Fire Berry Please!

[Brim006]

2 minutes ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Uh, no. 

UND is 62-26-14 in non-con. I can go season by season, if you'd like. Some are certainly better than others, but he's had one true under .500 non-con team.

No. See above.

My point is the continual habit of losing to poorly ranked bad teams is what has has kept them out of the tournament and likely will be the reason again this season. 62-26-14 looks great on paper, but 1 loss to a team ranked #35-64 in the pairwise washes out a lot of wins. Teams they shouldn't lose to, but have lost to, have kept them out of the tournament on Berry's watch.

I used to come on here a lot 2-3 years ago and mention these same concerns, and here we are still sitting in the spot spinning our wheels. And likely will for however many more years Berry is behind the bench IMO. I hate how the NHL has become a revolving door, and I don't want that, but I think UND is well due for a change after this season. A lot of fans have lost interest, the school has lost some reputation, and he has had more than enough chances to turn it around but just can't for whatever reason. 

Agree to disagree

 

[tnt]

So, under the other Bubba, we made the playoffs a good portion of the time.  Why did Goon think it was time for a change there?   Me thinks his objectivity is clouded a bit.  Whether Schmidt takes the program to another level is still to be seen, but there is a fire in the fanbase that has been absent for quite some time.  I would argue the fire in the hockey fanbase is trending the wrong direction as well, but I am willing to see where this year heads from here.   Maybe Berry truly can focus the team to actually peaking at the right time this year.  I am still hopeful that will happen.  If they miss the tournament again, there needs to be some soul searching.  

[stoneySIOUX]

Just now, siouxkid12 said:

RMU is so far beneath UND in everything (hell they just brought the program last year after cutting it). Again, exhibition or not, those are games you shouldn't lose because they can set the tone for the whole year.

I will agree with you that I don't believe Berry should be fired though. Like you, I am afraid of what would happen to the program going forward. Will we see instant success, or will we be bottom dwellers? 

We won the dang games. I'm sorry, how can we judge accurately if choose feelings over facts?

I disagree that the exhibitions set the tone for the whole year. They mean nothing other than getting legs hot. 

If this does happen, I am confident we'd get back to where we'd need to be, but I also just feel like he doesn't deserve to get fired.

[siouxkid12]

8 minutes ago, stoneySIOUX said:

I'd argue our 18-17-2 record kept us out that year LOL. Pretty sure it was the now infamous Canisius weekend that truly was the nail in the coffin.

This is true.
In the end we all see things a little differently but ultimately want what's best for the program. 

[siouxkid12]

1 minute ago, stoneySIOUX said:

We won the dang games. I'm sorry, how can we judge accurately if choose feelings over facts?

I disagree that the exhibitions set the tone for the whole year. They mean nothing other than getting legs hot. 

If this does happen, I am confident we'd get back to where we'd need to be, but I also just feel like he doesn't deserve to get fired.

You can win a game and still lose. Which I believe happened to UND when they played RMU (a lot of people would agree with me on that too).

[stoneySIOUX]

2 minutes ago, Brim006 said:

My point is the continual habit of losing to poorly ranked bad teams is what has has kept them out of the tournament and likely will be the reason again this season. 62-26-14 looks great on paper, but 1 loss to a team ranked #35-64 in the pairwise washes out a lot of wins. Teams they shouldn't lose to, but have lost to, have kept them out of the tournament on Berry's watch.

I used to come on here a lot 2-3 years ago and mention these same concerns, and here we are still sitting in the spot spinning our wheels. And likely will for however many more years Berry is behind the bench IMO. I hate how the NHL has become a revolving door, and I don't want that, but I think UND is well due for a change after this season. A lot of fans have lost interest, the school has lost some reputation, and he has had more than enough chances to turn it around but just can't for whatever reason. 

Agree to disagree

 

It's not a continual habit! Goodness, that's what I'm saying. With one outlier, the Canisius weekend, UND has beaten teams they should overwhelmingly more than they have not. When UND doesn't make the tournament, it's a full down season. Including conference play. 

You are right, agree to disagree.

[siouxkid12]

4 minutes ago, tnt said:

So, under the other Bubba, we made the playoffs a good portion of the time.  Why did Goon think it was time for a change there?   Me thinks his objectivity is clouded a bit.  Whether Schmidt takes the program to another level is still to be seen, but there is a fire in the fanbase that has been absent for quite some time.  I would argue the fire in the hockey fanbase is trending that direction as well. 

Because no one (reporter wise) in Grand Forks wants to rock the boat and hold the hockey team accountable.

[Brim006]

12 minutes ago, tnt said:

   Under two of those coaches my expectation was that we would win, or at least show up for big games.  Right now, when we get big games, destination games, WCHA Final Five games, my expectation is we will most likely be going home early.  I think our fanbase has gone from that of being confident of a win in those situations, to a resigned fanbase of being hopeful, but not very confident.   

   I admit some of our fans needed to be humbled a bit, because our cockiness was beginning to rival Minnesota's, but if it continues it may kill the golden goose which has had UND amongst the elite teams in college hockey.  We can't afford to fall off the face with the fans like Minnesota did for a while, because we don't have the corporate money.  We also can't afford missing out on the National media attention that deep runs in the National tournament gives teams.  Year in, and year out our team would be one of the teams always talked about as a title contender.  Not so much anymore.  I think you can see that in us not being in the top 3 or 4 teams for most of the guys that are Top Ten NHL draft prospects.   

Well said. Fan confidence is deflated, and with that so is excitement. Attendance home and away has and will continue to fall. I used to watch every single game every season, but now I haven't watched or listened to a single one in the past 2 years. The last one I watched was the OT loss in the NCHC to St. Cloud in March 2023. 

[gfhockey]

6 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

Because no one (reporter wise) in Grand Forks wants to rock the boat and hold the hockey team accountable.

Wait we have reporters un grand forks?

[siouxkid12]

18 hours ago, Goon said:

FFS! The current team has two number-one draft choices. Have you watched the D-Core? Because of injuries they got valuable time to mature and grow. To say the recruiting sucks is short-sighted.  Come on! Sacha, EJ Emery, Livanavage, Wiebe, Strathmann, just to name a few. 

Everyone talks about how we recruit #1 draft picks, but we never really discuss goaltending. Berry has yet to trust a goalie that he has recruited. Scheel was the only goalie that got to play regularly under Berry, the rest were transfer players for 1 or 2 years. Jakob Hellsten was here but then transferred to UNH and did pretty darn well (5 SO, 2.04 GAA, .909 Save %). I mean why is this such an issue for us? 

[brianvf]

8 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

You can win a game and still lose.

A W is a W.

3 minutes ago, Brim006 said:

I used to watch every single game every season, but now I haven't watched or listened to a single one in the past 2 years.

You wouldn't have lasted long as a UND fan in those mid-90's seasons.   

[stoneySIOUX]

Just now, siouxkid12 said:

Everyone talks about how we recruit #1 draft picks, but we never really discuss goaltending. Berry has yet to trust a goalie that he has recruited. Scheel was the only goalie that got to play regularly under Berry, the rest were transfer players for 1 or 2 years. Jakob Hellsten was here but then transferred to UNH and did pretty darn well (5 SO, 2.04 GAA, .909 Save %). I mean why is this such an issue for us? 

I had this conversation with someone previously away from here and I understand the frustration of not having "our guy", but I don't truly understand why this matters. We recruit the portal goalies to come here. 

[siouxkid12]

Just now, stoneySIOUX said:

I had this conversation with someone previously away from here and I understand the frustration of not having "our guy", but I don't truly understand why this matters. We recruit the portal goalies to come here. 

I'm not saying the portal goalies are bad, I am just asking why Berry loses faith in the ones he recruited to go out and get one from the portal? Are they not developing like they should? If we are relying on goalies from the portal (and we expect them to play lights out from the get-go), maybe our goalie coach isn't doing his job properly.

[Brim006]

9 minutes ago, stoneySIOUX said:

It's not a continual habit! Goodness, that's what I'm saying. With one outlier, the Canisius weekend, UND has beaten teams they should overwhelmingly more than they have not. When UND doesn't make the tournament, it's a full down season. Including conference play. 

You are right, agree to disagree.

Since you have so much confidence in Berry, and since we agree to disagree...I'd like to propose a friendly wager with you. 😊

$20 that they don't make it past the 1st round of the NCAA tournament this year. 

[Brim006]

3 minutes ago, brianvf said:

A W is a W.

You wouldn't have lasted long as a UND fan in those mid-90's seasons.   

Haha probably true. I still follow the scores, updates and watch the highlights etc. My interest has just fallen so I haven't gone to or watched any games recently. 

[siouxkid12]

3 minutes ago, brianvf said:

A W is a W.

That's like saying your first kiss was from a girl who happened to be your 2nd cousin. While you did kiss a girl, she's still your cousin.

[iramurphy]

4 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

That's like saying your first kiss was from a girl who happened to be your 2nd cousin. While you did kiss a girl, she's still your cousin.

You know this how?

[stoneySIOUX]

7 minutes ago, Brim006 said:

Since you have so much confidence in Berry, and since we agree to disagree...I'd like to propose a friendly wager with you. 😊

$20 that they don't make it past the 1st round of the NCAA tournament this year. 

Would you have made this bet at the beginning of the year? 

I won't take that bet simply because of the hole we've dug, unfortunately. I love the direction right now, but we have too many injuries to too many very good players for me to bet on it. I am still confident we can get there, but health will and absolutely does matter. 

[stoneySIOUX]

9 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

I'm not saying the portal goalies are bad, I am just asking why Berry loses faith in the ones he recruited to go out and get one from the portal? Are they not developing like they should? If we are relying on goalies from the portal (and we expect them to play lights out from the get-go), maybe our goalie coach isn't doing his job properly.

I would say this is likely the case. Hard to say it's on the coach or the player, but I for one never thought Helly should be the guy. I still think Hobie can get there, but he wasn't ready this year. And with the crutch that is the portal, we can go find a good tendy if we're uneasy about the current one.

[fightingsioux4life]

24 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

Because no one (reporter wise) in Grand Forks wants to rock the boat and hold the hockey team accountable.

I will argue they didn't want to hold Bubba accountable either. I think that change was driven by Armacost.

[siouxkid12]

1 minute ago, iramurphy said:

You know this how?

I mean, you don't need to be a rocket scientist to figure that out.

[RedFrog]

First, I agree that Berry's seat should be warm.  The team has put him in a position where he could be staring down the guillotine if they fail to make the NCAAs.  This team was ranked #5 in the preseason poll and has a ton of skill and talent.  I was OK with where we were sitting after being swept by Denver at home, but the results of the RMU and BSU weekends were unacceptable in my opinion.  Even with the injuries we were dealing with, those are teams our 2 deep should handle.  I won't call the Miami weekend a confidence builder (not with the first 55 minutes of that Friday night game), but this past weekend gives me more optimism and the season is far from over.

This fanbase demands and deserves more in the national tournament.  That does not mean that Berry hasn't provided a quality product.  You don't win 5 Penrose Cups without having teams that are considered contenders for the national championship.  Unfortunately, you can't compete for a national championship if you don't make the tournament.  I would agree that if this team misses the NCAAs, serious consideration needs to be given to replacing him.  We still have half the season to go though, which is more than enough time for this team to have a strong half, possibly win another Penrose, and have that shot to compete for a national championship.

Ultimately, if we win the Penrose and make the NCAAs but lose in the regionals, Berry is safe for another year but the seat stays warm.  If we don't win the Penrose and we lose the first game of the NCAAs or miss the NCAAs ... Berry needs to be celebrated for his contributions to the program and let go.

[stoneySIOUX]

1 minute ago, RedFrog said:

First, I agree that Berry's seat should be warm.  The team has put him in a position where he could be staring down the guillotine if they fail to make the NCAAs.  This team was ranked #5 in the preseason poll and has a ton of skill and talent.  I was OK with where we were sitting after being swept by Denver at home, but the results of the RMU and BSU weekends were unacceptable in my opinion.  Even with the injuries we were dealing with, those are teams our 2 deep should handle.  I won't call the Miami weekend a confidence builder (not with the first 55 minutes of that Friday night game), but this past weekend gives me more optimism and the season is far from over.

This fanbase demands and deserves more in the national tournament.  That does not mean that Berry hasn't provided a quality product.  You don't win 5 Penrose Cups without having teams that are considered contenders for the national championship.  Unfortunately, you can't compete for a national championship if you don't make the tournament.  I would agree that if this team misses the NCAAs, serious consideration needs to be given to replacing him.  We still have half the season to go though, which is more than enough time for this team to have a strong half, possibly win another Penrose, and have that shot to compete for a national championship.

Ultimately, if we win the Penrose and make the NCAAs but lose in the regionals, Berry is safe for another year but the seat stays warm.  If we don't win the Penrose and we lose the first game of the NCAAs or miss the NCAAs ... Berry needs to be celebrated for his contributions to the program and let go.

Well put, all around. 

[fightingsioux4life]

2 minutes ago, RedFrog said:

First, I agree that Berry's seat should be warm.  The team has put him in a position where he could be staring down the guillotine if they fail to make the NCAAs.  This team was ranked #5 in the preseason poll and has a ton of skill and talent.  I was OK with where we were sitting after being swept by Denver at home, but the results of the RMU and BSU weekends were unacceptable in my opinion.  Even with the injuries we were dealing with, those are teams our 2 deep should handle.  I won't call the Miami weekend a confidence builder (not with the first 55 minutes of that Friday night game), but this past weekend gives me more optimism and the season is far from over.

This fanbase demands and deserves more in the national tournament.  That does not mean that Berry hasn't provided a quality product.  You don't win 5 Penrose Cups without having teams that are considered contenders for the national championship.  Unfortunately, you can't compete for a national championship if you don't make the tournament.  I would agree that if this team misses the NCAAs, serious consideration needs to be given to replacing him.  We still have half the season to go though, which is more than enough time for this team to have a strong half, possibly win another Penrose, and have that shot to compete for a national championship.

Ultimately, if we win the Penrose and make the NCAAs but lose in the regionals, Berry is safe for another year but the seat stays warm.  If we don't win the Penrose and we lose the first game of the NCAAs or miss the NCAAs ... Berry needs to be celebrated for his contributions to the program and let go.

Well put. You should contribute on here more often.

[siouxkid12]

1 minute ago, stoneySIOUX said:

I would say this is likely the case. Hard to say it's on the coach or the player, but I for one never thought Helly should be the guy. I still think Hobie can get there, but he wasn't ready this year. And with the crutch that is the portal, we can go find a good tendy if we're uneasy about the current one.

I mean I know goalies are hit or miss but it just seems like the past 4-5 years we have had a hard time getting that guy.