BarnWinterSportsEngelstad

This 2000 article sheds some light on initial ownership. ENGELSTAD ARENA: Cost to top $80 million Architect working with want list, not budget By Michael Benedict Herald Staff Writer The new Engelstad Arena is expected to cost in excess of $80 million. The price tag for the arena was estimated at $65 million to $70 million in September, and the estimate before construction started was about $50 million. Interviewed Monday, a principle with the architectural firm that designed the arena said Ralph Engelstad never mandated a $50 million budget for the arena. When Engelstad, a UND alumnus and casino owner, announced a donation of $100 million to UND in December 1998, he said then that half of the money -- $40 million to $50 million -- would fund the new arena. Engelstad and UND didn't know then where they would spend the remainder. The casino owner declined to talk to the Herald for this article, but through a spokeswoman, he did confirm the arena will cost "$80-million plus." "All I know is we're trying to build what Ralph wants," said James Kobetsky, the principle with the building's design firm, Schoen Associates. "We didn't really have a budget. (He) was telling us what to design." At the end of 1998, Engelstad also didn't know what such a facility would cost, said Earl Strinden, emeritus chief executive officer of the UND Alumni Association and Foundation. Strinden said Engelstad came up with the $40 million to $50 million total based on other university arenas he toured before his donation announcement. Strinden said the new Engelstad with its 11,400 seats won't be the largest university arena in the country. "It will be a facility that will be the finest in the world," Strinden said. "It will be a diamond." He said UND President Charles Kupchella and Engelstad continue to discuss the remainder of the $100-million gift. Among highlights that weren't included in initial thoughts, a building connected to the arena that will contain an indoor, Olympic-size ice sheet for practice and other community needs. The extra building cost several million dollars, Strinden said. "Ralph and UND wanted to get everything in they wanted," said Kobetsky, adding material costs are lower here than in other areas of the country. "At this point, we're getting very good value for the money. Another highlight is a 3-foot-high, 900-foot-long video screen that wraps the arena for instant replays, scores and "more excitement." Called dasher boards, the boards that will surround the main building's NHL-size rink also are spring-loaded. The boards flex four inches on impact, which will lead to fewer hockey injuries. In large construction projects, there are always add-ons, but, with 95 percent of the building's contract bids now final, Kobetsky said he doesn't anticipate costs will continue to increase. "These are the kind of things (Engelstad) spent more money on," Kobetski said. "He knows exactly what he wants in the facility to make it more successful." Through his Arena Construction Inc. and Ralph Engelstad Arena Inc., Engelstad technically owns and operates the new arena, but he does plan to give it to the university soon after it's completed, said Strinden. For charitable tax reasons -- to prove the property valuable -- Engelstad's lease agreement with UND, however, state's he can own the facility until Sept. 30, 2030. "His full intentions are that it will be turned over to the university in the very near future," Strinden said. "I do know in my visit with him, he will turn it over." Any profit the facility makes in his ownership, Engelstad plans to donate to UND athletics. Grand Forks Herald, October 17, 2000 http://und-fraud.com/UND/Campus/Arena/engelstad_arena.htm What went wrong or maybe right since the beginning ??????? The lease continues. Ralph Engelstad never gave the building (shortly after completion) to UND. It now won't happen till September 30th, 2030, why? The ND State Legislature was not eager with the responsibility of possible paying for potential operating financial shortfalls of the Diamond. Imagine that? This concern eventually brought Ms. Kris McGarry into our lives? Issues? Would the hockey program and building still be top tier if UND owned the building shortly after it's completion, and would UND be diverting funds elsewhere? Would The Betty have ever been built? Or, maybe the state legislature should of should said thank you for The Ralph? The whole initial $100 million that Ralph donated to UND went into the arena plus $4M. The building was paid for before the first puck was dropped, amazing!

"The usage agreement differs from the 30-year lease agreement between the university and the Ralph" from the last GF Herald article posted. So we have 4 entities (3 non profits & 1 LLC) that is in short known as "The Ralph" all on top of UND land. We have a 30 year "Lease Agreement" that ends in September of 2030, which at such time, the improvements become part of the land. There is a "Usage Agreement" with UND Athletic Department that is presently being worked on and has been adjusted in the past. Apparently a majority of the board of directors need not get involved to renegotiate this agreement. Be interesting what really is disclosed to the public in this next week. If all the money stays within The Ralph and the U (like board of director Strinden claims), what does it matter what %(52/48) is used up front at ticket collection time? Because, funds get shifted in other various ways (rent, adv, services, police, & etc.) between the two which also could get adjusted. Where do the proceeds from concessions, parking, & etc. come in, do any of these $ get forwarded to the AD in some way, or does The Ralph have a piggy bank? Any potential season ending overage $ given to the AD? What changes in 3 years when The Betty bond is paid off? How much more are MH tickets today than they were in 2001 for the first season in The Ralph?

Or actually lower. You can move the $ of the cost of a program pretty easy. The ? that should be asked is how much do we save each year by not having WH? That is after all hangover expenses have been taken care of?

We each had a 12 game winning streak, but the one in the 80's cost me a case of beer each year.

Turn the 5x5 overtime from 5 minutes into 10 minutes.

The tutors sssss won't make it such a distance.

The fans and Bison players didn't know what hit them, absolute shock! I was there also, our defense really controlled the game. What a ride back to GF.

How about something a little more positive. That game in Fargo in 1971 in the rain was an upset of a #1 ranking team. Can't wait for the yellow rusty Dogde the bullet pickup trucks to show up in the Hawk's Nest parking lot! 2020? No. Date Location Winner Score 1 1894 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 24–6 2 1894 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 20–4 3 1895 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 42–0 4 1895 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 12–4 5 1896 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 58–12 6 1897 Fargo, ND North Dakota 39–0 7 1897 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 20–0 8 1898 Fargo, ND North Dakota 39–6 9 1899 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 46–0 10 1900 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 16–0 11 1901 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 17–11 12 1902 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 47–0 13 1904 Fargo, ND North Dakota 22–0 14 1904 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 17–0 15 1905 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 23–5 16 1905 Fargo, ND Tie 11–11 17 1906 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 32–4 18 1910 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 18–0 19 1912 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 3–0 20 1913 Fargo, ND North Dakota 20–14 21 1914 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 7–6 22 1915 Fargo, ND North Dakota 20–0 23 1916 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 10–0 24 1917 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 20–6 25 1919 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 7–6 26 1920 Fargo, ND North Dakota 14–7 27 1921 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 38–3 28 1922 Fargo, ND North Dakota 7–0 29 1923 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 10–3 30 1924 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 20–7 31 1925 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 19–10 32 1926 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 7–6 33 1927 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 13–0 34 1928 Fargo, ND North Dakota 18–0 35 1929 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 14–0 36 1930 Fargo, ND North Dakota 14–7 37 1931 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 20–12 38 1932 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 7–6 39 1933 Grand Forks, ND Tie 7–7 40 1934 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 7–0 41 1935 Grand Forks, ND Tie 20–20 42 1936 Fargo, ND North Dakota 14–0 43 1937 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 27–0 44 1938 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 17–13 45 1939 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 18–0 46 1940 Fargo, ND North Dakota 24–0 47 1941 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 20–6 48 1942 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 26–14 49 1945 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 20–12 50 1945 Fargo, ND North Dakota Agricultural 26–7 51 1946 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 31–0 52 1947 Fargo, ND North Dakota 25–20 53 1948 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 19–7 54 1949 Fargo, ND North Dakota 13–6 55 1950 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 33–0 56 1951 Fargo, ND North Dakota 33–14 No. Date Location Winner Score 57 1952 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota Agricultural 14–13 58 1953 Fargo, ND North Dakota 26–6 59 1954 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 40–7 60 1955 Fargo, ND North Dakota 21–0 61 1956 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 14–7 62 1957 Fargo, ND North Dakota 9–0 63 1958 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 36–0 64 1959 Fargo, ND North Dakota 20–15 65 1960 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 16–7 66 1961 Fargo, ND North Dakota 26–6 67 1962 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 30–7 68 1963 Fargo, ND North Dakota 21–7 69 1964 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 20–13 70 1965 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 6–3 71 1966 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 18–15 72 1967 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 34–10 73 1968 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 14–8 74 1969 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 64–14 75 1970 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 20–3 76 1971 Fargo, ND North Dakota 23–7 77 1972 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 22–17 78 1973 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 21–14 79 1974 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 31–20 80 1975 Fargo, ND North Dakota 34–17 81 1976 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 22–15 82 1977 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 45–20 83 1978 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 24–21 84 1979 Fargo, ND North Dakota 14–7 85 1980 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 38–20 86 1981 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 31–7 87 1982 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 10–3 88 1983 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 23–6 89 1984 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 14–3 90 1985 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 49–0 91 1986 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 62–13 92 1987 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 42–10 93 1988 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 34–27 94 1989 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 21–0 95 1990 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 42–14 96 1991 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 35–28 97 1992 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 20–19 98 1993 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 22–21 99 1994 Fargo, ND North Dakota 34–13 100 1994 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 17–7 101 1995 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 21–7 102 1995 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 41–10 103 1996 Fargo, ND North Dakota 33–19 104 1997 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota State 31–10 105 1998 Fargo, ND North Dakota 39–25 106 1999 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 13–10 107 2000 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 16–13 108 2001 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 19–7 109 2002 Fargo, ND North Dakota 12–6 110 2003 Grand Forks, ND North Dakota 28–21 111 2015 Fargo, ND North Dakota State 34–9 Series: North Dakota leads 62–46–3

Didn't notice UND in any of the top 25 polls this year, nor even mentioned as receiving some attention. But, I'd say this season we're the best of the teams that were 3-8 last year, and have a shot at being in top 25 after homecoming!

This has been bothering me while reading the posts here since the transfer announcement. I've meet Geno several times, seems like a large challenge here?

That WAS a pounder!

I don't either, added another view to this board.

Yes , sorry for the confusion, I meant lot NE of The Ralph.

Had a grinder at U Red Pepper yesterday, it's the bread. Definitely not as good as the Hugo's bread. Do I sound like a Sioux Forever fan?

U might B on2 something there?

You're wasting all that talent, remember - you need to shop at bisonville

For the Hawk ice program, I'll take a few blue chips. For the HPC II, I'll take a couple lottery tickets.

This is a good move for the program. As some kind of an affiliate of the Big Sky for two more seasons, let's remind them we are capable of winning the Big Sky again, even if we agreed to not take home the trophy.

UND is paving a parking lot that was gravel, used by Med School and then also for parking for hockey games.

This thread dam near came to a screeching halt over the long Memorial Day Weekend, but some of the tough guys came back on line and even SD is helping again. These next 10 days could explode this thread into a 100 pages by the next 10 days, hopefully it's about good news and then we start a process of unifying our fan base! Could there also be HPC phase II news in the coming days?

Agree, The Ralph needs to set the standard.

And then again, he will find out the hard way, that he doesn't run The Ralph.

The corn meal really changes the taste.

Here's what U do. Log onto Bisonville.com and go to Smack Talk, then The Official $hit On UND No Matter How They Do Thread. Let them know everything you know about Hockey and FB. You'll be consumed past the finish of the next hockey season.

Slowly creeping up, we need ag economy to rebound.