Chewey Posted March 9, 2008 Share Posted March 9, 2008 Nicknames promote racism, not dialogueSo if the logo/name is changed, these problems will suddenly vanish? He's an Ojibiwe, like T.J. Oshie, so his opinion shouldn't count right? That's what the PCers indicated when T.J. Oshie stated that he proudly supports the nickname. Where are these victims and where is the data indicating that the nickname actually causes such ills? Just because a few guilt-ridden, angry PCers (most of whom are white) say it does means that it does? That's about all they can offer and such a claim is itself racist. Marc Ranfranz and T.J. Oshie seem to have done pretty well, the supposed deleterious effects of the nickname notwithstanding. What a bunch of baloney. Oh, and according to this guy's logic, it's ok for the victims of racism to continue the saga of misery by racially stereotyping themselves? What planet are we on again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted March 9, 2008 Share Posted March 9, 2008 Nicknames promote racism, not dialogueSo if the logo/name is changed, these problems will suddenly vanish? The writer forgot to mention that the Sioux name/logo also causes bad breath, acne, people driving slow in the left lane and menstrual cramps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Tribal college presidents, UND grads bow out of Beyond Beads and Feathers photo shoot citing Sioux nicknameA planned photo shoot of current and former tribal college presidents for UND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiSioux Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I think that there was another thread about it, but I can't find it... However, I noticed today when I was going past the Native American Center that they have replaced the stolen eagle. I assume that it is a brand new one, since I haven't heard anything about someone being caught for stealing the old one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Tribal college presidents, UND grads bow out of Beyond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 The other tribal college leaders who declined to participate in the photo shoot were Cynthia Lindquist Mala, president of Cankdeska Cikana tribal college in Fort Totten, N.D.; ... Gee, wasn't she hand picked by JQ Paulsen to be on the president selection committee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 However, I noticed today when I was going past the Native American Center that they have replaced the stolen eagle. I assume that it is a brand new one, since I haven't heard anything about someone being caught for stealing the old one. The Herald reported that the missing one was found in the Coulee behind the AISS building this summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siouxmama Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 The Herald reported that the missing one was found in the Coulee behind the AISS building this summer. I don't remember reading that. Was the statue ruined so it had to be replaced with a new one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Heck, I missed one: As part of a second round of the poster campaigns, UND had planned to send a photogra-pher to the American Indian Higher Education Conference in Bismarck on Monday, to take a group photo of the 14 UND graduates who are past or present tribal college presidents. Five of those presidents, however, declined to take part in the photo shoot, citing UND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeauxSioux Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 (edited) E-mail from UTTC President David Gipp to UND AISS Director Leigh JeanotteI must decline for the photo at this time, since the UND mascot controversy continues. It is incessantly and increasingly a topic of dissension among the various communities--tribal and non-tribal. Indeed, by all appearances the State of North Dakota continues to pressure First Americans and tribal leaders to approve the current usage: by the North Dakota attorney general naming the tribes in the court approved settlement between North Dakota and the NCAA and disregarding the official views of Indian Tribes and the positions they have already taken.If there is indeed dissension within the tribal communities in regards to the Fighting Sioux name/logo, wouldn't that mean that there are people there who don't feel the same way as Mr. Gipp? Edited March 13, 2008 by GeauxSioux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 If there is indeed dissension within the tribal communities in regards to the Fighting Sioux name/logo, wouldn't that mean that there are people there who don't feel the same way as Mr. Gipp? Given that and the previous story, I'd say yes. Using the provided very limited sample, I'd say of 14 UND graduates who are (Mr. Gipp's term) "First Americans" the split is 9 support and 5 don't. Aren't the folks in the minority opinion normally considered the dissenters? Wouldn't that mean Mr. Gipp is causing the ... dissension? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Illiniwek Supporter Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 2. You got the power you wanted and now it's "disrespectful" to have given it to you? Exactly. First you weren't happy because you couldn't control what North Dakota did with a word from the English language that you claimed "ownership" of: now you're unhappy because you DO have control? Be careful what you wish for.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourwindsboy Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 This article points out that the use of mascots and derogatory names is insulting. UND does not have a mascot nor is the name Sioux derogatory. The article also points out that people who are for the names do little or nothing for the American Indian. As stated ad nauseam, UND spends millions of dollars on American Indian programs and services. Whoa, whoa, whoa! UND does not spend millions of $$$ out of its own pocket for NA programs. All of the NA programs at UND are grant programs funded by the feds. UND applied for those grants and they awarded to them. In fact any federal grant has indirect costs related to them, always around 10-15% of the grant, which UND puts in thier pockets. So in effect, UND is earning themselves money for having these NA programs. I know for a fact the NA cultural center, INMED, Bridges, the Mcnair programs and the INPSYD program are federally funded. I challenge you to tell of a NA program at UND that is funded by UND funds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Whoa, whoa, whoa! UND does not spend millions of $$$ out of its own pocket for NA programs. All of the NA programs at UND are grant programs funded by the feds. UND applied for those grants and they awarded to them. In fact any federal grant has indirect costs related to them, always around 10-15% of the grant, which UND puts in thier pockets. So in effect, UND is earning themselves money for having these NA programs. I know for a fact the NA cultural center, INMED, Bridges, the Mcnair programs and the INPSYD program are federally funded. I challenge you to tell of a NA program at UND that is funded by UND funds. Before your start replying to posts that are almost three years old you should read all the posts related to the issue. I have posted since then that the NA programs at UND are funded by federal grants. It's apparent to me that your trolling my posts in order to start a hostile and abusive dialog with me. I'm not biting. As I said before, you're not bringing anything new to this forum and I'm not interested in arguing with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourwindsboy Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Before your start replying to posts that are almost three years old you should read all the posts related to the issue. I have posted since then that the NA programs at UND are funded by federal grants. It's apparent to me that your trolling my posts in order to start a hostile and abusive dialog with me. I'm not biting. As I said before, you're not bringing anything new to this forum and I'm not interested in arguing with you. Ah, you just did. And don't go feelin all warm and fuzzy about me trolling your posts. I looked at the first page of the topic and came across your post. I didn't have time to look at all 134 pages to find replies to your post. By the way how did it feel to be dead wrong about your statement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sioux-cia Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 I have been wrong before and will very likely be wrong again. I have no problem admitting this fact of life. You are officially on ignore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stromer Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 I looked at the first page of the topic and came across your post. I didn't have time to look at all 134 pages to find replies to your post. But yet you blindy replied to something that likely got retracted in the last 3 YEARS?! That makes a lot of sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Ah, you just did. And don't go feelin all warm and fuzzy about me trolling your posts. I looked at the first page of the topic and came across your post. I didn't have time to look at all 134 pages to find replies to your post. By the way how did it feel to be dead wrong about your statement? Hey Troll don't go away mad, but please just go away! You do not bring anything remotely constructive to ss.com. It is not that you don't agree with people, but it is that you just look to argue. Plus you are just plain wrong on some things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourwindsboy Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Hey Troll don't go away mad, but please just go away! You do not bring anything remotely constructive to ss.com. It is not that you don't agree with people, but it is that you just look to argue. Plus you are just plain wrong on some things. OK I get it. I don't support the nickname and try to give a Native American perspective to most of my posts but you all are so close minded that you don't want to listen or just ignore. What would be constructive? I know if I was if favor of the nickname, i get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westsidesioux Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 OK I get it. I don't support the nickname and try to give a Native American perspective to most of my posts but you all are so close minded that you don't want to listen or just ignore. What would be constructive? I know if I was if favor of the nickname, i get it. It's not that you are giving a Native American perspective or that other posters on here are close-minded. I think most posters have come to terms that there will always be opposition to the nickname. I think what people are more upset about is that you really are not bringing a constructive arguement to the table that we already haven't heard, but you are being disrespectful in an effort to start a fight, from what I can gather, mainly with Sioux-Cia. She's already stated that she is not taking the bait but you continue anyway. Nobody is calling you names and accusing you of being close-minded so please show the same respect to the rest of the posters. Your arguement goes a lot further if you state your point without getting into the name-calling and "I told you so's." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sioux7>5 Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 OK I get it. I don't support the nickname and try to give a Native American perspective to most of my posts but you all are so close minded that you don't want to listen or just ignore. What would be constructive? I know if I was if favor of the nickname, i get it. I am not close minded at all. I am very open to all points of view, but maybe you are the one that is close minded by not seeing are side. You claim to be giving the NA point of view, you do not speak for all NA's. I think you do not get it. You can't make people be honored. UND does honor the native american people. You just don't want to be honored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwing77 Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 The way I see this issue is this: You have Side A and Side B. Both are mutually exclusive. Despite this, a majority are respectful of the opposite side. However, there are some who act in such a manner that makes their respective side look foolish, pigheaded, or just ignorant. Both sides of this debate has seen that. GrahamKracker spewed hate towards the pro-nickname crowd. 30+ years ago, NDSU students printed some retarded T-shirts and UND students acted in a very forgettable manner towards NA people during a parade. But that was 30+ years ago. Times have changed. People have changed. Idiots still exist but they don't represent the whole. GrahamKracker doesn't represent the whole of NA people either. "Fourwindsboy," you aren't being met with such hostility because you are anti-nickname. You are being met with hostility because that's the way you handle the opposition. You don't present any new information. You don't present even the old information with any respect to the perspectives of the other side. You are vindictive. You seem to have targeted Sioux-cia for some reason and, whether she is right or wrong, you have decided to act rather childish in pointing it out. She admitted that the statement you cited was wrong and she stated she corrected her mistake but you neglect to care about the fact that she did so. This is yet another problem with the "victim" society. They see injustice and forget the rest. It doesn't matter if the wrongdoers were punished. Those hecklers at that UND parade 30+ years ago could have been strung up by their feet, hung upside down, and shot with a shotgun for all it mattered, the "atrocity" would still exist. When is a criminal act just a criminal act? It's as stupid an argument as "Guns should be banned because they kill people." Or perhaps "UND students were caught drinking while underage. Therefore, UND endorses underage drinking." Seriously! Next thing you know they'll be attributing irrelevant acts of stupidity on something like this... oh wait... the anti-semitism thing on campus has already been blamed on the nickname. Present your side of the story fourwindsboy. I don't care. But if you can't do it in a respectful manner, one that is respectful to those who don't agree with you, then take the high road and simply don't state it. Sioux-cia has placed you on ignore and I'm not certain I blame her. She's tired of the "eye for an eye" approach previous anti-nicknamers have taken on this board and so am I. Start speaking respectfully and stop attacking other people's opinions in an argumentative fashion and you'll be treated far better. Otherwise, you'll just get summarily ignored or worse. Go in peace, pal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goon Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 It doesn't matter if the wrongdoers were punished. Those hecklers at that UND parade 30+ years ago could have been strung up by their feet, hung upside down, and shot with a shotgun for all it mattered, the "atrocity" would still exist. The Parade incident was in the early 1990's but I didn't want to interupt you while you were saying some good things. Sorry... In 1992, members of the UND Greek community harassed Native American children during the homecoming parade, chanting things like �Your parents are on welfare,� and �Go back to the reservation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourwindsboy Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 The Parade incident was in the early 1990's but I didn't want to interupt you while you were saying some good things. Sorry... Does anyone know if any action was taken against those students? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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