bincitysioux Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 I think The Betty is a great basketball facility for UND. I can't imagine that either the mens or womens teams will ever need much more than 4000 seats for basketball. If they did, I doubt it would take much to add extra seating, concessions and bathrooms to make it a first class facility that any D1 school would love to have. ....how will the Sioux ever need more than 4000 seats for it's teams. And if they do, they could easily switch the game over to the REA. Some interesting points: The SCSU fan points out we're complaining about a wealth of riches, or that as I've heard one guy say "complaining that our ice cream is too cold." I'll agree with Rick. My eyes say that larger end portable stands could be put into The Betty. What's there now is about 10 rows per end. Put in 20 row models and I bet you'd (a) push that place to about 5000, and (b) make Hyslop seem like a pleasant place for opponents. PS - What NDSU drew v. Idaho would have been held by The Betty: 3541. I agree, the size of the Betty is just fine. Bigger portable bleachers on the ends would be an easy fix if needed to accomodate 1,000 or so more fans on a regular basis, and that would be a wonderful problem to have. The only games the Betty probably couldn't accomodate, would be against certain DI opponents like NDSU, Minnesota, or Montana/Montana St (if it were a Big Sky conference game ), and any of those games could easily be played in REA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 I agree, the size of the Betty is just fine. Bigger portable bleachers on the ends would be an easy fix if needed to accomodate 1,000 or so more fans on a regular basis, and that would be a wonderful problem to have. The only games the Betty probably couldn't accomodate, would be against certain DI opponents like NDSU, Minnesota, or Montana/Montana St (if it were a Big Sky conference game ), and any of those games could easily be played in REA. I'm just curious, were any of the three of you guys at the UND vs. UNO games this year? I can't fathom how the Betty could realistically handle another 1300 to 2300 people regardless of whether more seats were added or not. Or more specifically, it might be possible to fit 4500 seats or more with larger portable bleachers, but getting the people into and out of the building, as well as handling the traffic at halftime and between games (concessions, bathrooms, etc.) would be the biggest challenge. I think it has to be experienced before a person can really understand what I'm talking about. But if you guys have been there for a game with much over 2000 and still feel the way you do, then I am more than happy to simply agree to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new2sioux2 Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 I'm just curious, were any of the three of you guys at the UND vs. UNO games this year? I can't fathom how the Betty could realistically handle another 1300 to 2300 people regardless of whether more seats were added or not. Or more specifically, it might be possible to fit 4500 seats or more with larger portable bleachers, but getting the people into and out of the building, as well as handling the traffic at halftime and between games (concessions, bathrooms, etc.) would be the biggest challenge. I think it has to be experienced before a person can really understand what I'm talking about. But if you guys have been there for a game with much over 2000 and still feel the way you do, then I am more than happy to simply agree to disagree. I am thinking they have not...let's hope the game tomorrow or at least on the 2nd of February proves your point. The game at SCSU drew over 4800 pitted against a hockey game (as you pointed out) I would say close to half of those in attendance were from UND...one would expect a full capacity crowd for that one...it could be a problem. I don't think some people understand that basketball could be drawing big numbers for a while..and not against DI teams (that would be awesome..to play NDSU or the Gophers) but against good teams within the conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 I was not at the UNO game, but I was at the Southwest Minnesota St. game, and I didn't notice a big problem. UND normally draws around 3,500-4,000 for conference games, and there are currently only six of those. I agree that the corridors to the court where the concessions are are too small. But for 2/3 of the home schedule it is just fine. Since you don't have to use the corridors to get to the bathrooms, that is not a problem once you get into the gym. The bathrooms may be small, but are optimally located. For bigger drawing games the space behind the bleachers should be better used for additional concessions. However, as long as we are DII, I don't think any of this is a concern. If we were DI, the only regular game I can foresee being a problem would be NDSU, and that game would never be played in the Betty. It is just as bad using the South entrance of the Alerus on gameday to get your tickets and gain entry to the concourse. And if I'm not mistaken, I normally spend about the same amount of time in line for concessions and bathrooms at REA and Alerus. Agree to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 I was not at the UNO game, but I was at the Southwest Minnesota St. game, and I didn't notice a big problem. UND normally draws around 3,500-4,000 for conference games, and there are currently only six of those. I agree that the corridors to the court where the concessions are are too small. But for 2/3 of the home schedule it is just fine. Since you don't have to use the corridors to get to the bathrooms, that is not a problem once you get into the gym. The bathrooms may be small, but are optimally located. For bigger drawing games the space behind the bleachers should be better used for additional concessions. However, as long as we are DII, I don't think any of this is a concern. If we were DI, the only regular game I can foresee being a problem would be NDSU, and that game would never be played in the Betty. It is just as bad using the South entrance of the Alerus on gameday to get your tickets and gain entry to the concourse. And if I'm not mistaken, I normally spend about the same amount of time in line for concessions and bathrooms at REA and Alerus. Agree to disagree. I will grant you that the SW St. game wasn't a huge problem despite only officially having about 350 fewer people. But there really seemed to be more overall congestion for the UNO game--a lot more than what you would expect based on a relatively small increase in attendance. I am going into the next couple of games with an open mind. If the Betty can handle 3000 or more people (hopefully the next two games will exceed 3000) with no major problems, then great. I would still question the ability to ever expand the capacity beyond 3500 to 3800 or so, but time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 I definately believe that when The Betty was built it was built with the idea that it would primarily be used for practice and basketball camps. I think that the REA thought that alot of the games would be played in the Ralph. I agree that the previous games in the Ralph didn't have great atmosphere, but I think that they could. As I said earlier, I think that if the court was placed on the north end of the ice so that the arena created a "U" around the court and place the portable seating only on the south end of the court that it would help create a more intimate feeling. They could sell tickets for sections 109-116. Sections 112 and 113 behind the basket could be the student sections. If you place the band on the portable seating facing the horseshoe it would help fill the place with more sound. Also, for larger games the north Club level could be used and would have great sitelines of the court. If a move to DI is made I think we will see alot more games in the REA. It could be a great drawing tool to help bring in larger schools. Imagine 6-8,000 people in this set-up, it could be a great atmosphere. It could also be a great recruiting tool for the teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted January 26, 2006 Author Share Posted January 26, 2006 I definately believe that when The Betty was built it was built with the idea that it would primarily be used for practice and basketball camps. I think that the REA thought that alot of the games would be played in the Ralph. I agree that the previous games in the Ralph didn't have great atmosphere, but I think that they could. As I said earlier, I think that if the court was placed on the north end of the ice so that the arena created a "U" around the court and place the portable seating only on the south end of the court that it would help create a more intimate feeling. They could sell tickets for sections 109-116. Sections 112 and 113 behind the basket could be the student sections. If you place the band on the portable seating facing the horseshoe it would help fill the place with more sound. Also, for larger games the north Club level could be used and would have great sitelines of the court. If a move to DI is made I think we will see alot more games in the REA. It could be a great drawing tool to help bring in larger schools. Imagine 6-8,000 people in this set-up, it could be a great atmosphere. It could also be a great recruiting tool for the teams. I think you have a good idea, but the issues with scheduling around home hockey series and concerns about how the ice would be affected would be challenges. On the other hand, other schools/facilities seem to make it work so it's not impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4siouxnow Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 I think you have a good idea, but the issues with scheduling around home hockey series and concerns about how the ice would be affected would be challenges. On the other hand, other schools/facilities seem to make it work so it's not impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 I think you have a good idea, but the issues with scheduling around home hockey series and concerns about how the ice would be affected would be challenges. On the other hand, other schools/facilities seem to make it work so it's not impossible. The Kohl Center, last weekend: Friday night hockey, Saturday noon hoop, and Saturday night hockey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 The Kohl Center, last weekend: Friday night hockey, Saturday noon hoop, and Saturday night hockey. How do they do that? During the postgame show on WDAZ after the home series with Minnesota, John Bernstrom did a feature on maintaining the ice at REA. Correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC they said they needed a minimum of 24 hours to switch from ice to no-ice or vice-versa. Also since the REA has been setup for hockey pretty much all season, I haven't heard nearly as many complaints about the condition of the ice as in previous seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamsioux Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Exactly...day one of BB back in the Ralph, the puckhead-basketballer haters would be back whining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 How do they do that? During the postgame show on WDAZ after the home series with Minnesota, John Bernstrom did a feature on maintaining the ice at REA. Correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC they said they needed a minimum of 24 hours to switch from ice to no-ice or vice-versa. I'm pretty sure Kohl Center puts down a layer of thermal padding then a layer of "hard floor" and then the court on top of that. I thought that's what REA does too. The "24 hours to switch from ice to no-ice or vice-versa" sounds more like "NO ice" (as in rip it out or pour a total new surface) not covered/uncovered ice. But it's been more than a day since I drove a Zamboni. Where's the man with the answers, Denny Gunderson, when we need him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 A teen group I work with helped install the BB court over the ice one time. It took more than 3 hours with at least 20 people to put down the layer of insulation boards first and then put down the court. That didn't include putting up the baskets, the bleachers or some of the sideline stuff. It is very labor intensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
star2city Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 As I said earlier, I think that if the court was placed on the north end of the ice so that the arena created a "U" around the court and place the portable seating only on the south end of the court that it would help create a more intimate feeling. They could sell tickets for sections 109-116. Sections 112 and 113 behind the basket could be the student sections. If you place the band on the portable seating facing the horseshoe it would help fill the place with more sound. Also, for larger games the north Club level could be used and would have great sitelines of the court. If a move to DI is made I think we will see alot more games in the REA. It could be a great drawing tool to help bring in larger schools. Imagine 6-8,000 people in this set-up, it could be a great atmosphere. It could also be a great recruiting tool for the teams. This proposal definitely makes a lot of sense. Only issue may be that the overhead scoreboard would be off-center, as well as the press box. As far as the basketball court hurting the ice quality, an REA employee stated on this forum that ice quality was due to underdesign of the piping system, not covering the floor. As for the games in the Betty, it would seem that the Olympic ice entrance should be used for season ticket holders to limit the congestion in the front lobby. Vendors could also be setup on either end of the Oympic ice arena to limit congestion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82SiouxGuy Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 This proposal definitely makes a lot of sense. Only issue may be that the overhead scoreboard would be off-center, as well as the press box. As far as the basketball court hurting the ice quality, an REA employee stated on this forum that ice quality was due to underdesign of the piping system, not covering the floor. As for the games in the Betty, it would seem that the Olympic ice entrance should be used for season ticket holders to limit the congestion in the front lobby. Vendors could also be setup on either end of the Oympic ice arena to limit congestion. One other issue with the Ralph set-up may be suiteholders at the far end of the arena. They would have a lesser view of the court and it may be obscured if the bleachers set up on that end are high enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 One other issue with the Ralph set-up may be suiteholders at the far end of the arena. They would have a lesser view of the court and it may be obscured if the bleachers set up on that end are high enough. I'd guess they have an even worse view now when the games in the Betty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 This proposal definitely makes a lot of sense. Only issue may be that the overhead scoreboard would be off-center, as well as the press box. As far as the basketball court hurting the ice quality, an REA employee stated on this forum that ice quality was due to underdesign of the piping system, not covering the floor. As for the games in the Betty, it would seem that the Olympic ice entrance should be used for season ticket holders to limit the congestion in the front lobby. Vendors could also be setup on either end of the Oympic ice arena to limit congestion. To give credit where credit is due, the full front lobby at the Betty was utilized last night, so congestion wasn't bad at all. Now if they could just find someplace else to have the Fighting Sioux Club function (Olympic arena perhaps?) so that the entire area behind the north (?) bleachers didn't have to be blocked off... With that said, I really like dakotadan's suggestion more and more regarding a different set-up for basketball in the Ralph. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Who was at the games this evening? Apparently it was a sell-out - but the crowd was less than 3,100! I thought the Betty held 3,800. Can anyone explain this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bincitysioux Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Who was at the games this evening? Apparently it was a sell-out - but the crowd was less than 3,100! I thought the Betty held 3,800. Can anyone explain this? What was the atmosphere like? How did the Betty handle the aforementioned issues, with the biggest crowd on hand so far? 3,064 in attendance against the #4 team in the country?! C'mon Sioux basketball fans, we should be able to do better than this! This could be the best women's team that Roebuck has assembled, and there have been some damn good teams to play for him! My excuse for not going is living 100 miles away, it's a school night, and the weather is crap! What is your excuse, Grand Forks!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND92,96 Posted February 3, 2006 Author Share Posted February 3, 2006 What was the atmosphere like? How did the Betty handle the aforementioned issues, with the biggest crowd on hand so far? 3,064 in attendance against the #4 team in the country?! C'mon Sioux basketball fans, we should be able to do better than this! This could be the best women's team that Roebuck has assembled, and there have been some damn good teams to play for him! My excuse for not going is living 100 miles away, it's a school night, and the weather is crap! What is your excuse, Grand Forks!? Well, it was announced as a sell-out, and the few empty seats almost certainly belonged to season ticketholders who didn't show up, so I guess maybe the capacity is less than what we were told? In any event, I don't think more than maybe 100 more people could have been fit in tonight even had there been no no-shows at all. I'm still confused as to how many people the Betty actually holds. It appears that maybe it's much closer to 3000 than 4000. EDIT: I guess I really can't estimate how many empties there were, since from my vantage point (side where the benches are), I can really only see the other side. There were very few empty seats on that side, but of course there could have been some on my side that I wasn't in a position to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 $crew the Betty!! I drove an hour in a winter blizzard to go to the basketball games with a college roommate of mine that is in town for the week. When we got to the game they made us park in front of the Ralph and walk all of the way around to the SC in the blizzard, just to get to the door and them tell us there weren't any tickets left. 3,000 people a sell-out, sad. They should move back to the Hyslop if nothing else. In case anyone hasn't noticed, I'm pissed. The hour long drive back home in the blizzard while listening to the games on the radio was alot of fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachdags Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 $crew the Betty!! I drove an hour in a winter blizzard to go to the basketball games with a college roommate of mine that is in town for the week. When we got to the game they made us park in front of the Ralph and walk all of the way around to the SC in the blizzard, just to get to the door and them tell us there weren't any tickets left. 3,000 people a sell-out, sad. They should move back to the Hyslop if nothing else. In case anyone hasn't noticed, I'm pissed. The hour long drive back home in the blizzard while listening to the games on the radio was alot of fun. That is a JOKE had to be 3-400 empty seats....POOR GAME MANAGEMENT... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGreyAnt41 Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 That is a JOKE had to be 3-400 empty seats....POOR GAME MANAGEMENT... I have to agree. If that's what the place is going to look like when they stop selling tickets, then there's a problem somewhere that has to be fixed ASAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UND Fan Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 I have to agree. If that's what the place is going to look like when they stop selling tickets, then there's a problem somewhere that has to be fixed ASAP. Could it be that many season ticket holders did not attend due to weather (not a good excuse) or other reasons? The Athletic Department can not sell their seats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoteauRinkRat Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Could it be that many season ticket holders did not attend due to weather (not a good excuse) or other reasons? The Athletic Department can not sell their seats. This must be the explanation. I had a couple of friends get turned away also, saying there were no tickets available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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