iramurphy

Joe Mollberg scored 23 against Grand Rapids last week and Brian Labatt rejected a couple of key shots from their 6'7" post player last week to lead Detroit Lakes to a win over one of the top ranked teams in Minnesota. With those points, Mollberg becomes the leading scorer in DL history. Earlier this year Labatt became the leading rebounder in DL history. These two guys could be pretty special for UND in the years to come. Both great kids and great athletes. (Mollberg's girlfriend needs 2 points to hit the 1000 point mark in Thursday's playoff game against TRF to become one of the leading scorers in DL girls history. She is the daughter of former UND All-American FB player Paul Muckenhirn and she also will attend UND but won't be playing FB).

I was told that one of the UND FB alumni was buying them.

It's that simple only for the simple minded, David.

Has nothing to do with integrity. There are people on both sides of this issue, even those radicals on both sides who have integrity. The minunderstanding of this issue and associating the importance of this name or a fight with a private organization making rules we don't like is not the same as the civil war, the civil rights movement, or the atrocities of WWII. There are those with no integrity but not because of their stance on this issue. You want to take a stance for what is right, how about taking a stance against the politicians who are using UND as a pawn in their private battle to gain control of the SBoHE? Keep in mind the constitution does in fact protect the SBoHE for this exact reason.

Watched game on NBC Cable Sports network. One of more impressive games from Sioux in years. Similar to last year in Regions when we beat Denver 6-1. Outhustled, out hit and clearly outplayed Denver until the last 5 minutes. Lamoureaux's and Pattyn's penalties were inexcusable when we should have had a power play earlier in game . Junior hockey crap. We went into a defensive shell after our fourth goal and lost our edge and our focus. We should have stayed agressive. Don't know if that was our plan or it just happened. We got out of position defensively on their second goal and Lamoureaux left his man on the face off on Zucker's goal at the end to leave Eidsness against a great shooter at point blank range. Where did he think he was going? It will be interesting to see if we can start tonight like we did last night rather than start how we finished, This team plays the rest of the year like they did most of this game and they will be tough for anyone to beat.They play like they did the last 5 minutes and take stupid penalties it will be tough. This time of year we can't have those 5 minute lapses.

Then you will be stuck at home watching the Raiders on TV. If UND gets sanctioned and we lose recruits (evidence presented by Lennon that is already occuring}, we don't get into the Big Sky ( I think we probably will, but there is a real threat as outlined by Fullerton), we lose games.(aleady occuring) then you won't have a team to call the Fighting Sioux. UND alumni aren't going to spend money to support an NAIA school which seems to be what you prefer. UND fans would rather see quality athletic events in a quality conference than watch UND play Crookston, Minot State, U of Mary etc. Not sure why it seems so difficult to see that. Maybe after watching the Raiders the last few years you see those schools as a step up?

That would work for those who sold their soul to the Fighting Sioux in the first place and very few of us are that stupid. You talk as if the NCAA didn't give us an out. They did and we didn't take advantage of that in 2005 when we only needed one tribe for the ok.. You were likely sitting in your living room watching your Raiders because you weren't doing anything to help the rest of us. They didn't "back us into a corner" they simply told us the party is by invitation only and because it is their party, there is a dress code and we have to wear a tuxedo. We asked if we could wear a suit and tie and they said we could beut we had to show up on time and we had to have a date. We didnt' show up on time with the date so they said then we had to wear a tuxedo. We had the opportunity to come to their party as invited and neither UND, the State of N.Dak.nor the Tribal councils showed up properly dressed and on time. We showed up late with a sport coat and turtle neck and no date and asked if we could get in. They said OK but then we had to go home and dress in a suit and tie and bring two dates but had to be there before midnight. We didn't do that either. Now we sit outside looking in and we are no longer welcome on those terms. We can still party with these folks but we are going to have to wear the tuxedo and begging or threatening to crash their party doesn't work. I tried to make a simple analogy for the simple folks who don't get it. This has nothing to do with the ultimate sacrifice. If you really believe that Dave, put down the remote and get out and explore the world. Don't forget to turn the tV off.

No it wouldn't. We are better off in the Big Sky. So would the other Dakota Schools in the long run, but time will tell.There is more flexibility there and we also need to be prepared to move FB up if the opportunity arises. If Montana goes, we should go. Not going to happen in the near future, but we can't get caught short like we did before. There are a lot of kids who like the idea of going to a smaller school in a smaller community and competing at the highest level. UND and NDSU need to be prepared to make that move if the opportunity arises.

What about North Dakota "Spirit". It embodies the Spirit of the Fighting Sioux Spirit and the name could have meaning to our Native American brethren. It embodies the Spirit of those settlers and pioneers who braved the elements and killed Bison to survive the frozen cold of the prarie. Whether or not we make it the Fighting Spirit or simply Spirit could be food for thought. Spirit would embody the Spirit of those who have come before us. Ira Friendberg. Red Jarrett. Jake Stocker. Fritz Pollard. Arjan Gelling. Not just Cliff Purpur but Al Purpur who took care of the athletic fields and the hockey arena when we played at the "old barn". The Pudenz sisters and Jenny Crouse and Sherry Kleinsasser. It would embody not only the spirit of John Noah and Ralph Englestad but also chester Fritz and Kenny Hyslop. It would embody the Spirit of the fans like the Burfennings and Jack Gray. It would remind us that guys like Jeff "Jeff-Jeff" Anderson who was the consumate Sioux fan and although had special needs was one of the first donors when money was raised for the first Englestad Arena. It would embody the Spirit of baseball players like Gary Royal and Corey Nyhus and the Koch brother and Bruce Daucsavage. The wrestlers and Swimmers and Cross Country and Track athletes who were All-Americans or simply role players who helped make those All Americans who they are. . It would embody the Spirit of those who have fought hard for the name and still fight for it. We could get Ben Brien the artist who did the logo to redo one with that Spirit in mind. If the NCAA were to ever relent we could revert back to the Fighting Sioux if we get the blessing of the tribes and an assurance we won't face penalties. In a way we stick it to the NCAA by incorporating the culture of all of those people of the state including Native Americans and our students, athletes, coaches and fans that have made this university and the athletic teams great.

no

Obviously, Honest ABE met you Fetch. How the hell old are you???

What you don't seem to understand is that Hakstol stood by his convictions. His contract was not a factor in his statement. He is not in favor of losing the name and logo and he isn't being forced to make a statement. He is smart enough to see the harm these sanctions will cause UND hockey and therfore he stated that. He has spoken out in order to defend his program. Dale Lennon has confirmed the issue has UND FB in recruiting. Anyone who thinks hockey recruiting is not hurt by this are fools. Hakstol is also aware of that fact. There is no one in there right mind who understands intercollegiate athletics that doesn't understand sanctions by the NCAA will hurt UND hockey and UND athletics. Not being in the Big Sky or similar conference will destroy UND athletics. Calling people sheep or insinuating Hakstol was coerced is foolish. I read the letter from the SL folks and I thought it was well written. They are being told that UND officials are making up the real threat to the Big Sky membership and they are told that the NCAA will cave in if the State of N.DAk. would force the name on UND. What they are being told is not true. Just like the NCAA believed the crap they were told by the Jeanottes and Longies about the name being hostile and abusive, these folks are believing the crap they are told by the Frank Burgraffs and name supporters. Simply put the NCAA gave UND the same chance that FSU, Utah and Central Michigan took advantage of and that was support by one named trib in 2005. Don't come now and blame UND or UND officials because the tribes didnt' want to help back then There is ample evidence that if UND brings the name back the same cast of Characters will be picketing and lobbying against the name. UND needs to move on. All of the things UND stands for is unchanged and UND can still provide the same programming and advantages for our State's Native American students.

Wrong. They may schedule whomever they wish and all they need to do is state that FSU, Utah or whomever are not under sanctions by the NCAA.

No, they may choose to schedule whomever they wish. It isn't a legal issue.

That would be great. He believes that I am sure, but all of that could happen without forcing the name issue on UND. Too many factors out of UND's control to risk the future of UND hockey and UND athletics on the opinion of a few people. The NCAA wouldn't relent when legislation was passed by the legislature. Get Standing Rock to relent, then we can start figuring our if we can then get the NCAA to move back on this issue. In the meantime, our teams and athletes have new conferences to join and games to win. The name will have to be a lower priority until we know for sure we will be held harmless.

Burgraff's statement is another example of the misinformation some in his group have been spreading when they took the petitions around. First of all, if you look at the the list of contributors to UND athletics published in the UND hockey program, it does not contain Frank's name for some reason. His comments about Dave Hakstol is why I would never go to war with a guy like Frank. You can't count on him to have your back. Frank takes a shot at Hakstol for stating the obvious. Frank would not be privy to negotiations between UND and Hakstol. A government employer could face complaints were they to make an employee make public statements concerning polictical issues such as this. He didn't have to say anything and his future at UND is not in jeopardy. What might gain credibility for Frank would be if he had countered Dave's opinion with facts and he didn't do that. Hakstol has the best interest of UND and UND hockey in mind. It is obvious Frank Burgraff is uninformed and does not have the best interest of either UND nor UND hockey as his top priority. He uses a combination of the emotions and affection people have for the name, with the disdain we have for the NCAA, with rumors and partial facts and supposition, to confuse some and convince others that his measures will somehow defeat the NCAA, the SBoHE and allow UND to retain the name without penalty or harm and that is just not accurate. Taking a shot at David Hakstol for speaking the truth tells me a lot about the character of one of our former (very mediocore) hockey players. He won't let facts or truth confuse him as he plows blindly forward. What an embarassment.

Appreciate Dave's support and insight. He sums things up pretty clearly, the threat to UND and UND athletics has become too serious and the name and logo and what we like about it, does not out weigh the risk to UND and UND athletics including hockey.

I agree let the Bison have the first game, then alternate. Might be good to play in Bismarck but I don't think their Stadium at Bismarck State (or whatever they are called) is big enough. They should play WBB or MBB in Bismarck but that is for a different thread. I wouldn't take it our of state. You would also take the revenues for Businesses in Fargo or Grand Forks that they won't want to give up.

You are correct. As long as UND was D2 they did not get their share of Frozen Four revenues. We lost about $400,000 per year. the expense money UND received fro the NCAA didn't usually cover our costs. The D2 issue vs D1 issue is irrelevant because we would still have the same sanctions regardless of which Division we are in. They are both NCAA. Would there still be an NCC? With SDSU, USD and the AC all gone maybe, probably not but we woudl give up the home playoff games which is a big deal for FB whether you are D1 or D2. D2 became so watered down and was losing scholarships. With 14,000 students and the history of UND athletics and academic excellence, we outgrew D2. Dolphinswin: UND is a hockey school but not hockey only. Get the WBB or MBB or FB into the tournament and you will learn that UND will support any successful program and especially hockey, BB, or FB. Force the logo and name issue on UND and you will learn we are not a "hockey school" we are a University with a great hockey program with a great tradition. The great tradition of UND hockey does not need nor has it ever needed the name for its success and tradition. How many National titles have we won since the team moved into the Ralph??? How many did UND win when they played in the old quonset? How many did they win playing in the old Ralph that didn't have the name and logos everywhere? I want a successful hockey program a lot more than a name or logo that without NCAA approval hurts my hockey team. We will end up a bunch or rubes with a great logo and name and beautiful arena and no where to go.

Coach you are correct you didn't say that, but others have. I also believe your comments about Ralph and what he said are correct.

The NCAA has said repeatedly they can to live with it. They can afford to because they lose nothing. We can't afford to, because we lose too much, maybe everything. Why would anyone in their right mind want to subject our hockey teams (forget the other teams for now) to those sanctions? Don't forget the NCAA, as part of their policy, also encourages member institutions not to schedule teams on their sanction list. Over 400 member schools voted to support their policy. The list is growing. Anyone who thinks that the scheduling part of this sanction by itself won't hurt UND hockey is living in a bubble that does not allow logical discussion or thinking. You can't have ever coached or recruited at the college level. There are kids out there who do factor in who is on our schedule. Dont' forget how pissed we get when we lose a kid to Juniors in Canada. Don't kid yourself, every college hockey coach in the country with an IQ above 50 will use this as a tool against us. They can tell kids anything they wish about how this will hurt our scheduling. If you are going to continue to support the name despite NCAA sanctions then you are going to be part of a group of people who set UND hockey back 50 years and the Ralph in all its glory will not be enough to neutralize the damage. The only way to fight the NCAA is by backing the litigation by the Spirit Lake tribe. I don't know if they will be able to force the NCAA to review and change their discriminatory policy against Native American names and logos, but changing the State consitution or trying to force UND to keep the name in face of these sanctions and penalities is not in the best interest of our hockey team and especially not our University or athletic dept. The high regard we hold our hockey team is not shared by everyone else in the country nor even in the hockey world. There are those who despise us because of our success and there are those who feel because we are from N. Dak. we are irrelevant. We all want to fight the injustice of the NCAA but sitting with an athletic dept. and hockey team in shambles with sword in hand standing on our principles is the wrong approach. We need to somehow live to fight another day. If we go down this path led by people who don't have a stake in this fight or have an axe to grind with either the SBoHE or UND we are going to get burned and once that happens it will be too late. This name issue and issues with the SBoHE or legislature need to be separated from UND athletics so UND can move on with what is more important to UND and that is the viability of our hockey team and athletic dept. Those of you who don't care about atheltics, it will affect the viability or our University if we end up losing the standing and prestige our athletic teams now have. I have heard too many times that once we stand up to the NCAA or once we get a tribe to support us or once we get the legislature to pass a law etc,. the NCAA will back down and the conferences around the country wil want to take us in. That isn't happening and in fact no one other than Spirit Lake has stepped up to the plate. I appreciate that, but had they done so in 2005, we would have met the criteria the other schools did to keep the name. It is too late for that now.

That's why we are screwed.

Over 400,000 hits on this. The kid is a senior at Detroit Lakes and a member of the White Earth reservation. He was a hell of a FB player but some idiot convinced him to quit FB and focus on hockey. I dont' know who he scored against but it was an away game. There were some nasty comments about his hair which is part of his culture. He also competes in Native American dancing competition. Good kid, good student. Pretty good hockey player on a below average team. Goal reminds me of Evan Trupp's move in the Final Five and his recent goal in his minor league game.

A couple of things that need to be clarified. First of all, Ralph did not get Baker fired. The SBoHE made the decision and it wasn't related to the name and logo nor to Ralph's gift. Ralph's gift never required UND to keep the name and logo. After he was told it was ok and then later Kuppy balked, he got pissed and threatened to walk away from the unfinished arena. The SBoHE had their meeting scheduled before Ralph sent his famous letter and they already planned to direct UND to keep the name and logo. That may have had something to do with pressure from UND supporters and Alumni and a reported threat from Dean Blais to quit if UND dumped the name. Wanless wasn't fired by the SBoHE. However he ended his employment, it was UND's doing, not the SBoHE. I do not know if Ralph had anything to do with Wanless leaving UND. I am not stating Ralph didn't make statements others said he made, I am saying the decisions by the SBoHE weren't due to pressure from Ralph. Anyone who serves on a public board like this would know it is poor form to bend to threats from wealthy benfactors. To state the SBoHE made a decision about a UND president based on dislike by a benefactor I do not believe is accurate.

I agree with you but short of the litigation by the Spirit Lake Tribe they don't seem to care what we think.