Media Stories on the Sioux Name

[Goon]

My dog's name is not NC$$.

My dog's name is hostile and abusive. DAKOTA.

[Goon]

I thought dogs only knew the Hind-lick manuver.

oooohhhh....

[jimdahl]

Goetz says he wants to speed up timeline for nickname resolution

“We can’t wait until November 2010,” Goetz said Friday during a meeting with the Herald’s editorial board. “When 2010 comes, we need to have a foundation in place with plans for a transition. All parties need to understand there will be some type of a transition.”

Goetz said it is possible that the school’s Indian head logo could be changed with the nickname remaining the same or similar. He also said it is possible for the history of the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo to be preserved in some way even if the nickname is changed.

eh?

Goetz estimated it could cost $1 million to remove most of the thousands of Fighting Sioux logos from Ralph Engelstad Arena, the hockey team’s home arena. He said Ralph Engelstad Arena officials are not willing to foot the bill for the potential removal of the logos.

Uh?

[82SiouxGuy]

I basically had the same reaction. You can't tell which way he's spinning things. My guess is that he has proposed some kind of compromise that he hopes will save a little good will with the large group of UND people that support the nickname and logo.

[dakotadan]

Goetz says he wants to speed up timeline for nickname resolution

I understand that the interview with Goetz happened on friday because he was in town for Pres. Kelley's inauguration. But why did the Herald have to hang this article over Potato Bowl weekend? Could they not have waited until Sunday or Monday to run the story? Or if they really wanted to run it on a Saturday couldn't they have held the article about the interview until next Saturday?

[GeauxSioux]

Goetz said he has discussed the nickname issue with tribal chairs, who have declined to support the school’s nickname and logo, but “they have held fast that their position hasn’t changed.”

He said forcing reservation-wide referendums on the issue won’t provide a long-term solution.

I would think that having a reservation-wide referendum would be the best long term solution for keeping the name.

Goetz said it is possible that the school’s Indian head logo could be changed with the nickname remaining the same or similar. He also said it is possible for the history of the Fighting Sioux nickname and logo to be preserved in some way even if the nickname is changed.

This is curious statement. I thought the biggest sticking point for the Native Americans was the name, not the logo that went with the name. So are we saying North Dakota Sioux with an altered logo?

[jimdahl]

This is curious statement. I thought the biggest sticking point for the Native Americans was the name, not the logo that went with the name. So are we saying North Dakota Sioux with an altered logo?

I read it as an endorsement of a name that evokes memories of the Fighting Sioux nickname. E.g. something related to American Indians, but not the word Sioux itself.

[Sioux-cia]

Goetz says he wants to speed up timeline for nickname resolution

After reading this, I'm nauseated.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

[petey23]

Nothing should be done until the members of the reservation have voted.

[dakotadan]

As a tax paying North Dakotan, I move that any NDUS Chancellor/Board Member be an elected official that has to answere to the citizens of North Dakota.

Maybe they would then begin to actually do what the citizens of North Dakota want them to do.

[GeauxSioux]

I read it as an endorsement of a name that evokes memories of the Fighting Sioux nickname. E.g. something related to American Indians, but not the word Sioux itself.

What kind of a name fits this category? Dakota?

What if the endorsed name falls out of favor with the tribes in a couple of years? According to the settlement it would have to be changed.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

What if the endorsed name falls out of favor with the tribes in a couple of years? According to the settlement it would have to be changed.

Yes, not merely the endorsed name but the "price" of the endorsement is up for continuous, daily review by each of the tribes according to the settlement. Just one of the reasons the settlement is ridiculous on its face, and IMHO not a settlement at all but rather a three-year public relations excercise.

These statements by your administrator are just another milepost along that road to surrender.

[The Sicatoka]

The same day this article runs in the Fargo "Flem", the "Flem" runs an editorial promoting the wonderful history of ... this.

[GeauxSioux]

The same day this article runs in the Fargo "Flem", the "Flem" runs an editorial promoting the wonderful history of ... this.

Coincidence?........... I think not.

[The Sicatoka]

Coincidence?........... I think not.

Wise beyond your years, you are.

[GeauxSioux]

Wise beyond your years, you are.

:lol: Find that, did where you, hmm?

[The Sicatoka]

Very useful tool, Google can be.

[Goon]

Goetz estimated it could cost $1 million to remove most of the thousands of Fighting Sioux logos from Ralph Engelstad Arena, the hockey team

[Goon]

If only those rumors could be true about Ralph writing it into his will that REA be imploded if the nickname were to be changed. I would really hurt the legacy of the Fighting Sioux for a team by any other name to call that place their home ice.

This is the one sentence out of the Herald article that gives me hope:

But Goetz said it is not a forgone conclusion that UND

[Chewey]

Actually it is confusing because he is talking out of both sides of his mouth.

If majorities of the tribal councils are so opposed and if there is no benefit to be gained by tribal wide votes, how does he come up with this stuff? One of the following:

1. There really is some hope of retaining the nickname under certain conditions;

2. Personal CYA -- Act like he's really working with the tribes to retain the nickname and after a lot of puffery lower the boom on the masses;

3. Tribal Council CYA -- Make it look like the tribal councils have some flexibility but in the end concluded that there's just too much "racism" going around on campus to retain the nickname -- a condition which the nickname supposedly exacerbates.

4. Just talking baloney out of both sides of his mouth to temporarily placate the masses while the PC PR machine figures out the correct language and propaganda to use to lower the boom.

5. Just talking baloney out of both sides of his mouth in the hope that REA will be more amenable to foot the bill for this ridiculous PC insanity.

6. Just plain delusional

While I contributed to the lawsuit, we should have either never brought it or went ahead and litigated it to conclusion. If the NC00 had changed its policy afterward, we would have still been in the same position as before it started but we would have had some "loser precedence" against the NC00. While I am not familiar with the specifics of the lawsuit, one would think that there would have been some res judicata effect that would have somewhat militated against the NC00 regarding a change in policy. We shoul probably have told the NC00 to take a flying leap, purchased uniforms for post-season and indicated that we'd work with the tribes on our own regarding the nickname and its retention/retirement. If it's the NC00's policy enacted after the construction of the REA, the NC00 should foot the bill. One would think that there would be a claim for damages there somewhere, although that conceivable claim probably was air-mailed out the door with the settlement.

[UND92,96]

Lloyd Omdahl column in today's Herald.

[Goon]

Lloyd Omdahl column in today's Herald.

Nice to see that the Grand Forks Herald is on board to call for the end of the logo.

Big shock there...

[WiSioux]

Just thought that I would share the article from today's Dakota Student about the logo and the flag ceremony this weekend

Logo and REA Ceremony

I wish that everyone could understand the way it makes me feel to see this logo. If only they could understand the damage that Native people undergo with the perpetuation of this stereotypical imagery. I know that if they if these people really understood, and if they truly cared to honor and respect Native people, they would no longer be so determined to keep the logo around.

[GeauxSioux]

However, there are some down-sides to living here as well. I do not enjoy walking around campus every day, entirely unable to avoid the negative imagery of the Fighting Sioux logo.

It seems that nearly everyone chooses to utilize this logo as a part of their clothing, car decorations, and countless other forms of display.

I feel perpetually threatened, angry, and saddened, because this logo is being used as an improper and inaccurate representation of Native culture - and it's everywhere.

I still to this day don't see the "negative imagery" angle. The logo was designed by a respected Native American artist. Did Mr. Brien design the logo in a negative way?

How does the logo make you feel threatened, angry, saddened? Does it somehow change your being, as a Native American? Does it degrade you as a human? To quote Eleanor Roosevelt, "Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent".

Unfortunately, there are people who work diligently to make sure that the logo stays; attempting to silence the voices of people like myself, who have good reason to oppose the logo and its false imagery of Native people.

I still haven't heard what the good reason is. I'm an open minded person, willing to listen, but I haven't heard a good argument yet from the anti-logo crowd.

I have posed a question before on this forum. I would be willing to put the logo question to a vote at both SL and SR, would you Ms. Luger?