In Memory of the Big 12 Conference ?

[star2city]

The PAC 10 will likely be voting this weekend on accepting UT, aTm, TTU, OU, OSU, and CU for full membership. Texas has essentially given Nebraska an ultimatum to stay within the Big 12 or Texas will accept the Pac 10 offer.

In the mean time, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowas State, and Baylor may very well be left out of the action. All four have posted letters on their website stating their belief that the Big 12 can survive. None of the other Big 12 schools have done that.

Iowa State's statement

Kansas State's statement

Baylor's Statement

Kansas' Statement

New Pac 16

USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon St, UW, WSU

Texas, TA&M, TTU, OU, OSU, CU, Ariz, ASU

New Big 16

Nebraska, Minnesota, Missouri, Iowa, Illinois, Wisconsin, Northwestern, Notre Dame

Michigan, Mich St, Indiana, Purdue, Ohio St, Penn St, Rutgers, Syracuse

New Big 12

Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa State, Cincinnati, Louisville, Tulsa

Memphis, TCU, Houston, Baylor, Tulane, UTEP

[82SiouxGuy]

An interesting perspective by an SEC blogger. It gives his read on the situation for each Big 12 school. I liked this point:

There are only two firm, solid rules to the expansion game:

1. If you are in no danger of losing a member school under any circumstances, you're in a position of strength. Only the SEC, Big Ten, and Pac-10 apply.

2. If you are in danger of losing one or more member schools in any conceivable circumstance, you're in a position of weakness. That's everyone else.

[star2city]

Missouri and Nebraska given ultimatums by Big 12

Texas legislators working to replace Colorado with Baylor to Pac16

[star2city]

Big Ten and BCS caused college football's armegeddon

Imagine, with a 16-team playoff, the Big 12 would have been much wealthier than the football-poor Big 10.

By opposing a playoff, the Big 10 becomes the winner. Delaney is going to destroy college athletics as we know it (including hockey) and install himself as the new NCAA.

[Hayduke]

Unbelievable!

I didn't know any of this was even taking place!

Well, I'm sure the the NCAA is sure proud of their fine scholar athlete position. After all, it's not about the money.

[Shawn-O]

Lost in the Phog: Kansas evidence of basketball's second-class status

If basketball is second-class, where does hockey stand?

[The Sicatoka]

Lost in the Phog: Kansas evidence of basketball's second-class status

If basketball is second-class, where does hockey stand?

There's the king, and everything else. That's where hockey would stand, along with BB and baseball. Like the article says ...

All that matters is football and TV markets. That's it. ... Again, basketball just doesn't register, not even KU's elite basketball program, which is about as important as Cal State-Fullerton's elite baseball program to the conference leaders backstabbing each other in the name of greed.

How irrelevant is Kansas basketball in expansion? So irrelevant that Notre Dame football will likely decide its future.

[Smoggy]

I heard on one of the radio shows (Cowherd maybe?) today that perennial crappy Kentucky said that football is their big money maker. That shows why Kansas bball is second fiddle.

Why am I not not surprised that the Texas legislature is already forcing Baylor on Pac 10. As much as I want Big 10 to get Texas, that's all I want from there. Have fun Pac 10.

[star2city]

I heard on one of the radio shows (Cowherd maybe?) today that perennial crappy Kentucky said that football is their big money maker. That shows why Kansas bball is second fiddle.

Why am I not not surprised that the Texas legislature is already forcing Baylor on Pac 10. As much as I want Big 10 to get Texas, that's all I want from there. Have fun Pac 10.

Supposedly, Louisville makes the largest profit - by a large margin - from basketball, not Kentucky. Louisville requires a large annual seat license. Louisville's AD is also terrified that Louisville may left out of BCS conferences, even with a new 22,000 seat KFC YUM arena opening this fall.

As far as the latest, sounds as if Notre Dame may very well accept a Big Ten Conference offer on a couple of conditions:

that all eleven other Big 10 schools sponsor Notre Dame's AAU membership for research universities and that Notre Dame gains immediate 100% payment and equal sharing of Big Ten profits with no buy-in required.

The whole conference alignment situation seems to hinge on Notre Dame. If NDU accepts, then the Big 10 stops at 12 members. If NDU says "no", then the PAC10, SEC, ACC, and Big10 might all move to 16 members, effectively destroying the Big East. The Big East football members reportedly got a Big East resolution passed that Notre Dame must play Big East Conference football or be evicted for all sports. Notre Dame's special status was becoming even a cancer within the Big East: if the football schools could push them off the deck, the whole conference could be saved.

[farce poobah]

Big Ten and BCS caused college football's armegeddon

Imagine, with a 16-team playoff, the Big 12 would have been much wealthier than the football-poor Big 10.

By opposing a playoff, the Big 10 becomes the winner. Delaney is going to destroy college athletics as we know it (including hockey) and install himself as the new NCAA.

I don't really believe the author's claims. More money from a football playoff would only serve to consolidate the top football teams into fewer conferences - thereby avoiding the need to share $$ with second-tier football schools.

In such a world, the Big 10's TV revenue becomes a "tiebreaker" in getting top football schools to join.

[star2city]

I don't really believe the author's claims. More money from a football playoff would only serve to consolidate the top football teams into fewer conferences - thereby avoiding the need to share $$ with second-tier football schools.

In such a world, the Big 10's TV revenue becomes a "tiebreaker" in getting top football schools to join.

It's not adding "top" football schools: if it did it would consider Cincinnati and West Virginia. Rutgers has never accomplished anything meaningful in football except play the first collegiate game. Missouri's has effectively been a non-player throughout it's history. Notre Dame's program has been a recent joke. The Big 10 is filled with bottom feeder programs (Minn, Indiana, NW, Illinois) and would be quite satisfied with more (Syracuse, Missouri, Rutgers) if they brought in more TV sets.

A football playoff, if truly inclusive, opens up the possibility of a TCU or Boise State to win it all. That was the Big 10's, Big 12's, and Pac 10's concern: it tears down the myth of their invincibility. The Big 10 is especially concerned about a playoff, because it knows it chances of ever winning one are minimal: the Big Ten simple doesn't have the talent base that the SEC, Big 12, Pac10, or even ACC has. Boise St - by recruiting California, TCU with Texas, and USF, with Florida (earlier it was Miami) all have the potential to blow out Big 10 teams. The Big 10 can not tolerate such scenario: so it squelches any "newcomer" with placing financial and competition hurdles to frequent that from happening. The Big 10 wants monopoly control.

[Smoggy]

As far as the latest, sounds as if Notre Dame may very well accept a Big Ten Conference offer on a couple of conditions:

that all eleven other Big 10 schools sponsor Notre Dame's AAU membership for research universities and that Notre Dame gains immediate 100% payment and equal sharing of Big Ten profits with no buy-in required.

I wonder if things (rumors, media, conferences leaping each other for Big 12 schools) hasn't gotten so far out of control that the Big 10 will have no choice but to take a few others than just Notre Dame. If Notre Dame is only school moving does Pac 10 really want all 6 Big 12 schools? Sure Texas is a grab, but I don't think they'll make up enough revenue to offset adding that many schools. Now if they get there own network going and on TVs...different story.

[Smoggy]

As far as the latest, sounds as if Notre Dame may very well accept a Big Ten Conference offer on a couple of conditions:

that all eleven other Big 10 schools sponsor Notre Dame's AAU membership for research universities and that Notre Dame gains immediate 100% payment and equal sharing of Big Ten profits with no buy-in required.

I wonder if things (rumors, media, conferences leaping each other for Big 12 schools) hasn't gotten so far out of control that the Big 10 will have no choice but to take a few others than just Notre Dame. Especially now that Mizzou and Nebraska have an ultimatum. If Notre Dame is only school moving does Pac 10 really want all six Big 12 schools? Sure Texas is a grab, but I don't think they'll make up enough revenue to offset adding that many schools. Now if they get there own network going and on TVs...different story.

[MplsBison]

It's not adding "top" football schools: if it did it would consider Cincinnati and West Virginia. Rutgers has never accomplished anything meaningful in football except play the first collegiate game. Missouri's has effectively been a non-player throughout it's history. Notre Dame's program has been a recent joke. The Big 10 is filled with bottom feeder programs (Minn, Indiana, NW, Illinois) and would be quite satisfied with more (Syracuse, Missouri, Rutgers) if they brought in more TV sets.

A football playoff, if truly inclusive, opens up the possibility of a TCU or Boise State to win it all. That was the Big 10's, Big 12's, and Pac 10's concern: it tears down the myth of their invincibility. The Big 10 is especially concerned about a playoff, because it knows it chances of ever winning one are minimal: the Big Ten simple doesn't have the talent base that the SEC, Big 12, Pac10, or even ACC has. Boise St - by recruiting California, TCU with Texas, and USF, with Florida (earlier it was Miami) all have the potential to blow out Big 10 teams. The Big 10 can not tolerate such scenario: so it squelches any "newcomer" with placing financial and competition hurdles to frequent that from happening. The Big 10 wants monopoly control.

Yep -- we all know that talented football players only come from the south!

Hopefully UND can recruit 75% of its incoming classes from CA, TX and FL!! Otherwise, might as well not even play the games.

[MplsBison]

I wonder if things (rumors, media, conferences leaping each other for Big 12 schools) hasn't gotten so far out of control that the Big 10 will have no choice but to take a few others than just Notre Dame. Especially now that Mizzou and Nebraska have an ultimatum. If Notre Dame is only school moving does Pac 10 really want all six Big 12 schools? Sure Texas is a grab, but I don't think they'll make up enough revenue to offset adding that many schools. Now if they get there own network going and on TVs...different story.

I don't think so.

If Big Ten doesn't take Nebraska and Missouri, then the Big XII is saved...for now. Texas would rather stay in the Big XII with unequal profit sharing than move to the Pac 10.

[bison73]

Yep -- we all know that talented football players only come from the south!

Hopefully UND can recruit 75% of its incoming classes from CA, TX and FL!! Otherwise, might as well not even play the games.

Strange---you said its a waste of money for NDSU to recruit those areas.

[The Sicatoka]

There's some serious concern to our south.

Remember the old line, "Hey, you don't need to make a federal case out of it!" ... well ...

http://www.omaha.com/article/20100609/NEWS...-a-federal-case

An executive at a Big 12 school relayed to The World-Herald on Tuesday that he expects Nebraska to become a member of the Big Ten as early as Friday.

http://www.omaha.com/article/20100608/NEWS...early-as-friday

Why would NU move? More reasons than you think.

http://www.omaha.com/article/20100609/NEWS...f-the-field-too

[Smoggy]

I wonder if things (rumors, media, conferences leaping each other for Big 12 schools) hasn't gotten so far out of control that the Big 10 will have no choice but to take a few others than just Notre Dame. Especially now that Mizzou and Nebraska have an ultimatum. If Notre Dame is only school moving does Pac 10 really want all six Big 12 schools? Sure Texas is a grab, but I don't think they'll make up enough revenue to offset adding that many schools. Now if they get there own network going and on TVs...different story.

Well they have about another week to give the Big 12 there decision. If they say they aren't making the commitment the Pac 10 is offering the Texas schools (& CU?) and probably next week. How long will that offer stand is the question. And of course, damage has been done even if Big 12 stays together.

If I was Nebraska and Missouri I'd be asking the Big 12 to renegotiate that imbalanced revenue. But then Texas might just bolt (however I think Texas is screwed bc they have to stay with all Texas schools).

[the green team]

So just to make sure I have some idea of what's being laid out. Nebraska is the trigger- for the entire conference shake-up. If they go to the Big 10, Texas despite getting rich on unequal profit sharing will then react by going to the Pac 10, taking with it the Oklahoma Schools, Texas A&M, & Texas Tech for sure. That means the Pac10 will complete it's raid with either Baylor or Colorado.

The Big 10, gaining Nebraska wants into the KC, St Louis markets and grabs Missouri. Do they then head east Syracuse, Rutgers, Pitt? & and if 1 or 2 of those schools leave the Big East? is that enough for Notre Dame to move out of being an independent for football?

If Nebraska is the trigger, it is going to be a whole new world as far as BCS conferences are concerned. Actually the Mountain West would do well to gain schools like Colorado, Boise St etc...

I love major college football, Don't get me wrong I love the Sioux and cheer for them dearly, but I just have a passion for Big time football and I don't know if I would like this new look.

At this time I would like to extend a warm welcome to Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St, & Baylor into the Great West Conference. I wonder if they'll accept.

I think they replace nicely: Chicago St, NJIT,

I would then like to re-invite: The school to the South, and SDSU-

Hey this Great West is looking better already

[The Sicatoka]

ESPN top of the hour radio news (I'm streaming 1500 ESPN out of MSP) just reported that their sources have learned that the Nebraska regents have voted to join the Big Ten. Expect the announcement and news conference Friday. (Given ESPN inside sources history, for example "Brett Favre" stories, take it for what it's worth.)

Honestly, that makes sense from a Big Ten POV: Getting Nebraska folds the Big XII; it effectively kills any midwest television competition for their Big Ten Network.

[star2city]

Well they have about another week to give the Big 12 there decision. If they say they aren't making the commitment the Pac 10 is offering the Texas schools (& CU?) and probably next week. How long will that offer stand is the question. And of course, damage has been done even if Big 12 stays together.

If I was Nebraska and Missouri I'd be asking the Big 12 to renegotiate that imbalanced revenue. But then Texas might just bolt (however I think Texas is screwed bc they have to stay with all Texas schools).

If the Big12 had totally balanced revenue, Nebraska would lose money. Nebraska isn't pleased with a number of things: including limited partial qualifiers, Jones' stadium rather than KC as championship venue, the 1 second put back on the clock last year, etc. etc.

Since Notre Dame is hemming and hawing on going to the Big Ten, it appears only Nebraska (not Missouri) is heading there. The Big 10 might stop for the time being. Orangebloods.com: NU to Big10

Missouri may have really screwed themselves, as they might be left in the Big 12.

Pac16

USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, OSU, OU, UW, Wazzou

ASU, UA, OU, OSU, TTU, aTm, UT, CU

New Big 12

Kansas

Kansas St

Missouri

Iowa St

+BYU or Utah

+Colo St or Air Force

Baylor

+Houston

+TCU

+Memphis

+Louisville

+Cincinnati

New Big East (football) - very vulnerable if SEC / ACC go to 16

Rutgers

Syracuse

UConn

Pitt

WVU

USF

+UCF

+Temple

MWC (losing TCU, AFA or CSU, BYU or UTah)

UNM

AFA or CSU

BYU or UU

+Boise St

Wyoming

UNLV

SDSU

+Fresno St

+Nevada

WAC (losing Boise, La Tech, Fresno, Nevada) may not survive

Hawaii - might go independent in FB and in Big West otherwise

San Jose St - drop to FCS and Big West?

Idaho

NMexSt

UTah St

(add three of UCDavis, Cal Poly, Sac St, Portland St, Montana, MSU, Texas St)

CUSA (losing UCF, Houston, Memphis)

Adds La Tech

Adds UTSA

Adds FAU or FIU

Sunbelt

Adds Ga St

[Shawn-O]

If you had said a week ago that Lincoln, Nebraska would become the center of all this I'd have said you were nuts. This is remarkable.

[The Sicatoka]

If you had said a week ago that Lincoln, Nebraska would become the center of all this I'd have said you were nuts. This is remarkable.

They've always thought they are the center of everything in Lincoln.

[star2city]

Might expect the SEC to make one last ditch attempt on adding Texas (four teams of UT, aTm, TTU, and Baylor). Although the SEC would want OU and doesn't want TTU or Baylor, UT would catch *@)$# if it screwed TTU when the Pac10 had an open offer.

In that case Oklahoma and Okie State could also be really messed with. Without Texas, the Pac10 isn't offering Oklahoma schools.

[MplsBison]

There's no reason for the MWC teams to leave now. They know the Big XII is dead.

Pac 10 - UW, WSU, UO, OSU, Cal, Stan, UCLA, USC, UA, ASU, OU, OkSU, UT, TAM, TT, Bay

Big XII - dead

Big 10 - NU, UI, Minn, Wisc, NW, Ill, IU, PU, Mich, MSU, OSU, PSU

MWC - ISU, Mizzou, KU, KSU, CU, CSU, AFA, Wyo, Utah, BYU, UNM, TCU, UNLV, SDSU, Boise, Houston

SEC - Same

ACC - Same

Big East - Same