BIGSIOUX Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 I wore my Kell's t-shirt back from Cancun and I had several people come up to me and tell me how great of a time they have had there. One couple even told me the story of how their son met his wife there..... Everyone loves Kell's! i ate there friday, its a bit of an optometry hangout as well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrygunSue Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Not agreeing with you, pointing out the flaws in your dissenting view point is necessary when someone is as clueless as you about the issue at hand. You keep bringing up 'some of the people' who disagree with UND's use of the Sioux name and logo and I point out more persons than don't want UND to keep the name and logo. You've insulted Dr. Kupchella, you insult people such as myself who don't agree with you and you've been insulted. All seems pretty democratic to me. Keep posting ridiculous statements, keep showing your lack of knowledge and I'll keep pointing it out. Darn it. Keep that up and I might start to cry. I didn't mean to insult Dr. K. I just think he seems like a ranting buffoon (did I get it right that time?) that will alienate the University and that this stance that he has made will only harm our cause. The guy ought to be removed. Other than that, I think he's been a great leader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 If one person is offended by the Sioux being the Sioux, then the NCAA ought to step in. Excuse me, I have to go puke..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Darn it. Keep that up and I might start to cry. I didn't mean to insult Dr. K. I just think he seems like a ranting buffoon (did I get it right that time?) that will alienate the University and that this stance that he has made will only harm our cause. The guy ought to be removed. Other than that, I think he's been a great leader. I agree with Dr. K but if we went around removing peopelthat we did not agree with all the time then there would be no politicians(not a bad idea)but it would not be good. I think it this point Kupchella had every right to finally take the gloves off. It was long over due. Orygunsue will disagree, but did you ever speak your mind after a boss, spouse or even a friend did not listen to reason. THen you know exactly why Kup said what needed to be said. The NCAA is acting like a bunch of idiots and saying we made a rule and tha tis that. But wait a minute this school in FLorida brings us a lot of money and this school in North Dakota not as much therefore we will just hang the school in North Dakota out to dry. No biggie what could they ever do to us. Well it is time the find out what UND could do. Orygunsue you think that name is outdated. Do you know any Native Americans that are of Sioux decent that disagree with the nickname? I know several and they all think it is great and want UND to keep it. I just want you to answer this then, why is it OK for Notre Dame to be the Fighting Irish? is that not racial towards a group of people. Or any school with a Viking type name. I am Norweigian, should I demand that they be forced to change their name. Seriously I would like you to answer these questions. Sorry all for the long rant. Once again...GO Sioux and Sioux forever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 I didn't mean to insult Dr. K. I just think he seems like a ranting buffoon (did I get it right that time?) that will alienate the University and that this stance that he has made will only harm our cause. The guy ought to be removed. Other than that, I think he's been a great leader. That banging you hear is my head against my laptop screen! Since you can't win with facts, your intent is clearly to drive me mad!! *Sylvia, is that you Sylvia?* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Excuse me, I have to go puke..... I am one person and I am offended by the Minnesota Vikings should the NFL make them change their name? My wife is Irish, Notre Dame change your name. My son was bitten by a Gopher, Minnesota change your name. OrygunSue anyone can be offended by anything if the want to live their lives being offended by things. Maybe it is time for the PC crowd to grow the "F" up! It has gotten old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 That banging you hear is my head against my laptop screen! Since you can't win with facts, your intent is clearly to drive me mad!! *Sylvia, is that you Sylvia?* I thought I heard a loud noise, can you hold it down....Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrygunSue Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 I agree with Dr. K but if we went around removing peopelthat we did not agree with all the time then there would be no politicians(not a bad idea)but it would not be good. I think it this point Kupchella had every right to finally take the gloves off. It was long over due. Orygunsue will disagree, but did you ever speak your mind after a boss, spouse or even a friend did not listen to reason. THen you know exactly why Kup said what needed to be said. The NCAA is acting like a bunch of idiots and saying we made a rule and tha tis that. But wait a minute this school in FLorida brings us a lot of money and this school in North Dakota not as much therefore we will just hang the school in North Dakota out to dry. No biggie what could they ever do to us. Well it is time the find out what UND could do. Orygunsue you think that name is outdated. Do you know any Native Americans that are of Sioux decent that disagree with the nickname? I know several and they all think it is great and want UND to keep it. I just want you to answer this then, why is it OK for Notre Dame to be the Fighting Irish? is that not racial towards a group of people. Or any school with a Viking type name. I am Norweigian, should I demand that they be forced to change their name. Seriously I would like you to answer these questions. Sorry all for the long rant. Once again...GO Sioux and Sioux forever! Sure, there are times that you should speak out. This just shouldn't be one of those times. UND has too much other stuff going on with the NCAA to let this issue trancend everything else. Sioux-cia, do you need me to hold your hair back? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Sure, there are times that you should speak out. This just shouldn't be one of those times. UND has too much other stuff going on with the NCAA to let this issue trancend everything else. Sioux-cia, do you need me to hold your hair back? Thank goodness your not on the "We Decide What Is Important" UND Board!! Are you really so naive' that you believe that the path the University takes regarding the name issue is President Kupchella's decision? He's not alone in this. Also, I wouldn't worry about 'the other stuff going on'; nothing is being neglected. You obviously do not believe that this is an important issue. Thank goodness there are enough fans and alumni that recognize it for what it is and are going to support and fund any legal action the University takes to right this wrong. Thanks anyway, I want to keep my hair! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Darn it. Keep that up and I might start to cry. I didn't mean to insult Dr. K. I just think he seems like a ranting buffoon (did I get it right that time?) that will alienate the University and that this stance that he has made will only harm our cause. The guy ought to be removed. Other than that, I think he's been a great leader. I just wanted to say that since this whole nickname issue fired up, I have a new-found respect for Dr. Kupchella. I think he has handled it very well in taking a hard stance against the NCAA. His latest letter just reaffirms my new opinion of him. And in regards to the hypocrisy (sp?) in the manner this resolution was implemented by the NCAA, I can't seem to find it now, but I believe I recently read that of the original 17 schools on the list that there are only 5 or 6 that are still on it including UND. That is pretty bad if you ask me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nodaker Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 If one person is offended by the Sioux being the Sioux, then the NCAA ought to step in. OrygunSue = Phil Jackson Go Sioux!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewey Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Phil Jackson is very strange. Just ask anyone from Williston or anyone who played with him in the late 60's at UND. He's basically a fully baked hippie throw back who barely acknowledges his ND connection. I guess I'm glad about this because he's such a knob. He'd probably be relegated to anonymity if not for Shaq, Kobe, Michael Jordan and Pippen (sp?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 If this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...then why is this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyMom Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 If this isn't hostile or abusive... That is the best post in this entire thread. Thank you for posting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxmama Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 That is the best post in this entire thread. Thank you for posting it. Ummm...PCM, you da man! Where do you come up with all of these things? I'm impressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrygunSue Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 If this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...and this isn't hostile or abusive... ...then why is this? This whole argument is flawed. I don't deny that the NCAA is being inconsistent in its ruling to these universities, but if it WERE consistent, then everybody would be asked to change rather than complete acceptance of Native American symbols by any university that chooses to adorn on on themselves. This is 2006. Some (maybe only a few) people are offended by these symbols. It's a distraction from all of the good things that UND stands for. Dr. K ought to recognize that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 This whole argument is flawed. I don't deny that the NCAA is being inconsistent in its ruling to these universities, but if it WERE consistent, then everybody would be asked to change rather than complete acceptance of Native American symbols by any university that chooses to adorn on on themselves. This is 2006. Some (maybe only a few) people are offended by these symbols. It's a distraction from all of the good things that UND stands for. Dr. K ought to recognize that. Ummm.... Now I'm confused. I thought that this was a distraction caused by the NCAA months ago. This wasn't Kup's fault. Isn't Kup's distraction being caused by the NCAA's distraction? The NCAA isn't supposed to be legislating individual school's policies. I seem to remember something about the NCAA standing for National Collegiate Athletic something or other. Also, if only a few people are offended by these symbols, why are we talking about it here; and why does the NCAA even care? Wouldn't they just say that they are staying out of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 What are the odds of "Orygun Sue" being another poster who has been banned or suspended? Same ad hominum attacks, poor grammar, sophomoric logic, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 For the folks that just don't "get" what Dr. Kupchella is doing: I hope you understand that as the chief executive officer of the University of North Dakota, I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 This whole argument is flawed. I don't deny that the NCAA is being inconsistent in its ruling to these universities, but if it WERE consistent, then everybody would be asked to change rather than complete acceptance of Native American symbols by any university that chooses to adorn on on themselves. This is 2006. Some (maybe only a few) people are offended by these symbols. It's a distraction from all of the good things that UND stands for. Dr. K ought to recognize that. You just can't get past that brick wall can you? As Flatland has stated, Dr. Kupchella is not the cause of this situation. He is protecting us from the opinions of Myles and like minded University Presidents. The NCAA has yet to present any facts/evidence that the use of the Sioux name and logo is hostile and abusive to Native Americans. No actions of hostility or abuse, some Native Americans just don't like it. I don't like what your saying in this forum so you be banned from it, you should be banned from using any internet service, you should be banned from using any computer. That way I won't run across and be offended by what you think. You could still get your information from television, newspaper, and/or radio. You could write letters to the editor by hand or typewriter stating your opinion in that media form. I will be protected from your opinion. I'm only one person but I am one person who you are offending. If one person is offended by the Sioux being the Sioux, then the NCAA ought to step in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 You just can't get past that brick wall can you? As Flatland has stated, Dr. Kupchella is not the cause of this situation. He is protecting us from the opinions of Myles and like minded University Presidents. The NCAA has yet to present any facts/evidence that the use of the Sioux name and logo is hostile and abusive to Native Americans. No actions of hostility or abuse, some Native Americans just don't like it. I don't like what your saying in this forum so you be banned from it, you should be banned from using any internet service, you should be banned from using any computer. That way I won't run across and be offended by what you think. You could still get your information from television, newspaper, and/or radio. You could write letters to the editor by hand or typewriter stating your opinion in that media form. I will be protected from your opinion. I'm only one person but I am one person who you are offending. I completely agree with you Sioux-Cia. I make excellent points. I think that people do not think this all the way through and the jsut dig in their heels and never change their minds even when they have been proven wrong. Thanks for the excellent posts....Go Sioux! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Oregon Sioux (spelled as such because I refuse to misspell either word) is what we call an act utilitarian in the ethical sense. Act Utilitarian ethicists believe that, since a minority of people believe that the majority is wrong, the majority should take some action akin to remedy. Funny thing, really, utilitarianism is RARELY seen nowadays among ethical circles because it's just downright assinine. To be true utilitarian either the minority must rule completely over the majority (a totalitarian arrangement) or the majority must rule over the minority (which, in some areas like religious influence, the US is heading towards). Both sides are extreme. Extremism is the best way to destroy everything Americans have worked hard for, fought for, and died for in the 230 years in which we've been a sovereign nation. It doesn't matter if you are extreme left or extreme right. ANY extreme is destructive, harmful, and truly hostile towards the American way of life. No, it shouldn't be made 'illegal' to have such beliefs, but I think it should be marginalized, or largely ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjw007 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 I do not believe that FSU covered all aspects of their case. I am not going back and research it for sure, but I believe that I recall there is a branch of the Seminole tribe in Oklahoma that vocally opposed FSU using Seminoles but the NCAA approved it based on the Florida tribe saying its ok. Well, the Spirit Lake has an official resolution supporting UND use of Fighting Sioux, but other tribes do not. That is the NCAA hypocrisy. Treating a big time Division I institution one way while treating UND differently. Originally, the NCAA denied Florida State because it didn't have the support of the Oklahoma Seminoles. Later it was discovered that it was 2 members of the Oklahoma Seminoles out of, I think, 16 board members who didn't approve. The NCAA changed its mind after that (and the threat of a lawsuit including the State of Florida) discovery. Of course, it seemed the NCAA's initial version was if one person didn't like it, then it should be banned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjw007 Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Sure, there are times that you should speak out. This just shouldn't be one of those times. UND has too much other stuff going on with the NCAA to let this issue trancend everything else. Sioux-cia, do you need me to hold your hair back? Actually, you will never find a better topic no matter what side of the issue you are on. If you are for keeping the existing name, you have items like freedom of speech and expression, protection from monopolistic organizations, etc. If you are on the other side, you have pride, protection of an identity and culture, etc. Both sides have points and it should be discused. It would be hostile and abrusive to brush the native Americans under the table and forget about them. Remember, Brand suggested that the Universities follow the example of Iowa and Wisconsin which have few native Americans students (off the top of my head I want to say 5 combined but I really need to get factual information). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Remember, Brand suggested that the Universities follow the example of Iowa and Wisconsin which have few native Americans students (off the top of my head I want to say 5 combined but I really need to get factual information). It's more than five, but far less than 400. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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