Coach Jones?

[SiouxVolley]

I know people on this site like to pump up Bubba's recruiting, but most if not all of the Minnesota commitments he has gotten so far he either beat out D2's for the kid or UND was his only offer. Not saying they won't be good players, but they weren't heavily recruited.

NDSU always says they beat out UND for recruits in everything.  Just confirms you're part of the Bisonville groupthink. 

[gfhockey]

Kinda like jerry kill beating out 1 aa schools and Mac schools for his recruits when he started building the um program

[darell1976]

I know people on this site like to pump up Bubba's recruiting, but most if not all of the Minnesota commitments he has gotten so far he either beat out D2's for the kid or UND was his only offer. Not saying they won't be good players, but they weren't heavily recruited.

http://wiki.siouxsports.com/doku.php/football/2014_recruiting_information

 

I didn't know USA, Air Force, and a PWO for UM & UW are D2's. Thats 3 out of 5 MN LIT recruits. Not bad for the little time he had to work with.

[SWSiouxMN]

http://wiki.siouxsports.com/doku.php/football/2014_recruiting_information

Think he is talking about this year's not last.

I didn't know USA, Air Force, and a PWO for UM & UW are D2's. Thats 3 out of 5 MN LIT recruits. Not bad for the little time he had to work with.

[darell1976]

 

 

Well, the dumbass didn't specify it. Just shows what a stupid troll he is.

[teamsioux]

This thread is the cyber version of the knuckleheads in the barbershop in Hoosiers. So out of bounds. Low class crap full of faceless self -aggrandizing jackasses. Recruits, committed recruits, and parents of recruits, etc unfortunately read this. If you truly cared about the program you would take this off of here and move it back into the barbershop. Awful.

I did not know Rocky was a member of SiouxSports.com.

[Oxbow6]

This thread is the cyber version of the knuckleheads in the barbershop in Hoosiers. So out of bounds. Low class crap full of faceless self -aggrandizing jackasses. Recruits, committed recruits, and parents of recruits, etc unfortunately read this. If you truly cared about the program you would take this off of here and move it back into the barbershop. Awful.

Don't you have better things to do with your time Mussman?

[UND-1]

Don't you have better things to do with your time Mussman?

 

I don't think people understand the mess this team is, both on and off the court.  Bringing in all these transfers has led to what you saw Saturday.  A mess.  

 

There is no reason to bring in all those transfers.  2-3 would be fine.  To bring in NINE is ridiculous, especially when you have shown you can recruit good high school kids like Hooker, Cashman, Crandall, and Huff before them.  To me that is lazy recruiting and taking the easy way to fill your roster.  

 

Can they get better as the season goes on?  Yes.  Will they?  ___

[jdub27]

So since it involves "other people's money", we must shut up and accept whatever is dished out to us?  Sorry, not happening, no matter how many "grandfatherly" lectures you give me and others on this forum.  Honestly, you and 82SiouxGuy set the standard for preaching and establishment brown-nosing.  And you both like to relentlessly attack anyone that dares to think otherwise.  Whatever floats your boat I guess.....

 

Please name one thing in this world (outside of REA itself) that isn't built at least in part with "other people's money"?  The Vikings Stadium?  Other people's money.  Target Field?  Other people's money.  Fargodome?  Other people's money.  Alerus Center?  Other people's money.  Do you sense a pattern here?  I do.  And I honestly don't care how we fund this stuff; it simply needs to be done.  And it is not my job or your job to find the financing; it's the Faison's and Kelley's of the world that are tasked with doing this.  Our sister institution in North Dakota (NDSU) is dominating the State and Region in terms of media coverage, success on the field and court and so on.  You may not have a problem with that, I do.  What happened in Fargo last night is just another example of this.  Jones has been here since before the move up to Division I, but his teams continuously underachieve and cannot buy quality road wins if their lives depended on it.  But he'll have his defenders that will make the case that he is not responsible for what happens during games because he isn't out there playing.  The FB program crashed and burned because of that thinking; I do not want MBB to suffer the same fate.

 

As for e-mailing or calling these people, I honestly question just how much they care what I or other stakeholders think.  The cave-in to FU with regard to FB scheduling was vehemently opposed by me and others on this forum.  I sent Mr. Faison an e-mail telling him not to cave in.  I am pretty sure many others did as well.  Did it make any difference whatsoever?  Nope.  That is why a lot of people are cynical about doing that.  You may have all the confidence in the world in the establishment to make the right choices on things like this, but I do not.  More and more in our society, the average person is worth next to nothing to the decision makers and power brokers and no number of e-mails and phone calls will change that.

 

Always question authority when things don't look right or smell right or feel right.  Always.

Unless something happens outside of W/L's, Jones will be the coach of this team this year.  On top of that, there is a very, very high chance that he will be the coach of the team next year as well.  If you can't see and/or understand that, then you really aren't paying attention.  And I'm not saying I agree with it or don't, I'm saying it is a reality.  Same thing with Mussman: there was absolutely zero chance he was going to fired mid-season and the timing of him being let go was pretty clear.  People are free to post their opinions, I've never claimed anything different, and if disagreeing with someone while laying out facts is considered relentlessly attacking, then I guess we will have to agree to disagree.  My original plan was to only post only kneejerk reactions and long emotion filled rants, some on the edge of tinfoil hat conspiracies, but there was already more than enough of that to go around.

 

Everyone of your examples are taxpayer funded facilities, the majority done in the name of "economic development".  That is completely different than funding for UND athletics.  The state will not be kicking in any money for these grand ideas people have (and remember, I actually agree with you that some of them need to be figured out and soon).  The point was that the money needs to come from somewhere whether you care or not.  You don't think that the Champions Club and Athletic Department would love to have an unlimited budget?  Look at the budget crunch Montana State put itself in a few years ago by not having the funds in place for their football stadium expansion for an example of what happens when you do things because "they need to be done".

 

I also sent an e-mail regarding the FU football games and I felt the same way you did.  In the end, Bubba is the one who forced Faison's hand.  It was never going to be signed until Bubba explained why he felt playing the game was important.  You complain about NDSU dominating the region in coverage, apparently Bubba thinks similar and he felt that the quickest way to fix that was take them head on, even under what most here (myself included) deemed to be unfavorable terms.  I still don't agree with it 100%, but I understand why he convinced Faison to make the decision he did.

 

And I have no clue what your last sentence is supposed to mean.  Question authority when things don't look, smell or feel right?  What?  UND isn't some front for a secret government agency.  They aren't in year 131 of some long con.  If you don't think the athletic department, from the AD to the coaches to the players, want to be successful just as much as the fans, alumni and other stakeholders then you should reassess your opinions.  It isn't just wins and losses to them, it is their livelihood.  It doesn't mean that I agree with all the decisions they make but I know that the decisions are done with UND's best interest in mind under whatever circumstances are presented.

[Oxbow6]

This thead is basically the same thread and content that happened when most fans got sick of seeing what had become of the FB program under Muss with those posters who supported and apologized for Muss to the end now supporting Jones amid the disaster that is becoming the UND MBB program.  UND is a D1 university in all sports and 2 of the big 3, FB and MBB, are no where near what they should be at this point in their D1 existence IMO.  Changes were made in FB and I believe that program will be eventually head in the right direction.  MBB at some point will need to follow suit.

 

Look at all the games played to date by UND's FB and MBB teams since turning D1 and tell me where one big time signature win is in either sport...........................

[UND-FB-FAN]

^^^ this^^^

^^^ and this ^^^

How good a recruiter is Jones when his recruits refuse to follow his coaching? Mussman v1.2 anyone?

But it needs to start at the top. UND has a PC agenda pushing President and an ineffective AD. Say what you want about Bresciani and Taylor, they have/had a much deeper commitment to the success of the Bison getting into the nation spotlight. FCS Championships, March Madness appearances and even ESPN Game Day, games on ESPN's main network, Fox Sports 1 have put Fargo University into the spotlight more than UND's consecutive Frozen Four appearances (even if they had won one). Change needs to start at the top.

Absolutely 100% correct.

Ignoring what NDSU athletics has accomplished as a whole is downright foolish and ignorant. NDSU works with the same fundamental assets as UND (climate, location, budget, etc.) and yet they have a much higher standard than UND athletics. This is entirely attributable to the athletic department and leadership at UND. It's a shame to admit but Gene Taylor did a much better job at creating competitive clubs at NDSU than Brian Faison has ever even hinted at. Its all about influencing contributable donations from well-to-do alumni and than using that to create DI tier programs in both facilities and staff. Right now, Faison is not getting the job done. NDSU has gained so much financial support in the last 10 years it's not even funny. Football coach with over 200K salary and a basketball coach with a 150K salary; now compare that to UND and it's a joke.

[UND-FB-FAN]

This thread is the cyber version of the knuckleheads in the barbershop in Hoosiers. So out of bounds. Low class crap full of faceless self -aggrandizing jackasses. Recruits, committed recruits, and parents of recruits, etc unfortunately read this. If you truly cared about the program you would take this off of here and move it back into the barbershop. Awful.

Perhaps the recruits should know the truth; in fact, maybe Faison and the "true" UND supporters should acknowledge the truth every once and awhile.

Trying the same thing over and over again and expecting difficult results is insanity, right Mr. Einstein?

[UND-FB-FAN]

I know people on this site like to pump up Bubba's recruiting, but most if not all of the Minnesota commitments he has gotten so far he either beat out D2's for the kid or UND was his only offer. Not saying they won't be good players, but they weren't heavily recruited.

UND's not in a position to recruit highly touted players. Every year hundreds of players slip through recruiting cracks in DI football. Bubba's focus is on development right now. With wins, UND will start to battle for highly touted recruits more often. Bubba has more committed recruits now (17) than Mussman ever had at this point in the year.

[MafiaMan]

This thread is the cyber version of the knuckleheads in the barbershop in Hoosiers. So out of bounds. Low class crap full of faceless self -aggrandizing jackasses. Recruits, committed recruits, and parents of recruits, etc unfortunately read this. If you truly cared about the program you would take this off of here and move it back into the barbershop. Awful.

 

Let's say I hire Oxbow6 to do 61 assignments that take him away from his home...and he manages to complete 6 of them successfully.  Should I give him another 61 to see if there is improved performance or conclude that I've seen the best he's able to give?   

[UND-FB-FAN]

This thead is basically the same thread and content that happened when most fans got sick of seeing what had become of the FB program under Muss with those posters who supported and apologized for Muss to the end now supporting Jones amid the disaster that is becoming the UND MBB program. UND is a D1 university in all sports and 2 of the big 3, FB and MBB, are no where near what they should be at this point in their D1 existence IMO. Changes were made in FB and I believe that program will be eventually head in the right direction. MBB at some point will need to follow suit.

Look at all the games played to date by UND's FB and MBB teams since turning D1 and tell me where one big time signature win is in either sport...........................

Within a year or two, a change will be made and Jones will be gone. Unfortunately, due to the "knucklehead" mindset of Faison and other apologists such as those on this board, UND will likely go through a couple disaster, program set-back type seasons first.

[Oxbow6]

 

Let's say I hire Oxbow6 to do 61 assignments that take him away from his home...and he manages to complete 6 of them successfully.  Should I give him another 61 to see if there is improved performance or conclude that I've seen the best he's able to give?   

 

 

I have been told the best I'm able to give isn't that great............and it isn't anywhere near 4 hours. 

 

Carry on.......................

[jdub27]

Within a year or two, a change will be made and Jones will be gone. Unfortunately, due to the "knucklehead" mindset of Faison and other apologists such as those on this board, UND will likely go through a couple disaster, program set-back type seasons first.

UND needs to find money to invest in its basketball program.  I have no clue where it is going to come from which is kind of the problem, but as it sits right now, they don't have $200K+ sitting around to buyout the last two years of Jones contract, which would be 20% of the basketball budget, on top of $125K+ annually to cover what a new quality coach would demand and the increase in the assistant salary pool that would required. Tough to justify it when you have "UND" fans who would probably prefer to just fold the basketball team and divert the money to the hockey program.

 

The issue is only going to get worse in the coming months once full cost of attendance is passed and put into place.  Since there is a Title IX component of it, I'm really hoping they focus that on either WBB or VB or both to give those programs a boost.

[darell1976]

Absolutely 100% correct.

Ignoring what NDSU athletics has accomplished as a whole is downright foolish and ignorant. NDSU works with the same fundamental assets as UND (climate, location, budget, etc.) and yet they have a much higher standard than UND athletics. This is entirely attributable to the athletic department and leadership at UND. It's a shame to admit but Gene Taylor did a much better job at creating competitive clubs at NDSU than Brian Faison has ever even hinted at. Its all about influencing contributable donations from well-to-do alumni and than using that to create DI tier programs in both facilities and staff. Right now, Faison is not getting the job done. NDSU has gained so much financial support in the last 10 years it's not even funny. Football coach with over 200K salary and a basketball coach with a 150K salary; now compare that to UND and it's a joke.

Even though after football and men's basketball NDSU sports are horrid (major sports only not T&F, or softball), where at UND the only major sports suffering is football and men's basketball. Football actually saw an increase of wins (more than one), for the first time since the 2011 season, men's basketball hasn't had an increase of wins (more than 1 game) since going 19-15 in the 2010-2011 season after winning just 8 the year before.  Last year UND had 1 more win than the year before, so in the past 3 seasons (2011-12 through 2013-14) UND's increase of wins is ZERO!! Jones is consistant on thing.....being .500!!! In that 19-15 season (Jones's best) UND won 4 games against non DI competition, went 0-8 in OOC road games,  (0-9 if you include Air Force in the CIT).  I know this was in the middle of transition but if someone brings up his best season, look at the numbers closely and see how watered down they are. (just like Muss's 2011 season)

[UND92,96]

UND needs to find money to invest in its basketball program.  I have no clue where it is going to come from which is kind of the problem, but as it sits right now, they don't have $200K+ sitting around to buyout the last two years of Jones contract, which would be 20% of the basketball budget, on top of $125K+ annually to cover what a new quality coach would demand and the increase in the assistant salary pool that would required. Tough to justify it when you have "UND" fans who would probably prefer to just fold the basketball team and divert the money to the hockey program.

 

The issue is only going to get worse in the coming months once full cost of attendance is passed and put into place.  Since there is a Title IX component of it, I'm really hoping they focus that on either WBB or VB or both to give those programs a boost.

 

Assuming Jones could find an assistant job at a division I mid-major (such as UNI or Creighton), wouldn't the buyout end up being almost nothing? It would be reduced by whatever salary he gets from his next coaching job.

[darell1976]

UND needs to find money to invest in its basketball program.  I have no clue where it is going to come from which is kind of the problem, but as it sits right now, they don't have $200K+ sitting around to buyout the last two years of Jones contract, which would be 20% of the basketball budget, on top of $125K+ annually to cover what a new quality coach would demand and the increase in the assistant salary pool that would required. Tough to justify it when you have "UND" fans who would probably prefer to just fold the basketball team and divert the money to the hockey program.

 

The issue is only going to get worse in the coming months once full cost of attendance is passed and put into place.  Since there is a Title IX component of it, I'm really hoping they focus that on either WBB or VB or both to give those programs a boost.

How much money is UND losing in attendance, concessions, and fan support? Football hasn't recovered from the Muss years that drove our attendance into the ground.

[jdub27]

Assuming Jones could find an assistant job at a division I mid-major (such as UNI or Creighton), wouldn't the buyout end up being almost nothing? It would be reduced by whatever salary he gets from his next coaching job.

Yeah, don't know for sure but I'd assume that language is in the contract.  Probably can't assume 100% you won't have to cough up any of the money when making a decision though and why I doubt they'd pull the trigger with anything more than 1 year remaining on his contract.

[Oxbow6]

How much money is UND losing in attendance, concessions, and fan support? Football hasn't recovered from the Muss years that drove our attendance into the ground.

 

 

The duckies and bunnies crowd dosen't even want to recongnize this.  R-E-V-E-N-U-E!  Dollars fund the athletic department not warm and fuzzy feelings. If UND can't get decent revenue from any other sport outside of hockey nothing will change within the athletic dept.

[MafiaMan]

I have been told the best I'm able to give isn't that great............and it isn't anywhere near 4 hours.

Carry on.......................

Ummmmm...we're still talking about basketball, right?

[darell1976]

The duckie and bunnie crowd dosen't even want to recongnize this.  R-E-V-E-N-U-E! Dollars fund the athletic department not warm and fuzzy feelings. If UND can't get decent revenue from any other sport outside of hockey nothing will change within the athletic dept.

Just look at what UND was in football attendance in 2007 with Lennon and 2008 with Muss's first season, then look how it just nose dived and Bubba is left to try to field a team to get butts back in the seats. Basketball attendance is hovering around 1700-2000 the last 3 seasons, if Jones starts to miss the tournament, have losing seasons, or worse lose to a DII school (Crookston could beat this team) then you will have a nose dive in attendance that will rival Sac State.

[Oxbow6]

Ummmmm...we're still talking about basketball, right?

 

 

Of course.............