Chewey

In a word, YES. I know that the state governments could do NO worse than the entities charitably referred to as "tribal governments." Oh, and there would be a lot more transparency too so there would not be near the corruption or petty feuds as is the case on every reservation. Pray?!?!??!? WTF?!?!?!? While I agree that prayer is a good thing and can't hurt, how about adding some accountability of tribal governments and how about adding personal action/responsibility? If you're fully capable and sitting in a cesspool, all you have to do is get up and walk out of it. You don't pray that Captain Kirk beams you out of it up to his ship and you don't pray that God lifts you out of it. At one time, Germans, English, French, Chinese, India Indians, etc were all like American Indians in that they were tribal and nomadic. They, as a whole, have largely made the quantum leap to "white" success and they were able to retain a lot of their heritage. Look at Quebec for a modern example. Look at Pella, IA for a modern example with respect to the Dutch. The problem with Russell Means and people of his sour ilk is that they cling to a past existence that is no longer possible or practical. It's one thing to retain your heritage. It's quite another to reject all modern avenues to success and thumb your nose at the whole country. Maybe Russell can design a time machine? That's the only way what he wants is going to happen.

While I agree that the U S, in many respects, did not stick to the treaties with the Indians and while I understand that indians have suffered through the decades, it is thinking like this that only perpetuates the suffering of the indian people. I don't see how parting from the U.S. helps indians at all. Without federal money and with the political corruption that pervades many reservations, the indian people would only be worse off. Time to move through the anger and work within what you've got now even though you would rather things be different.

Corruption. Just another reason why the tribes/reservations should be done away with.

You're right. Burglary, embezzlement, etc. don't involve hate. The so-called "hate crimes" involve passion/hate just like manslaughter, murder, rape, etc. The fact that the victim is a afro-american, homosexual, etc. is simply a different expression of passion/hate. To elevate those victims into a special class over and above rape victims, white murder victims, assault victims is itself a form of bigotry and discrimination. When I was in high school and got into a fistfight with someone, there was "hate" or dislike involved. To presume additional malice simply because a victim is in a new protected class is nothing more than a diminution of the constitutional rights that are to be accorded any defendant. Tommyjo, you spelled the name correctly; it's correct for me, anyway. There's a reason I spell it that way and it involves a certain AKS frat party about 18 years ago.

Every crime is a "hate" crime. People who rape hate and want to control women. People who murder hate the ones being murdered, etc. All crimes of violence are terrible, end of story.

Agree entirely. "Independent" means indenpendent, right? From what my mother-in-law, a French Canadian, tells me, the Quebec French Canadians want for themselves how the indians have it here. It's truly nonsensical.

I guess I'm surprised by it too. Perhaps the tribes may see the advantages of close connections with the UND. The putting on of clinics, etc on the reservation could only help the reservation youth. Maybe they can see how a close connection with the U and the nickname can help their people in such ways. I'm probably being naive but I'd like to think that they're seeing the positives.

Yep. See NCAA. What are the realistic odds of just having "North Dakota"? There are many benefits to this, not the least of which is that no committee of PC professor types would be appointed for purposes of finding a completely sanitized and boring nickname.

Yes, but all the people in the state are "Dakota" or "Dakotans." By "Fighting Dakota" or "Fighting Dakotans," the reference would not necessarily be to the Dakota Sioux Tribe. The reference would be to the inhabitants of North Dakota. A bit Paul Bunyan-type white guy with a scythe could be the logo. I bet Brien could do a nice job with it.

Please no animals. Go with "Fighting Nordics" or something like that. While I like the "Dakotans" or "Fighting Dakotans," the word "Dakota" means friend or ally doesn't it? Thus, the "Fighting Friends"?? "The Fighting Allies"??

Southern Minnesota -- the Blooming Prairie "Blossoms" This is an actual team name. No $#@@! I could hardly believe it myself when I watched the Mankato Loyola "Crusaders" play them in football this year.

We could always have the ABBA song "Super Trooper" at the start of games.

They could always be named "the Blossoms" like one of the area teams around here. Stupid.

The so-called political leaders on the res are so entrenched against the nickname that I don't think this thoughtful letter will make any difference. They and their UND professor cohorts are the very ones that label such well-reasoned people "sell outs."

I agree with you DaveK. Although I am not a liberal, I have several friends who are and they too are pieved at the PC faction that find the Sioux nickname "offensive." While I'm more of a conservative/independent (given the failings of the Bush Presidency and the corruption of the Republican Party generally), I agree that not all liberals should be considered "knee-jerk" just like all conservatives should not be so labeled. The use of such terms only stifles legitimate debate from the get go. I'm sure I've done the same thing as the Chief at times so, personally, I'm going to be more vigilant about it. The Chief seems to be a pretty conscientious and articulate fellow so I'm sure a better way will be found.

There should be a boycott of their casinos, in my opinion. They get most or all of their revenue from ND residents. There may be a few SD residents with the Prairie Winds Casino and some Canadians with the Spirit Lake Tribe's casino but any ND person ought to stay clear away and go to New Town or Belcourt or Mahnomen, MN. The per capita paid out from casino revenues is the tribe's until it is paid out to the tribal members. The powers that be on the tribal council can really mess with someone they don't like (or who opposes them) by not paying per capita or by paying greatly reduced per capita. They are not supposed to do this and there is recourse that can be had against them for doing it but it happens all the time anyway. It happens here in MN with the Lower and Upper Sioux tribes so I'm sure it happens in ND. I'm sure RHHIThunder and cohorts have made it known that anyone who opposes them will have their per capita at risk. I say wait the 3 years out. Perhaps new tribal leadership will change things.

You have that right. It's just too bad that he has a widely circulated mouth piece in which to propagandize and misinform. What actually is being done? Is all of it just going to be a half-hearted attempt to give it the old college try and then accept the inevitable? One would think that the AG and the Gov and maybe even the congressional delegation would be meeting with the tribes at some point. I suppose the congressional delegation will not care (indeed they have not cared) what the tribes do as long as the tribes don't rat them out (i.e. see Jack Abramoff). One would think that UND would have Archie Fool Bear and others on the reservations trying to help out. Perhaps, as one already insightfully pointed out, all of this has been just to placate and satisfy the alumni and the AG just went through the motions. I don't see why they would have spent so much money just going through the motions though.

Well, you should take in to account that people are very disappointed and angry. Those feelings are often expressed inartfully and I speak from experience there. That does not mean that people are racist. Some of what has been said has been directed at Ron His Horse Is Thunder and his NA and non-NA cohorts. I can't speak for everyone but don't think anyone, if asked when he or she is not angry, would truly advocate for the elimination of programs that help a group of people in need. Will the programs suffer due to apathy or grudges held? Only time will tell that but I don't think anyone would come out advocating for it simpy because of a name change. Quid pro quo was not the coin when the programs were started and it should not be the coin for them to be maintained. Suffice it to say that people are angry and that they say things inartfully when they are angry.

Any idea as to whether a vote has been scheduled with the Spirit Lake Tribe? It seems as though that tribe has been the one closest to giving support for the nickname. Any idea on whether the tribe will clarify its 2000 resolution supporting the nickname as long as good comes from it (or something like that)? I think that's what it said but I forget right now.

I agree with what you are saying. I agree that lumping all NA's with Ron His Horse is Thunder (that is a cool name -- I have to give him that) is not right and that NA students are just students like anyone else. I think that the many advantages that would accompany an agreement regarding the Sioux name and inure to the benefit of all NAs will be lost, even as to the non-PC/"I don't care" NAs. This will be a true loss. I just hope the NAs lay the blame right at Ron and cohorts for not receiving all of the good things that could have come about.

Yes. Just wait for the hue and cry that UND is not "inclusive" enough. Just wait for the claims that the tribes are being ignored because of the nickname dispute and that the nickname hostily still lives on campus 10 years, 20 years, etc. after. I too think that saving face may have been the route taken all along. Whomever posted that was/is pretty insightful.

Why in the He!! did the AG agree that both tribes need to give permission?? For everyone else, only one tribe is supposedly required right? I think it would be possible to get the Spirit Lake Tribe on board but I'm not so sure about the Standing Rock Tribe. I agree that the state should have gone forward to trial and made the NC00 change its bylaws formally. I still am not convinced that the NC00 would have had the votes to do that but I am a total outsider. I still would like to think that the AG and the state officials know something about possibilities that I don't. The tribes would be pretty stupid, financially speaking, to not come to some agreement with UND. But like my dad who works on a res says, "rational thinking is not really part of the native mindset" or the PC mindset for that matter.

Wow!