NCAA Decision is in

[mksioux]

if it stands - the first major sports to be impacted would be M&W basketball and the abililty (or rather non-ability) to host the regional.

[redwing77]

From what I heard it doesn't affect the Hockey team at all save for the fact that the jerseys will have to be changed. That's ok, we already have them.

It affects all other sports save Hockey though when it comes to post season play.

If you ask me, so be it. Take the logos off the jersies and that's that.

As for what jk said, I'd like to modify it.

We can't just dump everything. Then we'll look like spoiled idiots.

I say we do nothing more than the federal grants pay for. Not a penny of UND's other funds not SPECIFICALLY earmarked for the Native American programs should be spent. If that means that faculty must be cut, so be it.

Pow Wows and all are no longer free to the Native Americans. If they want to hold one at UND, they can rent out the Hyslop like any decent member of the general public.

And yes, I support the Fighting Cavalry.

[Diggler]

From what I heard it doesn't affect the Hockey team at all save for the fact that the jerseys will have to be changed.  That's ok, we already have them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We already have alternate jerseys? Where? All jerseys I've seen say Sioux. Unless you're talking about those crappy ones from the early 90's.

[willistonsioux]

We already have alternate jerseys? Where? All jerseys I've seen say Sioux. Unless you're talking about those crappy ones from the early 90's.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Couldent we wear are jerseys with are old logo.

[Diggler]

Couldent we wear are jerseys with are old logo.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Translate this into proper English and get back to me. Heck, I'd settle for improper English.

[dakotadan]

We all pretty much expected a denial from the NCAA. However I was pleased with Kupchella's comments today. He seems very determined to keep the name and logo but find some common ground for both sides. I have said before that the biggest problem with this issue is that everyone looks at it in black or white. An all or nothing attitude will not settle this. Kupchella on the other hand seems to be determined to try and work things out for everyone's best interest. We will see if this is even possible.

[willistonsioux]

Translate this into proper English and get back to me. Heck, I'd settle for improper English.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

what so bad about that

[bincitysioux]

If "Sioux" is a name given to the Lakota/Dakota/Nakota Indian tribes by the Chippewa, shouldn't we be asking the Chippewa Tribes for permission to use it?

Since I am part Chippewa, I'm offended that another tribe is offended by one of our tribal words.

[PCM]

If "Sioux" is a name given to the Lakota/Dakota/Nakota Indian tribes by the Chippewa, shouldn't we be asking the Chippewa Tribes for permission to use it? 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No. We should be asking the French for permission because it was their word to begin with.

[farce poobah]

Sounds like Dr. Kupchella is stepping forward as a strong advocate of the school's tradition. Win or lose, I have to feel like Sioux nickname supporters were well represented in this *&^$# process.

I for one won't be setting foot in a tribal casino. Ever.

As to programs at UND for Native Americans, it would be extremely shortsighted to dump over this trivial matter. [come on, its just sports] Getting opportunities, a chance to get off the reservation for those who want it, getting a chance for education is far more important, and I'm still proud to be an alum of a school with a strong record of supporting advancement for Native Americans.

[redwing77]

[oldralph]

Jeonette said he believes that UND tries to use the name in a respectful manner, but "the biggest problem is how do you convince that of the opposing team?" he said.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=2174858

This is the biggest problem? This is the hostile and abusive climate? Keeping the opposing team from saying Sioux sucks? This guy is right on campus and this is his biggest concern! Excuse me, are we blowing smoke with this "hostile and abusive" environment crap? I think you know my stand. Geez.

[Sioux-cia]

[dagies]

At this point I as well am sick of the continuing controversy over the nickname. I was one who was all high minded but when I read the decision I have to admit my thoughts were more like jk's. After I sleep on this I think I'll be a bit more rational.

It's been suggested by others but at the moment, of the various options, I like this idea. WIN the lawsuit, then drop the name like a hot potato.

I can't decide what I like next. I like the idea of no name at all. If we can't have the one we came to the party with, we'll just do without. I love my Sioux jersey and I plan to keep wearing it regardless.

I also like the idea of picking an "appropriate" name. So Fighting Cav is in by me. I can't imagine what would be more hostile and abusive to the native americans than that, but it's good for the NCAA so it must be good for the native americans.

I also like the idea of keeping the logo and changing the name to another tribe that is more than happy to be represented. Fine, we don't NEED you, Sioux. My biggest problem with that is I like to be original, and names like Chippewa are already being used.

Oh, so much to consider. But fine, if you want to take your ball and go home, fine by me. Just don't wonder why you're standing in your yard all by yourself.

[dagies]

Another question. When UND hosts a regional at the REA, how much money does the NCAA get?

I have to admit I'm questioning whether I'll be keeping my Frozen Four tickets. I hate to support the NCAA in any way after this.

[siouxrunner]

Another question.  When UND hosts a regional at the REA, how much money does the NCAA get? 

I have to admit I'm questioning whether I'll be keeping my Frozen Four tickets.  I hate to support the NCAA in any way after this.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The NC$$ hasn't been, at best, hypocritical through this process, but I suspect that those saying they won't support the NC$$ after this will still be watching March Madness this spring.

[PCM]

It's been suggested by others but at the moment, of the various options, I like this idea.  WIN the lawsuit, then drop the name like a hot potato.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Win the lawsuit, establish a legal right to use the name and then, as Kupchella discussed today, attempt to start the dialogue with the tribes. If the only dialogue the tribes are willing have revolves around UND changing the name, then end the discussion, change the name and move on. Some will soon discover that being equal isn't all it's cracked up to be.

[PCM]

So I'm reading a story on the Web about the NCAA denying UND's appeal and I notice off to the side that there are links for "Native American costumes." I click on the link and find this, this, this and this. One of the costumes is listed as "Sassy Squaw." And here's what it says about another one:

This great costume will bring you many compliments from the no-understand white man.

I can certainly see now that UND is one of the last great bastions of racial stereotyping.

[Diggler]

The chick is quite the looker at least.

[PCM]

The chick is quite the looker at least.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was too offended to notice.

[Flatland]

People keep talking about what a new logo and name for UND should be. I read names like the Fighting Calvary or whatever. However, there is one name that I think would be awesome.

The Dakotans

I know that it is repetitive to say the University of North Dakota Dakotans or North Dakota Dakotans (it doesn't exactly roll off the tongue), but we could get a mascot. He'd be a farmer of scandinavian descent with a pitchfork (or whatever farming utensil anyone could come up with, I don't care.)

The reason I suggest this name is obvious. Dakotans does not just refer to a native american tribal group, but also to the people living in North and South Dakota. I'd like the PC crowd try to get rid of this one since it has native american origin, but has been adopted by the settlers of North and South Dakota over the last 150+ years.

[jk]

It's an old rule, but a good one: Don't post in anger or frustration after a loss.

I still think it's perfectly appropriate for Grand Forks to deny a casino in town, but closing down all the Native American programs at UND out of spite is probably a little too much.

Still, UND would need to examine its mission, and where Native American programs fit into it. If the name is gone, is there still a special relationship that suggests having such a focus on Native American higher education? Maybe the answer is yes, but perhaps to a more limited degree.

UND should focus on excelling on issues that are important to the state, where UND can make a difference in the state's future. To me, the biggest issue facing the state in the previous and next decade is the death of the "farming way of life," with all the economic and cultural after-effects. Basically, for a number of generations, families farmed and the state's economy and culture were built around this fact. All across the state, farmers are aging, retiring and dying, leaving empty farmsteads; the towns that used to support them are withering away.

NDSU has the "farming" aspect of the issue well-covered. The land will still be farmed, ever more efficiently thanks to NDSU. It's the after-effects that seem more important to me. What does the state look like when the century-long foundation of its structure is gone? UND should help the state move to whatever it will be for the next century.

It seems to me that business acumen will be key in this post-farming century, so UND should focus on its business school and entrepreneurship. What industries can flourish in a place that is, frankly, pretty difficult to live in for a third of the year? Wired businesses, where information and communication travel, while the people are warm and cozy inside. UND should focus on information technology. Energy is ever more important to the country, and North Dakota has abundant capabilities below the earth's surface and above it (the lovely wind). Unfortunately, it's hard to store and transport energy efficiently to other parts of the country. UND should focus on energy technology, to help the state become an energy powerhouse (because the wind's not going to stop blowing till Minnesota stops sucking).

UND has well-established medical, legal and aviation programs, and should continue to play to these strengths. In addition, it could focus on business, information and energy to help the state move to the post-agriculture era. I don't see Native American studies on my list. Absent a special relationship, UND should focus its resources elsewhere. Other people may have a different list of priorities for the state, but I'm not sure Native American studies are going to wind up being crucial to the state's future on most lists.

[Sioux-cia]

So I'm reading a story on the Web about the NCAA denying UND's appeal and I notice off to the side that there are links for "Native American costumes." I click on the link and find this, this, this and this. One of the costumes is listed as "Sassy Squaw." And here's what it says about another one:

I can certainly see now that UND is one of the last great bastions of racial stereotyping.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I really like this http://www.windycitynovelties.com/EPaysoft...nd+Games&ovcrn=FLASHING+INDIAN+HEAD&ovtac=CMP

I have a wall hanging with the 1950's UND logo that looks similar. Maybe I'll get this and hang it in my front window next to the Whiplash poster I plan to buy.

[HockeyMom]

People keep talking about what a new logo and name for UND should be.  I read names like the Fighting Calvary or whatever.  However, there is one name that I think would be awesome.

The Dakotans

I know that it is repetitive to say the University of North Dakota Dakotans or North Dakota Dakotans (it doesn't exactly roll off the tongue), but we could get a mascot.  He'd be a farmer of scandinavian descent with a pitchfork (or whatever farming utensil anyone could come up with, I don't care.)

The reason I suggest this name is obvious.  Dakotans does not just refer to a native american tribal group, but also to the people living in North and South Dakota.  I'd like the PC crowd try to get rid of this one since it has native american origin, but has been adopted by the settlers of North and South Dakota over the last 150+ years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I believe that Dakotans would also be considered 'hostile and abusive' by the NCAA because Dakota is a Native American name. Kupchella brought this up in a press conference shortly after this all broke.

[Sioux-cia]

People keep talking about what a new logo and name for UND should be.  I read names like the Fighting Calvary or whatever.  However, there is one name that I think would be awesome.

The Dakotans

I know that it is repetitive to say the University of North Dakota Dakotans or North Dakota Dakotans (it doesn't exactly roll off the tongue), but we could get a mascot.  He'd be a farmer of scandinavian descent with a pitchfork (or whatever farming utensil anyone could come up with, I don't care.)

The reason I suggest this name is obvious.  Dakotans does not just refer to a native american tribal group, but also to the people living in North and South Dakota.  I'd like the PC crowd try to get rid of this one since it has native american origin, but has been adopted by the settlers of North and South Dakota over the last 150+ years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No can do, Flatland. Dakota is the name of an indigenous tribe also known as the Sioux. The fact that settlers of North and South Dakota adopted the name means about as much to the NC$$ as UND having adopted the Sioux name 80 years ago.