82SiouxGuy Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Maybe those women should talk to the women here. The ones I know would probably say you're minimizing the issue; I certainly think you are. Call it a rape. Call it bullying. The bottom line is that you have one party forcing another party to do something it shouldn't have to do and, ultimately, doesn't want to do. That's the perspective. Saying that something is just this or just that is a hazardous, equivocating and insipid perspective. You could call a gay person some idiotic, homophobic epithet or you could call a black person a similar name and say it's just a word. Why are you allowing that simple word to have such control over you? In the end, it's a simple perspective - truly. It's a wrong and it is not to be tolerated. Capice? No, I don't capice. You are equating the loss of a nickname with the loss of life or physical trauma. UND and the state of North Dakota agreed to a settlement with the NCAA. UND and the state have choices and at least some control. Victims of abuse and rape often have no control. Your comparison is horrible. Don't worry Teeder, I would never bother to ask that question. Quote
Chewey Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 The only party forcing anyone to do something it doesn't want to do is the state Legislature (and by extension the petitioners who forced the ballot question -- which is the people's right and I support the exercise, just not happy with the result), which is forcing the SBOHE, and by extension UND, to retain an athletic nickname. The NCAA isn't even "raping" anyone in this case. They haven't told UND that it has to do anything. For all the NCAA cares, UND can be the Fighting Sioux forever and ever. All they have ever said is that if you want to be in our club, you have to play by our rules, and here are the guidelines. Capice. And just how did we get to here, pray tell? If UND keeps the nickname and logo, monopolistic and low-core aggressive entity uses its monopolistic might and, influence as to other schools who fear similar abuse, against a weaker party that has done NOTHING. Seriously? The NCAA has told UND what will happen if UND doesn't do what the NCAA wants, which is the same damn thing. No, what they've done is say that we'll use our monopolistic influence to effect "social change and we'll define where and what that social change is" and and if you don't want the weight of that monopolistic influence to course against you, do what we say. 1 Quote
Fetch Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 see the wink Biz now go give your Biz to someone who might listen to it - I have been a Sioux Sports Fan most likely before you were born. UND has been good for the community, but it is a nicer place in the summer when most of you are gone Quote
watchmaker49 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 And just how did we get to here, pray tell? If UND keeps the nickname and logo, monopolistic and low-core aggressive entity uses its monopolistic might and, influence as to other schools who fear similar abuse, against a weaker party that has done NOTHING. Seriously? The NCAA has told UND what will happen if UND doesn't do what the NCAA wants, which is the same damn thing. No, what they've done is say that we'll use our monopolistic influence to effect "social change and we'll define where and what that social change is" and and if you don't want the weight of that monopolistic influence to course against you, do what we say. Anger issues? Quote
UNDBIZ Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 And just how did we get to here, pray tell? If UND keeps the nickname and logo, monopolistic and low-core aggressive entity uses its monopolistic might and, influence as to other schools who fear similar abuse, against a weaker party that has done NOTHING. Seriously? The NCAA has told UND what will happen if UND doesn't do what the NCAA wants, which is the same damn thing. No, what they've done is say that we'll use our monopolistic influence to effect "social change and we'll define where and what that social change is" and and if you don't want the weight of that monopolistic influence to course against you, do what we say. And you're attempting to compare that to rape.... Quote
ScottM Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Comparing the Sioux moniker issue to "rape" is as stupid as comparing it to a "hate crime". Jesus, somebody trot out the Holocaust and we can finally reach the gutter. Quote
UNDBIZ Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 see the wink Biz now go give your Biz to someone who might listen to it - I have been a Sioux Sports Fan most likely before you were born. UND has been good for the community, but it is a nicer place in the summer when most of you are gone All I noticed in my summers in Grand Forks (both growing up and while in college) was the town emptied out and the waitresses got a lot uglier.... 1 Quote
82SiouxGuy Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Comparing the Sioux moniker issue to "rape" is as stupid as comparing it to a "hate crime". Jesus, somebody trot out the Holocaust and we can finally reach the gutter. DaveK keeps calling the NCAA Nazis, so we are probably there already. Quote
Fetch Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Using a word or phrase out of context is the lowest way to debate or discredit someone - that is your sides problem in communicating to the rest of the State. But hey keep up the good work Now here is my new theme song for the June ballot - How to remember how to vote (in the chorus) - it's a great old song may make you want to get up & dance No no no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no Nobody can do The shing-a-ling Like I do No no no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no Nobody can do the skate Like I do No no no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no Nobody can do The boogaloo Like I do No no no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no Nobody can do the philly Like I do Well don't you know I'm gonna skate I'm doin', ain't nobody doin' But me baby Nobody but me Yes i gonna philly, I'm doin' Ain't nobody doin' But me baby Nobody but me Well let me tell you nobody Nobody but me Well let me tell you Nobody, nobody, nobody, etc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mEMfxFEaXw Quote
UNDBIZ Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Using a word or phrase out of context is the lowest way to debate or discredit someone - that is your sides problem in communicating to the rest of the State. But hey keep up the good work Being a fan means advocating for your institution and not tolerating the intolerable or acquiescing to it. What is happening is completely analogous to a rape - not entirely figuratively speaking either. The difference is just bending over for it vs. fighting for your life against it, screaming and drawing some passers-by out of their lulled sensibilities to assist. My affiliation with our local women's and animal shelters, in part, informs my position on this. You don't stand for abuse - ever. So he wasn't comparing the loss of a nickname to rape?? Quote
Teeder11 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 And just how did we get to here, pray tell? If UND keeps the nickname and logo, monopolistic and low-core aggressive entity uses its monopolistic might and, influence as to other schools who fear similar abuse, against a weaker party that has done NOTHING. Seriously? The NCAA has told UND what will happen if UND doesn't do what the NCAA wants, which is the same damn thing. No, what they've done is say that we'll use our monopolistic influence to effect "social change and we'll define where and what that social change is" and and if you don't want the weight of that monopolistic influence to course against you, do what we say. The major fallacy with your analogy, and bear with me, board, as I'm going to prolong this rediculous "rape" theme, is that, per the settlement agreement with the NCAA, the act is not rape against UND, but rather it is consensual. UND is not a victim of the NCAA; the University is actually complicent per the settlement, or "surrender" agreement, if you will. It's other forces, external to UND and the SBOHE, that are forcing themselves on the decision-making power of UND to do what it feels is best for the University and its stakeholders. 2 Quote
petey23 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Spirit Lake can use the Sioux name because they are Sioux. But UND isn't giving the rights to the Fighting Sioux nickname or logo to anyone. And it wouldn't be giving them back to Spirit Lake because Spirit Lake never gave them to UND. UND adopted the name because it was available and they filed for the trademark. But UND isn't giving it to Spirit Lake because that would defeat the purpose of giving up the name. At some time in the future it may make sense to turn over the rights, but not for several years until a new name has a chance to be established. Otherwise people would totally ignore the new name and use the old name, buying goods with the old name and logo. Some of that is gonna happen anyway. Quote
Fetch Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 HOW TO VOTE FOR SHOWING THE NCAA THEY ARE WRONG & SHOULD GET OUT OF NORTH DAKOTA"S BUSINESS No no no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no no no no No no no no no & if you want to learn the dance steps http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUg3Emz7hpI&feature=related 1 Quote
UNDBIZ Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 HOW TO VOTE FOR SHOWING THE NCAA THEY ARE WRONG & SHOULD GET OUT OF NORTH DAKOTA"S BUSINESS You don't seem to understand that the NC$$ doesn't care. The NC$$ will be just fine when UND athletics is suffering under sanctions. Quote
82SiouxGuy Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Some of that is gonna happen anyway. Yes, it is. But they have to try to minimize it as much as possible. Quote
82SiouxGuy Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 You don't seem to understand that the NC$$ doesn't care. The NC$$ will be just fine when UND athletics is suffering under sanctions. He doesn't care about UND. He only cares about being able to keep the nickname. 1 Quote
watchmaker49 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Cognitive issues? I have good cognitive skills there Steve E. Quote
watchmaker49 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 I did not know I was in the peanut gallery until now. Give it up already. You don't know who I am. Whomever this small town lawyer is, he must have gotten one over on you at some point which, quite obviously, is probably not that hard to do. If I need legal advice the first person I call is Pat Morley. I'm sure you have heard of him in that small town of yours Steve. Quote
82SiouxGuy Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 The major fallacy with your analogy, and bear with me, board, as I'm going to prolong this rediculous "rape" theme, is that, per the settlement agreement with the NCAA, the act is not rape against UND, but rather it is consensual. UND is not a victim of the NCAA; the University is actually complicent per the settlement, or "surrender" agreement, if you will. It's other forces, external to UND and the SBOHE, that are forcing themselves on the decision-making power of UND to do what it feels is best for the University and its stakeholders. And don't forget that UND has multiple options if they want to keep the nickname. They could just accept the sanctions and become a cold Alcorn State. They could leave the NCAA and move to the NAIA. UND would probably be one of the big dogs nationally in the NAIA. Or UND could just refuse to partake in NCAA post-season play. There are entire conferences that choose to not participate in the NCAA football playoffs. Of course no one at UND wants to take one of these options, so retiring the nickname is a better option. 3 Quote
Fetch Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 I love Sioux Gear & have always enjoyed seeing what other fans have & wear - especially at the many final fives & 1 Frozen 4 I have been to & I have lived & worked all over the State. There has always been LOTS of Sioux Gear But now there is SIOUX Gear extrodinaire None of us will live long enough to see it end I'm willing to bet most of those Folks are willing to vote to keep their gear, The Proud Name, of the teams they Love Quote
UNDBIZ Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 I love Sioux Gear & have always enjoyed seeing what other fans have & wear - especially at the many final fives & 1 Frozen 4 I have been to & I have lived & worked all over the State. There has always been LOTS of Sioux Gear But now there is SIOUX Gear extrodinaire None of us will live long enough to see it end I'm willing to bet most of those Folks are willing to vote to keep their gear the Proud Name of the teams they Love Ah yes, because if the nickname is removed then Pres. Kelley is going to come to your house and take your sioux gear away Quote
Chewey Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 I have good cognitive skills there Steve E. That's a matter of serious doubt. Quote
Chewey Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 If I need legal advice the first person I call is Pat Morley. I'm sure you have heard of him in that small town of yours Steve. Sure. I hope you have someone at least as skilled for your other, more obvious, failings. Quote
watchmaker49 Posted April 6, 2012 Posted April 6, 2012 Sure. I hope you have someone at least as skilled for your other, more obvious, failings. My failings there Steve? What are my failings oh wise one? Quote
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