JAN 10TH. USCHO, USA TODAY POLL and INCH RANKINGS

[PCM]

I can't stand the MNF crew so I watch the game while listening to a little Van Morrison, the game is so much more enjoyable!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Van does football? Who knew?

[dagies]

Personally, I think Woog does a good job of giving credit to the other team when they deserve it, or being critical of a gopher, or correcting Mazzacco when he complains about a penalty call.

Woog is a big time homer, but IMO he's plenty balanced in his evaluation of the game. I think he does a great job.

[DamStrait]

Personally, I think Woog does a good job of giving credit to the other team when they deserve it, or being critical of a gopher, or correcting Mazzacco when he complains about a penalty call.

Woog is a big time homer, but IMO he's plenty balanced in his evaluation of the game.  I think he does a great job.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I strongly disagree. Woog has flat out stated, on the air, more than once, that Sioux players get phantom assists at home. For this alone, he has zero credibility as an announcer. If I were running the REA, his fat arse would never get through the door to a Sioux home game ever again.

[siouxtatoo42]

[shep]

I find Sweeney all but impossible to listen to and when paired with Bredahl it's just a matter b/4 he attempts some weird pun or other non sequiter that makes no sense in the context of a hockey game which is why

I turn down the volume and turn on the radio.

[siouxtatoo42]

I find Sweeney all but impossible to listen to and when paired with Bredahl it's just a matter b/4 he attempts some weird pun or other non sequiter that makes no sense in the context of a hockey game which is why

I turn down the volume and turn on the radio.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

is anyone as big a fan as me of greg and how he conducts his player interviews between first and second period. I like that he gets the players opinions on the community and college life in general. anyone can research and ask about injuries or stats or whatever, which in itself is interesting. But how cool is it to hear about what these young athletes both sioux and opponents, think about our community. big round of applause for Greg

[siouxnami]

Woog is a much better broadcaster than coach.

[siouxtatoo42]

Woog is a much better broadcaster than coach. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i don't know about that, i hear his makeup staff, hairstylists, two of the cameramen, both producers and everyone out in the truck all had to be from minnesota. that was his biggest stipulation in his contract. no canadians or other out of staters allowed on his set.

[redwing77]

[dagies]

I strongly disagree. Woog has flat out stated, on the air, more than once, that Sioux players get phantom assists at home. For this alone, he has zero credibility as an announcer. If I were running the REA, his fat arse would never get through the door to a Sioux home game ever again.

I didn't say I agreed with everything he says. Still I think he does a pretty good job of describing the game.

[Smoggy]

It always amazes me that people will continue to listen to announcers they do not like, especially with TV where the sound is superfluous. I can't stand the MNF crew so I watch the game while listening to a little Van Morrison, the game is so much more enjoyable!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have no choice when the Sioux are playing the Gophs, because the internet feed is too far behind.

[Smoggy]

Woog is very critical of the Gophers during his broadcasts - or at least the during the away games. I'm at the home games so I wouldn't know if his style changes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Woog still makes idiotic statements, but he's gotten much better over the years. It's too the point where I don't mind listening to him. I think he's also toned down his homerism.

[TC_transplant]

[Let'sGoHawks!]

Your "facts" show something very interesting: UND sets up goals much more than other teams.

As far as Woog and Mazzacco go: I have never been able to stand Frank M., he is the biggest homer I have ever encountered. I don't like Woog, he can be bad, but I agree he is pretty even during games, sometimes correcting Frank when he says something wrong. I don't listen to the two much, usually only when the Sioux are playing them, but I consider Frank the worst broadcaster around when it comes to being one-sided and a baby if the Gophers don't do well.

[CoteauRinkRat]

[Sioux Rule]

Bredahl is terrible, I think he is by far worse than Doug or Frank.

[The Sicatoka]

Right from the NCAA Rulebook, Rule 5, Section 3:

The duties of the referee(s) are as follows:

paragraph 3:

Announce to the official scorer or penalty timekeeper all goals and assists legally scored, ....

The referees were in on it, right "TC"?

[TC_transplant]

Right from the NCAA Rulebook, Rule 5, Section 3:

paragraph 3:

The referees were in on it, right "TC"?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Assists are determined from the press box. Have PCM ask the UND officials in the press box at the Ralph where they get the assists from.

BTW, compared to 84% for UND in 2000-01....MN in 2001-02 - 67% of their goals at home had two assists.

[CoteauRinkRat]

Assists are determined from the press box. Ask PCM.

BTW, compared to 84% for UND in 2000-01....MN in 2001-02 - 67% of their goals at home had two assists.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Troll

This tired argument from Woog and gopher fans has been beaten dead.

[Blackheart]

Ok smart hockey guys...without too much strain, can someone tell me what constitutes an assist? Or the second assist?

[Sioux_Hab-it]

Ok smart hockey guys...without too much strain, can someone tell me what constitutes an assist?  Or the second assist?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

According to USA Hockey it is a "point awarded to a player or players for helping set up a goal; usually the last two offensive players to handle the puck prior to a goal being scored are credited for assists."

[The Sicatoka]

Rule 6, Section 18, paragraph after paragraph d:

When a player scores a goal, an assist shall be credited to the player or players taking part in the play preceding the goal, even though the play may originate in the defensive zone; but not more than two assists can be given on any goal.

The word "shall" in there is very interesting. No, actually, "shall" in there is the key.

By saying "shall be credited to the player or players taking part in the play preceding the goal" and saying "but not more than two assists can be given on any goal" that affirms that two-assist goals are the norm as long as the two previous touches to the goal were teammates.

Conversely, by saying "shall" it says that one-assist goals are only in the case of the puck going from opponent to teammate (assist) to goalscorer.

And of course none of this pertains to unassisted goals.

[schmidtdoggydog]

That myth about phantom assists began in the late 80s and early 90s. Now with technology, it would be tough to get away with.

Here's some numbers to help Woog's cause. In 1999-2000, one of the last year's before the state-of-the-art Ralph and all its TV monitors....

Home games: 81% of the goals had two assists (MN: 60%; UW: 67%)

Away games: 67% of the goals had two assists (MN: 61%; UW: 54%)

(In 2000-01, UND's goals at home had two assists a whopping 84% of the time)

Home games: 17 goals had 0-1 assists (MN: 27; UW: 31)

Away games: 34 goals had 0-1 assists (MN: 31; UW: 32)

(In 2000-01, UND scored a whopping total of 13 goals at home that had 0-1 assists)

Source: www.collegehockeystats.com

Pretend you were a fan of Bemidji State, what would you think?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

2000-2001!!!

The "myth" ??

Personally, I like to live in the now!

The following is a post from POI reprinted with the author's consent:

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In the last two years involving Sioux/Goph games at the REA, UND has outscored the Gophers 16-14 and here are how the assists break down:

UND 16 goals

7 with two assists 44%

7 with one assist

2 unassisted

UMN 14 goals

10 (yes, 10) with two assists 71%

3 with one assist

1 unassisted

It always cracks me up when people make sweeping statements without knowing the FACTS.

-------------------------

and they still don't get it . . . . . . It is pretty sad when Woog (as funny as he can be in his own way) makes a typical comment, without a factual basis, and the majority of Gopher fans like what they hear, they embrace it and preach it.

There was a play during the Gopher holiday tourney against Merrimack, for crying out loud, when UM scored and only one assist was credited due to a shot off the goalie before the goal scored and when the scoring was announced, Woog says something like, gee, only one assist, if this game was in GF everybody would've gotten an assist, hahaha.

Gopher fans can now spend their time on collegehockeystats and ushco trying to prove their point - so be it - but the bottom line is the numbers printed above are facts directly related to Gopher hockey in GF over the last two years.

They "myth" has been disspelled and needs to be put to rest.

[PCM]

That myth about phantom assists began in the late 80s and early 90s. Now with technology, it would be tough to get away with.

I don't care what the stats say. It's an urban legend, and it needs to die.

How assists are awarded has nothing to do with technology. The official procedure is that whenever a goal is scored, the referee tells the official scorekeeper (who is a WCHA official) down on the ice which players the goal and the assists (if any) should go to. The scorekeeper records what the ref told him and informs the PA announcer, who announces the scoring.

The statskeepers (usually in the press box) then record the goals and assists as instructed. The official scorekeeper and statskeepers don't have creative license to add assists. The referee reviews and signs the official score sheet after the game. He isn't going to sign the sheet if it includes "phantom assists."

Now, we've all heard and seen scoring changed after it's been announced. That's because when the ref isn't sure what happened, he'll ask for the goal to be reviewed so the scoring is accurate. Or sometimes a sports information director, someone on the stats crew or someone in the media takes issue with what the ref says he saw. When tape is available, it's reviewed. Sometimes the tape isn't conclusive. The players themselves are then asked who touched the puck in what order. Usually they can agree on what happened.

(This occurred a couple weekends ago when Nick Fuher appeared to score on a slapshot from the point. The goal was initially awarded to Fuher. However, Travis Zajac was in front of the net at that moment and it looked as if he might have tipped the shot in. But it was difficult to tell from the video replay if he actually did. After the game, Zajac and other players were asked about the goal. They said that he'd tipped the shot. Therefore, the scoring was changed to award Zajac the goal and Fuher an assist.)

When scoring is changed, the sports information directors from both schools have to agree to it. UND can't arbitrarily decide to change the official scoring simply because it wants Jeff Panzer to win the Hobey Baker Award. The ref would notice it. The WCHA would notice it. And if UND got away with it, so could all other schools in the league. The idea that the WCHA would sit idly by while UND added wholesale "phantom assists" is so ludicrous that I'm constantly amazed that normally knowledgeable hockey fans buy into it.

And let me cite another example of how the scoring works. I believe it was two seasons ago when Peter Sejna of CC was on a scoring tear. He had an impressive string of games in which he had at least one point. It might have been a school or WCHA record. In any event, when a game against the Sioux at the Ralph was over, Sejna had no points. It appeared that his scoring streak was over.

Someone from CC felt that Sejna should have been awarded a second assist on one of the Tigers' goals. The CC SID and the UND SID reviewed the video well after the game had ended. They both agreed that Sejna should have been awarded the assist. Thus, the scoring was changed because representatives of both schools decided it was accurate. Sejna's streak remained alive, and UND lost the bragging rights for ending it.

Edited January 13, 2005 by PCM

[The Sicatoka]

When scoring is changed, the sports information directors from both schools have to agree to it. UND can't arbitrarily decide to change the official scoring ... The ref would notice it. The WCHA would notice it. ... The idea that the WCHA would sit idly by while UND added wholesale "phantom assists" is so ludicrous that I'm constantly amazed that normally knowledgeable hockey fans buy into it.

The ref, the opposing SIDs, the league, they're all in on it, right "TC"?

The point is so key it deserves a second mention:

The idea that the WCHA would sit idly by while UND added wholesale "phantom assists" is so ludicrous that I'm constantly amazed that normally knowledgeable hockey fans buy into it.