timbo Posted December 4, 2004 Share Posted December 4, 2004 as for national titles both schools are history, the presidents letter has the tone of i am sick and tired of being second to ndsu and even though we cant afford it we are going to risk it instead of keeping the same position were are in now, the letter sent to UND from th big sky is the same as the rest of the letters sent to universitys they are wondering about and as for ndsu being badly in the red i talked to a guy today in the know and he claims that ndsu should come out even if not ahead as long as the trend of donations continues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted December 4, 2004 Author Share Posted December 4, 2004 I think people are looking at this letter in the wrong context. I agree that some of what Kupchella said and how he worded it is up for debate if a president should be saying that. But what people need to realize is that this was a personal letter that was in response to letters that he had received from UND letterwinners. He did not make these statements in an interview. I am assuming that he intended for this letter to remain private and not be printed in the Forum. I will agree though that even though Kupchella has these feelings (as many others of us do) that you should keep these comments behind closed doors and off of paper! I can only imagine what the letters he was replying to looked like. I am sure that those letters were probably alot worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted December 5, 2004 Author Share Posted December 5, 2004  Kupchella should challenge the alumni's fundraising ability with a goal that ties together academics and athletics and benefits both. A goal such as: Raise $15 million with $10 mill as a downpayment on an athletic scholars trust fund and $5 mill to start aerospace engineering and a DI move will be in the offing. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I completely agree with this idea. Set a goal for the alumni to raise so much money with a set amout for athletics and the rest for academics. This should have been UND's stance as soon as NDSU started talking about their move, ultimately causing talk about UND moving. From the very beginning Kupchella and Thomas could have stated that now is not the right time to move due to money issues, but if you raise the money we will look at the issue. Start a fund raising campaign including athletics and academics and at the least the U has more money for academics and even if they decided not to go DI they would still have that added money in the endowment to help support athletics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted December 5, 2004 Share Posted December 5, 2004 I think people are looking at this letter in the wrong context. I agree that some of what Kupchella said and how he worded it is up for debate if a president should be saying that. But what people need to realize is that this was a personal letter that was in response to letters that he had received from UND letterwinners. He did not make these statements in an interview. I am assuming that he intended for this letter to remain private and not be printed in the Forum. I will agree though that even though Kupchella has these feelings (as many others of us do) that you should keep these comments behind closed doors and off of paper! I can only imagine what the letters he was replying to looked like. I am sure that those letters were probably alot worse. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> save the fact the letter was destined to become public the argument make sense. that's precisely why you save these comments for speeches behind closed doors and unrecorded phone calls. if chapman had used the words 'hate' and 'UND' in the same sentence you would be seeing a similar reaction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxMeNow Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 FACT-NDSU was looking at moving to DI in 1992, but the Iraqi Oil Embargo caused the decision to be postponed. This may well be the MOST STUPID - MORONIC - LAME Justification for ANYTHING I've ever heard!!! yes... ...events on a GLOBAL SCALE "affected" your decision (I'd assume it was the beginning of a LONG losing streak to UND but who am I )...sorry, trying to keep a straight face here ...GET A GRIP you morons!!! THE WORLD DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND THE bison!!! If you can explain this reference....go ahead...I'm all ears ps - why do we bother with these self-absorbed IDIOTS!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonguy Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 This may well be the MOST STUPID - MORONIC - LAME Justification for ANYTHING I've ever heard!!! yes... ...events on a GLOBAL SCALE "affected" your decision (I'd assume it was the beginning of a LONG losing streak to UND but who am I )...sorry, trying to keep a straight face here ...GET A GRIP you morons!!! THE WORLD DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND THE bison!!! If you can explain this reference....go ahead...I'm all ears ps - why do we bother with these self-absorbed IDIOTS!!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Much higher oil prices=much higher travel costs=not feasible to move up when travel would be greatly increased and the costs of those travels are much more expensive because of the increased cost of gasoline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 (edited) I did a Google search for "Iraqi oil embargo" and "1992." I got a paltry 15 hits. The most interesting one was this article in the Aug. 26, 2004, Fargo Forum in which former NDSU assistant athletic director Dan Summy is quoted as saying: "The gas prices tripled, even quadrupled back then," said Summy, who was in charge of the committee. "The increased transportation costs were a big key in making such a move. It always came down to, 'Where are you going to find the money?'"I had no recollection of gas prices tripling or quadrupling in 1992. None of the other Google hits mention this either, which is rather strange for an event that would have had global economic consequences. I went to the DOE's Energy Information Administration Web site and looked up average US gasoline prices and found this interesting chart. It shows that in 1992, the average price for a gallon of unleaded regular gasoline was $1.127. This price is lower than the previous two years ($1.164 in 1991 and $1.14 in 1990). The average price per gallon of unleaded regular didn't increase above the 1992 level until 1995 when it hit $1.147. Since then, gasoline prices have mailnly trended upward, averaging $1.358 per gallon in 2002 and $1.591 in 2003. It looks as if the average price for 2004 will be around $1.85 per gallon. This begs the question: If the price of gas and the cost of transportation was a factor in NDSU's decision not to move to DI-AA in 1992, why didn't gas prices that truly were rising influence the decision-making process in 2002 and 2003? The Forum's story provides this lame answer: So what's the difference 12 years later? Well, Sadaam Hussein no longer rules Iraq and Joseph Chapman is now the NDSU president. Chapman, who came to NDSU from Division I Montana State, has been pushing for this move since he arrived in Fargo five years ago. Yes, Saddam is no longer in charge of Iraq, but anyone who takes five minutes to do a bit of research on the Web can see that gas prices were lower while Saddam was in power and have increased since he's been out of power. Some Bison fans have the gall to accuse the Grand Forks media of publishing "UND news releases." However, the Forum story clearly demonstrates that it will publish a pro-NDSU story that has no basis in fact without even bothering to confirm that it's true. More than ever, the public deserves to know the answer to the question Kupchella raised in his letter: Where is NDSU getting the money to cover the increased costs of moving to DI-AA? Edited December 6, 2004 by PCM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDSU grad Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 More than ever, the public deserves to know the answer to the question Kupchella raised in his letter: Where is NDSU getting the money to cover the increased costs of moving to DI-AA? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If the money is coming from private sources, does the public really deserve to know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 If the money is coming from private sources, does the public really deserve to know? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you want an honest debate on the issue, yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 If the money is coming from private sources, does the public really deserve to know? Open records laws in this state says, "yes" to that question. (Not the donor's name, just a confirmation of the revenue stream.) The public, the taxpayer, deserves to know that the money is coming in and that no deficit spending and debt is being incurred. And I'd think NDSU fans would love public confirmation of this in the media, "If the money is coming from private sources" truly. It would prove it can be done once and for all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hansel Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 If you want an honest debate on the issue, yes. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you want an honest discussion- you would have to see REA's books too. Call it a hunch but I don't see it happening. As far as Forum coverage- which are people going to more interested in, a possible NDSU budget deficit. (it started at an est 1M- but they Taylor said another home game would take 100k off that-which they got, so from what we "know' it stands at about 900k and there have been anonymous donations) or UND moving to DI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 which are people going to more interested in, "Which are" and "which should" are very different questions. Did someone mention REA's books? Not officially "the books", but the data in there had to come from "the books." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 If you want an honest discussion- you would have to see REA's books too. Call it a hunch but I don't see it happening. You're missing the point. This isn't about UND. Kupchella has stated that the university currently does not have the funding to cover the move and has said how much it will cost. Do you think he's lying? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 I'd just like to see the Fargo media show as much interest and zeal in obtaining records from NDSU on the DI-AA issue. There are two sides to this story. Right now, only one is being reported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 I'd just like to know why the Forum ran the story on Kupchella's letter on Saturday instead of any other day of the week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sicatoka Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 I'd just like to know why the Forum ran the story on Kupchella's letter on Saturday instead of any other day of the week. A letter to football lettermen on the day of a National Semifinal in football, maybe? (A lot of football fans picked that paper up for the UND @ PSU preview.) Because the letter really had nothing new in it, like most of the other stories that week? Because Kupchella had just left on vacation? Because UND had the banner headline the preceding two days and the Forum was going for a trifecta? What are you thinking as to why? That story was less impactful than the preceding ones in my opinion. That's probably why "Saturday". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 I disagree Sicatoka, I think it's because Saturday is the slowest news day of the week. While some may think it is a totally pointless story (and may be right), I think the Holy SH$t factor would have been much bigger it would have ran on a Tuesday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaBison Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cratter Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 "The Division I Question" is UND IS interested at this time in the BSC if they go DI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonguy Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 "The Division I Question" is UND IS interested at this time in the BSC if they go DI <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Shouldn't that be the Division I Answer? Looks like the letter of interest has been sent off to the Big Sky from UND. The questionaire was not filled out, but is not required at this point in the process. Doug Fullerton stated that UND must show interest in moving to DI to be considered. The above from WDAY 6:00 sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iramurphy Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 A letter to football lettermen on the day of a National Semifinal in football, maybe? (A lot of football fans picked that paper up for the UND @ PSU preview.) Because the letter really had nothing new in it, like most of the other stories that week? Because Kupchella had just left on vacation? Because UND had the banner headline the preceding two days and the Forum was going for a trifecta? What are you thinking as to why? That story was less impactful than the preceding ones in my opinion. That's probably why "Saturday". <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The letter was sent out quite a few days before the day of the semifinal game. It wasn't a bad letter. UND officials and concerned Alumni have been meeting and working on this issue even before the Bisonies made the move. Kupcake does bring out a very valid point and that is the step from DII to DIAA is not such a big step as some wish to believe. It is more expensive and would be a good move for football. The step from DII to the real DI is much bigger and that is why you see our friends from Fargo SDSU and N. Colorado lost when it comes to soccer, VB, BB etc. That is also why the other coaches don't want to make the move. If we can get the NCAA to agree to let DII FB teams move in FB alone it will solve the problem and UND will go. Other wise we need to get out the checkbooks and make it happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
administrator Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 This may well be the MOST STUPID - MORONIC - LAME Justification for ANYTHING I've ever heard!!!    yes... ...events on a GLOBAL SCALE   "affected" your decision (I'd assume it was the beginning of a LONG losing streak to UND but who am I )...sorry, trying to keep a straight face here      ...GET A GRIP you morons!!! THE WORLD DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND THE bison!!! If you can explain this reference....go ahead...I'm all ears       ps - why do we bother with these self-absorbed IDIOTS!!! This is a public post because it's directed to everyone, please keep down the taunting. The Bison and other opponents' fans here do a good job of heeding our requests to discuss the issues without smacking/trolling/personal attacks, and we expect the same from Sioux fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakotadan Posted December 7, 2004 Author Share Posted December 7, 2004 THIS IS THE BIGGEST GAME OF CHESS THAT I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! UND and the Alerus Center have retracted their bid to host the DII National Championship game. Why do you think that is? Even though UND is not saying a whole lot of anything new on the DI issue, they are sure trying to get their chess pieces in place for anything that happens! My thought on what is going on. UND is going to try carry things on as long as possible without taking a definate stance on the DI issue, DUH! Come Dec. 13 the Big Sky has their meeting to discuss expanding. Dec. 14 Roger is on the phone talking to sources in the BSC. RT feels out the waters to see what direction the current is flowing. We all know that he has to have had some closed door discussions up to this point with someone in the know. Dec. 16 RT interviews for the NCC Commissioner, or does he?!?! Ultimately, UND is making sure it has a few options. If the Big Sky does seem interested, UND can claim that it withdrew it's bid as a gesture of their commitment to moving DI. And is it a coincidence that the NCC Commissioner interviews are just a few days after the BSC meeting? I honestly don't know. But wouldn't that look good to the BSC if Roger turns down the job and in a few months states that it was because he wanted to help with UND's move to DI. These all seem like ways that UND can put itself in a position to look good to the BSC without ultimately having to do anything until more is know on the BSC's intentions. On the other hand, if things don't sound like they may be going in UND's direction as far as being accepted into the BSC if they announce a move to DI, Roger could take the NCC job and declare that UND is going no where, will be a cornerstone of the NCC, and start trying to recruite potential members into the NCC. Let the conspiracy theories continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigmrg74 Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 You know, playing the devils advocate here, but maybe the fact that they're not bidding on the D2 game just means that they don't think they can convince the powers that be in the NCAA into letting them host it there. North Dakota isn't easy to get to, and I know the game is indoors and all, But the North Dakota Climate isn't going to be all that attractive to fans from other schools that are prehaps more southernly located. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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