Sioux @ SCSU

[Siouxmama]

Here you go.

VIRG FOSS COLUMN: Flood of comments on officiating

http://www.grandforksherald.com/articles/i...;section=Sports

Thanks for the link, PCM.

[dagies]

Here you go.

VIRG FOSS COLUMN: Flood of comments on officiating

http://www.grandforksherald.com/articles/i...;section=Sports

Thanks for the link, PCM. This stuck out for me:

[petey23]

Thanks for the link, PCM. This stuck out for me:

[fargosioux]

First off, I loved the article by Virg Foss. It is right on. McLeod needs to go as even he doesn't have a clue on accountability.

Second, this dynasty thing doesn't phase me. Here's a few reasons why:

1. They are BUILDING a dynasty. That doesn't mean they have it.

2. For the first time in a long time SCSU homers (including their commentators) actually have a team worth getting excited about following.

3. For the first time since last year SCSU has had a coach who can indeed outcoach a coach in the WCHA. Dahl couldn't outcoach Goldie GOpher (forget about Lucia or Hakstol or anyone else).

Let them be excited. They finally have a coach who doesn't suck.

I think their fans have serious reason to be excited about the future too. They've got commitments from Aaron Marvin & Jordy Christian. It also looks like they have 2 of the top 3 scorers on the Salmon Arm team locked up. Plus one of the top scorers in the USHL right now.

I thought Salmon Arm was one our farm teams!

[Goon]

Is there a link to this article. Because of the snow, I haven't had a GFH delivered since Wednesday.

They aren't by any chance charging you for that are you?

[kfah1]

How was the quality of the web-cast and is it worth the 6 or 7 bucks? I would really like to be able to watch the game tonight....

With help from Sprig, I was finally able to get the feed (B2 wasn't much help). Video looked good from my end (when it didn't freeze up... which was occasional). Audio on the game was good (except when the commercials came on, I had to turn down my speakers). Then, you'd just have to put up with the announcers (wouldn't expect anything less from St Cloud announcers though). Did lose the feed for awhile.

All in all, these were minor problems to be able to watch the Sioux. I'd paid the $6.00 again to watch tonight.

For what my two cents was worth...

[Siouxman]

Game observations from Friday night:

1) overall the Sioux looked good, all lines. Vandevelde had probably his best game of the year. If that is an indication, things will be good.

2) Lammy played well, but the SCSU 2nd and 3rd goals should not have been. Their second was an unscreened slap shot from between the point and the faceoff circle right at the five hole. Any WCHA goalie should have stopped that one. One their third goal he just couldn't control the puck.

3) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

4) The DOT line was snake bitten. One very clear pipe and they missed a couple of open nets. Toews seemed to have problems keeping the puck on his stick while trying make some moves. You get so used to seeing him do it, that you are surprised when it doesn't go as planned. TJ was his usual self all over the ice, and Duncan was a pest. The DOT line could have easily had 4-5 goals or more with just a couple of bounces.

4) Kaip took an absolutely stupid penalty in the first.

5) Sioux defense got caught a couple of times coming in two deep, which created odd man rushes, but Sioux did pretty well covering up and Lammy took care of the rest.

6) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

7) Husky fans got upset when Sioux fans did sieve chant on Goepfort.

8) Porter played an outstanding game, even drawing a penalty with his hustle when the Sioux were shorthanded.

9) Lee seems to have figured out some of the things he hasn't been doing that need to be done. He made his presence felt last night and looked pretty good.

10) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

11) The Sioux could have/should have won the game. They are playing well as the playoffs start next week. They could win the Final Five and it wouldn't be a surprise.

Let's hope the Sioux win tonight and Denver loses or ties. 3rd place would be great heading into next week.

[HEXTALL]

I guess having back-to-back winning seasons constitutes a dynasty at the Clown College

yes that is about it!!!!!!man they are desperate

[HEXTALL]

When he used the word dynasty perhaps he was speaking of the DQ Cup.

ya theres a real trophy to build a dynasty with???

[Trunk Monkey]

With help from Sprig, I was finally able to get the feed (B2 wasn't much help). Video looked good from my end (when it didn't freeze up... which was occasional). Audio on the game was good (except when the commercials came on, I had to turn down my speakers). Then, you'd just have to put up with the announcers (wouldn't expect anything less from St Cloud announcers though). Did lose the feed for awhile.

All in all, these were minor problems to be able to watch the Sioux. I'd paid the $6.00 again to watch tonight.

For what my two cents was worth...

Thanks for the info!

[cujo2]

Thanks for the link, PCM. This stuck out for me:

[Huskie]

yes that is about it!!!!!!man they are desperate

I shouldn't have to point out they said "BUILDING" a dynasty. Sounds like you are getting desperate for put downs. You might as well go back to the very innovative JBSU, no NCAA wins, etc. etc.. They hurt us so bad.

[luv_state]

Game observations from Friday night:

1) overall the Sioux looked good, all lines. Vandevelde had probably his best game of the year. If that is an indication, things will be good.

2) Lammy played well, but the SCSU 2nd and 3rd goals should not have been. Their second was an unscreened slap shot from between the point and the faceoff circle right at the five hole. Any WCHA goalie should have stopped that one. One their third goal he just couldn't control the puck.

3) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

4) The DOT line was snake bitten. One very clear pipe and they missed a couple of open nets. Toews seemed to have problems keeping the puck on his stick while trying make some moves. You get so used to seeing him do it, that you are surprised when it doesn't go as planned. TJ was his usual self all over the ice, and Duncan was a pest. The DOT line could have easily had 4-5 goals or more with just a couple of bounces.

4) Kaip took an absolutely stupid penalty in the first.

5) Sioux defense got caught a couple of times coming in two deep, which created odd man rushes, but Sioux did pretty well covering up and Lammy took care of the rest.

6) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

7) Husky fans got upset when Sioux fans did sieve chant on Goepfort.

8) Porter played an outstanding game, even drawing a penalty with his hustle when the Sioux were shorthanded.

9) Lee seems to have figured out some of the things he hasn't been doing that need to be done. He made his presence felt last night and looked pretty good.

10) JBSU can't do a cheer without the word "suck" in it.

11) The Sioux could have/should have won the game. They are playing well as the playoffs start next week. They could win the Final Five and it wouldn't be a surprise.

Let's hope the Sioux win tonight and Denver loses or ties. 3rd place would be great heading into next week.

I couldn't agree more. The cheers (or lack there of) by our student body are just lame. I get so tired of having "you suck" in every chant. Though it may be true, but it is stupid as heck. I really think they should take a class in creative cheers and chants 101. I admire the spirit and volume of the Dog Pound. But their uncreative chants are a little embarrassing to us. Go State!

[Siouxdonyms]

What you have just said is one of the most insanely intelligent posts, everyone is now smarter for reading it.

One thing I have never understood about this site is the constant barrage on the officials. It seems to me that UND fans think that no penalties should be called on the UND players & if a penalty is called it is a "blown call" or a "BS call" or something to that effect. On the inverse the oppostition should be called for every single time they touch UND player. I just don't get it.

That's probably a fair assessment for some fans on the board, but not all. I'm sure you didn't mean it in regards to all Sioux fans though, but just trying to make a point. There are a lot of complaints on officials on this site. Some of them are made through green glasses, while others have an argument. Overall, I don't think the refs do that bad of a job. Some are worse than others, but for the most part, it's done pretty well. I guess I look back to a Mike Prpich interview earlier in the year that he had with Sweeney. Prp said that the refs in the league do a good job for everything they have to put up with, along with everything else going on the ice. That coming from a guy who continually agitated opponents, and saw his fair share of time in the box, who am I to argue with him?

[Goon]

One thing I have never understood about this site is the constant barrage on the officials. It seems to me that UND fans think that no penalties should be called on the UND players & if a penalty is called it is a "blown call" or a "BS call" or something to that effect. On the inverse the oppostition should be called for every single time they touch UND player. I just don't get it.

I'll bite on this one. The refing has sucked this season, there is no way around it. Even Gopher fans have been complaining about it. Its called consistancey, whats called in one game isn't called in another game. I watched the MTU and UMN game last night and it was amazing that Hunt was calling things he let slide when he was up here reffing in Grand Forks. You can say that there is a conspiracey mentality in Grand Forks but your team is benifitting from getting the majority of the calls to go your way, please don't tell us other wise. Finally last weekend UND got some offical luck, the funny thing is the DU fans and media was saying the same damn thing, that UND fans have been saying all season long.

[redwing77]

What you have just said is one of the most insanely intelligent posts, everyone is now smarter for reading it.

One thing I have never understood about this site is the constant barrage on the officials. It seems to me that UND fans think that no penalties should be called on the UND players & if a penalty is called it is a "blown call" or a "BS call" or something to that effect. On the inverse the oppostition should be called for every single time they touch UND player. I just don't get it.

Surely there are some, but as one person who is as vehemently anti-official as I am, I must chime in.

First off, I've seen quite a fair share of poorly officiated games. Interestingly enough, though, the worst officiated game I've ever witnessed (on TV) was not a UND game at all. It was now about 4 years back IIRC, Derek Shepherd was the official. It was Minnesota vs. MSUM. Calls all over the place that were flat out WRONG and not calling the most obvious penalties in the book.

The UND-MN tilt this weekend had some disparaging stats (the PP totals for each team being such a discrepency is certainly one of them) but we won anyways. That being said, what bothers me isn't so much the calls that are called against UND is that seemingly the same thing that would get UND sent to the box isn't getting called on the other team when they commit the penalty. If UND commits a penalty, call it. Fine. I don't have to like the fact UND committed a penalty but that's hardly the official's fault. However, arbitrarily allowing penalties to go uncalled due to various situations or just not calling a penalty arbitrarily for whatever reason at all just doesn't cut it.

And the worst thing about it at all is that the WCHA administration (McLeod and Shepherd) can't seem to get it into their heads that their officials lack accountability for bad performances. They dont' even think that they have bad games!

To me, the problems with WCHA officiating isn't just bad officials. For me, it's hard to distinguish whether the official is that bad or is he just calling what the front office tells them to pay attention for. To me, its poor administration. If competant leadership were in place, the officials would know that they'd best not screw it up because that is grounds for losing pay and, worse yet, termination from the ranks of WCHA officiating.

This also means getting their heads out of the sand and admitting that their perception of the officials might not be entirely accurate. Every official, even Adam, has a good point to them, but ignoring their faults is hardly the way to state that the quality of officiating is at an all time high.

Fix the administration, then fix the staff. I remember when Campion used to call games very VERY well and suddenly he went south? Even before his wife's condition went the way it did, it was showing signs of poorness. Why? He didn't start out bad. Does the administration even know or care about this?

The only solution to this problem is an extreme one thanks to the complete disregard for trust when it comes to the system. The answer is to dismiss McLeod and Shepherd and put someone in into each position who can try to right the ship. The WCHA is a good DI hockey conference that is only being held back from sheer greatness by the administration and the officiating crew. Lou Lamoriello took a mediocre hockey conference and made it great. That's what a good administrator does. WCHA desperately needs someone like Lou.

[Goon]

Surely there are some, but as one person who is as vehemently anti-official as I am, I must chime in.

First off, I've seen quite a fair share of poorly officiated games. Interestingly enough, though, the worst officiated game I've ever witnessed (on TV) was not a UND game at all. It was now about 4 years back IIRC, Derek Shepherd was the official. It was Minnesota vs. MSUM. Calls all over the place that were flat out WRONG and not calling the most obvious penalties in the book.

The UND-MN tilt this weekend had some disparaging stats (the PP totals for each team being such a discrepency is certainly one of them) but we won anyways. That being said, what bothers me isn't so much the calls that are called against UND is that seemingly the same thing that would get UND sent to the box isn't getting called on the other team when they commit the penalty. If UND commits a penalty, call it. Fine. I don't have to like the fact UND committed a penalty but that's hardly the official's fault. However, arbitrarily allowing penalties to go uncalled due to various situations or just not calling a penalty arbitrarily for whatever reason at all just doesn't cut it.

That was a piece of art. Couldn't agree more. So what if they call us Halo's.

Just to add to that piece I find it funny that the same officals two weeks ago wouldn't call a penalty for hookings, holding and obstructions call the same things penalties two weeks later when the Gophers are playing Tech. Funny?

[The Whistler]

[Dean]

That was a piece of art. Couldn't agree more. So what if they call us Halo's.

Just to add to that piece I find it funny that the same officals two weeks ago wouldn't call a penalty for hookings, holding and obstructions call the same things penalties two weeks later when the Gophers are playing Tech. Funny?

You seem to bring up the 'halo' issue quite often. Must be striking some kind of nerve.

[Goon]

You seem to bring up the 'halo' issue quite often. Must be striking some kind of nerve.

My Halo is held up by two horns.

[The Whistler]

Another troubling thing is that the longer a person is a WCHA official the worse they get.

[PCM]

All I have to say is that anyone who watched Don Adam ref the DU-CC game last night would understand that there are problems within the league. There's no way he should still be officiating. It makes you wonder exactly an official would have to do to be booted out of his job.

So my complaint that started this tangent had nothing to do with the officiating at a UND game.

[Smoggy]

SCSU has looooong postgame radio show. TH was giving them grief about it last night. Anyways, they said that SCSU hadn't beaten a team in faceoffs in a long time and beat us by almost 10.

I actually thought we were doing better at winning them last night.

VV looked excellent and seemed to double shift once in the 3rd. Also played on the 4 on 4.

Lammy was struggling to control the puck in the second.

[dagies]

Did we deserve most of those calls? Yes.

But taking your point a couple dives by Minnesota, a Minnesota player that tripped over the puck means three less calls on us. A few holding calls uncalled by Minnesota means two or three on them.

That lowers the ratio from over 2-1 to 3 to 2 for the weekend. The bigger issue was why did all of the breaks go Minnesota's way? The Sioux fell down untouched once or twice without a Minnesota player being called for it.

A properly called weekend would still have given the Gophers an advantage IMO, but that doesn't take away the fact that we had very poor officiating for the weekend.

McCloud seems particularly clueless in his little email there. It sounds like he thinks that since we won we must have no reason to complain. I would rather complain when the call didn't affect the outcome of the game because I think it looks less like sour grapes.

Redwing makes some good points. My personal theory is that the officials are given different instructions by Greg Sheppard on a weekly basis. They're told to call them a certain way until someone like Donna Lucia calls up the office to complain. The reason why we are seeing inconsistency in the on-ice officiating is because they don't get consistent policies from the head office.

I agree with much of what you say but the final conclusion. McLeod says the message he's receiving is that UND fans think that UND was called for too many ticky tacky penalties. The real issue is that the game wasn't called consistently for both teams. Many Sioux fans complain that opponents are allowed to ride our skilled players, and then complain when the Sioux are called for penalties that they want called against the opponent.

Rather than complain to McLeod about the Sioux getting called for ticky tacky calls, complain that MN wasn't called for the same things, and that MN dives weren't recognized by the refs.

Send the right message, because McLeod obviously missed it.