Buning Says UND Moving

[sultan]

Contrarian is an excellent word to describe McFeely. But I can think of an even more descriptive term in this instance: hypocrite. From McFeely's 1/18/2002 column Division I is NDSU's green light:

So, in 2002 McFeely was obviously convinced that Division II and the NCC were the places to be for NDSU. But now in hindsight he's criticizing UND for not tagging along? Whatever. I think next time the "particularly prescient sports columnist" needs to dig a little farther into his own archives unless he enjoys looking like a fool.

RD17 do you know how to have McFeeley read what you just wrote? Does he have an E-Mail address? I know McFeeley admits reading Bisonville. I suppose a person could send a comment to the Forum or some blog. It would be fun to have McFeeley and other people see how silly his comments really look. Anyway RD17 that was a very good post. Your right, he should pull up all his posts about the subject and not just the posts that him look good.

[rabidrabbit]

Believe it or nor, there were some rather serious reasons:

- The time to post-season eligibility for a UND DI men's basketball team has been reduce from 13 years to 5* years since NDSU declared. (*- if UND is an autobid conference member)

- UND hosted the DII men's basketball championship in 2005 and formerly had hopes of hosting other events - like the DII football championship at the Alerus. The attendance at the DII championship was "not favorable".

- The name issue - what better time to resolve a lack of home field issues if you don't have post-season eligibility?

- The future of GFAFB was highly in doubt. No way were local boosters going to pony up more money if GF unemployment became 20%.

- GF was still in post-flood recovery. Not an ideal time whatsover. Now, does the F-L-*-*-* word even come up?

- UND had no idea what the financials would look like with the REA and Alerus. It now has five years of knowledge.

My own Monday-morning quarterbacking is why didn't we, or NDSU, or SDSU, go DI in 1980 or 1990 or 2000? The rules then were much more lenient. Very few fans have a clue of how much the new DI transition rules punish (enacted in 2002) new DI schools. Schools that moved pre-2002 are already core DI schools. NDSU will not be a core DI school until 2016. UND not until 2019 at the earliest. Core DI schools are the only type schools that help conferences maintain their autobids.

The important thing is to make a decision, and then stick with it for the next 10 years (or more). Stay D-II, hold the NCC together, and enjoy being a top program in a weakened division. Go D-IAA, renew your play against NDSU, SDSU, and maybe even UNC fairly quickly. Expect to spend a couple of years as an everything but football independent. Adjust, and get back to being the competitor you've always been, but now at a higher level. Despite many of the dire words from just south fans, generally, you'd be welcomed again.

[RD17]

RD17 do you know how to have McFeeley read what you just wrote? Does he have an E-Mail address? I know McFeeley admits reading Bisonville. I suppose a person could send a comment to the Forum or some blog. It would be fun to have McFeeley and other people see how silly his comments really look. Anyway RD17 that was a very good post. Your right, he should pull up all his posts about the subject and not just the posts that him look good.

Yes, McFeely's email address is listed at the end of his column but it didn't occur to me before to contact him directly. I think I will send him an email asking him to explain his contradictory statements and see if I get a response.

[NanoBison]

To the person who said, you've already given up on competing with MIT and the likes...

We aren't competing with them, we are doing research with them. Of course, in terms of research

grants in general, we're competing with the same pool everyone else is competing against for NSF dollars.

http://www.ndsu.edu/research/article.php?article_number=72

My favorite part of the article :

"NDSU being selected to work on the project shows what a world-class education center it is", Dorgan said.

[SiouxMD]

To the person who said, you've already given up on competing with MIT and the likes...

We aren't competing with them, we are doing research with them. Of course, in terms of research

grants in general, we're competing with the same pool everyone else is competing against for NSF dollars.

http://www.ndsu.edu/research/article.php?article_number=72

My favorite part of the article :

"NDSU being selected to work on the project shows what a world-class education center it is", Dorgan said.

High words of praise from an UND alumnus.

[SiouxMeNow]

To the person who said, you've already given up on competing with MIT and the likes...

We aren't competing with them, we are doing research with them. Of course, in terms of research

grants in general, we're competing with the same pool everyone else is competing against for NSF dollars.

http://www.ndsu.edu/research/article.php?article_number=72

My favorite part of the article :

"NDSU being selected to work on the project shows what a world-class education center it is", Dorgan said.

WOW!! You got a politician to support you!! KUDO'S!!!! CASE CLOSED!! I hope he has more to say on how great you are!

SERIOUSLY -- Do you think anyone in public office would say anything less than something complementary for whatever situation he finds himself in? If so - YOU need a college education! I suggest UND...

[NanoBison]

People, People, People... I'm just telling you were working with MIT, no need to get all up in arms about it....

(But it was a good thing being said from Dorgan wasn't it???... maybe all of UND should take heed and realize that there are 2, yep I said it, 2 good institutions in this state...) It might make the world, or at least our little corner of it, a better place....

Ok, let the daily NDSU and NanoBison bashing begin ...

[GeauxSioux]

.. maybe all of UND should take heed and realize that there are 2, yep I said it, 2 good institutions in this state...) It might make the world, or at least our little corner of it, a better place....

I know about UND. What was the other one again?

[IowaBison]

Everyone one who has read the Final Report to Kupchella, all of it, including the fiscal sub-committee data and the attachments, raise their hand.

Well, I see mine up.

I read it and saw a set of simple facts and data. It doesn't all say "go" nor does it all say "stay". I saw issues I hadn't seen before. It was about as unbiased a report as any I'd seen. There was no "tone" to it, positive or negative.

For example, I see this random tossing about of "additional $1,000,000.00" being scoffed by some folks as a huge understimate. Guess what: Scoffing is correct! UND's report says so:

I read honest assessments of present dollars, possible revenues, areas of strength, areas of weakness.

What I read in the report primarily, however, is what I've said all along:

Answer either "cost" or "conference" and you have your answer.

I expect we'll be receiving our answer shortly.

I did last week during a lunch break.

I thought it was relatively disappointing. There were mistakes, ommissions, and shotty work in many parts.

I agree that the issues are cost and conference. However, I felt that the report did nothing to estimate anywhere near the true cost of a move (or stay). For UND to make a move without those numbers in hand would be quite surprising. Of course, the coaches and staff could probably churn those out in a couple of weeks.

[The Sicatoka]

... the true cost of a move (or stay).

How do you measure the true cost of a "stay"?

There have to be impacts beyond fiscal in a long-term view.

I'd say we could look at the budgets of the SUs for a move estimate, but asking to see those budgets just gets me in trouble.

At least the report was honest enough to admit that it wasn't best qualified to make either estimate and that more work needed to be done.

[IowaBison]

The report stated in a number of places that numbers for staying DII were needed in order for a comparison to be made. I agree with that opinion.

[DI IN FARGO]

Careful. There are juries still out in Fargo and Brookings.

Milton College.

Thats laughable, the jurys still out? Hell you know as well as everyone else its been absolutely the right thing for NDSU and has been a complete success. If the jury was still out then there is no way kup o jelllo would be considering making the move, of course he did say something like '"I want you to know that I hate the idea that NDSU even appears to be making a move ahead of us in any way whatsoever," and then goes on to say "I recognize that we may have to make this move even though ultimately it may make no otherwise logical or financial sense to do so." Yeah you guys are on a great foundation there with leadership like that and when someone like Nano or myself points out that it would have been best to hire a outside consultant to assure a unbiased recommendation you mock it. Beautiful just beautiful.

[The Sicatoka]

Thats laughable, the jurys still out?

What conference are you in today?

Can we look at your budget to see how you do it fiscally?

[PCM]

Thats laughable, the jurys still out? Hell you know as well as everyone else its been absolutely the right thing for NDSU and has been a complete success.

Perhaps NDSU and SDSU will be the excpetion to the the rule that in DI, the rate of revenue increases don't keep pace with expenditure increases. I wouldn't bet money on it, however, because as NCAA president Myles Brand writes, the odds aren't good.

Some time ago, I wrote about the impending financial problem facing intercollegiate athletics, especially in Division I. In a nutshell, the problem is that the average annual rate of increase in expenditures is three to four times the rate of increase in expenditures in the general university budgets. While the rate of increase in revenues in athletics tends to exceed that of the general university, it does not keep pace with expenditure increases. Over time, this is not a sustainable business model, and we are already seeing increased transfers of funds from the academic parts of the university and increased student fees to compensate growing athletics deficits.

Not every Division I university faces these problems; out of approximately 350 universities, one to two dozen do balance their books in athletics. But it is getting harder to do so even in these few cases.

[Bison Dan]

What conference are you in today?

Can we look at your budget to see how you do it fiscally?

Hell you can't do it in dii!

[DI IN FARGO]

Hell you can't do it in dii!

Wouldn't you know it they want us to show them our books because they can't figure it out themselves.

[The Sicatoka]

Hell you can't do it in dii!

Neither did NDSU in their last DII year.

[The Sicatoka]

Wouldn't you know it they want us to show them our books because they can't figure it out themselves.

Somebody has to check the math.

[DI IN FARGO]

Somebody has to check the math.

That's ok, this is the same as always, we lead and you follow.

[The Sicatoka]

That's ok, this is the same as always, we lead and you follow.

Really? Dang.

And here I thought UND was up seven DI titles to zero.

Must be the math.

[Sioux-cia]

Really? Dang.

And here I thought UND was up seven DI titles to zero. Must be the math.

[BisonMav]

Really? Dang.

And here I thought UND was up seven DI titles to zero.

Must be the math.

Were all the hockey championships DI?

Division classification wasn't started until the 1970's.

[Sioux-cia]

Were all the hockey championships DI?

Division classification wasn't started until the 1970's.

NCAA's list of DI hockey champions starts with Michigan in 1948;

http://www.ncaasports.com/icehockey/mens/history

[DI IN FARGO]

Really? Dang.

And here I thought UND was up seven DI titles to zero.

Must be the math.

Again if your proud of a Championship in a Sport where just a handful of schools compete and you want to brag on it that's ok and I mean that in all honesty. The only problem with it is it's no comparison to any championship in any division where the majority of schools compete. This is getting off the topic of the thread so will leave it at that and watch with mild curiosity at the bumbling stumbling sioux administration as they try to figure out what to do or not to do next

[Shawn-O]

Again if your proud of a Championship in a Sport where just a handful of schools compete and you want to brag on it that's ok and I mean that in all honesty. The only problem with it is it's no comparison to any championship in any division where the majority of schools compete. This is getting off the topic of the thread so will leave it at that and watch with mild curiosity at the bumbling stumbling sioux administration as they try to figure out what to do or not to do next

***Biting....tongue.....*** I can't give you a pass on this one. Let's be honest, the national publicity of the Fighting Sioux Frozen Four and championship teams eclipses by tenfold any of NDSU's title teams in football. With that said, I'll be the first to admit that if NDSU, god forbid, were to get into the Big Dance, the attention would blow away anything we've seen on the hockey front. Let's get a grip, here.