Conference Realignments - Take 2

[darell1976]

All fans do it. I bet I could dig up some equally moronic statements from UND fans about Minny and Wisco and Big Ten hockey.

Not this moronic. Went to the dance 3 years ago..."haven't won a tournament lately" You have to admit that is really stupid.

[johnson]

What got me is how we get slammed almost everyday from NDSU about travel and just basically about being in the Big Sky where 8 years ago they wanted in the Big Sky so bad and travel was never an issue for the school. Now that ORU is leaving they are slamming them too with idiotic statements:

http://www.bisonvill...tomorrow/page11

ORU went to the dance in 2006, 2007, and 2008. Besides NDSU's 1 year and Oakland there hasn't been any other Summit member since IUPUI in 2003 in the Dance. Last Summit team to win a first round game (not no play in game (Oakland 2005) was Valpo in 1998.

There are a lot of fans out there who type before they think. Travel wasn't an issue for NDSU at the time because the only options at that point were DI indy or go back to D2. I remember some heavy smack going on here about the FCS before UND left D2. I wonder if everyone still feels the same way now as they did back then? I think you switched positions on the Sioux name recently as well. Things change and so do opinions.

[darell1976]

There are a lot of fans out there who type before they think. Travel wasn't an issue for NDSU at the time because the only options at that point were DI indy or go back to D2. I remember some heavy smack going on here about the FCS before UND left D2. I wonder if everyone still feels the same way now as they did back then? I think you switched positions on the Sioux name recently as well. Things change and so do opinions.

Those fans hate to admit it. On the name issue.. I am for the name and big supporter until Nov. 30th 2010, then I went to retire the name. SR wasn't budging so it was over. Al Carlson's law..still not sold on it. Then the Big Sky letter came out threatening to possibly kicking UND out that changed my view 100% to change the name. We have no choice but to go to the Big Sky. They say well travel will be a problem, it will be a bigger problem if we are Independent.

[Bison Dan]

What got me is how we get slammed almost everyday from NDSU about travel and just basically about being in the Big Sky where 8 years ago they wanted in the Big Sky so bad and travel was never an issue for the school. Now that ORU is leaving they are slamming them too with idiotic statements:

http://www.bisonvill...tomorrow/page11

ORU went to the dance in 2006, 2007, and 2008. Besides NDSU's 1 year and Oakland there hasn't been any other Summit member since IUPUI in 2003 in the Dance. Last Summit team to win a first round game (not no play in game (Oakland 2005) was Valpo in 1998.

Darell why don't you just go back to all the smack NDSU recreived from you guys during our transition years? You guys were saying alot of the same stuff. 8 years ago the BSC was the ONLY option. NDSU is very happy where they are right now with multiple bus trips for travel instead of flying to every contest. You guys are happy with the BSC, great be happy. So why all the pages of posts about "how NDSU wishes it was in the BSC" and "how the BSC is so much better" which we all know is bs. Seems like you're trying to convince yourselves of something. If Montana and MSU decided to leave in a couple of years you'd be wishing them well I'm sure.

As far as winning I think ALL our sports teams have done very well to date and I won't bother to list all the big wins, but to just say that NDSU was the only FCS school to have all our fall sports last year in NCAA tournments.

[darell1976]

Darell why don't you just go back to all the smack NDSU recreived from you guys during our transition years? You guys were saying alot of the same stuff. 8 years ago the BSC was the ONLY option. NDSU is very happy where they are right now with multiple bus trips for travel instead of flying to every contest. You guys are happy with the BSC, great be happy. So why all the pages of posts about "how NDSU wishes it was in the BSC" and "how the BSC is so much better" which we all know is bs. Seems like you're trying to convince yourselves of something. If Montana and MSU decided to leave in a couple of years you'd be wishing them well I'm sure.

As far as winning I think ALL our sports teams have done very well to date and I won't bother to list all the big wins, but to just say that NDSU was the only FCS school to have all our fall sports last year in NCAA tournments.

Because all we still hear from you Bison fans are how we are going to struggle in the Big Sky due to travel. Where just 8 years ago you guys were all set, and travel was never an option. Also 8 years ago the GWFC was still alive so you still had an option. Where after this year there is no Great West so our ONLY option besides Independant land is the Big Sky. Take that over to Bisonville and share it. Yes people smacked NDSU for the move mostly because you moved while we were stuck in DII land, now that we are going to the Big Sky (MVFC's equal) you guys are smacking us on issues that didn't bother you 8 years ago. Jealousy?? And the Big Sky might be an option for NDSU if the NCC 2.0 oh sorry Summit League keeps their revolving door open and Oakland or IPFW or IUPUI leaves.

[JohnboyND7]

According to the Summit League president the Sioux logo was never an issue for him or the league and that President Kelley asked him to make statements that it would jeopardize a possible invite. The only reason USD joined the Summit league is because they couldn't afford the Summit buy out, South Dakota is a state that is hemorrhaging from a bad economy and they couldn't afford to join the BSC at the time because of the Summit. History and hockey has taught us that Sioux fans travel very well and our alumni are spread evenly throughout the footprint of the BSC, so we should be represented nicely at football and basketball games. Don't kid yourself, NDSU would give it's left nut to be in the Big Sky.

Don't your students have a hard time traveling to the Alerus?

NDSU would give it's left nut to be in the Missouri Valley fulltime, Missouri Valley is hands-down better than the Big Sky. I'm sure if the Big Sky could go back in time they probably would have let NDSU in rather than accepting Northern Colorado based on both schools performances since DI. Stay in the Summit until Missouri Valley comes knocking, otherwise, stand pat.

[The Sicatoka]

What's wrong with a scenario where one North Dakota research university has eastward ties and one has westward ties? I'd think that 's a win-win scenario because it opens lots of contacts and creates lots of options.

[darell1976]

Don't your students have a hard time traveling to the Alerus?

NDSU would give it's left nut to be in the Missouri Valley fulltime, Missouri Valley is hands-down better than the Big Sky. I'm sure if the Big Sky could go back in time they probably would have let NDSU in rather than accepting Northern Colorado based on both schools performances since DI. Stay in the Summit until Missouri Valley comes knocking, otherwise, stand pat.

You must not be able to read he said....ALUMNI not students. UND's alumni is heavy throughout the west.

[darell1976]

Don't your students have a hard time traveling to the Alerus?

NDSU would give it's left nut to be in the Missouri Valley fulltime, Missouri Valley is hands-down better than the Big Sky. I'm sure if the Big Sky could go back in time they probably would have let NDSU in rather than accepting Northern Colorado based on both schools performances since DI. Stay in the Summit until Missouri Valley comes knocking, otherwise, stand pat.

Both are 0-1 in the Dance. Of course UNC's trip was last year and NDSU's was...years ago. Football both haven't won a conference title. So point being is what??

[Bison Dan]

Because all we still hear from you Bison fans are how we are going to struggle in the Big Sky due to travel. Where just 8 years ago you guys were all set, and travel was never an option. Also 8 years ago the GWFC was still alive so you still had an option. Where after this year there is no Great West so our ONLY option besides Independant land is the Big Sky. Take that over to Bisonville and share it. Yes people smacked NDSU for the move mostly because you moved while we were stuck in DII land, now that we are going to the Big Sky (MVFC's equal) you guys are smacking us on issues that didn't bother you 8 years ago. Jealousy?? And the Big Sky might be an option for NDSU if the NCC 2.0 oh sorry Summit League keeps their revolving door open and Oakland or IPFW or IUPUI leaves.

WOW Darell - The GWC was created by Mr. Douple and Gene Taylor as a transitional conference for independants and transitioning DII schools in 2004 - our first year of the transition. Is the NCC 2.0 suppose to be some kind of smack? You do know that the NCC was the best DII conference in the country when it was running don't you? And believe me Darell you know nothing that I would ever need to share with anyone.

[johnson]

What's wrong with a scenario where one North Dakota research university has eastward ties and one has westward ties? I'd think that 's a win-win scenario because it opens lots of contacts and creates lots of options.

I completely agree with this. As far as the NCC 2.0 smack from Darrel I don't understand your angle. The NCHC has SCSU, UNO, UMD and UND in it who are all former NCC schools. Summit has NDSU, SDSU, UNO and USD. What exactly is your point or were you typing before thinking?

[PhillySioux]

I completely agree with this. As far as the NCC 2.0 smack from Darrel I don't understand your angle. The NCHC has SCSU, UNO, UMD and UND in it who are all former NCC schools. Summit has NDSU, SDSU, UNO and USD. What exactly is your point or were you typing before thinking?

The NCHC is not applicable the Summit situation. A more apt comparison to the NCHC is when most of the original WAC members left and started the Mountain West.

[RD17]

Don't your students have a hard time traveling to the Alerus?

NDSU would give it's left nut to be in the Missouri Valley fulltime, Missouri Valley is hands-down better than the Big Sky. I'm sure if the Big Sky could go back in time they probably would have let NDSU in rather than accepting Northern Colorado based on both schools performances since DI. Stay in the Summit until Missouri Valley comes knocking, otherwise, stand pat.

What makes you think the MVC will ever come knocking? You do realize that the MVC hasn't added a school in 17 years and has had just one departure in the last 26 years?

If the MVC announced tomorrow it was expanding, it would have interest from probably a dozen or more schools, with NDSU way down on its list. If the MVC ever did decide to expand northward, NDSU would be third in line behind USD and SDSU just based on geography.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: if Taylor et al would have been smart enough to allow Summit football to happen as a parallel league to the MVFC, future stability could have been created for the Summit League as a whole.

Without football, the Summit is and forever will be nothing more than a "starter" league that everyone seeks to escape at its first opportunity. Thank goodness that UND skipped that step in the process.

[johnson]

The NCHC is not applicable the Summit situation. A more apt comparison to the NCHC is when most of the original WAC members left and started the Mountain West.

The member schools were part of the former NCC in all other sports. The schools still wear the same name on their hockey jerseys as the other school sponsored athletic programs.

[PhillySioux]

What makes you think the MVC will ever come knocking? You do realize that the MVC hasn't added a school in 17 years and has had just one departure in the last 26 years?

If the MVC announced tomorrow it was expanding, it would have interest from probably a dozen or more schools, with NDSU way down on its list. If the MVC ever did decide to expand northward, NDSU would be third in line behind USD and SDSU just based on geography.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: if Taylor et al would have been smart enough to allow Summit football to happen as a parallel league to the MVFC, future stability could have been created for the Summit League as a whole.

Without football, the Summit is and forever will be nothing more than a "starter" league that everyone seeks to escape at its first opportunity. Thank goodness that UND skipped that step in the process.

IMHO, If I am the MVC I look very hard at DePaul long before I look at any current Summit schools. The Big East is going to the pits and Depaul's geography and sports mix works.

[JohnboyND7]

I think that the Big East is going to survive. It is just going to be a bit different, ESPN says that Big East, Conference USA, and MWC are considering some weird Super-League. I thought it sounded weird, but the set-up they used as an example kinda sorta maybe could possibly have a chance of working pretty well and end a lot of shifting around. If this went through, it could stop the shift of conferences in its tracks.

I seriously doubt that the MVC would take USD or SDSU before NDSU. NDSU has pretty good facilities, especially once the indoor track and basketball arena are ready to go, which conveniently enough, would probably be a little before or around the time the Summit explosion scenario would start up. In a perfect scenario, I would want SDSU to come with NDSU, we are kinda partners in crime so to speak. If the Summit is exploding and the Missouri Valley says no, then thats when NDSU would have to look to the Big Sky and I could kiss goodbye traveling to pretty much all road games.

I won't rag on the Big Sky as a conference, I just don't want NDSU to be a part of that, 7-8 years ago, I'd have been singing a different tune, but I like the current set-up NDSU has as long as it doesn't blow up.

[Johnny Five]

Is it possible that the two schools might "need" each other? Let's be honest here, competition and rivalry are a good thing. Both UND and NDSU have a good tradition in athletics and support from alums. It would be nice to have that natural travel partner and I for one miss the rivalry. Dammit I don't even hate UND football like I used to anymore....I'm in favor of the Bison going to the Big Sky but realize it's probably unlikely.

[darell1976]

I completely agree with this. As far as the NCC 2.0 smack from Darrel I don't understand your angle. The NCHC has SCSU, UNO, UMD and UND in it who are all former NCC schools. Summit has NDSU, SDSU, UNO and USD. What exactly is your point or were you typing before thinking?

You just gained Omaha and now all over BVille schools to replace ORU...St. Cloud and Mankato?? Hockey doesn't matter remember NDSU fan...its a niche sport. You guys dismiss our 7 DI titles so comparing DI basketball to DI hockey isn't the same in your green and gold glasses. Besides UMD won a national title in hockey, St. Cloud has been a member of DI hockey for decades while Omaha has been in DI hockey for years. SCSU, Mankato, and Omaha dropping football to join the Summit...where's Augy, and Morningside. My point is the Summit is turning into nothing more than a GWC with DII teams. I am glad UND is out of that conference. Yes better chance at the dance but getting to the championship against St. Cloud or Omaha?? If you lose..WOW!!!

[darell1976]

Is it possible that the two schools might "need" each other? Let's be honest here, competition and rivalry are a good thing. Both UND and NDSU have a good tradition in athletics and support from alums. It would be nice to have that natural travel partner and I for one miss the rivalry. Dammit I don't even hate UND football like I used to anymore....I'm in favor of the Bison going to the Big Sky but realize it's probably unlikely.

But wouldn't the travel hurt NDSU??

[Johnny Five]

As for football...what is UNI about 7 hours from Fargo? USD and SDSU pretty short trips to take. I live in Bismarck. As a football fan I make all the home games and maybe 1-2 away games and the current conference makes it easier to get to "some" of the road games. Let's be honest it is easier to get to SDSU but I can replace that with Grand Forks no problem. Heck the SDSU stands were jacked with Bison fans last weekend, that is not going to happen at UNC, EWU, Montana or Montana State I will tell you that. I am not travelling for basketball or baseball. This is looking at it from a selfish perspective, I could care less how the athletes get there.

I want the rivalry back. I think the two schools need to lock horns, become partners, make it happen....and then start hating each other again. LOL...

[darell1976]

As for football...what is UNI about 7 hours from Fargo? USD and SDSU pretty short trips to take. I live in Bismarck. As a football fan I make all the home games and maybe 1-2 away games and the current conference makes it easier to get to "some" of the road games. Let's be honest it is easier to get to SDSU but I can replace that with Grand Forks no problem. Heck the SDSU stands were jacked with Bison fans last weekend, that is not going to happen at UNC, EWU, Montana or Montana State I will tell you that. I am not travelling for basketball or baseball. This is looking at it from a selfish perspective, I could care less how the athletes get there.

I want the rivalry back. I think the two schools need to lock horns, become partners, make it happen....and then start hating each other again. LOL...

Thats what most bash UND about for joining the Big Sky..travel costs for the school. No one cares how the average joe gets from Grand Forks to Sacramento or Bozeman, but its how much it costs for UND to go to Sac St or Montana St. That is the major problem I have in looking back and seeing NDSU fans not mentioning travel in 03 but in 2011 its the number one problem that is going to plague UND for joining the Big Sky.

[Johnny Five]

Well some fans take every opportunity to rip their rivals obviously. Same can be said for UMN and Big 10 hockey, another rivalry (UND-UMN) I'm about to get screwed over on. UND and NDSU should figure out a fricken way to make it work. Seems like the best long term possibility is heading to the Big Sky so I'm in favor of it.

[UNDColorado]

Chartered flights are really not that expensive when you sell excess seats for $700 a pop; playing at least one FBS game per year takes care of the rest. Would you seriously rather sit on a buss for 4 - 7 hours or sit on a plane for 2?

Remember, it is not just about people in GF or Fargo who are butt hurt because they have to travel a little bit. This is more for alumni who are spread out around the western part of the country; there are more than most think. I bet UND has a pretty good showing at UNC this weekend because there are a lot of alumni out here that care. Same can be said for a lot of places in the Big Sky short of maybe Southern Utah.

That said I do wish NDSU was in the league for that game alone.

[johnson]

You just gained Omaha and now all over BVille schools to replace ORU...St. Cloud and Mankato?? Hockey doesn't matter remember NDSU fan...its a niche sport. You guys dismiss our 7 DI titles so comparing DI basketball to DI hockey isn't the same in your green and gold glasses. Besides UMD won a national title in hockey, St. Cloud has been a member of DI hockey for decades while Omaha has been in DI hockey for years. SCSU, Mankato, and Omaha dropping football to join the Summit...where's Augy, and Morningside. My point is the Summit is turning into nothing more than a GWC with DII teams. I am glad UND is out of that conference. Yes better chance at the dance but getting to the championship against St. Cloud or Omaha?? If you lose..WOW!!!

You also just gained Omaha and instead of Notre Dame you got St. Cloud so I believe you picked up a school you didn't really want either. You have a bad habit of grouping all NDSU fans into one. I have never dismissed your hockey titles nor would I ever. I could fire back at you with NDSU winning 8 titles in football and then wait for you do dismiss them because they are from so long ago and were won while still in D2. It can go on like this forever so why even do it? I don't understand how you justify NCC schools being in your conference because they have been in DI for a number of years while dismissing their other programs who are just making the move. They are still former NCC schools who have played pretty good hockey throughout the years and have had success at the D2 level. Now their other programs finally have an opportunity to play at the same level as their hockey teams. Why are the former NCC schools so inferior to you when they are playing in sports other than hockey? Do UNO and SCSU have different schools for the kids in hockey than the ones in all other sports? Do you think these former NCC schools would be as successful in DI hockey if there were over 300 schools participating? My point is we both have the same number of former NCC schools in our respective conferences and even a couple of the same. It is true that they have done some pretty good things in hockey but that doesn't mean that after a few years competing in DI they won't start playing some pretty good ball either. UND will eventually be playing these schools for OOC games and with the smack you are laying down you better hope they don't catch up.

[PhillySioux]

My friends at USD all hate Terry Vandrovec, as they believe hes in the bag for the Jacks. Here he has some thoughts on UND and conferences.

http://ia700700.us.archive.org/34/items/TerryVandrovec8Oct.25th2011SportsBlock/TerryVandrovecOct.25th2011.mp3