Sioux/Winona State

[mksioux]

I feel we have just passed the "Golden Age of Sioux Sports"

This is the rub. I just fundamentally disagree with you here. UND has been holding itself back for twenty five years because we have this "we're too small to compete" attitude that makes me sick. I needed to move away from Grand Forks and this attitude just to realize the potential the university has.

Does UND and Grand Forks have serious challenges ahead? You bet, but being complacent and falling behind as the rest of the world passes you by is NOT the way to meet those challenges. I say this with all due respect to your past support, but UND doesn't need your defeatist attitude.

[redwing77]

So I wonder. Is this the end of warrior_08 for the rest of the season? Or will he come back to predict we'll lose next week and the week after?

[HockeyMom]

So I wonder. Is this the end of warrior_08 for the rest of the season? Or will he come back to predict we'll lose next week and the week after?

What is the normal banishment? 2 weeks. I suspect he will be back and then we can just remind him that no matter how much he thinks UND sucks, Winona State sucks 42 points more.......or 89 points more if you want to count that.

Oh wait, no sports count except basketball.

[Cratter]

I just do not see Grand Forks and surrounding area ever consistantly supporting 15-18-20 thousand for a football game no matter who the opposition, or classification level we play in...sorry

Where do you get this stuff from? No one ever said UND was going to draw that many.

We know you hate it that UND is moving to DIAA. Sorry to inform you that not much is going to change with the football team moving to IAA. The main difference is we'll be playing teams more like ourselves. I guess that is bad in your eyes.

I guess supporting UND for many years (like thounsands of others) you seem to feel entitled to something.

[mksioux]

We are, what we are...

As late as 2004, we were competing with -- and getting the better of -- NDSU. Did Fargo's population superiority hold us back then? Now two years later, "we are what we are" and we need just accept the fact that NDSU has soared past us and left us in the dust?

My opinion our "Titles" will be very Few and Far, Far in between.

A national title is only as prestigious as the division in which it is won. We could move to NAIA and win a national title nearly every year, yet nobody would consider that an upgrade of the program.

The bottom line is that UND will be nationally competitive in DI-AA football immediately. For the other sports, the goal will be "league title" and not "national title". In basketball, a league title and a trip to the dance would create more buzz on campus, in the community, and amongst the alumni than a DII national championship ever could.

[star2city]

Like most others on this board, I was quite embarrassed by the lack of fans at the game yesterday. But while there's no question that playing a team UND had previously beaten badly played a role in the sparse crowd, it definitely wasn't the only reason. For reasons I don't think I'll ever completely understand, there's just something about early round playoff games that make several thousand people who were at a typical regular season game decide not to go. Even when UND played Pitt State in the first round in 2003, there was only a little over 7000 in attendance. Put Pitt State on the schedule in September, and there will be 11,000-plus there. What's the difference? I know, there's hunting, but I'm not sure that comes close to explaining the huge dropoff. In terms of people who actually live close enough to attend if they so choose, I guess there are about 5000 real fans, and 5000 to 6000 fans who evidently don't feel that it's important to support their team in what will almost certainly be the last home game of the year. It's pretty sad.

Considering the circumstances, a record low in attendance should not have been a surprise - even ML baseball has trouble drawing crowds in the divisional playoffs. Early round playoff games, especially this one, are not big draws at the DII level for a number of reasons:

- 49-2 vs Winona State earlier, anything other than an annihilation would have been disappointing

- Already had plans (e.g. deerhunting) or too short notice

- Five days to sell tickets vs months for season ticket packages or single games

- Playoff tickets are not in the household budget, whereas season tickets are

- Businesses that have season tickets do not necessarily buy playoff tickets

- Alumni from well-out-of-town (like me) can't plan fall trips around playoffs

That said, the hard-core Sioux contingent at Omaha will probably be pretty good. Too bad the Husker game is on Friday, rather than Saturday. If those games had overlapped, the Mav fanbase would have totallly disappeared.

[star2city]

My opinion is that there is 1 team (ndsu) that we could possibly draw 20,000 fans to, but half of them would be for the other team.

With an unlimited seating capacity, an NDSU / UND could quite possibly draw 30,000 IMHO (granted, many them of the SU fans.)

Edit (And admittedly a stretch): if UND did indeed go DIA eventually, UMinn is known to do 2-for-1's with MAC teams. With a 30,000 seat stadium in GF, that would be a sell-out.

I just do not see Grand Forks and surrounding area ever consistantly supporting 15-18-20 thousand for a football game no matter who the opposition, or classification level we play in...sorry

There are two schools that we don't currently play with that type of drawing potential: Montana and Montana St. Both travel well and have high numbers of alumni in Minnesota (i.e. Twin Cities) who would love to see their schools play at a driveable weekend distance. Such games would also gain a lot of interest (and fans) from Western ND.

[HockeyMom]

- 49-2 vs Winona State earlier, anything other than an annihilation would have been disappointing

- Already had plans (e.g. deerhunting) or too short notice

- Five days to sell tickets vs months for season ticket packages or single games

- Playoff tickets are not in the household budget, whereas season tickets are

- Businesses that have season tickets do not necessarily buy playoff tickets

- Alumni from well-out-of-town (like me) can't plan fall trips around playoffs

You forgot no beer.

[Goon]

You forgot no beer.

No beer and Deer Hunting probably was the reason for such a small turn out, not to mention WSU just isn't very good.

[Sioux27]

You forgot no beer.

Yeah, what the heck is up with that. I only have two beers a game, but I may have had some shakes! Is this an NC$$ policy.

I imagine that they don't get a cut from alcohol sales so they forbid it!

I still can't believe they did not list "Fighting Sioux" after North Dakota in the program. Wait a minute, I can believe it!

[HockeyMom]

I still can't believe they did not list "Fighting Sioux" after North Dakota in the program. Wait a minute, I can believe it!

Our logo behind our roster was the interlocking ND.......yet on another page in the very same program, the Florida State Seminole was on the middle of the page.

[DI IN FARGO]

Have a little Denny Green in you there Walrus? "They were who we thought they were." It amazes me knowing how in the know you are with Sioux athletics that you don't have a little more knowledge on the plan for this university. And I don't mean that with any type of disrespect towards you. I just know that you have a good working relationship with some people here at the university. Let's talk a little on the future of the university-

Your whole post talks of how we need GF to grow. We need better jobs. We need to keep our young kids here. Some questions for you. Who should be the leader trying to establish a better community? Should the university sit and wait until something is done, or should it be out in front, leading the way? Should we say "We are who we are," or say "We can be something better."? That is the question posed for both Kupchella and Bunning. Bunning has finally come in and said that this university can be something better than what it has been. Kupchella has finally seen the light, and I for one agree.

You are missing the ultimate goal of this program, and like I said earlier, with your inside knowledge you should have a better grasp of this. The comparisons you make with DI schools such as Maine as far as attendance are concerned have no merit, for that is not the goal of this program. IAA is a stepping stone for where this program wants to be. The end goal is for THE Fighting Sioux to play in the Mecca of college sports, IA football. The end goal is for THE Fighting Sioux to be playing in their new on-campus stadium (ever wonder what the new skywalk across Columbia is going to connect to?) And in all honesty, I feel it is in the best interest for this school to strive to be something great.

If you believe GF could never achieve this status, I offer up Boise State and Troy University. Both were one time DII members who have made the leap all the way up. Boise State, as everyone knows, has been very successful. They are averaging about 30,000 fans per a game. Granted, they have a city with a populationg of around 160,000, which could account for their ability to draw crowds, but how aout Troy? They are located in Troy, Alabama, with a population of 14,000. Somehow they are drawing in on average over 20,000 fans per a game.

We need to quit thinking we are who we are and be a little proactive. Why not make this university into what it can be? We are the ones with a Med school. We are the ones with a law school. We are the ones with a world renowned aerospace school. Who else in this state can say that? The time has come for this university to become what it can be and lead the city of Grand Forks out of the dark ages it has resided since the Red River Carts quit hauling goods. I know I for one would help in contributions to make this possible, and I think there are plenty more out there that feel the same way I do.

My wrists hurt and I'm going to watch some football. Later.

I was reading through this thread and had to post on this comment. I almost feel sorry for you up there but then I remember all the past and that goes away. But this comment is just way to out there not to point out the obvious. You can't draw flies for a playoff game (using that term playoff losely here) and you have someone posting your ultimate goal is to go IA with a 30,000 seat outdoor facitlity? That's hilarious and ridiculous at the same time. One of your own points out what many in Fargo have said for years and now you come down on him. If this was someone from Fargo that said this you'd be all over that tenfold. Your other comment about leading, Please lets not go there, you are following and you know it. I will give credit to some who at least see things clearly (walrus) but woden you need to lay off the bottle when your at the computer posting this stuff.

[mksioux]

I was reading through this thread and had to post on this comment. I almost feel sorry for you up there but then I remember all the past and that goes away. But this comment is just way to out there not to point out the obvious. You can't draw flies for a playoff game (using that term playoff losely here) and you have someone posting your ultimate goal is to go IA with a 30,000 seat outdoor facitlity? That's hilarious and ridiculous at the same time. One of your own points out what many in Fargo have said for years and now you come down on him. If this was someone from Fargo that said this you'd be all over that tenfold. Your other comment about leading, Please lets not go there, you are following and you know it. I will give credit to some who at least see things clearly (walrus) but woden you need to lay off the bottle when your at the computer posting this stuff.

Even though I didn't make the comment, I'll concede UND going DIA is not much more than a pipe dream at this point. But from what I hear, some of your brethren are saying the same thing about NDSU, which is not a whole lot less rediculous.

And I'll concede that UND is not leading. That's unfortunate, but I'd rather be following than giving up and becoming an NSIC-type school like Walrus would have us do. I know you'd probably like all of us to share his defeatist attitude so we'd stay and languish in DII and never again be competitive with the Bison, but fortunately Walrus is in a tiny minority of Sioux fans.

[The Walrus]

I'm a realist....and definetly not "tiny"

[dlsiouxfan]

I was reading through this thread and had to post on this comment. I almost feel sorry for you up there but then I remember all the past and that goes away. But this comment is just way to out there not to point out the obvious. You can't draw flies for a playoff game (using that term playoff losely here) and you have someone posting your ultimate goal is to go IA with a 30,000 seat outdoor facitlity? That's hilarious and ridiculous at the same time. One of your own points out what many in Fargo have said for years and now you come down on him. If this was someone from Fargo that said this you'd be all over that tenfold. Your other comment about leading, Please lets not go there, you are following and you know it. I will give credit to some who at least see things clearly (walrus) but woden you need to lay off the bottle when your at the computer posting this stuff.

If you really want to be accurate as to who is following whom you only need to look at how ndsu has historically followed in UND's footsteps academically. UND was a well respected school for producing top of the line professionals long before ndsu could even call itself a university. Fargo's growth has as much to do with UND's success as it does with ndsu's. People from both communities overestimate the effect the two communities have on the two universities. UND grads in Fargo and Minneapolis for that matter don't stop being alumni or fans just cause they leave Grand Forks.

On to another point DI Bison shouldn't you be posting retractions for all the crap you spewed about UND's budget a while back. Guess who's in the black and who went fishing for last minute donations to balance the budget again. Until you retract your statements you have zero credibility on this message board as anything other than a troll.

[DI IN FARGO]

If you really want to be accurate as to who is following whom you only need to look at how ndsu has historically followed in UND's footsteps academically. UND was a well respected school for producing top of the line professionals long before ndsu could even call itself a university. Fargo's growth has as much to do with UND's success as it does with ndsu's. People from both communities overestimate the effect the two communities have on the two universities. UND grads in Fargo and Minneapolis for that matter don't stop being alumni or fans just cause they leave Grand Forks.

On to another point DI Bison shouldn't you be posting retractions for all the crap you spewed about UND's budget a while back. Guess who's in the black and who went fishing for last minute donations to balance the budget again. Until you retract your statements you have zero credibility on this message board as anything other than a troll.

This post is even funnier then the first one I quoted. Now your trying to take credit for Fargo's growth and your calling NDSU the follower? You are the one with no credibility whatsoever with that kind of foolish talk. You go ahead and live in your dream world, let me know how your first football game goes in that outdoor 30,000 seat facitlity your DIA football team is going to be playing in Don't forget to clean yourself up after you wake up from that dream

[SiouxMeNow]

WOW! great season! so who is NDSU playing in the playoffs next week?? This is one of the greatest things for ND I can recall!!

[SiouxMeNow]

I'm hoping ndsu plays uni! ! OOPS!! I guess BOTH didn't make the di-aa playoffs!!! WAA- wahh!!! WHO CARES!!! OUR playoffs are on....

[NanoBison]

I'm hoping ndsu plays uni! ! OOPS!! I guess BOTH didn't make the di-aa playoffs!!! WAA- wahh!!! WHO CARES!!! OUR playoffs are on....

Yep, you had an impressive 5,073 show up at the last game...

I think if you re-arrange your statement of above ...

OUR playoffs are on.... WHO CARES!!!

... you can clearly show your fan's sentiment towards your team, which

is evident in the attendance you just showed this Saturday...

Where the hell is the support for your team? When we were playing

Concordia-St. Paul (mediocre team) we had 4,000 students attend...

... that's just students...

SiouxMeNow,

You've got nothing to brag about, nor do you have anything to try

and tarnish the hell of a year the Bison had. No playoffs for us?

It's the humbling suffering we must go through to show we're

committed to the move up. Hopefully, you guys, when you do move

up, have the same success as we do and have to "suffer" not being

able to play in a championship game due to a technicality and end

the year knowing your the best program in DI-AA football (Sagarin Rating)

just like we are doing now. Your statements were nothing more than

absolutely childish.

[GeauxSioux]

Yep, you had an impressive 5,073 show up at the last game...

I think if you re-arrange your statement of above ...

OUR playoffs are on.... WHO CARES!!!

... you can clearly show your fan's sentiment towards your team, which

is evident in the attendance you just showed this Saturday...

Where the hell is the support for your team? When we were playing

Concordia-St. Paul (mediocre team) we had 4,000 students attend...

... that's just students...

SiouxMeNow,

You've got nothing to brag about, nor do you have anything to try

and tarnish the hell of a year the Bison had. No playoffs for us?

It's the humbling suffering we must go through to show we're

committed to the move up. Hopefully, you guys, when you do move

up, have the same success as we do and have to "suffer" not being

able to play in a championship game due to a technicality and end

the year knowing your the best program in DI-AA football (Sagarin Rating)

just like we are doing now. Your statements were nothing more than

absolutely childish.

On the contrary. I think that the Bison had a great year and should be proud.

Yes, I'll agree that the 5,073 is embarrassing. When I lived in GF, I never missed a game no matter who the opponent or what the weather was and that was at Memorial. But I also think you are comparing apples and oranges when you are talking about attendance. You are comparing a regular season game to which the students get in free early in the season to a playoff game to which the students would have to pay against a team we had already beaten soundly (49-2). As I said previously in this thread, we may not win a championship this year, but it is apparent that the overall level of competition is sliding. I am off the fence about the move to Division I and am willing to fork over more money to the U to pay for it.

[mikejm]

Sorry to be late to this party. I never post in the football threads, but there are some things that need to be said:

1. I think NDSU would beat the living daylights out of the Sioux this year. I went to my first SU FB game in decades Saturday and was blown away by their size and speed. Coach Bohl and his staff have done a great job recruiting and the strength program is obviously paying dividends. I was amazed at SU's physical presence.

2. It is too bad that the Bison can't be included in the D-IAA playoffs, but they knew the rules before they started and the folks who are involved with the program and many of their fans are graciously accepting their fate. I don't know if they are truly the best team in the division (ask the Sioux hockey team how well their #3 ranking turned out in Anchorage last weekend. Ouch!), but they're obviously a good

[mksioux]

Sorry to be late to this party. I never post in the football threads, but there are some things that need to be said:

1. I think NDSU would beat the living daylights out of the Sioux this year. I went to my first SU FB game in decades Saturday and was blown away by their size and speed. Coach Bohl and his staff have done a great job recruiting and the strength program is obviously paying dividends. I was amazed at SU's physical presence.

2. It is too bad that the Bison can't be included in the D-IAA playoffs, but they knew the rules before they started and the folks who are involved with the program and many of their fans are graciously accepting their fate. I don't know if they are truly the best team in the division (ask the Sioux hockey team how well their #3 ranking turned out in Anchorage last weekend. Ouch!), but they're obviously a good

[UND92,96]

[CoteauRinkRat]

Despite not being playoff eligible, their season was head and shoulders better than UND's.

The Bison had a great season and were definitely a very good football team who would have done a lot of damage in the playoffs this year, but I'm not sure how you can say their season was "head and shoulders better than UND's"? I just think the comparison of the two is silly.

They are in a different division and they have more scholarships.

I would hate to see what you would say about UND's season if they had went 5-5 or worse.

[sultan]

The Sioux would definitely give the Bison all they could handle. SDSU gave the Bison all they could handle. In fact they had more yards offense than NDSU. They almost had 500 yards of offense. SDSU lost to a DIII team this year and they lost to Northern Iowa too. I believe the Sioux beat Northern Iowa. The Bison have a good team but it would be a heck of a game if they played the Sioux.