tnt Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Are you basing that on Toews comments about returning to UND or is there more to it? It seems to me like they are all very likely to turn pro. After looking at the Bruins roster I don't see how Kessel wouldn't find his way onto the 1st or 2nd line. Same with the Hawks and Toews. EJ would likely get a top four defensemen spot opening night. All three no doubt have significant development to do, but there is no reason they can't do it at the NHL level. I posted it on USCHO as well but the only way I can see any of them returning is if their NHL team doesn't want to start the clock on the time they have exclusive rights to the player. I think the other 1st and 2nd round picks on the Sioux and Gophers are more interesting cases. I'm not sure, but was Bochenski even on the top two lines of the Blackhawks? I am not so sure Kessel would be a regular on the top two lines of the Bruins either. I can see him having a lot of powerplay time, but unless he adds a ton of scoring punch right away, the defensive liability for a team that doesn't score a lot to begin with might not be that wise. Like I said, if he was able to score a lot right away, the defensive aspect could be overlooked to some degree. I guess time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 On the toews situation, i believe he will stay. on pk, hes gone i feel. and ej i think will be gone but i would not be surprised if he goes to the M. no new news there i guess... on the spirko situation, i was definitely one who thought before this year that he was going to be a four year player. but this last year, even though he was injured at the beginning, he didnt have the "zip" that he had before, especially after xmas break...which was most likely due to his wanting to be with his bride to be. i dont see how anyone could have really been surprised by his departure, looking at those things. did everyone expect he was going to wait until the end of his sioux career to get married or bring her here?? i was very disappointed when he left though, because he was a very fine player...and its too bad he left but i have to say i dont blame him...in fact i think its very justified. after all he was presented with a contract of sorts for a LIFETIME of tang, not like the other guys who took money, with a HOPE that they would get some tang. and finally, this also makes me think of the zajac situation too...i hate to say this but i really dont think he liked playing here as much as some of the other players. my reasoning is similar to that of the spirko reasoning, zajac in my opinion could have been a runner for hobey this year...he was just a very quiet player...but i think he was the best on the team and very overlooked. dave hakstol even said this on the radio, he said that he felt that zajac wasnt scoring enough goals and hopefully next year he would be a 60 pt man... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Here's an interesting Kessel-Toews comparison by CSTV's Dave Starman: Kessel was the consensus No. 1 pick for this draft at this time last season, but I applaud the `Hawks for taking Towes over Kessel. I would have also. While Kessel brings a great package of skills, he does bring an attitude that turned off many scouts and their GMs. While players are always encouraged to have a swagger, Kessel's confidence seemed to rub some of the old guard the wrong way. Kessel has lethal scoring ability and good hands, but put in a situation where I had to choose Kessel or Toews, I'd have taken Toews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THETRIOUXPER Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Here's an interesting Kessel-Toews comparison by CSTV's Dave Starman: Ah yes, but please remember, it's not phil's fault. No one could have met the expectations heaped upon poor phil's shoulder's. Isn't that the battle cry of all of the kessel sympathizer's, who by the way seem to be mysteriously absent at the moment. How convenient. It seems a certain dillusional lunatic said this long ago about poor phil . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Ah yes, but please remember, it's not phil's fault. No one could have met the expectations heaped upon poor phil's shoulder's. Isn't that the battle cry of all of the kessel sympathizer's, who by the way seem to be mysteriously absent at the moment. How convenient. It seems a certain dillusional lunatic said this long ago about poor phil . Consider this a preemptive strike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 I seem to remember posts that said Kessel was a quiet, shy young man who would NEVER toot his own horn. The implications were that someone was pulling his strings, puppet style and all the bad things said about PK were not true. Those NHL folk just don't get it! I also remember many posts about Jonathan and the NHL folk concurred with all the them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THETRIOUXPER Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Consider this a preemptive strike. Touche' there PCM. I was merely trying to point out the inconsistencies of some of the "non-SiouxFan-type-posters". It just seems when they are showering phil with accolades they are far more likely to show up and spew their ilk. Now that some not-so-favorable things have been said about phil, their absence is more than peculiar to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Touche' there PCM. Did you think that I didn't know what type of response Starman's comments would generate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THETRIOUXPER Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Did you think that I didn't know what type of response Starman's comments would generate? So are you admitting that you are an instigator ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 So are you admitting that you are an instigator ? Heck no! I'm just trying to generate interesting discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Heck no! I'm just trying to generate interesting discussion. PCM gets an extra two minutes for being the instigator. That's not surprising though because if you turn his initials around you get MCP....aka Mike C. Prpich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckysieve Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Ah yes, but please remember, it's not phil's fault. No one could have met the expectations heaped upon poor phil's shoulder's. Isn't that the battle cry of all of the kessel sympathizer's, who by the way seem to be mysteriously absent at the moment. How convenient. It seems a certain dillusional lunatic said this long ago about poor phil . So you're admitting you're a delusional lunatic? If you would've just admitted that months ago we could actually be friends by now. Seriously though, you guys overreact to everything negative said abot Kessel. What about all the good things that have been said about Kessel lately? He's been called the player with the most upside in the draft, the best skater in the draft, the most explosive player in the draft, the player that makes you sit at the edge of your seat when he gets the puck about to make a rush. He's the player that everyone HAD to find negatives about because he was labeled with completely unrealsitic expectations for the last couple years that NO ONE could have lived up to. He's not a bad kid, no matter how bad you all want that to be true. He's the most scrutinized player I've ever seen play college hockey. I honestly feel sorry for him in that regard. You guys knew I couldn't stay silent forever right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggler Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 He's the player that everyone HAD to find negatives about because he was labeled with completely unrealsitic expectations for the last couple years that NO ONE could have lived up to. He's not a bad kid, no matter how bad you all want that to be true. The Oshie could've. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckysieve Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 The Oshie could've. I don't think I've ever seen a more talented freshman fly under the radar before entering college more than Oshie did. I have no idea why he was underrated the way he was. Nobody had any idea that he would be arguably the best freshman in the nation. These are 18 year old kids were talking about. The pressure of high expectations from fans and most of all the media can have a big impact on their performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 So you're admitting you're a delusional lunatic? If you would've just admitted that months ago we could actually be friends by now. I thought he did admit to that months ago. If not that, something worse than that. You're just hard to please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux_Hab-it Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 I don't think I've ever seen a more talented freshman fly under the radar before entering college more than Oshie did. I have no idea why he was underrated the way he was. Nobody had any idea that he would be arguably the best freshman in the nation. These are 18 year old kids were talking about. The pressure of high expectations from fans and most of all the media can have a big impact on their performance. Both Oshie and Toews demonstrated they were better players which has left egg on the face of both the WCHA and the NCAA. This thread is about Toews so lets stop talking about the One Move Bruin. Any debate on the subject ended a few months ago in the REA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 This thread is about Toews so lets stop talking about the One Move Bruin. Now that is a catchy phrase. I like it. Incidently Holy Cross is close to Boston. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THETRIOUXPER Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Both Oshie and Toews demonstrated they were better players which has left egg on the face of both the WCHA and the NCAA. This thread is about Toews so lets stop talking about the One Move Bruin. Any debate on the subject ended a few months ago in the REA. The debate on the subject SHOULD have ended in January when the WJC was over. Oshie clearly outperformed phil (not pointwise, but hard work, ect., is what I mean). As for Toews, he came home with the hardware after Team Canada was touted as underdogs, proving only, once again that team play and hard work will usually prevail. Then again, the debate SHOULD have ended when HC shook up the world at the REA, but the excuses keep rolling in. As for bucky, this is exactly what I said yesterday about phil sympathizers, their only excuse is that no one could have lived up to the hype, find a new excuse, that one is getting very tired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockey1 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 The debate on the subject SHOULD have ended in January when the WJC was over. Oshie clearly outperformed phil (not pointwise, but hard work, ect., is what I mean). As for Toews, he came home with the hardware after Team Canada was touted as underdogs, proving only, once again that team play and hard work will usually prevail. Then again, the debate SHOULD have ended when HC shook up the world at the REA, but the excuses keep rolling in. As for bucky, this is exactly what I said yesterday about phil sympathizers, their only excuse is that no one could have lived up to the hype, find a new excuse, that one is getting very tired. Would Sioux fans treat Kessel any different if he played on another team besides the Gophers? It seems Sioux fans hate him so much only because he is a Gopher. Oshie, Toews, Kessel are great players no matter what team they play for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Would Sioux fans treat Kessel any different if he played on another team besides the Gophers? It seems Sioux fans hate him so much only because he is a Gopher. The answer to your question is 'no', we wouldn't treat him any differently. In fact, we'll hate him just as much when he's a Bruin. On the plus side, it'll be fun to watch the opposition reaction when he does the ear-cupping move after scoring a goal in Montreal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockey1 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 The answer to your question is 'no', we wouldn't treat him any differently. In fact, we'll hate him just as much when he's a Bruin. On the plus side, it'll be fun to watch the opposition reaction when he does the ear-cupping move after scoring a goal in Montreal. So, your saying if Kessel would have played for Tech or AA or some other school you would have hated him as much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MafiaMan Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 So, your saying if Kessel would have played for Tech or AA or some other school you would have hated him as much. Not silly at all. I hate Kessel's cockiness as much as I hated Sean Hill's cheap-shots in the late 1980's/early 1990's (Wisconsin) and as much as I can't stand how "Diver Down" Robbie Earl (also Wisconsin) plays the game. While ESPN touted his 'miracle' goal against Maine, that bush league stunt made me want to puke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnt Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 So, your saying if Kessel would have played for Tech or AA or some other school you would have hated him as much. I think we both know the answer to this. To blame Kessel for the Holy Cross loss or somehow suggest that particular game somehow diminished him compared to Toews and Oshie is ludicrous. By that same logic, Zach Parise couldn't hold Vanek's jock, and we know that isn't true. I know this is a Sioux board, but it would be nice if there was a least a hint of objectivity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THETRIOUXPER Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 I think we both know the answer to this. To blame Kessel for the Holy Cross loss or somehow suggest that particular game somehow diminished him compared to Toews and Oshie is ludicrous. By that same logic, Zach Parise couldn't hold Vanek's jock, and we know that isn't true. I know this is a Sioux board, but it would be nice if there was a least a hint of objectivity. You may be right. However I have never seen anyone try to lable Oshie or Toews as "the greatest U.S./Canadian born hockey player of all time". Please show me the objectivity there. It's things like that, that set phil apart from these other guys and opens him up to public criticism. The world junior debacle was not phil's fault entirely. It would have been a good opportunity for him to "lead" the team to a medal, but he just faded away. The HC loss cannot be soley pinned on phil either, but he was part of a talented team that all faded away, and his performance was no better than the rest of minny's superstar's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Hate is a strong word. I don't hate PK, just don't like him. Leaving talent aside for the moment, let's look at on ice, locker room and off ice behavior. Both Jonathan and T.J., are head and shoulders above PK. They've proven themselves to be great team players and represent themselves and the team very well in the public eye. If PK were on another team, pulling the same antics there that he has with the Gophers, like/dislike/respect/lack of respect would be the same from the same folks who post here and those who have commented about him at the combine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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