2005-06 ND Highschool Hockey

[X2theZ]

Success in the past is an indicator of the future my friend.

The majority of those players come out of Fargo because they have a greater population...umm duh.

With all those great players you would have thought South would have won more hockey championships than one in how many years.

Good thing good players don't make a great team.

Chemistry and a bunch of other variables make a great championship team. And as of now the Fargo Schools seem to be lacking.

Its HS hockey. They are kids. You could essentially return a core of awesome players and still go nowhere.

[Cratter]

Success in the past is an indicator of the future my friend.

The majority of those players come out of Fargo because they have a greater population...umm duh.

With all those great players you would have thought South would have won more hockey championships than one in how many years.

Good thing good players don't make a great team.

Chemistry and a bunch of other variables make a great championship team. And as of now the Fargo Schools seem to be lacking.

Its HS hockey. They are kids. You could essentially return a core of awesome players and still go nowhere.

Please stop quoting multiple posts unless needed.

Please try to conceal the fact that you play high school hockey in grand forks.

[Cratter]

The population thing was in regardes to why Fargo has more players on the Select team than GF. A bigger city is obviously going to have more players from there on the select team. Hence your point you were trying to make is mute.

You want to know another variable besides chemistry?

Coaching...another thing both RR and Central (at least with Howard) thrive at.

Maybe you can come up with some on your own now and realize talent doesn't win championships, so go ahead and name off those talented players year after year that South gets, but haven't turned into to many championship teams.

[X2theZ]

The population thing was in regardes to why Fargo has more players on the Select team than GF. A bigger city is obviously going to have more players from there on the select team. Hence your point you were trying to make is mute.

You want to know another variable besides chemistry?

Coaching...another thing both RR and Central (at least with Howard) thrive at.

Maybe you can come up with some on your own now and realize talent doesn't win championships, so go ahead and name off those talented players year after year that South gets, but haven't turned into to many championship teams.

I think the word you wanted was moot. And it wasn't a moot point, Gf has had as many kids come out for hockey in every year i can remember.

[roper1313]

The population thing was in regardes to why Fargo has more players on the Select team than GF. A bigger city is obviously going to have more players from there on the select team. Hence your point you were trying to make is mute.

Cratter- I think a better way to look at it is not population, but size of the cities respective youth hockey programs. Using your theory the city of Minneapolis should be sending the most kids to these Elite camps. I don't think that is true.

Maybe someone can share with us the size of the youth hockey programs in Fargo and Grand Forks. Back when I was in high school fargo and grand forks systems were close in size, with GF being larger some years.

As a Fargo South grad (93) I'd like what I see talent wise. Until recently FS would go up to Purpur and get destroyed. Now they go up there with a chance to win. The gap is closing, but GF schools have the edge that they've been there and done that, and come into the state tourny loose and play their best hockey of the year. South High plays great hockey in ND, but go into brain lock when they play mediocre MN teams and when they play in the state tournament. Why? Who knows, but the program is a lot better off than when I was playing.

[Haas!]

Cratter- I think a better way to look at it is not population, but size of the cities respective youth hockey programs. Using your theory the city of Minneapolis should be sending the most kids to these Elite camps. I don't think that is true.

Maybe someone can share with us the size of the youth hockey programs in Fargo and Grand Forks. Back when I was in high school fargo and grand forks systems were close in size, with GF being larger some years.

As a Fargo South grad (93) I'd like what I see talent wise. Until recently FS would go up to Purpur and get destroyed. Now they go up there with a chance to win. The gap is closing, but GF schools have the edge that they've been there and done that, and come into the state tourny loose and play their best hockey of the year. South High plays great hockey in ND, but go into brain lock when they play mediocre MN teams and when they play in the state tournament. Why? Who knows, but the program is a lot better off than when I was playing.

heh, if i remember correctly, didn't Fargo South sweep both our teams in regular season and EDC last year and yes I know that GF came to play when it counted but I guess to say that the gap is closing would be an understatement. I would say they've probably leveled with GF at this point. just my opinion i guess. Coming from GF, it's difficult not to be totally biased on the subject but that's how i feel..

Haas - I have a few posts in this thread on the west. Check out post #s 123, 124,125, 128 as well as 135 and 136. Others have discussed the west as well - check out 5, 13, 15, 74, 77, 78, 97 and 225. This thread is getting to look like a book.

thanx!

[specifics]

It's good to see even those from Grand Forks can reason where I'm coming from. Hopefully some day we can get near the level of MN high school hockey where many cities are vying for the high school championships instead of just two or three teams. But that kind of competition, for now at least, is a ways off.

The season starts on Monday and I figured if it there was a time for one last speculative question there is no better time than now so, Who do you think will be in the top 10 for state scoring leaders this year? Any ideas? My thoughts are... (in no particular order)

1. Tom Campell

2. Paul Campell

3. Paul Weisgarber

4. Grant Larson

5. Marc Mihulka

6. Adam Campell

7. Nick Klenow

8. insert west player here

9. insert west player here

10. Tyler Klein

[Jack Mickleson]

It's good to see even those from Grand Forks can reason where I'm coming from. Hopefully some day we can get near the level of MN high school hockey where many cities are vying for the high school championships instead of just two or three teams. But that kind of competition, for now at least, is a ways off.

The season starts on Monday and I figured if it there was a time for one last speculative question there is no better time than now so, Who do you think will be in the top 10 for state scoring leaders this year? Any ideas? My thoughts are... (in no particular order)

1. Tom Campell

2. Paul Campell

3. Paul Weisgarber

4. Grant Larson

5. Marc Mihulka

6. Adam Campell

7. Nick Klenow

8. insert west player here

9. insert west player here

10. Tyler Klein

Erick Galt?

[ND Pride]

Erick Galt?

Cleary, based on past performance as a d-man Erick should be projected up there among the forwards. Out of the west maybe Andy Dittus of Minot. Maybe also Jon Greicar out of GF Central. The days of speculation are coming to an end and we can judge the top players from on-ice performance.

[specifics]

My mistake Jack Mickelson. Galt should have most definitly been on that list, I guess I was just thinking of forwards but yes definitly Galt should be included on that list.

[specifics]

The population thing was in regardes to why Fargo has more players on the Select team than GF. A bigger city is obviously going to have more players from there on the select team. Hence your point you were trying to make is mute.

You want to know another variable besides chemistry?

Coaching...another thing both RR and Central (at least with Howard) thrive at.

Maybe you can come up with some on your own now and realize talent doesn't win championships, so go ahead and name off those talented players year after year that South gets, but haven't turned into to many championship teams.

What do you mean talent doesn't win championships? This is high school hockey, talent is a huge factor. I can't think of a Grand Forks team that has won the title and not been talented. Talent is the primary factor for success in Grand Forks. If I remember correctly however, it was a much less talented Fargo North team that took a VERY talented Grand Forks Red River team into 5 OT's correct? Maybe because the Fargo North boys had some of those "other variables" your talking about? Because the score sure wasn't close because the teams were equal talent wise. So when you say Grand Forks teams are winning championships because of all these other factors you really have no hard evidence to prove it. I however know that Gopher captain Danny Irmen and fellow Gopher teammate Ryan Potunly were both on that Red River team. They also had a goalie name Nate Zieglemann so it wouldnt be rational to say the game was only close because North had Walski. Red River did not win that game because they had better coaching, were harder working, or had better chemistry. Red River won that game because they were more talented. If they did in fact have better coaching, were harder working, and had better chemistry the score of that game would have been at least 5-0.

[ND Pride]

Interesting night of hockey with Dickinson beating Century 9-3 and Shanley taking out Central 5-4 in OT. North bombed Wahpeton 14-3 and Minot shut out Mandan 6-0. Jamestown also beat Devils Lake 6-3. Should be interesting after each of the teams get 3-4 games under their belts. I expect South to dominate Bismarck High this weekend and, as I said before, West Fargo should beat Century on Saturday as well.

[Haas!]

As a GFC alumn I'm a little disappointed about this loss to SHANLEY!!!

What happened out there?? Did anyone witness this??

I want an explanation!

[redwing77]

As a GFC alumn I'm a little disappointed about this loss to SHANLEY!!!

What happened out there?? Did anyone witness this??

I want an explanation!

I wasn't there, but from what I gathered, Shanley had more goals at the end of regulation than Central did, hence the loss

[Mr. Blanston]

I wasn't there, but from what I gathered, Shanley had more goals at the end of regulation than Central did, hence the loss

That was a pathetic attempt at being witty considering Shanley won in overtime.

[roper1313]

I wasn't there, but from what I gathered, Shanley had more goals at the end of regulation than Central did, hence the loss

Actually they had the same number of goals at the end of regulation. Sounds like a good game for Shanley, I just spoke to a Shanley parent and apparntly its the first victory ever agains centra. I don't know if that's true but I'm sure it's been a long time.

[Fanfromafar]

[specifics]

First of all, I don't want to disparage any Fargo hockey players. What the Great Plans team was able to accomplish and great individual performances by Galt, etc. is to be commended; however, I don

[Fanfromafar]

[ND Pride]

One addition to your player review - Jake Statstad is playing for the Dubuque Thunderbirds of the MJHL (Junior "B").

In researching these things sometimes you need to look over a longer time frame to get a better trend line. There are a lot of variables involved such as community hockey culture, as you mentioned, and also quality of coaching, quality of youth development program, etc. Look at the difference between Fargo and Moorhead for example or Grafton and Wahpeton.

This could be a major research project for someone.

[Bauer16]

Actually they had the same number of goals at the end of regulation. Sounds like a good game for Shanley, I just spoke to a Shanley parent and apparntly its the first victory ever agains centra. I don't know if that's true but I'm sure it's been a long time.

I witnessed the game. Both teams were inexperianced with no real game plan. They both did the typical Wahp breakout plan of attempting to ice it with a cherry picker up high. Kelvin Shane did not have a lot of Defensive help otu there, but then again he didn't last year either. I tihnk South has th ebest set of D in the state. Which is goign to determine a lot fo the games this season. It was a game with numerous penalties and it was hard fought. Central at first had puck play most of the game until the third period. They were up 3-0 at one point. Penalties killed opportunites for both teams last night. I see Central getting better this season and being competitive as always at the end of the eyar. Shanley with such a young tema and coaching staff will not fair as well. However, thsoe 4-point games can kill a team's record.

[redwing77]

That was a pathetic attempt at being witty considering Shanley won in overtime.

Good thing I wasn't at the game!

And, yeah, it was pathetic... but generally speaking, it is usually the team with the most goals at the conclusion of the game that wins.

[crosby_87]

Interesting night of hockey with Dickinson beating Century 9-3 and Shanley taking out Central 5-4 in OT. North bombed Wahpeton 14-3 and Minot shut out Mandan 6-0. Jamestown also beat Devils Lake 6-3. Should be interesting after each of the teams get 3-4 games under their belts. I expect South to dominate Bismarck High this weekend and, as I said before, West Fargo should beat Century on Saturday as well.

From what I have read of your posts...you are extremely knowledgeable about high school hockey. So I was just curious about your take on how much better the east is than the west? You say you expect South to dominate Bismarck, but I kinda thought bismarck was always one of the better teams in the west...or is South just that good? What kind of gap do you see this year, and what kind of scoreline do you expect for the game, just so i can see how the best in the east compares to one of the better in the west. Thanks in advance.

[ND Pride]

From what I have read of your posts...you are extremely knowledgeable about high school hockey. So I was just curious about your take on how much better the east is than the west? You say you expect South to dominate Bismarck, but I kinda thought bismarck was always one of the better teams in the west...or is South just that good? What kind of gap do you see this year, and what kind of scoreline do you expect for the game, just so i can see how the best in the east compares to one of the better in the west. Thanks in advance.

Crosby87 (great screen name by the way) - you ought to order the DVD "The Making of Sydney Crosby" it is great. Anyway, I know probably all of the top 88 birthyear players in the state and many of the 87s, and a few 89s. I do not want to sound disrespectful of the west because there are some great kids out there and great parents/fans as well. Just the same, here is what I see. There are ups and downs in programs and teams and the Bismarck schools are in a downturn - not sure how long it will last (maybe only a year or two) but this group of seniors struggled in bantams when they were 2nd year players. Both Bismarck teams were short on quality players - they have quality players but not enough of them. Last year's cohort of Bismarck seniors had a lot of strength (to some extent so did Mandan - with Bair and Montplaisir, etc). There are not enough quality players to allow the Bismarck teams to field 2 or 3 competitive lines (unless the coaches can create some major improvement over the season). Bismarck High was typically one of the better teams but this year both Bismarck teams will struggle to have .500 seasons - that's my guess. Combine that with the fact that Fargo South is exceptionally strong this year. They have a large number of players who are USA Hockey National Festival level kids and several other kids played Elite I and Elite II this fall as well. They are deeper than any team in the state at this time. If they are not successful it will be because of coaching and team chemistry. However, there are a lot of kids on that team that are good friends and I expect that they will bond together strongly. South is the team this year - now they have to handle the pressure of their own expectations as well as the expectations of their fans. They will be wearing the target this year as the team to beat. I wish them luck - a great bunch of kids.

Regarding the gap between east and west - I think it is wide - how wide is hard to say because I believe that, with the exception of South and Grafton, the east is down as well. Shanley beat Central - and this is not the kind of team Shanley had a couple of years ago when they had some big strong players - several of whom are now in juniors (Graalum, Fylling, etc). The best in the west will be Williston and Minot and we do not get to see them enough to judge how good they are - this is especially true for Williston. The best we can do is look at comparative scores and try and evaluate teams based on that - which can be a practice of questionable validity. Bottom line - with little exposure to Williston and Minot it will be hard to judge them compared to the east.

On the question of Bismarck High vs South - it will be a significant difference in goals. It could be 5-1, 7-2 something on that order. You hate to predict these things as it is best to respect your opponent. Last year Bismarck upset South - but they had more quality players then too.

Ultimately, I don't think we will know too much about how the best of the west (Williston and Minot) compare to the east until state tourney time or at least until some of the EDC teams play Minot - I think Grafton and the two GF teams will play them later in the season.

In about two weeks we will know a lot more when we get scores from 4-5 games to evaluate. I hope all the players from all teams have a great season and exceed fan expectations.

[Wilbur]

Great post ND Pride

Actually, the eastern schools will get a good look at Minot. Starting with this Saturday, as Central makes the trip up to Minot. In December Minot comes down to Grand Forks to play East Grand Forks in the home of economy classic, and in early February Minot comes out east again to play Red River and Grafton on consecutive nights. The games in February should be a good indicator of what kind of team Minot is because it will be the last month of the season, and playing on the road against two good eastern schools will be a challenge for them.

I love this time of year....