bincitysioux Posted March 30, 2005 Posted March 30, 2005 Jim, I know not too long ago you took the Divison reclassification forum off the site but I just had to chime in now. When NDSU went DI, I was thinking, "What are they thinking?". That was because of the success of both of the programs in the state, UND in the last 5 years, NDSU about 15-18 years ago. But I realized this season that my perception was skewed. In 2001 and 2003 all of our playoff games were at home. In 2004, most of our playoff games were on the road. I was shocked watchin on TV. Less than 4,000 people at a playoff game in St. Cloud. At least 1/3 of them were North Dakota fans. About 2,000 people against Michigan Tech?!?!?! Again, about 1/4 to 1/3 were North Dakota Fans. I thought it was pathetic. Then against GVSU in GF, we had 10,000-11,000, with a good contingency of GVSU fans. Pitt St. in Kansas was packed again with 9,000 plus. This tells me that maybe DII IS getting watered down, as far as football goes. UND needs to take a SERIOUS look at moving to DI. I realize that basketball and all other sports would suffer for the sake of football, but really, 2,000 in attedance during the playoffs against the No. 1 team in the country at Michigan Tech? The Alereus routinely brings in nine to eleven thousand for regular season games. Hockey is king at UND, no doubt about it. Basketball already suffers in GF for hockey and football, GF is just not a basketball town, but thanks to its history and facilities it can hold its own, and be competetive. But GF and UND can sustain a successful football program at a higher level. We are critical of NDSU for sacrificing all sports in the name of football, but UND is in a unique positiion that it could establish a successful football program in DI-AA to go along with its already dominant status in DI hockey. Quote
BisonMav Posted April 5, 2005 Posted April 5, 2005 Then against GVSU in GF, we had 10,000-11,000, with a good contingency of GVSU fans. The Alereus routinely brings in nine to eleven thousand for regular season games. Sorry guys, but bincitysioux is always over on Bisonville wisecracking away, so this response is just for bincitysioux. No smack intended. GVSU official game summary has 8,222 for the official attendance. Routinely must mean 1/2 the time, 4 games over 9,000, 4 games below 9,000. Quote
bigmrg74 Posted April 5, 2005 Posted April 5, 2005 Then against GVSU in GF, we had 10,000-11,000, with a good contingency of GVSU fans. It wasn't that great of a GVSU contingency. We probably traveled better to Winona than what we did to UND. It was thanksgiving weekend and everybody gave us that excuse for not coming along with us to GF. Quote
bincitysioux Posted April 6, 2005 Author Posted April 6, 2005 Sorry, all I'm saying is that UND draws alot better than most D-II schools in football. When I said 10,000, I must have just been caught up in the excitement of playoff football. I suppose there is more time to count the people in the stands at NDSU games. Football can compete at the next level....it's just that no other sport can. Quote
BisonMav Posted April 6, 2005 Posted April 6, 2005 Sorry, all I'm saying is that UND draws alot better than most D-II schools in football. When I said 10,000, I must have just been caught up in the excitement of playoff football. I suppose there is more time to count the people in the stands at NDSU games. Football can compete at the next level....it's just that no other sport can. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Point taken, UND does draw better than most DII schools. Quote
RD17 Posted April 6, 2005 Posted April 6, 2005 I'm still baffled by the attendance at the SCSU/UND playoff game. SCSU was hosting its first playoff game in 15 years, playing the game against a major conference rival in a brand new stadium, and the weather was absolutely beautiful for November (mid-50's and sunny). How in the world do you only draw 2500 fans, half of which are supporting the other team? Unbelievable. I think the bottom line is that some schools have great fan support for football win or lose and others obviously do not. Sometimes breaking that culture and turning a place into a "football school" is easier said than done. Quote
legend334 Posted April 6, 2005 Posted April 6, 2005 Football can compete at the next level....it's just that no other sport can. I am not so sure I agree with that statement. I believe any team at UND can compete if given the equal resources. Assistant coaches, recruiting budget, travel expenses, etc.. I do not know of one coach at UND that would enjoy the competition...as long as the playing field is equal to whoever they are competing against!!! Quote
sokarcrazy Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 The difference for playoff games is that only paid attendence counts. That means normally, will call give away tickets, the band, other halftime entertainment that gets free admission doesn't count toward "attendence" for the NCAA. So I am sure there were more there than the reported attendence. Quote
huskies679 Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 I'm still baffled by the attendance at the SCSU/UND playoff game. SCSU was hosting its first playoff game in 15 years, playing the game against a major conference rival in a brand new stadium, and the weather was absolutely beautiful for November (mid-50's and sunny). How in the world do you only draw 2500 fans, half of which are supporting the other team? Unbelievable. I think the bottom line is that some schools have great fan support for football win or lose and others obviously do not. Sometimes breaking that culture and turning a place into a "football school" is easier said than done. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> SCSU has never drawn for football but the reg season game between SCSU and UND was a tough ticket in St Cloud. I think that SJU had a game that day with over 10000 in attendance. That didn't help because it takes away the non-partisan football fan out of the picture. The casual fan would rather take in that atmosphere. I don't know what to do to get students to go to SCSU football games. I bet there were only 50 students at the game. Oh well, I guess I just have to yell a little louder to make up for the poor attendance. Quote
dakotadan Posted April 8, 2005 Posted April 8, 2005 I was at that game and there definately were just as many Sioux fans as Heavy-weight fans. Quote
BisonMav Posted April 8, 2005 Posted April 8, 2005 SCSU has never drawn for football but the reg season game between SCSU and UND was a tough ticket in St Cloud. I think that SJU had a game that day with over 10000 in attendance. That didn't help because it takes away the non-partisan football fan out of the picture. The casual fan would rather take in that atmosphere. I don't know what to do to get students to go to SCSU football games. I bet there were only 50 students at the game. Oh well, I guess I just have to yell a little louder to make up for the poor attendance. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What percent of St Cloud students are from the Twin Cities. I work with several grads and they like St Cloud Hockey, but most follow the Gophers for other sports. Quote
huskies679 Posted April 8, 2005 Posted April 8, 2005 I was at that game and there definately were just as many Sioux fans as Heavy-weight fans. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I would say that is a very fair comment. I was completely embarrassed at our turnout. But I am sitll proud of out team. Quote
bincitysioux Posted April 10, 2005 Author Posted April 10, 2005 Football can compete at the next level....it's just that no other sport can. I am not so sure I agree with that statement. Quote
bincitysioux Posted April 27, 2005 Author Posted April 27, 2005 Just one more point about attendance regarding UND, DII, and DI. UND drew 9,389 per football game in '04, seventh best in DII. Two schools ranked ahead of them (NDSU and SDSU) are in transition so actually you could say UND was 5th. The average for DII football attendance is only 3,685. The average for DI-AA is 7,666. North Dakota already draws better than most I-AA schools. For men's basketball, in '04 UND drew 2550 per game, 11th in the nation in DII. Throw out SDSU (#1 DII Attendance), and that again puts us in the top 10. Average DII basketball attendance was 864. Average DI was 5,154. I know UND is closer to the 864, but c'mon, that sounds pretty meager to me. In '04, UND hockey was 2nd in the nation in attendance, 10,870. Last point, average enrollment of DII schools is about 4,300, while enrollment of schools with I-AA football is a little over 10,000. I believe UND's enrollment is right around 13,000. UND/GF can support a program at the next level. Quote
Cratter Posted April 27, 2005 Posted April 27, 2005 Just one more point about attendance regarding UND, DII, and DI. UND drew 9,389 per football game in '04, seventh best in DII. Two schools ranked ahead of them (NDSU and SDSU) are in transition so actually you could say UND was 5th. The average for DII football attendance is only 3,685. The average for DI-AA is 7,666. North Dakota already draws better than most I-AA schools. For men's basketball, in '04 UND drew 2550 per game, 11th in the nation in DII. Throw out SDSU (#1 DII Attendance), and that again puts us in the top 10. Average DII basketball attendance was 864. Average DI was 5,154. I know UND is closer to the 864, but c'mon, that sounds pretty meager to me. In '04, UND hockey was 2nd in the nation in attendance, 10,870. Last point, average enrollment of DII schools is about 4,300, while enrollment of schools with I-AA football is a little over 10,000. I believe UND's enrollment is right around 13,000. UND/GF can support a program at the next level. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Excellent points BinCity, and to add about your comments about Men's basketball. Down the road mens basketball attendance would be around 4-6,000 (at D1 level) when you have bigger more recognizable names coming to your school....say Kansas, Minnesota, Iowa, Montana, Wisconsin, every couple years or so. Quote
PCM Posted April 27, 2005 Posted April 27, 2005 UND/GF can support a program at the next level. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> All it takes is money. How much ya got? Quote
BigGreyAnt41 Posted April 27, 2005 Posted April 27, 2005 Excellent points BinCity, and to add about your comments about Men's basketball. Quote
bincitysioux Posted April 27, 2005 Author Posted April 27, 2005 I don't think that a Wis-GB or any opponent from the Horizon league would draw less than Dakota Weslyan or Colorado St-Pueblo. Quote
ESPNInsider Posted April 27, 2005 Posted April 27, 2005 I don't think that a Wis-GB or any opponent from the Horizon league would draw less than Dakota Weslyan or Colorado St-Pueblo. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I do, look at NDSU's #'s from this year. Quote
IowaBison Posted April 27, 2005 Posted April 27, 2005 I do, look at NDSU's #'s from this year. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I don't remember Wisconsin-Green Bay visiting Fargo. Quote
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