SiouxCrew11 Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 In looking at the all-NCC 1st team selections is it good to see so many UND players selected to the all conference team (9 in all) but i can't help but think where is Danny Fruend? Zach Miller of UNO was selected as 1st team all conference. But look at the stats: Fruend: 176.35 Efficiency, 182 Cmp (68.7%), 5 INT, 2573 yds, 24 TD Miller: 147.85 Efficiency, 104 Cmp (61.9%), 5 INT, 1445 yds, 10 TD Miller does add 9 TDs and 808 yds rushing to Fruend's 4 TDs on 51 yds rushing. Even with the rushing numbers Miller doesn't quite stack up to Fruend. Sure the Mavs went undefeated but UND only lost one game and your record shouldn't play into the all-conference selections because it should be based on individual achievement. Zach Miller is a glorified RB in my opinion and is a great player (i saw for myself when they played UND). However, he didn't deserve this. I think the coaches made a big mistake on their all-conference selections and should be embarassed. With stats that far surpass those of the 1st team selection Fruend only received honorable mention!
soohockey15 Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 It's because he plays on an undefeated team. Just like with Gold Gloves in baseball, where if you can hit you can win a Gold Glove (Derek Jeter), if you are on the best team in the country you'll be viewed as a better player.
tnt Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 In looking at the all-NCC 1st team selections is it good to see so many UND players selected to the all conference team (9 in all) but i can't help but think where is Danny Fruend? Zach Miller of UNO was selected as 1st team all conference. But look at the stats: Fruend: 176.35 Efficiency, 182 Cmp (68.7%), 5 INT, 2573 yds, 24 TD Miller: 147.85 Efficiency, 104 Cmp (61.9%), 5 INT, 1445 yds, 10 TD Miller does add 9 TDs and 808 yds rushing to Fruend's 4 TDs on 51 yds rushing. Even with the rushing numbers Miller doesn't quite stack up to Fruend. Sure the Mavs went undefeated but UND only lost one game and your record shouldn't play into the all-conference selections because it should be based on individual achievement. Zach Miller is a glorified RB in my opinion and is a great player (i saw for myself when they played UND). However, he didn't deserve this. I think the coaches made a big mistake on their all-conference selections and should be embarassed. With stats that far surpass those of the 1st team selection Fruend only received honorable mention! Don't think even Dale Lennon would classify this as being robbed. You can make a case for Freund, but Miller is an awesome talent, and head to head he led his team to a win.
BIGSIOUX Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 Mike Reiley is the best QB in the conference hands down.
siouxkid12 Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 It's because he plays on an undefeated team. Just like with Gold Gloves in baseball, where if you can hit you can win a Gold Glove (Derek Jeter), if you are on the best team in the country you'll be viewed as a better player. Gold Gloves are based on DEFENSE NOT OFFENSE! and out of 19 Gold Glove winners this year 7 came from playoff teams. Also, last year Justin Morneau won the AL MVP and he was not on the best team in the country. To start on Derek Jeter, I hate the Yankees but Jeter is at best and average hitter but his fielding is what makes him, in 1783 games he has only 182 errors which gives him a percentage of .975 which is very good. So to say that if you win a Gold Glove just because you can hit and your on the best team in the country does not make any sense.
The Sicatoka Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 So to say that if you win a Gold Glove just because you can hit and your on the best team in the country does not make any sense. Don Mattingly. Kent Hrbek. Who hit better? Donny Baseball. Who was a Yankee? Donny Baseball. Who was better defensively at first base? Kent Hrbek. Who has the Gold Gloves ....
siouxkid12 Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 Don Mattingly. Kent Hrbek. Who hit better? Donny Baseball. Who was a Yankee? Donny Baseball. Who was better defensively at first base? Kent Hrbek. Who has the Gold Gloves .... Don Mattingly : 1634 games=64 errors Fielding percentage .996 Kent Hrbek : 1609 games=87 errors Fielding percentage .994 are you still going to try and prove me wrong?
SiouxCrew11 Posted November 20, 2007 Author Posted November 20, 2007 how did this get offtrack so quickly?
siouxkid12 Posted November 20, 2007 Posted November 20, 2007 how did this get offtrack so quickly? Well soohockey tried explaining that you only win awards when you are on undefeated teams and then he went on to try and compare that with Gold Gloves in baseball and then I had to chime in and tell him his reasoning was wrong. But I also think everyone on this forum has a severe case of ADD because we all get sidetracked pretty easily!
Lefty - UNO Fan Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 I guess I missed the part where stats were the defining criteria when I was playing in the NCC. Ben King was robbed and so was Ted Schlafke. I mean don't the coaches know they should be voting for whoever has the best numbers and not who is the best player or who is the most likely to beat you? I know they spend every week breaking down film of every team in the conference versus us fans who follow our teams and see the opponents once every two years. Why bother with film study when the stats are available?
iramurphy Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 In looking at the all-NCC 1st team selections is it good to see so many UND players selected to the all conference team (9 in all) but i can't help but think where is Danny Fruend? Zach Miller of UNO was selected as 1st team all conference. But look at the stats: Fruend: 176.35 Efficiency, 182 Cmp (68.7%), 5 INT, 2573 yds, 24 TD Miller: 147.85 Efficiency, 104 Cmp (61.9%), 5 INT, 1445 yds, 10 TD Miller does add 9 TDs and 808 yds rushing to Fruend's 4 TDs on 51 yds rushing. Even with the rushing numbers Miller doesn't quite stack up to Fruend. Sure the Mavs went undefeated but UND only lost one game and your record shouldn't play into the all-conference selections because it should be based on individual achievement. Zach Miller is a glorified RB in my opinion and is a great player (i saw for myself when they played UND). However, he didn't deserve this. I think the coaches made a big mistake on their all-conference selections and should be embarassed. With stats that far surpass those of the 1st team selection Fruend only received honorable mention! Freund has had a great year and would have been deserving as well. The difference was Freund in the UNO game. HE missed Dressler twice when he was wide open and the FB once all for touchdowns which likely would have made the diffeence in the game. Conf. Championship to the Mavs, home field advantage to the Mavs, bye week to the Mavs and All Conf to Miller. Can't argue too much. He can make his case by getting wins the next two weeks over GVS and the Mavs in Omaha.
The Sicatoka Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Don Mattingly : 1634 games=64 errors Fielding percentage .996 Kent Hrbek : 1609 games=87 errors Fielding percentage .994 are you still going to try and prove me wrong? Check the year by year numbers. There's at least one that Kent got the short end. Now, back to this: I don't believe Freund got the short end. Which QB is the best in the league? The one who got his team to the best record in the league as long as he has numbers showing his impact in the team performance. Omaha's guy has it.
BigGame Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 I guess I missed the part where stats were the defining criteria when I was playing in the NCC. Ben King was robbed and so was Ted Schlafke. I mean don't the coaches know they should be voting for whoever has the best numbers and not who is the best player or who is the most likely to beat you? I know they spend every week breaking down film of every team in the conference versus us fans who follow our teams and see the opponents once every two years. Why bother with film study when the stats are available? I wouldn't worry about it, it's just a couple of fans whining. Miller is a scarey player to prepare for all by himself, I don't think most teams go into a game with UND thinking "we need to shut down Danny Freund". Fruend is a very good player but the NCC has some great QB's this season and I don't think it's slight that he isn't on the all NCC considering who he was up against. Most QB's didn't players like Weston Dressler to pass to either and that can make a big difference in the stat column. I personally would have put Reilly on the 1st team and Miller on the 2nd but both are very deserving either way.
siouxkid12 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Check the year by year numbers. There's at least one that Kent got the short end. Now, back to this: I don't believe Freund got the short end. Which QB is the best in the league? The one who got his team to the best record in the league as long as he has numbers showing his impact in the team performance. Omaha's guy has it. I am failing to see what year you would be talking about: 1985 1st GG Don:159 GP 7 E .993 FP Kent: 156 GP 8E .995 FP(less games but more errors) 1986 2nd GG Don: 160 GP 6 E .996 FP Kent: 147 GP 10E .992 FP(once again less games more errors) 1987 3rd GG Don: 140 GP 5 E .996 FP Kent: 137 GP 5 E .996 FP(same FP but Don gets it because of the more games played) 1988 4th GG Don: 143 GP 9 E .993 FP Kent: 105 GP 3 E .997 FP (cant give it to someone who has played 38 less games) 1989 5th GG Don: 145 GP 7 E .995 FP Kent: 89 GP 4 E .995 FP (same reason he didnt win it in '88, except he played 56 less games) 1991 6th GG Don: 127 GP 5 E .996 FP Kent: 128 GP 8 E .994 FP (Don plays one less game and because of his past record wins it) 1992 7th GG Don: 143 GP 4 E .997 FP Kent: 104 GP 3 E .997 FP (plays in 39 less games and pretty much has the same record, not this year!) 1993 8th GG Don: 130 GP 3 E .998 FP Kent: 115 GP 5 E .995 FP (once again played in less games) 1994 9th GG Don: 125 GP 7 E .994 FP Kent: 72 GP 2 E .997 FP (award shouldnt have been given out but the season was 3/4 done anyway) now please tell me where should have kent won it?
The Sicatoka Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Gold Gloves are based on DEFENSE NOT OFFENSE! Indeed, so why isn't fielding percentage king? And as a starting point, almost all first basemen field at over .990 (because of the high number of handles). I'd say Kent was shorted in 1988. He played more than half the season with a mere 3 errors and a far better overall percentage (in first baseman terms). Before you go off on "number of games played", how many partial seasons did (injury prone) Ken Griffey Jr. play and yet win a Gold Glove? Freund will be all conference next year, in FCS.
airmail Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Isn't Kent Hrbek that fat guy with the fishing show?
Northcountry Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Don Mattingly. Kent Hrbek. Who hit better? Donny Baseball. Who was a Yankee? Donny Baseball. Who was better defensively at first base? Kent Hrbek. Who has the Gold Gloves .... Kent Hrbek was better defensively than Don Mattingly? Within his limited range, Hrbek was outstanding but the best in the AL? I would beg to differ.
siouxkid12 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Indeed, so why isn't fielding percentage king? And as a starting point, almost all first basemen field at over .990 (because of the high number of handles). I'd say Kent was shorted in 1988. He played more than half the season with a mere 3 errors and a far better overall percentage (in first baseman terms). Before you go off on "number of games played", how many partial seasons did (injury prone) Ken Griffey Jr. play and yet win a Gold Glove? Freund will be all conference next year, in FCS. give it to someone who had a mere 3 errors in 105 games? that would be the stupidest thing ever, of course he is going to have less errors HE PLAYED IN A LOT LESS GAMES. To answer your question of how many GG did JR. win when he played a partial season...ZERO God you are getting dumber each time you speak...Griffey has only 10 GG and those 10 gold gloves all came when he played in SEATTLE not with the REDS it wasnt tell he got to the REDS that he started getting injured.
choyt3 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Kent Hrbek was better defensively than Don Mattingly? Within his limited range, Hrbek was outstanding but the best in the AL? I would beg to differ. Juff Dubay said it on "PA and Dubay" last week, so it must be true.
PCM Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 God you are getting dumber each time you speak... And you're getting more obnoxious every time you post. Chill, kid.
siouxkid12 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 And you're getting more obnoxious every time you post. Chill, kid. No, I just hate people who dont do some research and just say things off the top of there head. I am a huge Twins fan but i know Kent Hrbek was not the best out there and I can live with that, some people cant live with that fact and keep coming up with stupid claims of why he is better then Don. Each time he speaks he is getting dumber because he does not take the time to actually find these things out, he just thinks he is Howie Schwab and can name things right off the top of his head.
PCM Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 No, I just hate people who dont do some research and just say things off the top of there head. Fine. Make your point without resorting to insults and personal attacks.
siouxkid12 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 Fine. Make your point without resorting to insults and personal attacks. what, are you my mother now? I will say what I want to say when someone says stupid things!
PCM Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 what, are you my mother now? No, it's just a suggestion that you might want to consider if you want to be taken seriously.
siouxkid12 Posted November 21, 2007 Posted November 21, 2007 No, it's just a suggestion that you might want to consider if you want to be taken seriously. Well when I show FACTS its kind of hard to not take me seriously. You can't argue FACTS, something some people on here dont know how to get.
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