Know we know the price to lose

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

The UND women's team has been forced to play in the practice facility because of conflicts with ND state hockey and UND men's hockey. And at UND they didn't have to worry about changeover to basketball. You don't know how long ago those contracts were signed, it could be a 10 year contract. Did the CCHA have their schedule set that far out? Did they change their schedule? Also, it was a conference event. How much did the league get involved in the decision? You are making assumptions without a lot of information.

I'm making assumptions based on the limited information I'm privy too, but guess what, so are you . If I don't know how long ago the contracts were signed, neither do you . So does that mean Ohio schedules out longer than North Dakota for state tourneys? Did the WCHA schedule that far out? You are trying to based your side on asking questions you also don't know the answer to. No one has all the facts and most of our points are made up of conjecture and what we can observe which is what I'm doing.

Also, pointing out UND Women's hockey got pushed out one time does not help your position at all. That would be assuming the Men's and Women's hockey are equal which would just be proposterous.

[ozzie679]

That's what I've thought and what I've heard. Big Ten Hockey, despite what many people on here say or want to believe, will be a top 3 with the potential to be #1 or #2 in hockey. The world revolves around money and college athletics is no different. The Big Ten schools have more money than schools in any other conference...just depends on how much each school wants to invest in the sport. UM, UW, Michigan, Michigan State all have a solid hockey tradition. I don't expect PSU and OSU to automatically become powerhouses in hockey, but those other four won't be going anywhere...and I believe their programs will get stronger by being in the Big Ten because their schedule will be more friendly to the casual fan who doesn't have alot of college hockey knowledge.

Football and basketball are the biggest sport on the vast majority of college campuses. The NCHC is an exception to the norm. I'm worried that the B1G will become the destination conference for elite hockey players. This won't happen enitially, and the NCHC will always be a major player. But the schools of the B1G have massive athletic budgets, tons of recruiting money, and a media machine promoting the B1G brand. Not to mention, the B1G has major research institutions with prestigeous reputations. The BTHC's upside is scary.

[MafiaMan]

...the B1G has major research institutions with prestigious reputations...

LOL...something 98% of B10 football, basketball, and hockey players most likely couldn't care less about...

[82SiouxGuy]

I'm making assumptions based on the limited information I'm privy too, but guess what, so are you . If I don't know how long ago the contracts were signed, neither do you . So does that mean Ohio schedules out longer than North Dakota for state tourneys? Did the WCHA schedule that far out? You are trying to based your side on asking questions you also don't know the answer to. No one has all the facts and most of our points are made up of conjecture and what we can observe which is what I'm doing.

Also, pointing out UND Women's hockey got pushed out one time does not help your position at all. That would be assuming the Men's and Women's hockey are equal which would just be proposterous.

I'm not making any assumptions. And I'm not on any side, I really don't have a dog in this contest. I'm saying that you have very few facts, and you are trying to prove some kind of a point with those limited facts. That is just stupid. I don't know how long ago the contracts were signed, but I do know that there is an excellent chance that they weren't signed in the past year. Contracts for events like that are signed multiple years in advance. I don't know if Ohio has longer contracts for their state tournaments than North Dakota, and it really doesn't matter. My point, that you have obviously missed, is that you can't just assume that Ohio State doesn't care about their hockey program just because of the location they used for their playoff series. You don't know what ACTUAL FACTS were part of that decision. You don't know what contracts were involved, or when those were signed. You don't know how much the league office was involved in the decision. I don't know any of those facts either, and I admit it. Therefore I don't assume that I know what is happening within the department, something that you and some others are obviously ready to do.

[ozzie679]

LOL...something 98% of B10 football, basketball, and hockey players most likely couldn't care less about...

Anyway, do you deny the BTHC's upside is huge?

[MafiaMan]

Anyway, do you deny the BTHC's upside is huge?

It has potential...however, unless the conference can find some more schools willing to field hockey teams, I think the 6-team conference is a real downer.

Maryland and Rutgers? REALLY? I don't see them or Indiana, Northwestern, Nebraska, or anyone else jumping on the hockey bandwagon anytime soon.

[ozzie679]

It has potential...however, unless the conference can find some more schools willing to field hockey teams, I think the 6-team conference is a real downer.

Maryland and Rutgers? REALLY?

Agreed, they need more teams.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

I'm not making any assumptions. And I'm not on any side, I really don't have a dog in this contest. I'm saying that you have very few facts, and you are trying to prove some kind of a point with those limited facts. That is just stupid. I don't know how long ago the contracts were signed, but I do know that there is an excellent chance that they weren't signed in the past year. Contracts for events like that are signed multiple years in advance. I don't know if Ohio has longer contracts for their state tournaments than North Dakota, and it really doesn't matter. My point, that you have obviously missed, is that you can't just assume that Ohio State doesn't care about their hockey program just because of the location they used for their playoff series. You don't know what ACTUAL FACTS were part of that decision. You don't know what contracts were involved, or when those were signed. You don't know how much the league office was involved in the decision. I don't know any of those facts either, and I admit it. Therefore I don't assume that I know what is happening within the department, something that you and some others are obviously ready to do.

Please reference the post where I 'obviously missed your point' and assumed 'Ohio State doesn't care about their hockey program'. Go ahead, I'll wait......

[90siouxfan]

LOL...something 98% of B10 football, basketball, and hockey players most likely couldn't care less about...

How does a university's research programs have a bearing on thier sports teams? Are recuits looking for doctorates and research positions?

[MafiaMan]

How does a university's research programs have a bearing on thier sports teams? Are recruits looking for doctorates and research positions?

That was my point entirely...

[82SiouxGuy]

Please reference the post where I 'obviously missed your point' and assumed 'Ohio State doesn't care about their hockey program'. Go ahead, I'll wait......

How about http://forum.siouxsports.com/topic/18269-know-we-know-the-price-to-lose/page__st__60#entry621468.

I think Wilbur's point might be that Ohio State could have foreseen this being issue ahead of signing a contract for the girls basketball tourney. I mean, how many times has UND hockey played at their practice rink because of a conflict? And in the playoffs nonetheless? In my opinion, it just does not present Ohio State hockey as a priority but more of an afterthought with scheduling but I may be missing something too.

We don't know when the contracts for the tournament were signed. We don't know when the hockey schedule was put together for the NCAA, CCHA and Ohio State. The playoffs were later in March than normal. If the basketball contract was signed well ahead of the hockey schedule being put together, or if the hockey schedule was changed, than it would have nothing to do with what Ohio States priorities may or may not be. That is my point, which you obviously missed.

[82SiouxGuy]

It has potential...however, unless the conference can find some more schools willing to field hockey teams, I think the 6-team conference is a real downer.

Maryland and Rutgers? REALLY? I don't see them or Indiana, Northwestern, Nebraska, or anyone else jumping on the hockey bandwagon anytime soon.

How about this, do you think that the collective ego of the Big 10 and its' member schools are going to allow a conference of nobody schools like the NCHC to dominate them? The Big 10 is going to be a good conference. Yes, they need more teams. But they are going to have multiple programs that are competitive nationally on a regular basis.

[as15]

How about this, do you think that the collective ego of the Big 10 and its' member schools are going to allow a conference of nobody schools like the NCHC to dominate them? The Big 10 is going to be a good conference. Yes, they need more teams. But they are going to have multiple programs that are competitive nationally on a regular basis.

Now that the Big 10 has a hockey conference, will a team like Ohio State be more serious about its program? They have always been a Big 10 school, so why would they allowed "member schools from a conference of nobody schools" to dominate them before? The Big 10 hockey conference will add something to each of their respective teams programs, no disputing that, but does having a Big 10 hockey conference add anything collectively to the school as a whole? Are they going to

"care" more now that they are under the Big 10 label?

I don't see how that makes sense, a Big 10 school should want to be superior to "nobody schools" no matter if they compete under the Big 10 label or not.

[MafiaMan]

How about this, do you think that the collective ego of the Big 10 and its' member schools are going to allow a conference of nobody schools like the NCHC to dominate them? The Big 10 is going to be a good conference. Yes, they need more teams. But they are going to have multiple programs that are competitive nationally on a regular basis.

And in an era where schools are looking at cutting programs, the B10 is suddenly going to look at men's AND women's hockey EXPANSION?

How can all six of these hockey programs all be competitive? Someone's got to fish first...but someone's still going to finish sixth...

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

How about http://forum.siouxsp..._60#entry621468.

We don't know when the contracts for the tournament were signed. We don't know when the hockey schedule was put together for the NCAA, CCHA and Ohio State. The playoffs were later in March than normal. If the basketball contract was signed well ahead of the hockey schedule being put together, or if the hockey schedule was changed, than it would have nothing to do with what Ohio States priorities may or may not be. That is my point, which you obviously missed.

It seems you enjoy twisting words to fit your reasoning. Using the statement that 'OSU hockey is not a priority' does not mean the University does not care about the hockey team. If they didn't care they'd shut off the lights and implode the arena or turn it into a training facility. I stated that it would appear the team is not a priority as compared to other schools.

It absolutely comes down to their priorities as they stuck them in a 1,000 seat arena for a home playoff game. Would they do that to the OSU basketball team or even have the remote possibility of this occurring? Or better yet, what other hockey team has this happened to? I'll anxiously wait your twisting and tweaking of my statement to fit your point.

[82SiouxGuy]

Now that the Big 10 has a hockey conference, will a team like Ohio State be more serious about its program? They have always been a Big 10 school, so why would they allowed "member schools from a conference of nobody schools" to dominate them before? The Big 10 hockey conference will add something to each of their respective teams programs, no disputing that, but does having a Big 10 hockey conference add anything collectively to the school as a whole? Are they going to

"care" more now that they are under the Big 10 label?

I don't see how that makes sense, a Big 10 school should want to be superior to "nobody schools" no matter if they compete under the Big 10 label or not.

We don't know if Ohio State will get more serious or not. Competing exclusively against other Big 10 teams in conference may give them more incentive. Only time will tell. It may also encourage more fan interest because of the fact that they are competing for a Big 10 conference title versus some no name conference.

The reference to the collective Big 10 ego refers to the fact that the conference as a whole will not want to look bad against "lesser" schools. So they will encourage the member schools to be competitive.

[82SiouxGuy]

And in an era where schools are looking at cutting programs, the B10 is suddenly going to look at men's AND women's hockey EXPANSION?

How can all six of these hockey programs all be competitive? Someone's got to fish first...but someone's still going to finish sixth...

Most other schools aren't making a profit on their athletic department. Most schools have to supplement their athletic departments. Ohio State is among a small group of schools that is totally self-sufficient, and they still make a large profit. That is why Ohio State (and Penn State and Michigan and Wisconsin) is able to expand their hockey programs IF THAT IS WHAT THEY DECIDE THEY WANT TO DO. We don't know if that is what they will want to do. But they have the capability and the capacity if they decide to go in that direction.

[82SiouxGuy]

It seems you enjoy twisting words to fit your reasoning. Using the statement that 'OSU hockey is not a priority' does not mean the University does not care about the hockey team. If they didn't care they'd shut off the lights and implode the arena or turn it into a training facility. I stated that it would appear the team is not a priority as compared to other schools.

It absolutely comes down to their priorities as they stuck them in a 1,000 seat arena for a home playoff game. Would they do that to the OSU basketball team or even have the remote possibility of this occurring? Or better yet, what other hockey team has this happened to? I'll anxiously wait your twisting and tweaking of my statement to fit your point.

Everyone knows that hockey isn't among the highest priority sports at Ohio State, or just about any other school. That isn't exactly breaking news. And I never made a claim that they did. You keep trying to make a straight line from the simple fact that they played one series in their small arena to some imagined fact that Ohio State places very little value on their hockey program, and another imagined fact that they never will place any value on that program. There is no logical way to assume that straight line unless you know more facts.

As to your question about how many other schools has this happened to, I don't know and don't really care. But how many other programs actually have practice facilities that have seating for 1,000? I would guess that only a limited number of schools even have that capability.

[MafiaMan]

But how many other programs actually have practice facilities that have seating for 1,000? I would guess that only a limited number of schools even have that capability.

The OSU Ice Rink is the home of the Buckeye women's team and FORMER home of the men's program. It would be akin to UND having kept old REA open for practice (pre-flood of 1997, of course) or the Gopher men using the women's Ridder Arena.

[fightingsioux4life]

That's what I've thought and what I've heard. Big Ten Hockey, despite what many people on here say or want to believe, will be a top 3 with the potential to be #1 or #2 in hockey. The world revolves around money and college athletics is no different. The Big Ten schools have more money than schools in any other conference...just depends on how much each school wants to invest in the sport. UM, UW, Michigan, Michigan State all have a solid hockey tradition. I don't expect PSU and OSU to automatically become powerhouses in hockey, but those other four won't be going anywhere...and I believe their programs will get stronger by being in the Big Ten because their schedule will be more friendly to the casual fan who doesn't have alot of college hockey knowledge.

Unless you start paying people to go to games, all that BTN money won't help improve attendance, alumni donations or fan enthusiasm. I am willing to bet that Ohio State's spring football game draws better than any Ohio State hockey game. I hope the Big Ten Hockey Conference is a huge success, as that would strengthen the game as a whole. I just don't know if a 6 team league has enough depth in terms of quality teams.

[jdub27]

Unless you start paying people to go to games, all that BTN money won't help improve attendance, alumni donations or fan enthusiasm. I am willing to bet that Ohio State's spring football game draws better than any Ohio State hockey game. I hope the Big Ten Hockey Conference is a huge success, as that would strengthen the game as a whole. I just don't know if a 6 team league has enough depth in terms of quality teams.

Considering they had 81K+ for their spring game last year (the most in the nation), that is a pretty safe bet.

Not sure what your point is though. UND hockey live chats and likely the spring football game will outdraw basketball games at UND, yet I think most people still expect the basketball team to be competitive in their conference. Just because these aren't the number one sports at those schools and don't have the fan support of those top sports, they can still be successful.

[MafiaMan]

I am willing to bet that Ohio State's spring football game draws better than the cumulative total of all of Ohio State's regular season home and playoff hockey games.

Fixed your post.

[fightingsioux4life]

Fixed your post.

Yeah, that's better!

[jdub27]

Fixed your post.

It will be close (though that was accurate this year). They drew 72K this year for 18 games, which was good for the 19th best average in the nation. I would guess they will go over that by a little bit with what should be a better schedule (more "name" teams) this year.

[dmksioux]

OSU has fired their head coach. What happens if they hire Gwozdecky? If that happens, perhaps it's a signal that OSU is ready to take their hockey program more seriously...