Non-UND FCS Thread

[moser53]

On October 14, 2017 at 1:19 PM, fightingsioux4life said:

If "a good chunk" of NDSU commits are G5 caliber players, then maybe it's time for NDSU to move to the Big 12 or the MAC?

For the record, I do not think either UND or NDSU have any business being in FBS.

Just google growth in FM by the year 2050. As much as 350 thousand  population. Your a smart guy. What do I see that you don't? With that growth they want SU to be like Iowa or Oklahoma State. Why wouldn't' they. The plan is in place .

[geaux_sioux]

10 minutes ago, moser53 said:

Just google growth in FM by the year 2050. As much as 350 thousand  population. Your a smart guy. What do I see that you don't? With that growth they want SU to be like Iowa or Oklahoma State. Why wouldn't' they. The plan is in place .

And plenty of room on campus for expansion too.

[shep]

And that begs the question: 

Is being like Iowa etc better than being the top team in FCS.

What's the cost/benefit ratio? What will it cost to support an FBS team? Don't think that getting to a bowl game is it. MOST teams lose money going to bowl games. Yes it may look good for the  coach and to recruits, but it costs money to go to a game as most don't sell out and the teams MUST buy lots of tix.

[Cratter]

13 minutes ago, shep said:

Is being like Iowa etc better than being the top team in FCS.

99.9% of Iowa fans would say yes.

[Cratter]

39 minutes ago, moser53 said:

Just google growth in FM by the year 2050. As much as 350 thousand  population. 

So in 2050 they'll still be have less population than Sioux Falls will in 2050?

[shep]

38 minutes ago, Cratter said:

99.9% of Iowa fans would say yes.

No doubt, but they never won 5 FCS titles either. It's not bad being the big fish in the smaller pond.

SU will move up after UND beats them a few times. They're gonna need to run away from us like they did when we were whupping them in D2.

[fightingsioux4life]

1 hour ago, moser53 said:

Just google growth in FM by the year 2050. As much as 350 thousand  population. Your a smart guy. What do I see that you don't? With that growth they want SU to be like Iowa or Oklahoma State. Why wouldn't' they. The plan is in place .

You and I both know that NDSU will not be playing for national titles in FBS. I don't think finishing 6-5 and going to the Whatever.com bowl is going to appeal to your fan base.

[SIOUXFAN97]

3 hours ago, shep said:

No doubt, but they never won 5 FCS titles either. It's not bad being the big fish in the smaller pond.

SU will move up after UND beats them a few times. They're gonna need to run away from us like they did when we were whupping them in D2.

but they have nowhere to go...fcs is the limit.  no way the do a liberty...when und catches them in fb i see the ndac dropping football and going all in with wrasslin' and winning big 12 titles....in wrasslin'

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

49 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

but they have nowhere to go...fcs is the limit.  no way the do a liberty...when und catches them in fb i see the ndac dropping football and going all in with wrasslin' and winning big 12 titles....in wrasslin'

Isn't wrestling the fake sport, when they graduate from cawledge or quit, and go to the mat again?

[darell1976]

7 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

You and I both know that NDSU will not be playing for national titles in FBS. I don't think finishing 6-5 and going to the Whatever.com bowl is going to appeal to your fan base.

No team from the MAC, or Sun Belt is going to be in the FBS “playoffs”, so that would mean unless NDSU joins the Big 10 or Big 12, there will be no chance at a National Title. I am sure by the time they move up there will be more Bowl games so the 5-7 and 4-8 teams can play in one. Unless there is another tier in the FBS it’s not worth moving up especially with our location.

[darell1976]

9 hours ago, moser53 said:

Just google growth in FM by the year 2050. As much as 350 thousand  population. Your a smart guy. What do I see that you don't? With that growth they want SU to be like Iowa or Oklahoma State. Why wouldn't' they. The plan is in place .

And by 2050 there will still be no new dome so NDSU can be the Idaho of the FBS. I can imagine how much a new dome would cost in 2050 money? 

[moser53]

4 hours ago, darell1976 said:

And by 2050 there will still be no new dome so NDSU can be the Idaho of the FBS. I can imagine how much a new dome would cost in 2050 money? 

Don't underestimate Doug Bergum. If NDSU being like an Oklahoma State is his dream-goal in his lifetime what will we see at SU that will give clues. 10 thousand  more students  1 billion endowment. Underestimate the will in Fargo not me.

[SiouxVolley]

16 minutes ago, moser53 said:

Don't underestimate Doug Bergum. If NDSU being like an Oklahoma State is his dream-goal in his lifetime what will we see at SU that will give clues. 10 thousand  more students  1 billion endowment. Underestimate the will in Fargo not me.

His uncle Rick Burgum put up much of the money for Great Plains Software, enriching him more than Doug, and was a board member of  UND's Foundation.  His age makes him much more capable to give to UND soon.

[NDSU grad]

14 minutes ago, SiouxVolley said:

His uncle Rick Burgum put up much of the money for Great Plains Software, enriching him more than Doug, and was a board member of  UND's Foundation.  His age makes him much more capable to give to UND soon.

Rick's his cousin, and it was Rick's dad Al that invested heavily in Great Plains in the 80's.  When Microsoft bought Great Plains Rick was the majority shareholder.  Doug and his two siblings were a close second though.  

[SiouxVolley]

10 minutes ago, NDSU grad said:

Rick's his cousin, and it was Rick's dad Al that invested heavily in Great Plains in the 80's.  When Microsoft bought Great Plains Rick was the majority shareholder.  Doug and his two siblings were a close second though.  

Rick was listed in the top 100 software millionaires in 1997.  No other Burgum was listed then.  The total wealth has probably gone up by 3 or 4 times.  Rick graduated in 1968, so he is much older than Doug.

[jdub27]

On 10/14/2017 at 11:25 PM, Gothmog said:

Again, take an honest look at USD's schedule. Other than WIU and YSU it's not very good. NDSU's wins over EWU and YSU on the road are more impressive than anything USD has done. Indiana State is 0-6, UND is 2-5, Bowling Green is 1-6, and Drake is 3-3 in the Pioneer League.

Sagarin SOS rankings:
NDSU - 219
USD - 159 

Difference in opponent quality is over 10 points/game.

[Gothmog]

3 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Sagarin SOS rankings:
NDSU - 219
USD - 159 

Difference in opponent quality is over 10 points/game.

That's not the point. As I said, both teams have two good wins and the rest of their schedule is junk. It makes no difference if NDSU's junk is a little worse than USD's. The point is that NDSU wins are more impressive than USD's. That's what matters.

[jdub27]

9 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

That's not the point. As I said, both teams have two good wins and the rest of their schedule is junk. It makes no difference if NDSU's junk is a little worse than USD's. The point is that NDSU wins are more impressive than USD's. That's what matters.

Opponent ranks per Sagarin:
USD
WIU - 48 (64.71)
YSU - 85 (64.03)
Bowling Green - 135 (53.25)
UND - 163 (42.97)
ISU - 228 (37.67)
Drake - 234 (26.65)

NDSU
YSU - 85 (64.03)
EWU - 117 (57.71)
MSU - 204 (39.36)
ISU - 228 (37.67)
Robert Morris - 230 (27.54)
MSVU - 238 (8.35)

Sagarin has EWU as a whopping 4 points better than the Bowling Green team you claim ins't  a good win. Why does it always have to be "Me! Me! Me!" with NDSU fans?

[Gothmog]

2 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Opponent ranks per Sagarin:
USD
WIU - 48
YSU - 85
Bowling Green - 135
UND - 163
ISU - 228
Drake - 234

NDSU
YSU - 85
EWU - 117
MSU - 204
ISU - 228
Robert Morris - 230
MSVU - 238

Sagarin has EWU as a whopping 4 points better than the Bowling Green team you claim ins't  a good win. Why does it always have to be "Me! Me! Me!" with NDSU fans?

It wasn't a good idea to mention Sagarin Ratings in this discussion:

NDSU 76.13  (#43)

USD    68.15 (#71)

You lose that point.

 

 

[jdub27]

5 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

It wasn't a good idea to mention Sagarin Ratings in this discussion:

NDSU 76.13  (#43)

USD    68.15 (#71)

You lose that point.

What in the hell does that have to do with who currently has a better resume? More like you completely missed the point.

[Gothmog]

Just now, jdub27 said:

What in the hell does that have to do with who currently has a better resume?

Sagarin ratings either mean something or they don't. If you can use them to compare the quality of two team's opponents, you can also use them to compare those teams directly.

Sagarin says that NDSU has a better resume than USD, that's the whole point of the ratings. 

[jdub27]

13 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

Sagarin ratings either mean something or they don't. If you can use them to compare the quality of two team's opponents, you can also use them to compare those teams directly.

Sagarin says that NDSU has a better resume than USD, that's the whole point of the ratings. 

Both teams are 6-0.
Sagarin currently has NDSU rated as a better team.
Sagarin currently has USD with a significantly harder schedule to date (10+ points/game).

Resume is based on wins vs. the schedule you've play. Just because NDSU is rated better does not mean they currently have a better resume, the Sagarin algorithm is more complex than that. While there is definitely some correlation between the two, it is not mutually exclusive despite what you may think.

[BarnWinterSportsEngelstad]

38 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Sagarin has EWU as a whopping 4 points better than the Bowling Green team you claim ins't  a good win. Why does it always have to be "Me! Me! Me!" with NDSU fans?

Arrogance.

[Gothmog]

16 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

Both teams are 6-0.
Sagarin currently has NDSU rated as a better team.
Sagarin currently has USD with a significantly harder schedule to date (10+ points/game).

Resume is based on wins vs. the schedule you've play. Just because NDSU is rated better does not mean they currently have a better resume, the Sagarin algorithm is more complex than that. While there is definitely some correlation between the two, it is not mutually exclusive despite what you may think.

You're really grasping at straws here. The term "resume," as you're using it, is meaningless unless it can be used as an overall rating of that team, and then be compared directly to other teams. To say that a team can be rated higher but have a poorer "resume" in the same rating system is just silly.

 

 

[jdub27]

14 minutes ago, Gothmog said:

You're really grasping at straws here. The term "resume," as you're using it, is meaningless unless it can be used as an overall rating of that team, and then be compared directly to other teams. To say that a team can be rated higher but have a poorer "resume" in the same rating system is just silly.

Both teams are 6-0. One has played a harder schedule. Seems pretty simple to decide who, to this point in time, has a better resume. 

Also, if you use only results from this year, USD is rated #39 (76.65) and NDSU is #46 at (74.83). The main rankings are still showing bias from outside this season. What's going to be your excuse for that?