes.

[yzerman19]

That's illegal also, and an even bigger risk to people around them.

Agree, but would you suspend a player caught texting and driving?

We can set expectations. We can deal with those who fail to meet expectations.

Who gets to set those expectations??? The moral authority of this board? It is the administration, and UND just had a record enrollment year- that enrollment and the $$ is the driver of all big decisions, and don't kid yourselves, that number is not due to outstanding academic achievement. UND now (wasn't always the case) has a reputation, especially in Metro Minnesota, as a fun party school with tuition reciprocity, with a great hockey team- that you can still get into if your grades and ACT scores don't get you into Madison or Minnesota, sorry to tell it like it is. Remember Matt Greene's great statement to Edmonton?

My posts began by stating that this isn't a big deal and the coaches are dealing with it. I have taken a harder stance due to the responses essentially calling these guys out as needing to get their heads adjusted. Ask yourself this, does UND hockey players getting insanely drunk 3 weeks before the season starts truly cause you concerns?

Flame away, but it is all the truth.