Media Stories on the Sioux Name

[happy]

[The Sicatoka]

So, as a first step to amends, and to eliminate the problems brought by white people, the land the University of Minnesota - Twin Cities sits on should be given back to the Sioux.

There's a treaty that says everything west of the Mississippi in that area was to belong to the Sioux. PCM posted the details here a while back.

[happy]

So, as a first step to amends, and to eliminate the problems brought by white people, the land the University of Minnesota - Twin Cities sits on should be given back to the Sioux.

There's a treaty that says everything west of the Mississippi in that area was to belong to the Sioux. PCM posted the details here a while back.

They can have the West bank, all that's over there is a law library and some liberal arts buildings, with bad modern architecture. The majority of the U of M sits on the East bank of the Mississippi.

You must have gotten your geology lessons from Miss South Carolina Teen.

I think as the first step the U of M should do something symbolic, like refusing to play sporting events against teams that knowing use "hostile and abusive" nicknames. That should be more than enough of a sacrifice to make amends.

[Diggler]

I think as the first step the U of M should do something symbolic, like refusing to play sporting events against teams that knowing use "hostile and abusive" nicknames. That should be more than enough of a sacrifice to make amends.

What about all the Sioux that don't care about sports? I hardly think they'll be satisfied.

[DamStrait]

They can have the West bank, all that's over there is a law library and some liberal arts buildings, with bad modern architecture. The majority of the U of M sits on the East bank of the Mississippi.

You must have gotten your geology lessons from Miss South Carolina Teen.

I think as the first step the U of M should do something symbolic, like refusing to play sporting events against teams that knowing use "hostile and abusive" nicknames. That should be more than enough of a sacrifice to make amends.

Yappy - it's "geography" not "geology" and it's "knowingly" not "knowing". Looks like your reputation as an ignorant jackass is well deserved.

[ScottM]

They can have the West bank, all that's over there is a law library and some liberal arts buildings, with bad modern architecture. The majority of the U of M sits on the East bank of the Mississippi.

You must have gotten your geology lessons from Miss South Carolina Teen.

I think as the first step the U of M should do something symbolic, like refusing to play sporting events against teams that knowing use "hostile and abusive" nicknames. That should be more than enough of a sacrifice to make amends.

Bahahaha! Classic.

[The Sicatoka]

They can have the West bank, all that's over there is a law library and some liberal arts buildings, with bad modern architecture.

If it's so inconsequential, get it done.

[Chewey]

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

Wow, the wiping out of tribes, the taking away of land, the changing of ways of life didn't happen as between warring, conquering/conquered tribes before the white man came?....

Please-do not interrupt the agenda.

(Actually, its probably more accurate to say "do not interrupt the trolling".)

[Sioux-cia]

Where would people like Happy and the rest of the PCers be without the gift of victimology?

IMHO

Happy could give a rat's a$$ about the 'plight' of the NA. He's only a trollin' Goofy fan.

[happy]

[Csonked Out]

[Sioux-cia]

Good post. I have yet to get an answer to my questions.

How is the Fighting Sioux name and logo creating or contributing to the problems of the Sioux Nation???

How is the University of North Dakota, an institution of higher learning, preventing any Native American from receiving an education? As previously stated, the NA programs at UND have been set up to help Native Americans succeed in getting a degree in their major of choice.

I received a pleasant surprise today. The daughter of a Navajo friend I made here on the Navajo Nation told me today that she is going to apply to UND. She wants to be an Anesthesiologist. I had spoked about UND and all the programs available to Native Americans. She thinks it would be a good fit for her.

I'm worried though. I'm concerned that some zealot will get a hold of her and try to brainwash her to their way of thinking.

[Csonked Out]

Good post. I have yet to get an answer to my questions.

How is the Fighting Sioux name and logo creating or contributing to the problems of the Sioux Nation???

How is the University of North Dakota, an institution of higher learning, preventing any Native American from receiving an education? As previously stated, the NA programs at UND have been set up to help Native Americans succeed in getting a degree in their major of choice.

I received a pleasant surprise today. The daughter of a Navajo friend I made here on the Navajo Nation told me today that she is going to apply to UND. She wants to be an Anesthesiologist. I had spoked about UND and all the programs available to Native Americans. She thinks it would be a good fit for her.

I'm worried though. I'm concerned that some zealot will get a hold of her and try to brainwash her to their way of thinking.

I really do the nickname is used as an excuse so they dont have to focus on all the other problems that are going on. I think the main problem is the way some of these kids are raised. Their being told that they can't succeed because there parents didn't have the opportunity, or something went wrong. The hardest problems to change are the ones that are passed down through generations and pushed do the side, and this is just pushing the problem to the side by using the nickname as a shield.

[star2city]

NCAA asks judge to reconsider order, claims UND misled agency

In its "Motion for Partial Reconsideration," the NCAA argues UND itself may have violated NCAA bylaws, making it ineligible to bring its case.

The motion accuses UND of misleading the NCAA during its administrative appeals process by consistently claiming the Spirit Lake Sioux Nation supports UND's continued use of its nickname.

A 2000 Spirit Lake Tribal Council resolution states: "as long as something positive comes from this controversy, (the tribe is) not opposed to keeping the 'Sioux' name and present logo at UND."

UND has consistently maintained that the resolution should be read as a vote of support for the nickname, but tribal officials did not respond to several NCAA requests for clarification on the tribe's position.

In an Aug. 13 interview with the Herald, Spirit Lake Tribal Chairwoman Myra Pearson said she reads the resolution as neither supporting nor opposing the nickname. She said she does not expect the tribal council to clarify its position or to reconsider the nickname issue.

"Throughout the appeal process at issue, plaintiff consistently maintained that it had the endorsement and support of the Spirit Lake Nation," the NCAA motion states. "Those claims are also an integral part of the pending litigation. . . . Based on recent developments, it is becoming increasingly difficult to accept that plaintiff could have made these claims in good faith, much less 'utmost good faith.'"

The NCAA seems to be really grasping for straws here. They're stating UND misled the NCAA with "support" from the Spirit Lake resolution, yet the NCAA rejected the Spirit Lake resolution themselves. Obtuse logic by the NCAA.

[PCM]

This seems like a desparation move to me. Classic red herring.

[GeauxSioux]

This seems like a desparation move to me. Classic red herring.

Desperation is exactly how I read the article. They are throwing anything that they think could stick.

[dagies]

One thing I would like to mention. Many of us have asked the question about how changing the nickname will help solve the problems on the reservations. And we have been frustrated that we don't seem to get tribal leadership to care enough to help us out.

I think it bears mention that in a recent quote, Myra Pearson said they wouldn't revisit the nickname issue because they had more pressing problems to deal with.

1. Yes, that's a bummer for Fighting Sioux fans because we aren't getting the warm fuzzy we need.

2. That should be a blow against the NCAA. It would appear tribal leadership is sending the message that this nickname issue isn't that big of a deal to them. Certainly not a big enough deal to spend time denouncing.

[Goon]

This seems like a desparation move to me. Classic red herring.

I think PCM is right, I think the NCAA realizes with out that:

The NCAA might have no chance of winning in court...

In its "Motion for Partial Reconsideration," the NCAA argues UND itself may have violated NCAA bylaws, making it ineligible to bring its case.

[Goon]

Good post. I have yet to get an answer to my questions.

How is the Fighting Sioux name and logo creating or contributing to the problems of the Sioux Nation???

Its not.

[ScottM]

This seems like a desparation move to me. Classic red herring.

No, this is "desperation".

The NCAA motion also claims UND may have "impaired its equitable standing" through agreements with the Ralph Engelstad Arena.

"It is becoming increasingly apparent that the interests of third parties (Ralph Engelstad, his estate, family and foundations) have so insinuated themselves in this controversy that they cannot be ignored," the motion states.

I think the "Fat Lady" is warming up in the back room ...

As for the Spirt Lake resolution, was Pearson even the president in 2000?

[Goon]

No, this is "desperation".

I think the "Fat Lady" is warming up in the back room ...

As for the Spirt Lake resolution, was Pearson even the president in 2000?

Is this desperation on the NC$$ like it appears or is there a chance the judge grants the NC$$ the request?

If I remember back to 2000 the resolution on the name was that they spirit lake tribe didn't mind the name, I don't see how that can be bad faith on UND's part?

[Chewey]

Is this desperation on the NC$$ like it appears or is there a chance the judge grants the NC$$ the request?

If I remember back to 2000 the resolution on the name was that they spirit lake tribe didn't mind the name, I don't see how that can be bad faith on UND's part?

Regardless, I don't see how that fits into the "hostile and abusive" element. If the Judge believes that granting the request will "encourage" settlement, he'll likely do it. If he believes that denying it will "encourage" settlement, he do that. He's already decided it. I don't see how any recent "evidence" is going to change the focus from whether the NC00 followed its own contract to whether UND was "hostile and abusive" vis-a-vis the nickname/logo. Scott M or PCM probably have a better take on it but that's my 2 cents even though you didn't ask to be assaulted with my 2 cents.

[Chief Illiniwek Supporter]

From the article....

A motion filed Aug. 30 by the NCAA...

So this only became public knowledge ten days later? Why wasn't this motion disclosed earlier?

Its merely one layman's opinion, but it seems that the NCAA is trying to get the judge to define "support". Assuming the NCAA had a verbatim copy of the resolution in hand, this part of their complaint seems groundless.

Further quote from the article....

The NCAA motion also claims UND may have "impaired its equitable standing" through agreements with the Ralph Engelstad Arena.

"It is becoming increasingly apparent that the interests of third parties (Ralph Engelstad, his estate, family and foundations) have so insinuated themselves in this controversy that they cannot be ignored," the motion states.

Casino owner and former UND goaltender Ralph Engelstad built the $104 million arena that bears his name for UND in 2001.

Engelstad, who was a strong supporter of the Fighting Sioux nickname, threatened at one point to halt construction on the arena if the school dropped the nickname.

The arena, managed by an independent board, houses all of UND's home hockey games through a contractual agreement. Arena officials have said ownership of the arena may be transferred to UND in the future.

A) The university made a (quite legal) contract with the largest hockey arena in the city. What does this have to do with the lawsuit? "Third Party Insinutation" can be almost anything. Pontiac has a sponsorship agreement, the Big East rents out Madison Square Garden once a year under what I'm sure is a long term agreement: the list goes on and on. How does this "impair the University's standing"?? Does the NCAA claim that they have the right to review all contracts for possible future rules violations?

B) A donor made a conditional donation. Again, so what? What does that have to do with this lawsuit? If the NCAA wins, then no more hockey tournaments at the arena. What would they expect a judge to say at this point? (To rhetorically answer my own question, "They want to make the Ralph Englested group answer their questions in court".)

As noted, I'm not a lawyer: but to me this just seems like a delaying tactic. And further, it shows a lack of good faith by one party in regards to the "go settle this out of court" admonishment to both parties from the judge.

[The Sicatoka]

Folks, keep your eye on the ball. A man named Myles is trying to fool you with smoke and mirrors.

UND's case is based around:

1.

Breech of Contract

- The NCAA Executive Committee does not have authority to adopt legislation. The NCAA has breached the Contract in promulgating the Policy because the Executive Committee does not have the power to issue such policies.

2.

Lack of Good Faith and Fair Dealing

- When the NCAA has attempted to announce a standard, it has consistently and brazenly shifted its position in an arbitrary and capricious manner.

3.

Unlawful Restraint on Trade

- The Policy is a commercial boycott of members. Identified schools may not bid for or host earned championship events and thereby receive the economic and commercial benefits from hosting championship events and NCAA members are urged to stop scheduling regular season games with UND and other identified schools. In most circumstances, the Policy, as an undisputed group boycott, would be struck as a per se violation of the antitrust laws.

UND is suing not over who reads Spirit Lake's document on what day and what they think it says, no matter what the NCAA is trying to now claim.

UND is suing over breech, good faith, and a boycott.

UND is suing under contract law.