No Confidence on DiLorenzo... Again

[SWSiouxMN]

http://www.grandforksherald.com/news/education/4492307-aviation-faculty-give-vote-no-confidence-und-provost

Provost under fire again, this time from the Aviation department... which isn't surprising. Not a lot of fans over there

 

[UNDBIZ]

The Aviation Department really doesn't like it when the central university tries to make them part of the university, including sharing services and finding efficiencies.  They've acted as a separate entity with little oversight for a long time. 

With that said, everybody seems to hate DiLorenzo, even before the budget crisis.  Not sure how he's survived this long.

[gfhockey]

He tried showing up for a meeting once. We made him sit far far away 

[geaux_sioux]

8 minutes ago, gfhockey said:

He tried showing up for a meeting once. We made him sit far far away 

At the kids table with you?

[gfhockey]

No place we met at when he showed up was 21 and over 

[Teeder11]

So far a onesided story here, and not much of one at that. Again, I must say, this wreaks of another flanking maneuver in Gjovig's assault on the Kennedy administration.... IMHO.

 

[UND-FB-FAN]

1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

The Aviation Department really doesn't like it when the central university tries to make them part of the university, including sharing services and finding efficiencies.  They've acted as a separate entity with little oversight for a long time. 

With that said, everybody seems to hate DiLorenzo, even before the budget crisis.  Not sure how he's survived this long.

Agree with both parts. 

DiLorenzo is a Kelley administration holdover who should’ve received the boot a while ago. I hope it’s actually coming now.  

[Teeder11]

1 minute ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

Agree with both parts. 

DiLorenzo is Kelley administration holdover who should’ve received the boot a while ago. I hope it’s actually coming now.  

True. But Kennedy really likes DiLorenzo. He's not going anywhere, and for many on campus who will never say it publicly, that's a good thing. The ones who are complaining about the Provost are the ones who are averse to change, used to doing things their own way, and used to moving forward on things and asking for forgiveness later. The administration has drawn a line in the sand and called the Aviation department on the carpet on some shady things, and now they're crying.

[SoonersNSioux]

http://www.grandforksherald.com/news/education/4492546-resolution-details-aviation-facultys-complaints-about-und-provost

Justifiable concerns IMHO coming from the perspective of another department.  To the point above about shared services/efficiency, there is a reason Aerospace wants to keep some of these. They've seen what 'efficiency' means for the rest of campus. Degraded performance that harms the mission of the college/university.   Think of the department's perspective.  Surging enrollment numbers, and no decisions being made that help them cope with those numbers (hire open faculty positions, removal of services that help their students, etc.).

[UND1983]

Just now, Teeder11 said:

True. But Kennedy really likes DiLorenzo. He's not going anywhere, and for many on campus who will never say it publicly, that's a good thing. The ones who are complaining about the Provost are the ones who are averse to change, used to doing things their own way, and used to moving forward on things and asking for forgiveness later. The administration has drawn a line in the sand and called the Aviation department on the carpet on some shady things, and now they're crying.

I know you're a good guy Teeder from how you convos on here but DiLorenzo is an idiot.  He is probably the least respected administrator at UND in recent memory.  That's by everyone I talk to on campus.  I have yet to hear one person stick up for him.  

[UND-FB-FAN]

5 minutes ago, Teeder11 said:

True. But Kennedy really likes DiLorenzo. He's not going anywhere, and for many on campus who will never say it publicly, that's a good thing. The ones who are complaining about the Provost are the ones who are averse to change, used to doing things their own way, and used to moving forward on things and asking for forgiveness later. The administration has drawn a line in the sand and called the Aviation department on the carpet on some shady things, and now they're crying.

I can see where you’re coming from and it’s a very fair point. I know some of those who have complained regarding DiLorenzo and those folks happen to be far more problematic than DiLorenzo himself.

Even so, DiLorenzo has competence issues.

[Teeder11]

Just now, UND1983 said:

I know you're a good guy Teeder from how you convos on here but DiLorenzo is an idiot.  He is probably the least respected administrator at UND in recent memory.  That's by everyone I talk to on campus.  I have yet to hear one person stick up for him.  

Totally understand your take.

He's got a tough job because he has to do all the hard bad-cop work on campus. The problem is that you will never hear about any of the good things he does because that's not sexy news... so all you hear about is the complaints. So it skews the perception. All I can say is that the guy gets stuff done... and holds people accountable. And public employees don't really like that when it's their ox being gored.

[Teeder11]

2 minutes ago, UND-FB-FAN said:

I can see where you’re coming from and it’s a very fair point. I know some of those who have complained regarding DiLorenzo and those folks happen to be far more problematic than DiLorenzo himself.

Appreciate that. He's always been very fair, cordial and extremely nice in my interactions with him. I understand my stuff is all anecdotal and others will have other stories to counteract mine. I am sure there's blame on both sides. I just wish the faculty and administration could get together and hash these things out instead of doing the reverse and going straight to the media first, and then trying to work it out.

All good.

[Irish]

This guy is a menace who likes to break things just to see what would happen.  He needs to be gone.

[UND1983]

1 minute ago, Teeder11 said:

Totally understand your take.

He's got a tough job because he has to do all the hard bad-cop work on campus. The problem is that you will never hear about any of the good things he does because that's not sexy news... so all you hear about is the complaints. So it skews the perception. All I can say is that the guy gets stuff done... and holds people accountable. And public employees don't really like that when it's their ox being gored.

I am actually glad to hear that.  Thanks for replying.

[Teeder11]

1 minute ago, Irish said:

This guy is a menace who likes to break things just to see what would happen.  He needs to be gone.

Cool story, bro. 

[Teeder11]

44 minutes ago, SoonersNSioux said:

http://www.grandforksherald.com/news/education/4492546-resolution-details-aviation-facultys-complaints-about-und-provost

Justifiable concerns IMHO coming from the perspective of another department.  To the point above about shared services/efficiency, there is a reason Aerospace wants to keep some of these. They've seen what 'efficiency' means for the rest of campus. Degraded performance that harms the mission of the college/university.   Think of the department's perspective.  Surging enrollment numbers, and no decisions being made that help them cope with those numbers (hire open faculty positions, removal of services that help their students, etc.).

No argument here on that other than the departments still have to follow proper protocols and not circumvent the administration or the proper NDUS policies for incorporation of new student fees.

[SWSiouxMN]

The Aviation department definitely has their share of idiosyncrasies.  I've heard and experienced it first hand as a student in Odegard and Clifford. I remember a story from my late advisor about how they try to avoid cutting their budgets when Schafer was in charge.  They been at war with DiLorenzo since day 1.  In the AtSci department, IIRC, there wasn't much love for the Provost either. 

There have been a lot of things that DiLorenzo has done that I have not cared for.  I also understand the fact that faculty can have the tendency of being stubborn to chance and that drives me crazy as well.  Some stories I give more credence to than others.   

Of course I am sure this will be pinned on Kennedy, even thought these issues have popped up during the Kelley and Schafer administrations as well. 

It still doesn't look good that your #2 person at the university continues to have issues, for various reasons. At some point, you do need to consider a replacement.  If that comes, I am all for the Dean of Engineering for the spot.    

[UNDBIZ]

8 minutes ago, Teeder11 said:

No argument here on that other than the departments still have to follow proper protocols and not circumvent the administration or the proper NDUS policies for incorporation of new student fees.

School of Aerospace course fees were ridiculous.  Not talking about flight fees.  Pretty sure a state audit knocked them for it a few years ago too.  Also, the board is pushing campuses to roll their fees into the tuition rates so students aren't hit with all these unexpected charges.  I'm guessing aerospace is having issues with how UND is going about that.  Aerospace has always resisted contributing a fair share to central campus services and administration.

[UNDBIZ]

Also, when they're talking about flight training rates, are they talking about the charges for flight training?  What does that have to do with flight safety?

[Teeder11]

6 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

School of Aerospace course fees were ridiculous.  Not talking about flight fees.  Pretty sure a state audit knocked them for it a few years ago too.  Also, the board is pushing campuses to roll their fees into the tuition rates so students aren't hit with all these unexpected charges.  I'm guessing aerospace is having issues with how UND is going about that.  Aerospace has always resisted contributing a fair share to central campus services and administration.

Much truth in what you say. Aerospace has a student surge right now, and they need revenue to keep up. I give them credit for finding entrepreneurial ways to get it done, but you still have to play ball within the rules of the game. I find it ironic that the Portly One has a post about this whole debacle on his blog, detailing how despised DiLorenzo is on campus, when the underlying causation of the rift is that DiLorenzo is trying to stop Aerospace from doing things in a shady manner. Basically, he could have another blog post weeks from now railing against how UND let its aviation faculty jack up student fees with no accountability for what the money would actually be used for. 

[Teeder11]

FWIW ...Here is President Kennedy's response to the Aviation Department faculty.

http://blogs.und.edu/und-today/2018/08/president-kennedy-open-letter-to-aviation-department/

[gfhockey]

Kennedy comes off as I’d say perplexing arrogant

[Teeder11]

26 minutes ago, gfhockey said:

Kennedy comes off as I’d say perplexing arrogant

At least people can comprehend his messages. 

[TheFlop]

Happened at his last college too.  At some point it gets tougher to keep blaming others and Iike Bill Parcells used to say, you are what your record says you are.